eMTB mode on BULLS

Discussion in 'BULLS Forum' started by Ravi Kempaiah, Jul 20, 2017.

  1. Ravi Kempaiah

    Ravi Kempaiah Well-Known Member

    I took the updated BULLS Six50+ for a ride today.
    SIX50-E-FS-3.jpg


    My initial thoughts:
    1. Provides a certain level of cognitive ease. If your shifting techniques aren't sharp then the motor will compensate for it and the experience is quite enjoyable.
    2. Dynamic assist is useful when climbing some steep technical sections and when you don't want to lose the momentum.
    3. Loss of range. On my other Haibike (S Rx), I only use Tour mode and very rarely the sport mode. This gives me ~30 miles on a 400whr powerpack.
      But on a eMTB with knobby tires, eMTB mode and 500whr powerpack, I only got 29miles. I rode mostly on single tracks and it was not hilly. I can attribute this to the higher consumption in eMTB mode.
    4. Personally, I would not get this update. Simply because the system is exerting itself too much and sometimes I feel like I only need minimal assistance. It suits those who doesn't care about the range and prefer very sporty riding dynamics. Sadly, there is no option to revert back to the older firmware once you update it.
     
    JRA likes this.


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  3. Sonoboy

    Sonoboy Active Member

    Ravi, does your Walk Assist work with the new firmware? Did it work before?
     
  4. Craig Crowder

    Craig Crowder Member

    My experience with eMTB mode (version 1.7.0.0) was different on my BULLS Six50+ FS 3. I found the assist level was generally weaker than sport mode and it required me to use my legs more than before the update. I also liked startups on the steeps better, it was not as abrupt and had less wheel spin. Eco, tour and turbo modes are still there so there should be very little difference to those who don't use sport mode much. Since updating to eMTB mode I've only been on one 10.5 mile ride with some very steep sections and so far I haven't noticed an increase in battery consumption, I'll have a more informed opinion about eMTB range after I get a few more rides in.
     
  5. Rincon

    Rincon Active Member

    I'm not familiar with eMTB mode. Is it a fourth mode in addition to eco, tour and turbo mode? In other words is it optional?
     
  6. Sonoboy

    Sonoboy Active Member

    No, it's not an additional power level. It's the new name for the previously named 'SPORT' setting. Except now, instead of adding a discrete 200% to the riders input torque as a set value, it adds a range of torque from 120% to 300%, essentially replacing the three mode ranges of tour, sport, and turbo based on the riders torque input. It allows you to keep your eyes on the trail without having to keep making click adjustments to the controls.

    So, the four levels are now:
    Turbo = 300% discrete torque value added (up to the maximum of 75 Newton-meters or 55.3 ft-lbs)
    Sport/eMTB = 120-300% variable torque range added based on pedal pressure (input torque)
    Tour = 120% discrete torque value added
    Eco = 50% discrete torque value added

    Some have stated they see a faster battery drain in the new 'sport/eMTB' setting. But you can still select any of the other three and they will act the same as the previous firmware version.

    Edit: corrected range values
    2nd Edit: added max torque note
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2017
    Rincon likes this.
  7. Mark Peralta

    Mark Peralta Well-Known Member

    It depends on how strong your legs are. The torque sensor on MTB mode is reprogrammed to be hypersensitive and assigned assist values that spans from the equivalent of eco mode in the lower end (weak pedal force) up to Turbo mode on the upper end (strong pedal force).

    If you have forceful legs, then you are going to consume the battery quickly as if you were in the turbo mode most of the time. On the other hand, if you have weak legs, then you consume less battery, and get longer mileage.
     
    Sonoboy likes this.
  8. Craig Crowder

    Craig Crowder Member

    From the Bosch website;

    "The eMTB mode replaces the former eMountainbikes sport mode with the Performance Line CX and varies between travel mode tour and turbo. With a maximum torque up to 75 Nm strenghtens the engine the driver's personal contribution between 120 % und 300 %.

    Depending on the pedal pressure the progressive motor support adjusts automatically to the individual way of riding. Completely without shifting gears the engine supports slight RPMs constantly with ideal performance. The ride on steep slopes is effortless, moving forward on the terrain is considerably easier. This ensures a natural riding sensation and maximum performance on the trail.

    Link: https://www.bosch-ebike.com/us-en/news-and-stories/news/the-new-emtb-mode/
     
    Sonoboy likes this.
  9. Sonoboy

    Sonoboy Active Member

    Thanks, I stand corrected on the percentage at the lower range value.
     
  10. Craig Crowder

    Craig Crowder Member

    I was having a hard time explaining how it felt, this review explains it better;

    "As the pedal-assist now progressively adjusts as you’re riding, the Bosch CX motor does deliver a more natural sensation, distributing its power in a more mellow manner rather than lurching forward at the first touch of the pedals.

    On technical off-road climbs the eMTB mode generates more control and demonstrates better capability at modulating the power. However, this is primarily an asset on really technical sections with steps, big obstacles or other hurdles that most E-MTB riders will only rarely encounter on their trail rides. On more mellow uphill gradients, the eMTB mode isn’t noticeably different to the Turbo mode, as even the eMTB mode tends to provide full pedal-assist in such situations anyway. This makes the Turbo mode somewhat redundant, as the eMTB mode offers the same maximum power with better modulation."

    Link: http://ebike-mtb.com/en/emtb-mode-bosch-cx-review/
     
    Sonoboy likes this.
  11. Mark Peralta

    Mark Peralta Well-Known Member

    Yes very helpful on situations where you need to downshift but has no time to do it since you are already climbing a rock. A downshift would cause lose of momentum to a halt but stepping on it in MTB mode will dramatically increase the assist level equivalent to turbo mode.

    However, there are situations, especially on level roads, where you want to control how much assist is coming from the motor, so the sport mode is still valuable for the road bound ebikes (as opposed to off road ebikes).