2020 28mph e road bikes: Specialized Creo vs 2020 BH Core race 1.6 vs Trek Domane + HP vs Bulls Desert Eagle ?

Ebiker01

Well-Known Member
Trek Domane + HP (Bosch powered/625wh pack) coming at end of January. No pics/Additional info yet.







- Much Smaller Q factor (therefore greater performance/efficiency of Bh’s Core 164mm vs 181mm for Specialized Creo

- BH 540wh vs ONLY 320wh for Creo

- BH is also 10x better with warranty(5 years) and excellent dealer support

- 1.95kg (Creo) vs 2.1kg(BH) motor weight

- very clean and novel app+ display( based on different collies) , have to memorize a range of about 10-20 colors to adjust the assist level.









Also most likely it will be in the price range of 3.5-4.5k vs. 6.5k for the cheapest Creo. Prices were not announced for the Bh(I’m just making an assumption b/c they are always fair with their pricing and not overly expensive).

Personally If I could would “only” buy all 4 of them.
Realistically any of those 4 are solid choices, maybe Bulls not that great with warranty/dealer support from what I’ve read.
 

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Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
When I go to the BH website it mentions the bike assists up to 25 km/hr
As far as I can understand all high end road e-bikes disengage the motor as the assistance speed reaches the limit. Then the cyclist is on their own. The US version will probably be restricted at 20 mph. The concept is the assistance would mainly be used uphill.

Turbo Creo has a small battery and may have a range extender {there is an interesting post on it somewhere in the Forum). BH has a large battery that increases the bike weight.

The Creo battery can be transported by airplane in the cabin baggage while you cannot fly the BH battery. So many factors to consider.
 

Ebiker01

Well-Known Member
I just went to BH's website and as far as I can tell they don't sell bikes in North Amercia. Is this true?

They do. The 2020models are not on the US site yet.


They were one of the first big brands to sell ebikes , since 2012, and since 1920’s regular bikes...
 

HLM

New Member
The Specialized warranty is life on the frame for the original owner and 2 years otherwise. How is that 1/10th the BH warranty?
The Creo is about 8-10 lbs. lighter and its frame geometry is perfect for gravel and road.
One can opt for a "Range Extender" which adds another 160wH so one has a choice in terms of battery use length.
Now, with the Aluminum Creo out, at $5K, it's closer to home for many (I own the Creo SL Comp Carbon).
Maybe some riders are bothered by the Q factor but I haven't heard of any that are, including myself. I don't even notice it.


Trek Domane + HP (Bosch powered/625wh pack) coming at end of January. No pics/Additional info yet.







- Much Smaller Q factor (therefore greater performance/efficiency of Bh’s Core 164mm vs 181mm for Specialized Creo

- BH 540wh vs ONLY 320wh for Creo

- BH is also 10x better with warranty(5 years) and excellent dealer support

- 1.95kg (Creo) vs 2.1kg(BH) motor weight

- very clean and novel app+ display( based on different collies) , have to memorize a range of about 10-20 colors to adjust the assist level.









Also most likely it will be in the price range of 3.5-4.5k vs. 6.5k for the cheapest Creo. Prices were not announced for the Bh(I’m just making an assumption b/c they are always fair with their pricing and not overly expensive).

Personally If I could would “only” buy all 4 of them.
Realistically any of those 4 are solid choices, maybe Bulls not that great with warranty/dealer support from what I’ve read.
 

Ebiker01

Well-Known Member
an opt for a "Range Extender" which adds another 160wH so one has a choice in terms of battery
Yea the CREO is vastly inferior in terms of battery cappacity.
Plus can not remove it !! Unless you take the motor out.

- BH Core -540WH (not availabe yet in US)

-TREK +HP-500wh+500wh 2nd pack on downtube.

I would return a Creo and buy one of the above.

 

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Ebiker01

Well-Known Member
"I would return my Formula 1 bolid and buy a SUV".
@Ebiker01, please don't be silly. The Creo is just not for you.
i do like it but with +HP can do a longer ride and can also charge much faster.

100mile , 6000ft of climbing ride in the summer ? Sure , np.

Not so much with Specialized.

With Trek, Can also leave the battery @home and ride it unassisted.
With Creo, gotta take the drill, take the motor out ...then access the battery ; nonsense, proprietary stuff .

Creo- 8.6amps- 2amp charge rate

+HP- 11.6amps- 4amp charge rate, is possible to do 6amps.

And next year, probably other one will be better, but for now Trek +HP has the crown of best road ebike .

I would like to see what @Court has to say about the Trek +HP, or compare both of them. Hopefully he will review it soon.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
How many times have I to repeat the Creo is for able road cyclists and the key point is the weight and real road bike feel? You don't need to buy the Creo but you don't need to criticize it either @Ebiker01. The rush in the market towards the Creo clearly demonstrates how badly needed such a product was.
 

Captain Slow

Well-Known Member
How many times have I to repeat the Creo is for able road cyclists and the key point is the weight and real road bike feel? You don't need to buy the Creo but you don't need to criticize it either @Ebiker01. The rush in the market towards the Creo clearly demonstrates how badly needed such a product was.
I have been waiting for years for a lightweight road ebike like the Creo. 5 years ago I kept hoping someone would build one and finally it's here. I understand the appeal of the HP+ and if available in Canada at 28 mph then it would be a tough decision for me. I see the appeal of both bikes. But legislators have made the decision for me. I can get the Creo here, but not the HP+.

