Another Gain review

Jaxx

Well-Known Member
It seriously beats just walking into my office in terms of staying active!

The exact number is just a side effect of the year I did Team Bike Challenge with my cycling group.

It is/was a team-based, month-long ‘race’.

The year I participated it was for points, and the maximum points you could get was from riding 25+ miles.

My group was short 1 person to fill out the five-person team, so I joined essentially as a domestique to make sure we had maximum possible points every day — which meant I found a coffee shop 25 miles away and used it as an excuse to work on my novel. I varied routes a bit because doing the same ride every single day does get a bit old, and some days I got in more miles.

We had 2 folks doing 100 miles a day for the entire month.

The contest tracked miles too, but didn’t record anything over a hundred and only scored up to 25.

At the end of the month, we won by a margin of double over our nearest competitor, and the next year they changed all the rules.

I liked the coffee shop enough to just keep riding there!
And don't forget about the cakes!
 

arao99

New Member
I ride a M20i. Over the months of ownership I've started to get my head around the Gain. Regularly I get 100+ miles to a charge, the most important understanding of the Gain I have learned? IT LIKES REVS when requiring assist. Ride steady (below cut off) in a largish gear it doesn't use the assist. Likewise climb a hill out of the saddle in a large gear, and no assist is offered up. Sweet spot appears for my UK model is around 75 rpm. Sit back spin the pedals on hills to get maximum benefit. It's a very comfortable ride, super sure when descending at very high speeds. I don't find changing assist levels anymore awkward than reaching down for a bottle, although there is room for improvement. Because of the lack of mudgaurd fittings I have a alloy Gain on order for winter riding (if you need to carry and want wet weather protection) then the alloy version is a must. Finally, both versions of the Gain ride like normal bikes without the assist been engaged.
Hi I have the M30 and my bike use to feel like you describe your bike ,but a couple of weeks ago the power started to comes in as soon as I turn the pedals at what ever rpm I get full power ,I rode up a 9% hill with doing as little as 1or 2 rpm in a low gear . Also when I look at the app. no power is shown while riding and there does not seem to be any change in power if dial it down in the app.I have taken it to my dealer who at the moment thinks it is working as it should .He has spoken to Orbea and they have never had this problem. Orbea are going to allow the dealer access to software to check the bike with.
 

Jaxx

Well-Known Member
Hi I have the M30 and my bike use to feel like you describe your bike ,but a couple of weeks ago the power started to comes in as soon as I turn the pedals at what ever rpm I get full power ,I rode up a 9% hill with doing as little as 1or 2 rpm in a low gear . Also when I look at the app. no power is shown while riding and there does not seem to be any change in power if dial it down in the app.I have taken it to my dealer who at the moment thinks it is working as it should .He has spoken to Orbea and they have never had this problem. Orbea are going to allow the dealer access to software to check the bike with.
It sounds as though it's kind of STUCK in full on power mode? Is the button recessed at all into the unit?
 

arao99

New Member
It sounds as though it's kind of STUCK in full on power mode? Is the button recessed at all into the unit?
Just got my bike back from the shop ,they have turned the power down in mode 1 to 30 % mode 2 to 34% and mode 1 to 75% .they say there was nothing wrong with the bike I had it set at 40% 75%and 100%.which they say was too high. When I got the bike it was set 1,2,3, all 100% which he tells me that was not how it should have been set from the factory. my bike was shop demo with few miles on it .
 

Jaxx

Well-Known Member
Just got my bike back from the shop ,they have turned the power down in mode 1 to 30 % mode 2 to 34% and mode 1 to 75% .they say there was nothing wrong with the bike I had it set at 40% 75%and 100%.which they say was too high. When I got the bike it was set 1,2,3, all 100% which he tells me that was not how it should have been set from the factory. my bike was shop demo with few miles on it .
Aero, I have all my settings at 100% They are the default settings.
 

Solom01

Active Member
Aero my Gain also came with all 100% settings, that is the default. The only reason to lower it is to try to extend the battery range which as far as I can tell doesn't help much or if you feel it's putting out too much power, which with a 250 motor in level 1 seems like a stretch. Since it's easy to change the levels you should try increasing it to see what happens, it's easy to lower it if the issue comes back.
 

