Charging to 80% without a Satiator

The duke

Active Member
I don't try to do too much brain damage when figuring out how to charge my bike for maximum battery life. If I charge it to 80% every time, I figure maybe Ill add 100-200 charges if data is correct and not overly optimistic. Theres a certain value to my time making that effort, as well as the peace of mind of having a fully charged battery in case I get a horrendous head wind, decide to take a detour or have someone ask to ride with me or ride my bike.

I use this digital count down timer I bought on amazon for $11. I ballpark it based on how much battery I have and knowing a full charge takes about 5 hours. I'll typically plug in 3 hours when Im down to about 20-30% life left. Usually I end up with 70-90%....sometimes I'll mess up the math and get a full charge, but Id rather do that than undercharge and risk dying somewhere.

https://www.amazon.com/Century-Digital-Countdown-Repeat-Function/dp/B01D3QEK4E/ref=mp_s_a_1_1_sspa?crid=32TPL8TU5ND64&keywords=century+smart+digital+countdown+timer+with+repeat+function&qid=1556311319&s=gateway&sprefix=century+smart+digital&sr=8-1-spons&psc=1
 

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PastorDave

New Member
I don't try to do too much brain damage when figuring out how to charge my bike for maximum battery life. If I charge it to 80% every time, I figure maybe Ill add 100-200 charges if data is correct and not overly optimistic. Theres a certain value to my time making that effort, as well as the peace of mind of having a fully charged battery in case I get a horrendous head wind, decide to take a detour or have someone ask to ride with me or ride my bike.

I use this digital count down timer I bought on amazon for $11. I ballpark it based on how much battery I have and knowing a full charge takes about 5 hours. I'll typically plug in 3 hours when Im down to about 20-30% life left. Usually I end up with 70-90%....sometimes I'll mess up the math and get a full charge, but Id rather do that than undercharge and risk dying somewhere.

https://www.amazon.com/Century-Digital-Countdown-Repeat-Function/dp/B01D3QEK4E/ref=mp_s_a_1_1_sspa?crid=32TPL8TU5ND64&keywords=century+smart+digital+countdown+timer+with+repeat+function&qid=1556311319&s=gateway&sprefix=century+smart+digital&sr=8-1-spons&psc=1
Thank you! That is useful advice!
 

DDBB

Well-Known Member
Considering a new battery can cost a thousand dollars in some cases, some simple math for timed chargers to less than 100% capacity is no biggie when it means a considerable increase in cycle life
 
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bikerjohn

Well-Known Member
Another consideration is to know that a "full" charge, using the standard charger supplied with the Juiced CCX, does not charge the battery to 100% full charge. The charger supplied tops-off the voltage to 57.7 volts (about 93% full). Any top-off under 100% helps to reduce wear on the battery and increase it's useful life -although to a less extent than an 80% top-off charge which is considered optimal.:p
Any top-off voltage under 100 % adds useful life by increasing the total viable recharge cycles.
A worse situation for battery stress is in allowing the discharge voltage to drop below about 45.4 volts (20%).:eek:
 

Thomas Jaszewski

Well-Known Member
Wow I had no idea just charging the battery would be this complicated. I am totally lost. I never was great at math. Perhaps e-biking is not for me.
Then don't worry about it! You'll still get a heck of a lot of miles between batteries. I have a battery I broke most rules, except storing in a hot place it's in it's the 5th season. But you can increase it and I'd be happy to help sort it with you. Don't shy away because of charging. I'm an old goat and lousy with math. I can do it! My drunken DUI buddy can even do it!
 

Thomas Jaszewski

Well-Known Member
Considering a new battery can cost a thousand dollars in some cases, some simple math for timed chargers to less than 100% capacity is no biggie when it means a considerable increase in cycle life
Buy a bike with a standard battery case design if that price isn't doable. You can replace typical batteries for $500.

Usually that high a price is for a battery that has communication protocols. And it'll be a $3000 and up bike.
 

The duke

Active Member
Another consideration is to know that a "full" charge, using the standard charger supplied with the Juiced CCX, does not charge the battery to 100% full charge. The charger supplied tops-off the voltage to 57.7 volts (about 93% full). Any top-off under 100% helps to reduce wear on the battery and increase it's useful life -although to a less extent than an 80% top-off charge which is considered optimal.:p
Any top-off voltage under 100 % adds useful life by increasing the total viable recharge cycles.
A worse situation for battery stress is in allowing the discharge voltage to drop below about 45.4 volts (20%).:eek:
Just out of curiosity, does all this hold true for my smartphone too?
 

bikerjohn

Well-Known Member
Just out of curiosity, does all this hold true for my smartphone too?
Just a guess, it probably is a matter of circuitry design in the charger. All confusion aside, it seems to me there is an ever growing knowledge base on optimizing useful Li-Ion battery life. Understanding optimal Li-Ion battery life is learning there are consequences related to over-charging, excessive drain down, excessive temperature, and cell damage, -all can cause longevity issues.
 