I can do 100 miles and 6,000 ft. of climbing without a motor on my Cervelo. But the issue is that my buddies who race Cat 3 are too fast for me and I can't keep up with them on hills. Hoping the Creo will do that and on flats I'll have the motor off and sit on wheels if necessary. So yeah, I'm in that demographic where I really appreciate the Creo.
 

darlingbastard

New Member
Did a short road test of the new trek domane+ hp yesterday. Seems like essentially the same bike as the 2019 domane+. Kiox display instead of purion and they added a kickstand but otherwise, same battery, same lights, same weight, same speed. I think they updated to the latest Bosch motor which may have more torque but I was surprised the weight was the same. 37.6 vs 37.8 lbs. I guess the new motor is smaller but not much lighter? Not sure why this bike should be compared to the creo when it’s nearly identical to the older 2019 model which didn’t warrant much comparison. Still, might buy it though. I preferred it to the Allant+ and it seems a lot easier to carry on the train than Trek’s other offerings. The bike felt heavier on the road than the specialized vado 5 I rode recently which surprised me. Fit and finish was great, felt very solid and well built. Bosch is Bosch and I just don’t like their motor feel. Even on the new gen motors it’s very abrupt and obvious when the motor kicks in. Feels like getting pushed from behind rather than being stronger in the saddle. Power and speed are great, hills are nothing. One important point for me is I need to be able to carry the bike with one hand while navigating public transport (train for work crisis days when I don’t get out till 11pm). It’s heavy at nearly 40 lbs but manageable even with one hand. Mostly though it’s barely an upgrade to last years model (available for 1k less now). I don’t think anything has been added that would make it more compelling if the 2019 Domane+ wasn’t already on your wishlist.
 

darlingbastard

New Member
One more addition. As negative as my post above sounds I may actually buy the Dimane+ HP.

It might be the most well balanced bike out there for 2020 among the big bike retailers. It’s lightish at 38lbs but still has a decent battery (vs creo/giant). The light system is fully integrated and 1000 lumens vs 500 for Allant, <200 for specialized Vado and no integrated light at all for creo. It super solid and while I don’t care for the Bosch motor feel, it is powerful and certainly more proven than the specialized offerings. The battery system is also the most flexible and easy to remove with a generous handle and options for a range extender.

Any negativity is a sense that Trek has not improved any of their offerings in the last year. Still not convinced the Allant+ is better than the supercommuter in any way. It’s certainly worse in some regards.
 

Ebiker01

Well-Known Member
One more addition. As negative as my post above sounds I may actually buy the Dimane+ HP.

It might be the most well balanced bike out there for 2020 among the big bike retailers. It’s lightish at 38lbs but still has a decent battery (vs creo/giant). The light system is fully integrated and 1000 lumens vs 500 for Allant, <200 for specialized Vado and no integrated light at all for creo. It super solid and while I don’t care for the Bosch motor feel, it is powerful and certainly more proven than the specialized offerings. The battery system is also the most flexible and easy to remove with a generous handle and options for a range extender.

Any negativity is a sense that Trek has not improved any of their offerings in the last year. Still not convinced the Allant+ is better than the supercommuter in any way. It’s certainly worse in some regards.


Did the 2019 Domane had the integrated lights ?
And i'm not sure, but last year model did not have the capability of a 2nd 500wh pack.

I totally agree with your above post, i feel that it is just the perfect ebike, good for everything.

It could be made lighter (33-34lb) with some carbon parts(crank, lighter pedals, etc..$

I wish that it could accept a 48t or 50t front ring.
With this virus going on, hopefully they will put it at a 50% off sale soon....
 

FInx

New Member
The drive train on the 2020 Domane+ is completely different than the older models. It uses standard chainrings instead of the tiny chainring on the older models. Someone mentioned that you can ride without the battery. This is true on the Allante, but not on the HP/HP7. The battery has the cover integrated. It would leave a gaping hole in the side of the downtube.

I did some extensive comparisons of Class III drop bar e-bikes, and decided to go with the Trek Domane HP7. It came down to it and the Creo. The specs on the Creo were better in terms of overall system weight, but I'm a pretty big guy and ride the largest frame. When you factor in the rider weight, the fenders, racks, bags, lights, etc... the total difference in weight was less than 5%.

The Creo battery is not removable. I have a long commute and have to lock my bike outside. I can't bring it in to charge. Being able to bring the battery inside to charge during the day was a must.

The Creo has Boost hub spacing. I swap wheels between bikes and was not going to deal with a proprietary wheel set, especially after experiencing the debacle that was the SCS rear spacing on the Diverge - what a nightmare.

The Creo uses a brand new (unproven) motor and battery. Having dealt with Specialized on warranty issues in the past, I did not want to be at ground zero for this system. The Trek uses Bosch motor and battery that has a proven design and is well supported with parts and support. The mechanics at the shop are familiar with it.

Lastly, I just couldn't make myself give that much money to a company I despise as much as I despise the evil "S".