Juiced ccx review and mileage question

SDrider

New Member
I got my ccx in early August as a commuter for a 25 mile round trip. I have been commuting on it 5 days a week and the ride has become the highlight of my day, sad to say. I live in San Diego, so I had Juiced deliver the bike already assembled, which is a nice option for those in the area. The bike feels really solid and very stable at higher speeds. I did change out the handle bars to the Jones H Bar 2.5, which was a great change. I did not have to adjust any of the wiring or grips, everything went on without issue. It really takes the pressure off my wrists. I have added extra tail and head lights (Cygolite Metro 1100 and hotshot), I did not realize what a difference they would make day or night. The rear light that comes with the bike was crap. I also have Ortlieb gravel pack panniers. Really like the bags, but keep thinking I could use a bit more space. There is a bit of a learning curve about managing gear I carry. I do have a Grin Cycle Satiator, which I have programmed to top out at 55.4v. I'm having trouble figuring out what the best profile would be to extend the life of the battery. The only issue I've found is with the breaks. I've had to adjust the levers a couple of times as they where pulling in to almost the handle bars. The front break clicks when I break, still need to check that out. I have not ridden other ebikes, so I might be biased, but the bike is a real blast and I don't have to deal with the traffic anymore. I chose the bike as I wanted something that was really made for commuting. I ride mostly on level 3 for the sheer fun and to get off the busy sections of the ride as fast as possible. This brings me to my question:

I am using about 30% of my battery for about 13 miles. I start at 55.4v (80%) and end at 50.6v. My wh is 296, 5.9 Ah. This seems to be pretty poor, but I am averaging about 25 mph. I give the battery a 2.5 hour charge at work on the basic charger, which brings me back to about 75%. It seems like I should be getting better range from the battery or maybe I'm delusional about my expectations. Does this sound normal, I'm really not sure how to gauge this, I'm still trying to figure out battery management. When I first got the bike, I had not changed the charging profile and was going to 56.2v and I could get home at about 50v and did not have to charge at work. If anyone has any insight on what to look at or how to judge this, I'd appreciate the insight. Just trying to figure this out as I go. I was going to start riding at lower assists but like the fun factor too much.

One of the greatest parts is I only go to the gas station one a month, if that. I still have to drive every once in a while. My experience with their customer service has been mixed. I've had some very helpful people during the purchase, but if I've had a technical question, they've been no help. I understand that I'm clueless about most things, but a bit of effort would have been nice. So far, I'm really happy with the bike, it's been 600 miles of plug and play with no real issues.
 

youth

Active Member
I average around 400wh for 16 miles in level 3 & S. The speed is addictive plus I ride on suburban roads with 45mph limits so it helps me feel a little safer. The range would probably more then double if you keep it under 20.

Had the Satiator since Dec about the same time got the CCX & these numbers mostly represent one way of the 32.4mi commute. I use the OEM charger with a timer at work.
38583
 
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linklemming

Active Member
I got my ccx in early August as a commuter for a 25 mile round trip. I have been commuting on it 5 days a week and the ride has become the highlight of my day, sad to say. I live in San Diego, so I had Juiced deliver the bike already assembled, which is a nice option for those in the area. The bike feels really solid and very stable at higher speeds. I did change out the handle bars to the Jones H Bar 2.5, which was a great change. I did not have to adjust any of the wiring or grips, everything went on without issue. It really takes the pressure off my wrists. I have added extra tail and head lights (Cygolite Metro 1100 and hotshot), I did not realize what a difference they would make day or night. The rear light that comes with the bike was crap. I also have Ortlieb gravel pack panniers. Really like the bags, but keep thinking I could use a bit more space. There is a bit of a learning curve about managing gear I carry. I do have a Grin Cycle Satiator, which I have programmed to top out at 55.4v. I'm having trouble figuring out what the best profile would be to extend the life of the battery. The only issue I've found is with the breaks. I've had to adjust the levers a couple of times as they where pulling in to almost the handle bars. The front break clicks when I break, still need to check that out. I have not ridden other ebikes, so I might be biased, but the bike is a real blast and I don't have to deal with the traffic anymore. I chose the bike as I wanted something that was really made for commuting. I ride mostly on level 3 for the sheer fun and to get off the busy sections of the ride as fast as possible. This brings me to my question:

I am using about 30% of my battery for about 13 miles. I start at 55.4v (80%) and end at 50.6v. My wh is 296, 5.9 Ah. This seems to be pretty poor, but I am averaging about 25 mph. I give the battery a 2.5 hour charge at work on the basic charger, which brings me back to about 75%. It seems like I should be getting better range from the battery or maybe I'm delusional about my expectations. Does this sound normal, I'm really not sure how to gauge this, I'm still trying to figure out battery management. When I first got the bike, I had not changed the charging profile and was going to 56.2v and I could get home at about 50v and did not have to charge at work. If anyone has any insight on what to look at or how to judge this, I'd appreciate the insight. Just trying to figure this out as I go. I was going to start riding at lower assists but like the fun factor too much.

One of the greatest parts is I only go to the gas station one a month, if that. I still have to drive every once in a while. My experience with their customer service has been mixed. I've had some very helpful people during the purchase, but if I've had a technical question, they've been no help. I understand that I'm clueless about most things, but a bit of effort would have been nice. So far, I'm really happy with the bike, it's been 600 miles of plug and play with no real issues.
Nothing wrong with the ride being the highlight of your day. It certainly is the highlight of my day but I work from home so I get alot of variety in my rides and see alot of wildlife.

I say given your average speed of 25mph, your battery usage(22.8wh/mile) sounds about right. My rides usually average about 19-20mph and are specifically for fitness (not speed) and I use at the most 20wh/mile. My fastest ride ever was 21mph average and about 23wh/mile. I do live at 5400ft so wind drag is a little less. I have a much smaller chainring (42t) so I spin out at a lower speed and most of my rides are >60% offroad where I just cant go any faster due to corners/traction and obstacles.

The power usage required from 20mph to 25mph is quite a bit.

Here is a link you can use
http://bikecalculator.com/
 
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SDrider

New Member
I average around 400wh for 16 miles in level 3 & S. The speed is addictive plus I ride on suburban roads with 45mph limits so it helps me feel a little safer. The range would probably more then double if you keep it under 20.

Had the Satiator since Dec about the same time got the CCX & these numbers mostly represent one way of the 32.4mi commute. I use the OEM charger with a timer at work.
View attachment 38583
Thanks for the info, it's a bit of a learning curve, but so far that's been a good part of the fun. I seem to start the first few miles with good intention on reserving battery life, but that goes out the window pretty quickly.
 

SDrider

New Member
Nothing wrong with the ride being the highlight of your day. It certainly is the highlight of my day but I work from home so I get alot of variety in my rides and see alot of wildlife.

I say given your average speed of 25mph, your battery usage(22.8wh/mile) sounds about right. My rides usually average about 19-20mph and are specifically for fitness (not speed) and I use at the most 20wh/mile. My fastest ride ever was 21mph average and about 23wh/mile. I do live at 5400ft so wind drag is a little less. I have a much smaller chainring (42t) so I spin out at a lower speed and most of my rides are >60% offroad where I just cant go any faster due to corners/traction and obstacles.

The power usage required from 20mph to 25mph is quite a bit.

Here is a link you can use
http://bikecalculator.com/
This is helpful, appreciate you taking the time and thanks for the link. I guess you pay the price for speed, I need to start thinking in wh's. Appreciate the confirmation, seems like I'm always charging the battery and was concerned I was missing something.
 

xerxez

Member
Good information. I'm waiting for my ebike. The cost for speed is not cheap in Amp-hours. I'm still learning.
 

Bruce Arnold

Well-Known Member
There are a lot of factors that affect battery performance. Total weight (bike plus rider plus gear), wind, terrain, stops/starts (cruising takes less power than starting, say from a stop light), and so forth.

Even how hard you pedal makes a difference, because the torque sensor will respond with more power if you push hard. If you drop down one gear from what you usually use for a given speed, you will spin faster to maintain the speed but it will take less torque, hence less battery for equivalent velocity.

