(#3 of 4) My 2020 SWIFT: TORQUE SENSOR BOTTOM BRACKET price is $200.00..

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Sic Puppy

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(#3 of 3) My 2020 SWIFT: TORQUE SENSOR BOTTOM BRACKET price is $200.00..
[[The bold fonts referred to in some follow-up posts of this thread has been replaced with Tahoma fonts for ease of reading.. ]]
[[ This/these thread(s) refer to my 2020 SWIFT ebike and are a continuation-on-a-theme. Prior to viewing this thread, you first need to read my Posting #1: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/threads/2020-swift-on-day-10-mileage-264.34577/
and Posting #2: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/threads/my-2020-swift-at-day-150-and-mileage-2-130.38726/ thread postings on this BikTrix forum. Having actually read those first 2 postings, and then reading this #3 posting, you will be completely informed, and thus be treated to a comedy show that is the equivalent of The Three Stooges, plus Laurel and Hardy, along with Navin Johnson (Steve Martin in THE JERK) ]]

So, having read my two previous threads regarding the 2020 BikTrix SWIFT ebike, you are now aware of the fact that something just did not seem “right” with how this ebike performs. I tried various options, as far as CDU (computer display unit) settings were concerned. Nothing dispelled the nagging sense that, when riding this ebike, there was probably an electrical anomaly running amok within.
[[[ Here is my Oct 27th email to BikTrix describing complete details as to the erratic behavior of my SWIFT ebike (one of 30 back-and-forth emails):
Hi,
Here are some of the items I'm dealing with in regards to my 2020 SWIFT at mileage 2,000+:
1). On level ground and cruising (not pedaling), occasionally the power suddenly kicks in for 1 or 2 seconds. This is rather unnerving since I am not anticipating same (hand off handlebar to click + or -, etc).
2). Going up an incline (equivalent to a highway overpass as far as gradient) and shifting rear derailleur from 3rd to 2nd or 1st, the power cuts out (feels dead) but everything is still “on” . The only way for me to get added boost is to press and hold the thumb throttle for the duration. This takes ALOT of battery consumption. Increasing PAS from 5of9 to higher does nothing.
3). When transitioning from sitting to standing while pedaling, sometimes the power cuts out for a few seconds. This is dangerous in the sense that I can be thrown forward (over the bars) if I'm not alert.
4). I need to use PAS 5 of 9 on smooth level terrain. Any “climb” requires 8of9, or even 9of9. I ride at weight of 200 pounds. Shouldn't I be able to use lower settings PAS 2 or 3of9, etc? My speed is usually at/below 15mph-- I'm just a cruiser and I seldom use/need the thumb throttle.. ]]]
-- So, if YOUR ebike is guilty of the above-mentioned abnormalities, by the time you have finished reading this very long thread posting, you will be completely informed as to what to do/what ebike to not spend your hard-earned $$ on. I have no loyalty to any ebike company-- my only goal is to inform potential ebike buyers on how to avoid flushing their own hard earned $$$ down the toilet.

Over the series of 30 very pleasant emails of back-and-forth inquiries/recommendations between BikTrix and myself, it was finally decided that the most likely culprit in the “e” misconduct was the torque sensor located in/on the bottom bracket. Whenever I did a tight turnaround (within the dimensions of a 10 foot wide concrete bike path), or tried to ascend a hill, the SWIFT would stop-start-stop-start hurky-jerky hiccup. However, using ONLY throttle, things were smooth . If I performed this identical maneuver on my larger, heavier (by at least 25 pounds) M2S (brand) Fat Tire ebikes, their operation was always buttery smooth. No surprises.. No power bursts.. No on/off burpy farty darting (quite dangerous, by the way). However, those two M2S ebikes use a cadence sensor at their bottom bracket-- NOT a torque sensor as is installed on my 2020 SWIFT ebike.
I had never put any thought into the gizmo known as TORQUE SENSOR-- I just figured that it was pretty much the same operating principle/price as a cadence sensor.. HOT DAMN WAS I WRONG!! So, go grab a brewski and settle in for a VERY extended read and a most valuable lesson in Ebike Component Smoke and Mirrors Fiasco .'

