Orbea Gain M30 Motor sensor problem ?

arao99

New Member
Hi I have been riding my Gain for the last two weeks on holiday in France on their wonderful bike paths . I have not had to use power most of the time but turned it on yesterday to level 1 for some 10% climbs through the forests , the power came in after one revolution straight to full assistance and would stay on full just by turning the pedals in a very low gear and without any effort on my part flew up the hills . the app. did not show any percentage power at all . I tried in level two and three and I seemed to have more power. the power comes in and out very quickly , it was like having a throttle . Has anyone else experienced this problem. It was great fun but used the battery quickly.
 

MikeDee

Active Member
I'm not seeing this issue at all, but you can use the phone app to adjust the power percentage for each level. You have to have the system turned on and the app paired to the system. It's under Motor Maps in the app. Changes must be saved to be effective. The system does not have a torque sensor, only a cadence sensor, that tells the system whether you are pedaling or not.
 

arao99

New Member
Hi Mike
I see that the bike does not have Torque sensor but it only give power when you push on the pedals and gives more power the harder you push . I put the app on to try and see what was going on ,it showed 90%
battery but 0 power on the gauge when in motion. Today I turned the power down on level 1 to less than 40% but it had no effect on the power that was put out by the motor , I used 8% in about 2.5 miles. the bike was flying against the wind with little or no effort from me. maybe its the PASS sensor in the crank that is faulty.
 

wpottinger

New Member
Hi I have been riding my Gain for the last two weeks on holiday in France on their wonderful bike paths . I have not had to use power most of the time but turned it on yesterday to level 1 for some 10% climbs through the forests , the power came in after one revolution straight to full assistance and would stay on full just by turning the pedals in a very low gear and without any effort on my part flew up the hills . the app. did not show any percentage power at all . I tried in level two and three and I seemed to have more power. the power comes in and out very quickly , it was like having a throttle . Has anyone else experienced this problem. It was great fun but used the battery quickly.
Without a torque sensor the X35 system can only sense RPM, and can't tell whether a cyclist is pedaling hard (increased torque) or gently (reduced torque). When it senses crank RPM (edit: actually cassette RPM since that is where the PAS sensor is located) the motor applies the amount of power called for by the user-configurable preset (e.g., 20% for level 1, etc.). Riding any Specialized E-bikes, all of which have torque sensing motors, clearly demonstrates the difference. Getting that technology into a sub-30 lb bike for under $3k to compete with Orbea's rideability and exceptional value is the challenge!
 
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arao99

New Member
My M30 gain has now been repaired my Local bike shop Bache Brothers Cycles of Stourbridge . They have replaced the battery and associated electronics, fantastic service as this is not the dealer I bought the bike from. They told me my bike was giving 250w power all the time ,hence why it was hard to control at low speed . The national chain that I bought it from said there was nothing wrong with it.
 
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MikeDee

Active Member
Without a torque sensor the X35 system can only sense RPM, and can't tell whether a cyclist is pedaling hard (increased torque) or gently (reduced torque). When it senses crank RPM (edit: actually cassette RPM since that is where the PAS sensor is located) the motor applies the amount of power called for by the user-configurable preset (e.g., 20% for level 1, etc.). Riding any Specialized E-bikes, all of which have torque sensing motors, clearly demonstrates the difference. Getting that technology into a sub-30 lb bike for under $3k to compete with Orbea's rideability and exceptional value is the challenge!
It's a little more than that, as power is applied more or less depending on speed of the bike. There's a power profile built into the control system. Torque sensors are needed for bottom bracket motors because you don't want a lot of power being applied to the cranks when you make a shift. Hub motors don't have that constraint.
 

Solom01

Active Member
Unfortunately people seem to think that whatever flavor of motor they prefer is the answer to everything. If we assume that Cannondale has some idea of what they're doing it's interesting to see that for their lower end ebikes like the Synapse Neo Se they use a mid Bosch system with torque sensing. When they built a high end ebike meant for people who wanted a bike that was as bike-like as possible such as the Supersix Evo Neo they used the ebikemotion system, a PAS rear hub system. Bottom bracket mounted drives mess up the Q factor, are heavier and have other issues that don't apply to the ebikemotion system. That's not to say that there aren't terrible hub drives, but they tend to be found in cheap ebikes. The Cannondale Supersix is hardly a cheap bike and Cannondale could easily have used a Bosch drive at that price range - but they didn't.