Air resistance matters more the faster you go, especially over 20 mph.

The Eco setting really sips power, but you have to work harder for faster speeds. The S setting blows through watts like crazy, but it's crazy fun.

So do some experimenting with PAS levels and gears. Maybe time also. If battery capacity is that important to you, then could your commute be a few minutes longer?

And then there's this: unless you do something really stupid, like leaving your battery in the sun in 100 degree heat or draining it to 0% every time you use it, you're going to get many years' use out of it. Tinkering with how you charge it will make some difference in the long run, but how much? Yeah, I've seen the charts. I'm waiting to hear from real riders using the actual batteries that Juiced provides. There are more and more of us out there, and we'll be hearing more about battery longevity before long.

When it comes to this stuff, I think more like an engineer than like a scientist. My bike and my wife's Pedego have already paid for themselves in less car usage. (We've had them for a year and a half.) From now on, every bit of money that we save could be put aside to buy a new battery when the time comes. I'm not worried about getting the absolute most out of my battery, I just don't want to buy a new battery every couple of years. So far, so good.

I have one of the no-longer-made 17.4 Ah, 48 V batteries. It had the usual drop in capacity over the first few months -- this just happens, no matter how careful you are, because of chemistry -- but since then I've noticed no significant decrease in capacity at all. This is how lithium ion batteries behave: an initial drop in capacity, a long fairly flat plateau, and then a faster decrease towards the end of their useful life. If I get another year and a half out of this battery, I will consider it a winner.

I'd like to upgrade to the 19 Ah, 52 V battery at some point anyway, not so much for capacity as for performance -- higher voltage means hotter performance.
 

SDrider

New Member
There are a lot of factors that affect battery performance. Total weight (bike plus rider plus gear), wind, terrain, stops/starts (cruising takes less power than starting, say from a stop light), and so forth.

Even how hard you pedal makes a difference, because the torque sensor will respond with more power if you push hard. If you drop down one gear from what you usually use for a given speed, you will spin faster to maintain the speed but it will take less torque, hence less battery for equivalent velocity.

Air resistance matters more the faster you go, especially over 20 mph.

The Eco setting really sips power, but you have to work harder for faster speeds. The S setting blows through watts like crazy, but it's crazy fun.

So do some experimenting with PAS levels and gears. Maybe time also. If battery capacity is that important to you, then could your commute be a few minutes longer?

And then there's this: unless you do something really stupid, like leaving your battery in the sun in 100 degree heat or draining it to 0% every time you use it, you're going to get many years' use out of it. Tinkering with how you charge it will make some difference in the long run, but how much? Yeah, I've seen the charts. I'm waiting to hear from real riders using the actual batteries that Juiced provides. There are more and more of us out there, and we'll be hearing more about battery longevity before long.

When it comes to this stuff, I think more like an engineer than like a scientist. My bike and my wife's Pedego have already paid for themselves in less car usage. (We've had them for a year and a half.) From now on, every bit of money that we save could be put aside to buy a new battery when the time comes. I'm not worried about getting the absolute most out of my battery, I just don't want to buy a new battery every couple of years. So far, so good.

I have one of the no-longer-made 17.4 Ah, 48 V batteries. It had the usual drop in capacity over the first few months -- this just happens, no matter how careful you are, because of chemistry -- but since then I've noticed no significant decrease in capacity at all. This is how lithium ion batteries behave: an initial drop in capacity, a long fairly flat plateau, and then a faster decrease towards the end of their useful life. If I get another year and a half out of this battery, I will consider it a winner.

I'd like to upgrade to the 19 Ah, 52 V battery at some point anyway, not so much for capacity as for performance -- higher voltage means hotter performance.
I agree with what you've said, there is a lot of experimentation to find what works. I think I'm still in the honeymoon phase and just giving a couple hour charge at work for a full speed run home. I am starting to get more in tune with the cadence and torque sensors and how they behave. I have noticed a drop as you mentioned, hopefully this will level off.