Well, my most recent baptism by fire is about to begin. First of all let me tell you about my personal four NEW IMPROVED criteria for any rear hub ebike purchase:
1). The battery MUST be a Reention Dorado 48v (or 52 volt) “long” battery. By “long” I mean a length of 460mm (18 inches), not 390mm (15.4 inches--the length of a 10.4ah battery). If the battery has 16ah/17ah/21ah, it is definitely a long battery.
As a sidenote: JUICED (brand) and RAD ROVER (brand) ebikes use “proprietary” batteries, which means that you are pretty much restricted to them if you want/need to purchase replacement batteries..
2). Braking system must be hydraulic, not mechanical (wire cable). I cannot understate the superiority of the hydraulic units when you are dealing with a 50-80 pound (or even heavier) motorized bicycle. If you do decide to go with mechanical brakes, you will be constantly adjusting the slack due to cable stretch.
3). Bottom Bracket Cadence Sensor is mandatory. Should you ever need to deal with a replacement unit, the cost is $20.00. And they are easy breezy to install https://support.biktrix.com/hc/en-us/articles/360033119552-Stunner-LT-Cadence-Sensor-Replacement-DIY
You will notice that this instructional link is by BikTrix AND that it is for the Stunner LT rear hub fat tire ebike. The only problem is that the 2020 Stunner LT ebike is now equipped with the $200.00 torque sensor bottom bracket. I sure am curious as to WHY BikTrix replaced the $20 cadence sensor with the $200 (pea's of chit) torque sensor. As far as I can tell, the 2020 BikTrix Stunner LT fat tire 750watt rear hub ebike is the ONLY one out there in ebike world using the torque sensor system.
All four of my other ebikes (including the two 750w fat tire ebikes) use the cadence sensor system and it works just awesome on each of them. NEVER a problem/glitch with any of them. As a matter of act, 99.9% of all Fat Tire rear hub ebikes use the bottom bracket cadence sensor system. If it ain't broke don't try to “fix” it. So, why would BikTrix do EXACTLY THAT??!! $200 wasted-- no matter how you look at it..
4). [this is a really long one] The rear hub motor MUST be a BaFang brand. My other four ebikes each uses this brand of motor. It is the holy grail of rear hub ebike world. The two M2S(brand) fat tire bikes use the 750 watt (1 horsepower) beast of a motor-- remember that it is better to have that power available and seldom use it than to need it and not have it-- especially for, basically, the same $$$ as a less powerful ebike..
My 2018 M2S (brand) KUSH (model) dual-suspension ebike is still, after 2.5 years and 16,000+ miles, purring along just as quiet AND efficient as the very first mile (its name was changed from KUSH to R750 FS in late 2020). The same goes for the 2019 M2S(brand) R750(model) at mile 7,500 after 1.5 years.. This exact same fat tire motor is still in use (and has been since at least 2017) on many 2021 fat tire ebikes which use a rear hub motor. You can locate many sources of BaFang internal gears/ motors/ components on the internet. However, the MXUS rear hub motor used on the 2020 SWIFT is pretty much non-existent out the in ebike/parts world. If it goes kaput, you are screwed-- just like for the $200 bottom bracket torque sensor (more on that item later).
Yet another item to consider: my four ebikes utilizing the Bafang rear hub/motor assembly have remained mechanically consistent for the past 3+ years/30,000+ total miles (since at least Nov. 2017-- when I purchased my first ebike). During that same time frame there have been many new mid-drive motor units, manufactured by a variety of companies (Shimano/ Bosch/ BaFang/CaaCaa-DooDoo), introduced into production. More motor varieties= more specific replacement parts. Ebike companies do not/will not have the luxury of stocking the vast diversity of components (kind of like BikTrix with the torque sensor bottom bracket-- read on).
[[As a sidenote in regards to mid-drive motors: I know zilth about them other than the internet forums-verified fact that they rapidly ruin drivetrain components-- front chainring (3,000 miles), chain (1,500 miles) rear cassette/freewheel (3,000 miles), rear derailleur (3,000 miles). For me, having 31,000 total miles on my 5 ebikes (including the 2020 SWIFT), I have replaced 1 chain, 1 rear cassette, 1 rear derailleur. All of those items were on the 2018 KUSH and were swapped out at around the 12,000 mile mark. In hindsight, I really only needed to replace the rear cassette and the chain. I will leave you to do the math in regards to a mid-drive bike(s) maintenance upkeep/$$$ with the same amount of total mileage]].
--END of my (4) criteria for any rear hub ebike purchase--

Now that I have conveyed my thoughts as to what I look for/expect in an ebike, I shall get to the crux of this thread/post: the $200.00 torque sensor bottom bracket. Want to know the differences between the 2 types of sensors??: https://ebikes.ca/learn/pedal-assist.html
Just to give you yet another angle from which to examine the cadence sensor/torque sensor fiasco, let me present the unit as used by JUICED (brand) on their ebikes: https://hilleater.ca/juiced-crosscurrent-torque-sensor/ How's that item for an attention getter?
Now, here is a 12 magnet cadence sensor, as used on both of my 750w fat tire ebikes:https://eunorau-ebike.com/collectio...s-install-on-the-right?variant=37781644673175 $12.00-- Who da thunk it? But NOOOO!!! Instead, I get a BikTrix ebike that spec's a $200 torque sensor bottom bracket consisting of Unobtainium (more on that later) material...
Need to find a torque sensing bottom bracket?? Good luck on dat crap (go ahead and Google it).. However, I did stumble upon this most interesting website: https://ebikes.ca/catalogsearch/result/index/?p=1&q=Torque+Sensing+Bottom+Bracket .. You will see that prices vary between $150 and $240.. You will also see “OUT OF STOCK” on most of the items.
A bit of advise to every ebike company: The casual ebike rider does NOT want to have to exert more energy /power/pressure to attain a faster speed-- they only want to either push a PAS button or press a thumb throttle paddle to gain that extra speed. The cadence sensor takes care of the aforementioned. A torque sensor bottom bracket requires more exertion on the pedals for additional power. It ain't rocket science, ya know.. Anyway, back to my own current dilemma.