DDBB

Well-Known Member
Yes, it DOES apply to your cell phone battery. I don't know what the charging alogrithm is for your phone but plugging it in each night and leaving it plugged in will reduce cycle life. That being said, I know of no-one that monitors charging of their cell phone and stops the charge at 80% ... cellphone batteries are cheap by comparison and last a few years anyway, even if abused
 

Thomas Jaszewski

Well-Known Member
Yes, it DOES apply to your cell phone battery. I don't know what the charging algorithm is for your phone but plugging it in each night and leaving it plugged in will reduce cycle life. That being said, I know of no-one that monitors charging of their cell phone and stops the charge at 80% ... cellphone batteries are cheap by comparison and last a few years anyway, even if abused
I'd love to find a source confirming that. I've had my iPad plugged in 12 hours a do for 4 years and I still get HOURS of use. I always suspected they had an algorithm that managed battery in the best possible manner. Not intended to dis your post, I'm just hungry to learn more about battery management!
 

DDBB

Well-Known Member
No doubt our cell phones prevent over discharge and over charge but as far as having a sophisticated alogrithm? I guess it depends on your definition of sophisticated . My guess is it's a pretty simple formula not allowing 100% charge or more than 80% discharge and possibly some temp triggered shutdown. Just a guess though!.. IMO the satiator is over priced for what it can do.. A good hobby grade multi chemistry charger can do WAY more for 1/3 the price. The problem is most are limited to a maximum of 10 cells.
 
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PastorDave

New Member
So I got the Juiced CCS with the 48v battery. After several days of riding I estimate that I could probably go about 40 miles if I were to completely drain a full battery. I don’t want to go below 20% so that makes my effective range about 32. If I were to only charge to 80% that means my effective range becomes 24 miles. That’s just not enough. It looks like I will wind up charging to full most of the time. Maybe I will buy a second battery...
 

Rob02150

Active Member
So I got the Juiced CCS with the 48v battery. After several days of riding I estimate that I could probably go about 40 miles if I were to completely drain a full battery. I don’t want to go below 20% so that makes my effective range about 32. If I were to only charge to 80% that means my effective range becomes 24 miles. That’s just not enough. It looks like I will wind up charging to full most of the time. Maybe I will buy a second battery...
I've had my CCS for over a year and have over 2,000 miles on it. I charge until full and go until about 20% (42V on display) and have had no issues at all. I'm about 155 lbs and always get 30-35 miles per charge. That's going an average of 20-25 mph using different modes the whole time and light throttle here and there. Once your battery cells start to degrade in a couple years you can reach out to a battery company who can replace all the cells and get you back running. 18650 batteries are very popular and more and more companies will be offering battery repair services over times.
 

Bruce Arnold

Well-Known Member
Wow I had no idea just charging the battery would be this complicated. I am totally lost. I never was great at math. Perhaps e-biking is not for me.
Like any hobby, people can get fascinated by the smallest detail. Go on any motorcycle forum and watch what happens when someone brings up oil. Oil!

Buy a bike you like that meets your needs. Enjoy riding it. Don't let the battery get too low. Recharge as often and as high as you like -- the BMS won't let you overcharge. You may not get quite the miles out of the life of the battery that some of the people do who really, really get into the whole battery thing, but you will get many years and many thousands of miles of fun and utility out of it.

Pretty much describing how I do it. It really is that simple.
 
When I got my bike I was in much worse shape, and used way more of my battery on my 30 mile commute than I do now. I can safely do 20-80 now, but I couldn't when I started last year. So you might find yourself in the same position as you go forward.
 

bikerjohn

Well-Known Member
Like any hobby, people can get fascinated by the smallest detail. Go on any motorcycle forum and watch what happens when someone brings up oil. Oil!

Buy a bike you like that meets your needs. Enjoy riding it. Don't let the battery get too low. Recharge as often and as high as you like -- the BMS won't let you overcharge. You may not get quite the miles out of the life of the battery that some of the people do who really, really get into the whole battery thing, but you will get many years and many thousands of miles of fun and utility out of it.

Pretty much describing how I do it. It really is that simple.
It's not difficult to grasp the overall concept of battery wear. Even with the most sparing use of a Li-Ion battery, it ultimately will need to be replaced sooner or later! A battery, rechargeable or not, for any device, is meant to be replaced periodically.