ZJarvis

New Member
Both the demo bike I rode and the new D40 I picked up today came configured with the ‘engine map’ set to 100% across the board and I was told my bike was configured as it had been at the factory.

In other news:

3985039851

I had my dealer (Mike’s Bikes in Palo Alto) set it up tubeless and it was a good thing. The rear tire had a manufacturing defect that was causing a bulge on both sides in the sidewall. I was planning to just buy some more rim tape and do the job myself but my wife convinced me $30 was worth it, and lo, it was so true.

I talked to them about a variety of things, like later DI2 conversion on the alloy frame. While it doesn’t have routing for the seatpost battery, their tech guys didn’t think it’d be a problem. If it came to it, they could just drill a hole.

I also asked about the bar-mounted iWoc controls, because I’m not completely sold on the top-tube system.

The bar mount version is designed to fit the flat-bar bikes and wouldn’t fit on drop bars, but it’s also cheap enough ($50) that I’m thinking about having them order one and see if I can modify it to work.

Its very simple — just a ring with two buttons and colored lights to indicate the mode. I’m thinking it would be simple to 3D print a new housing for it.

The other thing I did was try it out in the parking lot because I’ve been pretty confused by the engine mapping feature.

Since it comes from the factory with all three levels at 100%, it’s not remotely clear if that means it ships in max assist all the time or not, from folks here on the forum, I get the strong feeling that’s not the case and in fact when you reduce those settings in the app you’re lowering already lowered output.

A quick test pretty much confirmed that.

So, when I did my 25 mile ride last week, keep in mind I did it mostly at 50% of the normal low setting, which I think means a cap of 75 watts?

Now that I own one, I’ll be trying out a wide variety of stuff because this is a very fun new toy.
 

Jaxx

Well-Known Member
Both the demo bike I rode and the new D40 I picked up today came configured with the ‘engine map’ set to 100% across the board and I was told my bike was configured as it had been at the factory.

In other news:

View attachment 39850View attachment 39851

I had my dealer (Mike’s Bikes in Palo Alto) set it up tubeless and it was a good thing. The rear tire had a manufacturing defect that was causing a bulge on both sides in the sidewall. I was planning to just buy some more rim tape and do the job myself but my wife convinced me $30 was worth it, and lo, it was so true.

I talked to them about a variety of things, like later DI2 conversion on the alloy frame. While it doesn’t have routing for the seatpost battery, their tech guys didn’t think it’d be a problem. If it came to it, they could just drill a hole.

I also asked about the bar-mounted iWoc controls, because I’m not completely sold on the top-tube system.

The bar mount version is designed to fit the flat-bar bikes and wouldn’t fit on drop bars, but it’s also cheap enough ($50) that I’m thinking about having them order one and see if I can modify it to work.

Its very simple — just a ring with two buttons and colored lights to indicate the mode. I’m thinking it would be simple to 3D print a new housing for it.

The other thing I did was try it out in the parking lot because I’ve been pretty confused by the engine mapping feature.

Since it comes from the factory with all three levels at 100%, it’s not remotely clear if that means it ships in max assist all the time or not, from folks here on the forum, I get the strong feeling that’s not the case and in fact when you reduce those settings in the app you’re lowering already lowered output.

A quick test pretty much confirmed that.

So, when I did my 25 mile ride last week, keep in mind I did it mostly at 50% of the normal low setting, which I think means a cap of 75 watts?

Now that I own one, I’ll be trying out a wide variety of stuff because this is a very fun new toy.
Like I mentioned before, 1000 Miles from new I'm still learning from this bike. Many ways of using the assist ie. Backwind no assist. It goes from mild help to stick it in max and jump up the hill. One thing we don't often mention though? This is a seriously comfortable bike, that can be ridden almost like a normal road bike should the battery die on you. Long range rides are not impossible on one charge. At present my other riding bike is a Trek Domane, under my snooker table is a Basso and Storck. They will be staying there for a loooong time, that's how highly I rate the Gain. Have fun.
 

ZJarvis

New Member

First ride on my own personal Gain (the D40), and while I certainly wouldn’t complain about having the lighter carbon frame, this is a perfectly acceptable compromise since I didn’t want to spend a ton of money on a bike right now, but I really needed to get back to riding.