So, after 30 emails, it was decided that BikTrix would send me a replacement torque sensor bottom bracket. And, it was done. When it arrived, I looked it over and, fortunately, discovered the “special purpose” of this type unit AND the very specific/ precise method of its' installation. A piece of cake-- now that I knew its little secrets. By the way, it is possible to install it backwards. That means it will only function when you back-pedal. Then, time for a complete dis-assembly /re-assemble. No fun at all.
So, first, I remove the black control box cover (located on the seat tube) to gain access to the connector. I trace the wire from the bottom bracket torque sensor only to discover that it is completely severed inside the black box. s*it Fire. Now I know why the SWIFT has been acting in “stupid” mode since mile #1.. I disconnect the useless wire. Then, I get out my special crankset/bottom bracket removal tools and commence the operation. Out comes the torque sensor bottom bracket gadget. No problemo. However, to my surprise the wire connection at the bottom bracket is also frayed-- a round 6-wire unit that has been flattened with multiple wires exposed (see the photo at the end of this posting)... So much for “quality control”. The replacement unit uses a flat 6-wire connector-- common sense, fer sure..
But, now that I know who the “e”culprit is (“Quality Control” at BikTrix), I go about installing the new unit. Patience is a virtue (hell yes). Everything goes according to plan.
I re-install the black cover over the control box wiring, etc. I install the ebike 48v battery and spin the crankset.. NOTHING.. Holy s*it-fire. Now what? I remove the black cover and there it is-- the new wire was completely severed. Though I was careful to re-insert all of the VERY MANY wires back inside the cover, I neglected to allow for the fact that the bottom opening (where all the wires exit the box) was not all that wide/deep and also that the base plate had a very sharp edge. If you ever need to open that black cover (Lordy help you if you do), run your fingers along that base plate. See how frigging sharp that edge is-- not razor sharp, but definitely QC “negligent” sharp.
Anyway, the very first thing I do is get my little saw and cut out the entire bottom section of the black cover. Won't ever be having wire decapitation occurring again (I can always use duct tape across the bottom). After completing that task, I removed the replacement bottom bracket unit. I didn't even get 1 wheel revolution out of it. Un-frigging-believeable.
I'm pretty good at dealing with bike maintenance stuff (I've been dinking with bikes since 1983), but this scenario had blown me completely away. Not only was BikTrix guilty of incompetence/negligence/ irresponsibility by specifying this type of sensor on a basic one thousand seven hundred dollar recreational ebike, but, by default, so was I.
I should have caught the deviation (torque vs cadence) when I first perused their website when considering the purchase of this one thousand seven hundred dollar ebike. But, then again, who would have factored in such a “trivial” item??
Now, onto the internet to email BikTrix in regards to my latest adventure. After explaining my debacle and pointing out their unacceptable “quality control” system (also referenced in post #1 and #2), I received the following reply:
(( Removed by moderator - posting private discussions is against forum rules ))

TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS!!! Jezzus H. This item is just a $20 run-of-the-mill basic bottom bracket with a thin sensing unit wrapped around the main body. I sure as hell DID NOT see $200, or even $100 for this joke of a device. Why in the heck would BikTrix spec such a convoluted piece of ebike technology on a one thousand seven hundred dollar pure street cruiser-style ebike?? My god, neither of my two Fat Tire beasts (nor any other ebike brand) utilizes this system!!! Oops, my bad-- the 2020 STUNNER LT fat tire/rear hub ebike also uses the torque sensing bottom bracket, as does RIDE1UP (brand) on their $1,800 LMT'D ebike-- buyer beware.. $200.. $200.. $200.. RIDE1UP also uses the same 1,000watt(?) MXUS rear hub motor on some models.. Lucky you..
On Dec 2nd (31 days ago), I placed the order for the $100 replacement sensor (yahoo!! Lucky me.. A $100 discount. Back flips, etc.). By Dec 18th I still had not heard from BikTrix in regards to the shipping of unit #3. Also, since I now had 2 basically useless $200 bottom brackets (a total of $400-- say that a few times) setting in my living room, I sent off an email to BikTrix:


Dec 18, 2020

HI,
Any idea as to when this gadget/sensor is going to actually ship??
Also, I need to get the address of the company that assembles this item so I can see if I can ship my 2 current sensors to them for installation of a new wire cable.
I already own two of these contraptions:
#1 has 2,300 miles total on it..
#2 has ZERO miles on it.
Pretty good waste of $$$ for $200 (retail) per pathetic unit..
zzzzz

And here is BikTrix response:


(( Removed by moderator - posting private discussions is against forum rules ))
As you can see from their response, the issue of cables being cut is apparently NOT an uncommon occurrence. And yet, they CONTINUE to install this bullsheet gizmo on their products.
And, they do not even know who/where their component manufacturer(s) location is. Mighty pathetic, fer sure. I guess that is what you get when you only pay one thousand seven hundred dollars for what is a basic ebike. Maybe if their component-of-choice was a $20 cadence sensor unit INSTEAD of a $200 torque sensor unit, things would be better all around. Also, I most definitely believe that paying $50 (?) worth of shipping costs to send $400 worth of bottom brackets back to the factory in China for repair is not at all out of the question (apparently, with this product, you can never have too many on hand). DUH!!
In addition, during the course of the 30 emails, I asked if I could install a magnetic Cadence System to replace the Torque Sensor system:
me: Also, do I have the option of being able to install a normal ebikes magnetic ring/electronic pickup (flashing red light) system at the bottom bracket axle, if I choose to do so. I know that cadence sensors have this setup.. Just wondering..
BikTrix: Unfortunately, this is not possible as the controller does not have a separate input for registering cadence.
Warm Regards, XXXX
So, If I should decide to go to the trouble of doing BikTrix's job for them, I would need to locate and purchase another controller box that is compatible with the basically nonexistent MXUS rear hub motor and which also has Cadence Sensor plug-in capability and is compatible with the SWIFTs peas o' chit multi-color handlebar mounted computer display unit (cdu). See the ripple effect when a product is not “correct” from the get-go?? What to do?? What to do??
For now, I will await the arrival of the 3rd torque sensor unit because, never having had to deal with this gizmo, I am definitely very curious as to how it actually conducts its' $200 real-world bicycling business as compared to the magnificent performance of the $20 cadence sensor installations on my other 4 ebikes.

Today is Jan 1, 2021.. Still no delivery information. Hey, I know: maybe BikTrix needs to go to this website to buy the correct (hopefully) torque sensor bottom bracket for my SWIFT ebike: https://ebikes.ca/catalogsearch/result/index/?p=1&q=Torque+Sensing+Bottom+Bracket After all, $100 out-of-pocket shouldn't bother them-- it sure didn't bother me to do so.
My 2020 SWIFT arrived on May 28, 2020. It's 1-year warranty period is up on May 27, 2021. However, since I am “without” my ebike (since Dec 2nd) until the 3rd sensor arrives, do I get an “extension” of the warranty based upon how damn long it takes to actually deliver the new sensor?
If I have any further “situations” with this “quality (very questionable)” one thousand seven hundred dollar ebike, will I be able to send it back to BikTrix for a refund?? After all, if they cannot deliver initially on “quality” issues, AND since they cannot deliver on inventory stocking issues, they don't deserve to retain possession of my (or your) hard earned one thousand seven hundred dollars.

