pricing

#4
a lot of the huge haibike discounts are gone, aren't they? like back in April ~ June due to over manufacturer, etc? You might want to keep discounts hush as there is a MAP policy. Just make some calls man !
 
#6
sorry guys, I didnt know there was a policy against free exchange of information about bike pricing on this forum. Luckily I did find a good price thanks to a member here and purchased a bike. It should be here by the end of next week
Thanks!
 

bob armani

Well-Known Member
#7
sorry guys, I didnt know there was a policy against free exchange of information about bike pricing on this forum. Luckily I did find a good price thanks to a member here and purchased a bike. It should be here by the end of next week
Thanks!
Which E-bike did you decide on during purchase? Was it last years model?
 
#9
a lot of the huge haibike discounts are gone, aren't they? like back in April ~ June due to over manufacturer, etc? You might want to keep discounts hush as there is a MAP policy. Just make some calls man !
I dont know the exact story so please correct me if wrong, I thought I read that Dicks sporting goods dropped Haibike leaving them with inventory that they expected to be spoken for. I read that the move had huge repercussions on the entire US distribution business.
 
#10
a lot of the huge haibike discounts are gone, aren't they? like back in April ~ June due to over manufacturer, etc? You might want to keep discounts hush as there is a MAP policy. Just make some calls man !
Sorry if I offended anybody. I wasn't aware of these restrictions on a discussion board.

I thought MAP policies applied to retailers advertising not to private parties discussing their purchases.
 
#11
Sorry if I offended anybody. I wasn't aware of these restrictions on a discussion board.

I thought MAP policies applied to retailers advertising not to private parties discussing their purchases.
Touchy subject around here lately. I have not seen it expressly indicated that it was frowned upon, but if you hang around long enough you will pick up some subtle editing or removal of etailers names in threads. I had hoped that it would be addressed in a proper thread so that we could know the ground rules, but I have not seen a stated policy on it at this point. I also know Court has so many other things on his plate, that it may not be important enough to address, but if you yourself had an edited post, it feels rather personal.
 
#12
Touchy subject around here lately. I have not seen it expressly indicated that it was frowned upon, but if you hang around long enough you will pick up some subtle editing or removal of etailers names in threads. I had hoped that it would be addressed in a proper thread so that we could know the ground rules, but I have not seen a stated policy on it at this point. I also know Court has so many other things on his plate, that it may not be important enough to address, but if you yourself had an edited post, it feels rather personal.
In my opinion this is a shame, Forums should be for the members and should allow for open exchange of information both positive and negative. But they have become sales channels and cater more to vendors who pay, which helps to keep the forums operating. Unfortunately that means we have to live with censorship. This is one of the more censored forums that I've joined and it's really too bad, owners here cannot get info on good buying experiences.

I came here because of Court's youtube reviews but after a while I could see that the reviews are given from behind a set of rose colored glasses and his relationship with the manufacturers seems to be more a part of the agenda than a balanced assessment of the product.

I had a really good experience with the retailer that I purchased my bike from and they gave me a great price too. It's too bad that I cant openly tell other people about it...

Being censored is not what forums are about
 
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#13
If there is a policy against free exchange of price information on this board, then Court should be notified, I can't believe he would maintain a board that so blatantly served dealers at the expense of the thousands of riders who are members here...
 

bob armani

Well-Known Member
#14
Touchy subject around here lately. I have not seen it expressly indicated that it was frowned upon, but if you hang around long enough you will pick up some subtle editing or removal of etailers names in threads. I had hoped that it would be addressed in a proper thread so that we could know the ground rules, but I have not seen a stated policy on it at this point. I also know Court has so many other things on his plate, that it may not be important enough to address, but if you yourself had an edited post, it feels rather personal.
WT-Very well said. My sentiments exactly. Not sure why they are not more flexible with this issue on this forum. We are not trying to market or sell anything for any private enterprise, etc.
 

bob armani

Well-Known Member
#15
In my opinion this is a shame, Forums should be for the members and should allow for open exchange of information both positive and negative. But they have become sales channels and cater more to vendors who pay, which helps to keep the forums operating. Unfortunately that means we have to live with censorship. This is one of the more censored forums that I've joined and it's really too bad, owners here cannot get info on good buying experiences.

I came here because of Court's youtube reviews but after a while I could see that the reviews are given from behind a set of rose colored glasses and his relationship with the manufacturers seems to be more a part of the agenda than a balanced assessment of the product.

I had a really good experience with the retailer that I purchased my bike from and they gave me a great price too. It's too bad that I cant openly tell other people about it...

Being censored is not what forums are about
My 2 cents-If a forum member draws more interest to purchases made by another member, they can always send a PM to your inbox without any worries of breaking forum rules IMO.
 

Alaskan

Well-Known Member
#16
I think there is an issue that might be misunderstood and should command our respect or at least discretion. Sometimes it is not just a matter of forum rules

Manufacturers in many categories (including ebikes) try to control their brand, pricing and discount policy down to the retail level. They do so to the point of expressly forbidding their retailers from offering any unauthorized discounts.

If a retailer with excess inventory and willing to operate on tighter margins, offers the product to the end buyer at an unapproved discount they may be putting their relationship to the manufacturer and their ability to buy more inventory at risk.