After my experience with the rental bike, I turned up the engine map a little bit. Unfortunately, for no reason I can quite figure out, the Ebikemotion app didn’t record the ride, so I don’t have any kind of readout on what was going on with the motor. Definitely used more juice, though! At the end of my 25 mile ride, I was down to 48% of the battery.

That, however, was from doing basically the entire ride in assist mode 2 (yellow). It was trivially easy to cruise along just under the max-speed (and, honestly, faster if I wanted, just with increasingly less help).

It was the difference between easily doing the ride at the pace I’ve been riding the last couple years, when I’ve been largely off the bike, and easily riding as fast as I’d be in a group.


40048

(Same picture is attached to the Strava ride, but I figured I’d put it here too, because NEW BIKE).

It was an incredibly fun ride, and I‘m pretty sure that as I get more fit I should be able to get basically the same performance out of assist level 1 (green).

I’m still at the coffee shop, and I’m undecided on whether or not I’ll try and ride back up the hill or call in the lagwagon, but I’m pretty sure 48% battery will get me up the hill. It’s only about 3 miles.

Early indications are that this was a very smart purchase.

And, as is my way, I’ve given my bike a scientific name (because why not).

My carbon fiber Time is ‘Velocipes gracilis’, my alloy frame Marin Gestalt is ‘Velocipes robustus’, so I’ve named the Gain ‘Velocipes harrijasotzaile’. That being a particular type of weightlifter in the Basque country where the weights are huge rocks. Seemed apropos!
 

ZJarvis

New Member
I got plucky and decided to take the train to San Bruno and ride the bike home.

I took the simplest route home -- Westborough to Junipero Serra then up King. It was easy until I got to King.

King is not easy. It's hard to get a reliable number, but it has grades between 9% and 14%. My guess is that in actuality it maxes out around 12%, but the data across many rides makes it unclear. Many rides going down that is.

I burned about 30% of the battery over 5.4 miles, and the first 3.8 of which I did in either assist 1 or 2. The rest I poured all over King, and it was rough going in the shape I'm currently in. I did it though!

Unhelpfully, the rear mech needs some minor adjustment. It was routinely dropping the chain between the cassette and the hub when I tried to get into the biggest gear. This wouldn't be as much of a problem if it weren't for that also occasionally convincing the drive system to engage the motor, but thankfully I never got my fingers caught. In the future I want this to never happen, but if it does, I need to remember to power off the bike before fishing the chain out.

Now mind you, it only did this irritating chain trick when it was in max assist and under heavy load at high cadence. I'm hoping it's actually solvable without drilling holes in the cassette and putting some pins in to stop the chain from going too far.
 

Rincon

Active Member
Now mind you, it only did this irritating chain trick when it was in max assist and under heavy load at high cadence. I'm hoping it's actually solvable without drilling holes in the cassette and putting some pins in to stop the chain from going too far.
Adjust the high limit screw on the rear derailleur. You don’t want to drill holes for pins. Cassettes are consumable items. Plastic disk chain guards are available, but just adjust the high limit screw. This is a normal break-in issue for a new bike. If that doesn’t fix it, then take it back to the dealer for a checkup.
 

Jaxx

Well-Known Member
It was very wet today here in the "East Riding of Yorkshire" to give it's full title. Not having any mudguards on my Gain, I decided to take out my Trek Domane (which does) This was my first non electric ride in an age. Two things stood out after my 30 mile ride? Firstly despite the low level off assist offered in eco mode on the Gain, just how effective and boosting it is, for a so called low powered ebike. Secondly the Trek Domane with it's "Isospeed" road absorbing coupling, really does make it a supremely comfortable ride. Surpassing everything I've rode or owned in over 50 years of cycling.
 

ZJarvis

New Member
Adjust the high limit screw on the rear derailleur. You don’t want to drill holes for pins. Cassettes are consumable items. Plastic disk chain guards are available, but just adjust the high limit screw. This is a normal break-in issue for a new bike. If that doesn’t fix it, then take it back to the dealer for a checkup.
The drilling pins comment was just mordant humor on my part.

I stuck the bike on my stand today and pretty quickly got the limit dialed in. The real proof, of course, will be riding it!
 