My take on the 2020 SWIFT ebike:
It is not worth $1,700 because it uses a torque sensor bottom bracket.
It is not worth $1,500 because it uses a basically non-existent MXUS rear hub motor.
It is worth $1,300 only because it uses the Reention Dorado 48v “long” battery and a hydraulic disc brake system.

Remember Studebaker? Rambler? DeLorean?-- automobile companies that no longer exist because of??? Maybe BikTrix will be included in the ebike equivalent thereof. Not totally undeserved, fer sure..

From reading various forum postings, it seems that the vast majority of ebike riders do not perform their own repairs/maintenance/tire changes. Instead, they go to their Local Bike Shop (LBS). However, those same shops can, and will, refuse to deal with these ebikes due to an unwillingness to take the chance of their own liability to have to replace a $200 torque sensor bottom bracket (or whatever) due to a wire being inadvertently snipped-- even if that item was not the intended repair. Strange things can/will occur when you are dealing with lots and lots of ebike wires. THEN you, the ebike owner, are really gonna be screwed. Just some food for thought.
As for a comfortable and dependable ebike: pretty much any Fat Tire ebike that uses the BaFang 750 watt rear hub motor. Said ebike can use 26” tires ,or 24” tires, or even 20” tires. I am seeing more and more 20” fat tire ebikes out on the local bike paths and they appear to be quite fun/nimble/ maneuverable. Some of them are straddled by very large mammals (250+ pounds) and they still git down the road like a scared rabbit. Here is one excellent example and it costs the same as the 2020 BikTrix SWIFT ebike: https://shop.m2sbikes.com/collections/all-terrain-electric-bike-series/products/all-terrain-scout
Another deed to do: go get a square of toilet paper.. use a sharpie to write “$1,700.00” on it.. go to the bathroom.. throw the paper into the toilet bowl.. flush.. that is ONE example of flushing one thousand seven hundred dollars down the crapper. Another option: buy the BikTrix SWIFT ebike.
By the way, I fully expect to have to “eat” this newest unworthy toy, but at least I have been able to (hopefully) save you from the exact same $1,700 fate.

My corral of ebikes (all are rear hub motor):
#1. [Oct 2017--1,500 miles] 2018 Xtreme(brand) TrailMaster Elite.. BaFang 250watt motor/9.6ah 24v battery($849): https://www.ebay.com/i/361493378890?rt=nc&_trkparms=aid=1110006&algo=HOMESPLICE.
#2. [Dec 2017-- 3,879 miles] 2018 Xtreme (brand) Sedona.. BaFang 500watt motor/10.4ah 48v battery.. ($1600): https://www.ebay.com/itm/X-treme-Se...in-Bike-Blk-/122088413914?hash=item1c6d095ada
#3. [May 2018-- 15,788 miles] 2018 M2S(brand) KUSH dual-suspension.. BaFang 750watt motor/16ah 48v battery.. ($1,800): https://shop.m2sbikes.com/collectio...es/products/full-suspension-electric-fat-bike
#4. [May 2019--7,425 miles] 2019 M2S (brand) R750.. BaFang 750watt motor/16ah 48v battery (the step-thru model uses 24” fat tires).($1,600): https://shop.m2sbikes.com/collectio...series/products/all-terrain-electric-fat-bike
#5. [May 2020-- 2,397 miles] 2020 BikTrix (brand) SWIFT.. MXUS 1000watt(?) motor/14.5ah 48v battery($1,700): https://www.biktrix.com/pages/swift-details
Hmm.. Interesting: the BikTrix website now (on Jan 1, 2021) shows the SWIFT to be equipped with a CADENCE SENSOR.. I wonder what's up wit dat??? Time will tell.
The reason I posted my 5 ebikes and their prices is because #1, #2, and #5 are each basically an overpriced peas o' chit in their own special way (for what you actually get $$$ wise)– so, that is a total of $4,149 down der terlet. Now, where is my sharpie pen and a sheet of toilet paper? But lessons learned-- or is it??
As for #3 and #4: I was SO impressed by #3 that I went ahead and bought #4, too. A total of $3,400 very well spent. I just wish that #3 would have been ebike #1, but, live and learn. I try to go on a 50 mile ride every day and I know that I can hop on either #3 or #4 and they will flat out get the job done—beautifully.. By the way, my “out-the-door ebike riding” weight is 205 pounds.
So, ya win a few/ya lose a few.. You, the reader, can either learn from my mistakes-- or not..

Well, that's all for now.
FILE0005.JPGIn regards to the photo: the unit at the bottom is the original installation. Magnify the photo and examine bottom bracket/wire juncture. See the flattened/frayed wires? Also, notice that both wires have been cut at exactly the same length (going into the black controller box). BikTrix “Quality Control” at work..


HAPPY HOLIDAYS
 
Last edited by a moderator:

J.R.

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
I hope you get this sorted out. I wanted to read the story, but all the bold text and lack of formatting was too much for my old eyes. The title really sparked my interest though. Biktrix seems like a responsive company, so best of luck.

Happy New Year!
 

BigNerd

Well-Known Member
Sorry to hear about your problems.

So if #3 and #4 (M2S) worked so well for you... why did you switch brands? And why are you buying so many ebikes?
 

tomjasz

Well-Known Member
FOS. MXUS is well known and builds great motors. That’s just one of too many opinions being sold as facts. Punctuation and structure would make this almost readable. Again we’re frustrated when we buy an eBike direct from an online reseller, and need to be our own support mechanic.
 