While it's tempting to inform others after getting a great deal under these circumstances, discretion should dictate communicating it privately as opposed to broadcasting it on a public forum, which may hurt the very retailer that helped you with lower pricing.
 
#17
@Alaskan - BINGO ! You sir, know how this game is played. Can you imagine being a Haibike dealer with a sustainable profit margin on your sales, only to have the manufacturer say 'We are cutting the price 40-60% for these leftovers - clear 'em out'!! You not only lose a great deal of what would have kept your store afloat, but you know just tripled the amount of warranty work that will come through the door. Yea, you sold a LOT of bikes last year, but the typical buyer was buying simply because it was a rock-bottom price. They won't necessarily be buying gear, accessories or attire at that store - not like the guy that bought it the year before at full price.

Also, there are a few high end etailers that list a 'Call for price' so they can skirt these deep discount issues. Yes,it very much pays to shop around, but what each bike sells for is not a constant, depending on time of year, or excess inventory.

@bob armani -if I had to hazard a guess on why it is edited in the forums, it would be to eliminate 'plants', or posters whose sole reason for joining and posting is to push shoppers to a certain store. We all would typically recommend the same bike that we bought from the same etailer that we purchased from - NOBODY wants to admit they overpaid or bought from a crappy vendor.
 

Court

Administrator
Staff member
#18
Hi @flynbulldog, I'm glad you found a great deal on an ebike that fits your lifestyle. Price is a sensitive subject around here for a couple of important reasons. I'll be as transparent as possible:
  1. Have you noticed that there are very few ads on the forums (and EBR in general). My goal is to provide an open space where people can discuss products without getting too much into promotion, discounting, and critical comparisons. There have been situations here one person was excited about a Pedego and another jumped in and made them feel bad about the price because "kits are cheaper" or "you can get similar things online" etc. etc. and it sort of ruins the fun and excitement the original person was expressing. Perhaps that person liked how Pedego's looked or appreciated the dealer network or whatever, and they just wanted to talk about the bike. On other occasions, an individual would be talking about how great their local Haibike dealer was and how they were on the verge of purchasing locally when a member of this forum representing a shop would chime in and say "buy from us online and we'll beat their price" which changes the atmosphere again... I chose to remove brand advertisements and forego valuable revenue with EBR to set the tone of this space being less about pricing and more about experience and connection. Yes, there are ads along the bottom of all pages here... the very bottom ;) and any shop can sign up for that. I spent over $150k and lots of hours with developers to build that system and I manually signed up nearly every shop that is listed over the phone. I pay $6k+ per month on programming support, website hosting, moderation, content creation, legal fees... and that doesn't include my travel, food etc. I could be taking commissions or secretly partnering with any one of these dealers, many have offered, but I don't... because I want to stay objective and separate from sales. Yes, I do tend to have rose tinted glasses during my reviews, but I am still thorough and objective about trade offs and considerations. I feel that it's okay to be excited about a cheaply made product, for example, because it may be all that a young or unemployed person can afford... though I still mention the trade-offs in my videos and write ups.
  2. Many manufacturers do have MSRP (manufacturer suggested retail pricing) which shops can dip below if they wish... and MAP (minimum advertised pricing) which they cannot, at least until the end of a season or some other set time. I do my best to uphold and honor those pricing guidelines by limiting conversation about pricing here to one specific forum area, the Items, Parts, and Promotions by-Dealer or Brand, which is also located at the very bottom of the homepage. We have posted about this forum communications policy before and direct messaged many users, I added a new post in the Forum Rules and Etiquette section today called Policy on Sharing Promotions and Pricing Information to clarify further. Even with these policies and gentle guidance to dealers (sometimes multiple guidance email conversations and phone calls) there have been direct-messaging campaigns on here where users will be contacted with below MAP pricing... and that's disheartening and potentially damaging to the relationship of trust that I have with each of you. I value your privacy and strive to reduce any spam that you might otherwise receive. Your emails are not sold or shared.
TLDR: EBR and I requests that users not discuss the pricing of ebikes because it changes the atmosphere, I set the example by limiting ads and foregoing income and instead have invested heavily in an open system where any dealer can join. I do not receive commissions on any ebikes sold through this platform (though I did try it once in 2014 with one brand towards the end of the season).

In terms of revenue generation, EBR relies on income generated through YouTube ads (you may notice that I only allow one ad at the beginning of videos vs. two or even three, and all ads are skippable), Skimlinks (we get a small commission when items are bought on Amazon and other sites with basic affiliate programs), and category promotions (where a bike is pinned to the top of a category on the site). In order to start ElectricBikeReview.com, I quit my job with $10k in the bank and lived in my car for two years before gaining enough traction to sign up some advertisers. You can learn more about that experience in this video:


As always, I'm open to suggestions and feedback... I care about each of you and this community, and my perspective over the years trying different revenue models and communication guidelines has led me to this semi-conservative approach.

Sincerely,
Court
 
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#19
Thank you Court for that thorough explanation of your motivations behind the guidelines and rules. I respect your decisions on how you run your forum and I appreciate that it is here for all of us. After reading your post it seems a tough balancing act to keep manufacturers, retailers, and we riders/consumers all happy. I wish you nothing but success and hope this site flourishes.