Ybfly

New Member
Usually just rain here too. We have very mild winters (courtesy of the Gulf Stream) hardly any snow, but we can suffer days of continuous grey clouds. Yes the weight difference is not all that great. However my M20i is now under 25lbs. Changes I've made. Cosmic Carbons, Conti 5000 Tyres, Time Carbon Stem, FSA Nano Carbon Bars, Fizik Aliante Carbon Seat, Time Titan Carbon Pedals, Dura Ace Cassette 12-28 finally ROTOR ULD Chainset (Oval Rings)

Now weighs about the same as my 60's Bob Jackson's 531c road racing bikes.
RE: Oval Rings (nice build btw)

I am interested in one part of your build @Jaxx: ROTOR ULD Chainset (Oval Rings);

How does the Gain cadence based motor switch work with the oval chainrings? I find on the steepest hills the power can cut out if I am not able to maintain smoothness in my cadence. Does the oval chainring make it harder to keep the power feed smooth?

Background:

I have an M30 and have started to modify it for a mixed commute (escape ‘to’ and from San Francisco: roads, mud trail, gravel trail, Golden Gate Bridge and sometimes gravel fire roads). I am rehabilitating a knee surgery (bone-graft to medial femoral condyle) and I need lower gears to get up the steep hill in Sausalito (southbound) and especially so for the steep hills and fire-roads in Marin Headlands. (Note, I’ve already switched tires to Specialized Pathfinder Pro 38mm and set them up tubeless, did notice a tiny drop in efficiency, but nothing worth worrying about).

The LBS is suggesting a 1x11 and putting in a huge cluster in the rear (e.g. 11-46) but the overall utility of the high end road gears is excellent, especially bombing home downhill and on the flats after work on maximum power (if I have it left).

If I stick to a 2x11, one option is to modify the Shimano 105 crankset with smaller Absolute black oval chainrings to decrease the overall number of teeth. This would allow me to combine with an SRAM 11-36 rear cluster as is, or with minor changes, such as a Wolfstooth roadlink put a Shimano 11-40 or even 11-42 rear cluster with the existing rear derailleur. The other option would be a subcompact chain set (e.g. FSA SL-K Modular Adventure BB386EVO Crankset such as 46-30). Thoughts?
 

Jaxx

Well-Known Member
RE: Oval Rings (nice build btw)

I am interested in one part of your build @Jaxx: ROTOR ULD Chainset (Oval Rings);

How does the Gain cadence based motor switch work with the oval chainrings? I find on the steepest hills the power can cut out if I am not able to maintain smoothness in my cadence. Does the oval chainring make it harder to keep the power feed smooth?

Background:

I have an M30 and have started to modify it for a mixed commute (escape ‘to’ and from San Francisco: roads, mud trail, gravel trail, Golden Gate Bridge and sometimes gravel fire roads). I am rehabilitating a knee surgery (bone-graft to medial femoral condyle) and I need lower gears to get up the steep hill in Sausalito (southbound) and especially so for the steep hills and fire-roads in Marin Headlands. (Note, I’ve already switched tires to Specialized Pathfinder Pro 38mm and set them up tubeless, did notice a tiny drop in efficiency, but nothing worth worrying about).

The LBS is suggesting a 1x11 and putting in a huge cluster in the rear (e.g. 11-46) but the overall utility of the high end road gears is excellent, especially bombing home downhill and on the flats after work on maximum power (if I have it left).

If I stick to a 2x11, one option is to modify the Shimano 105 crankset with smaller Absolute black oval chainrings to decrease the overall number of teeth. This would allow me to combine with an SRAM 11-36 rear cluster as is, or with minor changes, such as a Wolfstooth roadlink put a Shimano 11-40 or even 11-42 rear cluster with the existing rear derailleur. The other option would be a subcompact chain set (e.g. FSA SL-K Modular Adventure BB386EVO Crankset such as 46-30). Thoughts?
Ybfly, nice description of your predicament. For me short rides (30 miles) using Rotor rings I don't notice much benefit. After a long ride with plenty of hills however, my recovery is quicker, with less fatigue in the legs the next day. The lowest gear I use is 34x28 as long as I can keep the cadence around 75 rpm on steep climbs? The assist will continue to pump out. I think before you make a decision on the choice of drive train? You should consider your future fitness and recovery, you could be a great deal stronger next year? Would you want a 1x system that offered too lower gears, while not giving you the "Go for it gear?"