Last edited:

burlguy

Member
(#3 of 3) My 2020 SWIFT: TORQUE SENSOR BOTTOM BRACKET price is $200.00..
[[ This/these thread(s) refer to my 2020 SWIFT ebike and are a continuation-on-a-theme. Prior to viewing this thread, you first need to read my Posting #1: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/threads/2020-swift-on-day-10-mileage-264.34577/
and Posting #2: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/threads/my-2020-swift-at-day-150-and-mileage-2-130.38726/ thread postings on this BikTrix forum.
So, having read my two previous threads regarding the 2020 BikTrix SWIFT ebike, you are now aware of the fact that something just did not seem “right” with how this ebike performs. I tried various options, as far as CDU (computer display unit) settings were concerned. Nothing dispelled the nagging sense that, when riding this ebike, there was probably an electrical anomaly running amok within.
[[[ Here is my Oct 27th email to BikTrix describing complete details as to the erratic behavior of my SWIFT ebike (one of 30 back-and-forth emails):

Hi,
Here are some of the items I'm dealing with in regards to my 2020 SWIFT at mileage 2,000+:
1). On level ground and cruising (not pedaling), occasionally the power suddenly kicks in for 1 or 2 seconds. This is rather unnerving since I am not anticipating same (hand off handlebar to click + or -, etc).
2). Going up an incline (equivalent to a highway overpass as far as gradient) and shifting rear derailleur from 3rd to 2nd or 1st, the power cuts out (feels dead) but everything is still “on” . The only way for me to get added boost is to press and hold the thumb throttle for the duration. This takes ALOT of battery consumption. Increasing PAS from 5of9 to higher does nothing.
3). When transitioning from sitting to standing while pedaling, sometimes the power cuts out for a few seconds. This is dangerous in the sense that I can be thrown forward (over the bars) if I'm not alert.
4). I need to use PAS 5 of 9 on smooth level terrain. Any “climb” requires 8of9, or even 9of9. I ride at weight of 200 pounds. Shouldn't I be able to use lower settings PAS 2 or 3of9, etc? My speed is usually at/below 15mph-- I'm just a cruiser and I seldom use/need the thumb throttle.. ]]]
-- So, if YOUR ebike is guilty of the above-mentioned abnormalities, by the time you have finished reading this very long thread posting, you will be completely informed as to what to do/what ebike to not spend your hard-earned $$ on. I have no loyalty to any ebike company-- my only goal is to inform potential ebike buyers on how to avoid flushing their own hard earned $$$ down the toilet.

Over the series of 30 very pleasant emails of back-and-forth inquiries/recommendations between BikTrix and myself, it was finally decided that the most likely culprit in the “e” misconduct was the torque sensor located in/on the bottom bracket. Whenever I did a tight turnaround (within the dimensions of a 10 foot wide concrete bike path), or tried to ascend a hill, the SWIFT would stop-start-stop-start hurky-jerky hiccup. However, using ONLY throttle, things were smooth . If I performed this identical maneuver on my larger, heavier (by at least 25 pounds) M2S (brand) Fat Tire ebikes, their operation was always buttery smooth. No surprises.. No power bursts.. No on/off burpy farty darting (quite dangerous, by the way). However, those two M2S ebikes use a cadence sensor at their bottom bracket-- NOT a torque sensor as is installed on my 2020 SWIFT ebike.
I had never put any thought into the gizmo known as TORQUE SENSOR-- I just figured that it was pretty much the same operating principle/price as a cadence sensor.. HOT DAMN WAS I WRONG!! So, go grab a brewski and settle in for a VERY extended read and a most valuable lesson in Ebike Component Smoke and Mirrors Fiasco .'

Well, my most recent baptism by fire is about to begin. First of all let me tell you about my personal four NEW IMPROVED criteria for any rear hub ebike purchase:
1). The battery MUST be a Reention Dorado 48v (or 52 volt) “long” battery. By “long” I mean a length of 460mm (18 inches), not 390mm (15.4 inches--the length of a 10.4ah battery). If the battery has 16ah/17ah/21ah, it is definitely a long battery.
As a sidenote: JUICED (brand) and RAD ROVER (brand) ebikes use “proprietary” batteries, which means that you are pretty much restricted to them if you want/need to purchase replacement batteries..
2). Braking system must be hydraulic, not mechanical (wire cable). I cannot understate the superiority of the hydraulic units when you are dealing with a 50-80 pound (or even heavier) motorized bicycle. If you do decide to go with mechanical brakes, you will be constantly adjusting the slack due to cable stretch.
3). Bottom Bracket
Cadence Sensor is mandatory. Should you ever need to deal with a replacement unit, the cost is $20.00. And they are easy breezy to install https://support.biktrix.com/hc/en-us/articles/360033119552-Stunner-LT-Cadence-Sensor-Replacement-DIY
You will notice that this instructional link is by BikTrix AND that it is for the Stunner LT rear hub fat tire ebike. The only problem is that the 2020 Stunner LT ebike is now equipped with the $200.00 torque sensor bottom bracket. I sure am curious as to WHY BikTrix replaced the $20 cadence sensor with the $200 (pea's of chit) torque sensor. As far as I can tell, the 2020 BikTrix Stunner LT fat tire 750watt rear hub ebike is the ONLY one out there in ebike world using the torque sensor system.
All four of my other ebikes (including the two 750w fat tire ebikes) use the cadence sensor system and it works just awesome on each of them. NEVER a problem/glitch with any of them. As a matter of act, 99.9% of all Fat Tire rear hub ebikes use the bottom bracket cadence sensor system. If it ain't broke don't try to “fix” it. So, why would BikTrix do EXACTLY THAT??!! $200 wasted-- no matter how you look at it..
4). [this is a really long one] The rear hub motor MUST be a BaFang brand. My other four ebikes each uses this brand of motor. It is the holy grail of rear hub ebike world. The two M2S(brand) fat tire bikes use the 750 watt (1 horsepower) beast of a motor-- remember that it is better to have that power available and seldom use it than to need it and not have it-- especially for, basically, the same $$$ as a less powerful ebike..
My 2018 M2S (brand) KUSH (model) dual-suspension ebike is still, after 2.5 years and 16,000+ miles, purring along just as quiet AND efficient as the very first mile (its name was changed from KUSH to R750 FS in late 2020). The same goes for the 2019 M2S(brand) R750(model) at mile 7,500 after 1.5 years.. This exact same fat tire motor is still in use (and has been since at least 2017) on many 2021 fat tire ebikes which use a rear hub motor. You can locate many sources of BaFang internal gears/ motors/ components on the internet. However, the MXUS rear hub motor used on the 2020 SWIFT is pretty much non-existent out the in ebike/parts world. If it goes kaput, you are screwed-- just like for the $200 bottom bracket torque sensor (more on that item later).
Yet another item to consider: my four ebikes utilizing the Bafang rear hub/motor assembly have remained mechanically consistent for the past 3+ years/30,000+ total miles (since at least Nov. 2017-- when I purchased my first ebike). During that same time frame there have been many new mid-drive motor units, manufactured by a variety of companies (Shimano/ Bosch/ BaFang/CaaCaa-DooDoo), introduced into production. More motor varieties= more specific replacement parts. Ebike companies do not/will not have the luxury of stocking the vast diversity of components (kind of like BikTrix with the torque sensor bottom bracket-- read on).
[[As a sidenote in regards to mid-drive motors: I know zilth about them other than the internet forums-verified fact that they rapidly ruin drivetrain components-- front chainring (3,000 miles), chain (1,500 miles) rear cassette/freewheel (3,000 miles), rear derailleur (3,000 miles). For me, having 31,000 total miles on my 5 ebikes (including the 2020 SWIFT), I have replaced 1 chain, 1 rear cassette, 1 rear derailleur. All of those items were on the 2018 KUSH and were swapped out at around the 12,000 mile mark. In hindsight, I really only needed to replace the rear cassette and the chain. I will leave you to do the math in regards to a mid-drive bike(s) maintenance upkeep/$$$ with the same amount of total mileage]].
--END of my (4) criteria for any rear hub ebike purchase--

Now that I have conveyed my thoughts as to what I look for/expect in an ebike, I shall get to the crux of this thread/post: the $200.00
torque sensor bottom bracket. Want to know the differences between the 2 types of sensors??: https://ebikes.ca/learn/pedal-assist.html
Just to give you yet another angle from which to examine the cadence sensor/torque sensor fiasco, let me present the unit as used by JUICED (brand) on their ebikes:
https://hilleater.ca/juiced-crosscurrent-torque-sensor/ How's that item for an attention getter?
Now, here is a 12 magnet cadence sensor, as used on both of my 750w fat tire ebikes:https://eunorau-ebike.com/collectio...s-install-on-the-right?variant=37781644673175 $12.00-- Who da thunk it? But NOOOO!!! Instead, I get a BikTrix ebike that spec's a $200 torque sensor bottom bracket consisting of Unobtainium (more on that later) material...
Need to find a torque sensing bottom bracket?? Good luck on dat crap (go ahead and
Google it).. However, I did stumble upon this most interesting website: https://ebikes.ca/catalogsearch/result/index/?p=1&q=Torque+Sensing+Bottom+Bracket .. You will see that prices vary between $150 and $240.. You will also see “OUT OF STOCK” on most of the items.
A bit of advise to every ebike company: The casual ebike rider does NOT want to have to exert more energy /power/pressure to attain a faster speed-- they only want to either push a PAS button or press a thumb throttle paddle to gain that extra speed. The cadence sensor takes care of the aforementioned. A torque sensor bottom bracket requires more exertion on the pedals for additional power. It ain't rocket science, ya know.. Anyway, back to my own current dilemma.


So, after 30 emails, it was decided that BikTrix would send me a replacement torque sensor bottom bracket. And, it was done. When it arrived, I looked it over and, fortunately, discovered the “special purpose” of this type unit AND the very specific/ precise method of its' installation. A piece of cake-- now that I knew its little secrets. By the way, it is possible to install it backwards. That means it will only function when you back-pedal. Then, time for a complete dis-assembly /re-assemble. No fun at all.
So, first, I remove the black control box cover (located on the seat tube) to gain access to the connector. I trace the wire from the bottom bracket torque sensor only to discover that it is
completely severed inside the black box. s*it Fire. Now I know why the SWIFT has been acting in “stupid” mode since mile #1.. I disconnect the useless wire. Then, I get out my special crankset/bottom bracket removal tools and commence the operation. Out comes the torque sensor bottom bracket gadget. No problemo. However, to my surprise the wire connection at the bottom bracket is also frayed-- a round 6-wire unit that has been flattened with multiple wires exposed (see the photo at the end of this posting)... So much for “quality control”. The replacement unit uses a flat 6-wire connector-- common sense, fer sure..
But, now that I know who the “e”culprit is (“Quality Control” at BikTrix), I go about installing the new unit. Patience is a virtue (hell yes). Everything goes according to plan.
I re-install the black cover over the control box wiring, etc. I install the ebike 48v battery and spin the crankset.. NOTHING.. Holy s*it-fire. Now what? I remove the black cover and there it is-- the new wire was completely severed. Though I was careful to re-insert all of the VERY MANY wires back inside the cover, I neglected to allow for the fact that the bottom opening (where all the wires exit the box) was not all that wide/deep and
also that the base plate had a very sharp edge. If you ever need to open that black cover (Lordy help you if you do), run your fingers along that base plate. See how frigging sharp that edge is-- not razor sharp, but definitely QC “negligent” sharp.
Anyway, the very first thing I do is get my little saw and cut out the entire bottom section of the black cover. Won't ever be having wire decapitation occurring again (I can always use duct tape across the bottom). After completing that task, I removed the replacement bottom bracket unit. I didn't even get 1 wheel revolution out of it. Un-frigging-believeable.
I'm pretty good at dealing with bike maintenance stuff (I've been dinking with bikes since 1983), but this scenario had blown me completely away. Not only was BikTrix guilty of
incompetence/negligence/ irresponsibility by specifying this type of sensor on a basic one thousand seven hundred dollar recreational ebike, but, by default, so was I.
I should have caught the deviation (torque vs cadence) when I first perused their website when considering the purchase of this
one thousand seven hundred dollar ebike. But, then again, who would have factored in such a “trivial” item??
Now, onto the internet to email BikTrix in regards to my latest adventure. After explaining my debacle and pointing out their unacceptable “quality control” system (also referenced in post #1 and #2), I received the following reply:
Hi ZZZZZ,
Apologies for the delay.
We can provide you with a new torque sensor if that is what you mean by the bottom bracket. Please confirm.
The cost for the torque sensor will be $200. If you cover 50% ($100) we can send it to you free of extra shipping fees right away. Let me know if that works for you and I will send you the invoice.
Have a great day!
Warmest regards,
XXXX

TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS!!! Jezzus H. This item is just a $20 run-of-the-mill basic bottom bracket with a thin sensing unit wrapped around the main body. I sure as hell DID NOT see $200, or even $100 for this joke of a device. Why in the heck would BikTrix spec such a convoluted piece of ebike technology on a
one thousand seven hundred dollar pure street cruiser-style ebike?? My god, neither of my two Fat Tire beasts (nor any other ebike brand) utilizes this system!!! Oops, my bad-- the 2020 STUNNER LT fat tire/rear hub ebike also uses the torque sensing bottom bracket, as does RIDE1UP (brand) on their $1,800 LMT'D ebike-- buyer beware.. $200.. $200.. $200.. RIDE1UP also uses the same 1,000watt(?) MXUS rear hub motor on some models.. Lucky you..
On Dec 2nd (31 days ago), I placed the order for the $100 replacement sensor (yahoo!! Lucky me.. A $100 discount. Back flips, etc.). By Dec 18th I still had not heard from BikTrix in regards to the shipping of unit #3. Also, since I now had 2 basically
useless $200 bottom brackets (a total of $400-- say that a few times) setting in my living room, I sent off an email to BikTrix:

Dec 18, 2020

HI,
Any idea as to when this gadget/sensor is going to actually ship??
Also, I need to get the address of the company that assembles this item so I can see if I can ship my 2 current sensors to them for installation of a new wire cable.
I already own two of these contraptions:

#1 has 2,300 miles total on it..
#2 has ZERO miles on it.
Pretty good waste of $$$ for $200 (retail) per pathetic unit..
zzzzz


And here is BikTrix response:


Hi ZZZZZ,
We are currently out of stock of the bottom bracket (with torque sensor) for the SWIFT. We currently do not have an ETA on it as well. The company who makes these are somewhere located in China. It wouldn't make any sense sending it back to them.
Great care needs to be taken while installing these as the cables have a tendency to get cut off if not done well.
We will update you as soon as these arrive in stock. Sorry for the inconvenience caused and thank you for your patience and understanding.

As you can see from their response, the issue of cables being cut is apparently NOT an uncommon occurrence. And yet, they CONTINUE to install this bullsheet gizmo on their products.
And, they do not even know who/where their component manufacturer(s) location is. Mighty pathetic, fer sure. I guess that is what you get when you only pay
one thousand seven hundred dollars for what is a basic ebike. Maybe if their component-of-choice was a $20 cadence sensor unit INSTEAD of a $200 torque sensor unit, things would be better all around. Also, I most definitely believe that paying $50 (?) worth of shipping costs to send $400 worth of bottom brackets back to the factory in China for repair is not at all out of the question (apparently, with this product, you can never have too many on hand). DUH!!
In addition, during the course of the 30 emails, I asked if I could install a magnetic Cadence System to replace the Torque Sensor system:
me: Also, do I have the option of being able to install a normal ebikes magnetic ring/electronic pickup (flashing red light) system at the bottom bracket axle, if I choose to do so. I know that cadence sensors have this setup.. Just wondering..
BikTrix: Unfortunately, this is not possible as the controller does not have a separate input for registering cadence.
Warm Regards, XXXX
So, If I should decide to go to the trouble of doing BikTrix's job for them, I would need to locate
and purchase another controller box that is compatible with the basically nonexistent MXUS rear hub motor and which also has Cadence Sensor plug-in capability and is compatible with the SWIFTs peas o' chit multi-color handlebar mounted computer display unit (cdu). See the ripple effect when a product is not “correct” from the get-go?? What to do?? What to do??
For now, I will await the arrival of the 3rd torque sensor unit because, never having had to deal with this gizmo, I am definitely very curious as to how it actually conducts its' $200 real-world bicycling business as compared to the magnificent performance of the $20 cadence sensor installations on my other 4 ebikes.

Today is Jan 1, 2021.. Still no delivery information. Hey, I know: maybe BikTrix needs to go to this website to buy the correct (hopefully) torque sensor bottom bracket for my SWIFT ebike: https://ebikes.ca/catalogsearch/result/index/?p=1&q=Torque+Sensing+Bottom+Bracket
After all, $100 out-of-pocket shouldn't bother them-- it sure didn't bother me to do so.
My 2020 SWIFT arrived on May 28, 2020. It's 1-year warranty period is up on May 27, 2021. However, since I am “without” my ebike (since Dec 2nd) until the 3rd sensor arrives, do I get an “extension” of the warranty based upon how damn long it takes to actually deliver the new sensor?
If I have any further “situations” with this “quality (very questionable)”
one thousand seven hundred dollar ebike, will I be able to send it back to BikTrix for a refund?? After all, if they cannot deliver initially on “quality” issues, AND since they cannot deliver on inventory stocking issues, they don't deserve to retain possession of my (or your) hard earned one thousand seven hundred dollars.

My take on the 2020 SWIFT ebike:
It is not worth $1,700 because it uses a torque sensor bottom bracket.
It is not worth $1,500 because it uses a basically non-existent MXUS rear hub motor.
It is worth $1,300
only because it uses the Reention Dorado 48v “long” battery and a hydraulic disc brake system.

Remember Studebaker? Rambler? DeLorean?-- automobile companies that no longer exist because of??? Maybe BikTrix will be included in the ebike equivalent thereof. Not totally undeserved, fer sure..

From reading various forum postings, it seems that the vast majority of ebike riders do not perform their own repairs/maintenance/tire changes. Instead, they go to their Local Bike Shop (LBS). However, those same shops can, and will, refuse to deal with these ebikes due to an unwillingness to take the chance of their own liability to have to replace a $200 torque sensor bottom bracket (or whatever) due to a wire being inadvertently snipped-- even if that item was not the intended repair. Strange things can/will occur when you are dealing with lots and lots of ebike wires. THEN you, the ebike owner, are really gonna be screwed. Just some food for thought.
As for a comfortable and dependable ebike: pretty much any Fat Tire ebike that uses the BaFang 750 watt rear hub motor. Said ebike can use 26” tires ,or 24” tires, or even 20” tires. I am seeing more and more 20” fat tire ebikes out on the local bike paths and they appear to be quite fun/nimble/ maneuverable. Some of them are straddled by very large mammals (250+ pounds) and they still git down the road like a scared rabbit. Here is one excellent example and it costs the same as the 2020 BikTrix SWIFT ebike: https://shop.m2sbikes.com/collections/all-terrain-electric-bike-series/products/all-terrain-scout
Another deed to do: go get a square of toilet paper.. use a sharpie to write “$1,700.00” on it.. go to the bathroom.. throw the paper into the toilet bowl.. flush.. that is ONE example of flushing one thousand seven hundred dollars down the crapper. Another option: buy the BikTrix SWIFT ebike.
By the way, I fully expect to have to “eat” this newest unworthy toy, but at least I have been able to (hopefully) save you from the exact same $1,700 fate.

My corral of ebikes (all are rear hub motor):
#1. [Oct 2017--1,500 miles] 2018 Xtreme(brand) TrailMaster Elite.. BaFang 250watt motor/9.6ah 24v battery($849): https://www.ebay.com/i/361493378890?rt=nc&_trkparms=aid=1110006&algo=HOMESPLICE.
#2. [Dec 2017-- 3,879 miles] 2018 Xtreme (brand) Sedona.. BaFang 500watt motor/10.4ah 48v battery.. ($1600): https://www.ebay.com/itm/X-treme-Se...in-Bike-Blk-/122088413914?hash=item1c6d095ada
#3. [May 2018-- 15,788 miles] 2018 M2S(brand) KUSH dual-suspension.. BaFang 750watt motor/16ah 48v motor.. ($1,800):
https://shop.m2sbikes.com/collections/all-terrain-electric-bike-series/products/full-suspension-electric-fat-bike
#4. [May 2019--7,425 miles] 2019 M2S (brand) R750.. BaFang 750watt motor/16ah 48v motor (the step-thru model uses 24” fat tires).($1,600): https://shop.m2sbikes.com/collections/all-terrain-electric-bike-series/products/all-terrain-electric-fat-bike
#5. [May 2020-- 2,397 miles] 2020 BikTrix (brand) SWIFT.. MXUS 1000watt(?) motor/14.5ah 48v motor($1,700): https://www.biktrix.com/pages/swift-details
Hmm.. Interesting: the BikTrix website now (on Jan 1, 2021) shows the SWIFT to be equipped with a CADENCE SENSOR.. I wonder what's up wit dat??? Time will tell.
The reason I posted my 5 ebikes and their prices is because #1, #2, and #5 are each basically an overpriced peas o' chit in their own special way (for what you actually get $$$ wise)– so, that is a total of $4,149 down der terlet. Now, where is my sharpie pen and a sheet of toilet paper? But lessons learned-- or is it??
As for #3 and #4: I was SO impressed by #3 that I went ahead and bought #4, too. A total of $3,400 very well spent. I just wish that #3 would have been ebike #1, but, live and learn. I try to go on a 50 mile ride every day and I know that I can hop on either #3 or #4 and they will flat out get the job done—beautifully.. By the way, my “out-the-door ebike riding” weight is 205 pounds.
So, ya win a few/ya lose a few.. You, the reader, can either learn from my mistakes-- or not..

Well, that's all for now.

View attachment 75683In regards to the photo: the unit at the bottom is the original installation. Magnify the photo and examine bottom bracket/wire juncture. See the flattened/frayed wires? Also, notice that both wires have been cut at exactly the same length (going into the black controller box). BikTrix “Quality Control” at work..


HAPPY HOLIDAYS
The wiring harness looks like a simple solder and shrink wrap repair.... Are the wires not color coded well enough?

Its a very simple repair and I could do it but am hesitant that they may not function if they have been back fed voltage. I can repair them and you only pay if they work for you. You cover shipping and $50 if they both work.
 

jangles

Active Member
We have the M2S Scout and it has been a solid bike from unpacking to now . I also Have the Eunorau E-Torque and it has torque sensing instead of cadence and it has been a great bike from the git go . My wife loves it . I have a Eunorau AWD fat bike which after I figured a small problem out has been a great bike and three BBSHD built bikes that have all been great . I have an Ultra FS bike also . So as you can read , I have an ebike problem . I'm looking to either sell one or buy another cause I hate uneven numbers !! lol
 

roshan

Well-Known Member
(#3 of 3) My 2020 SWIFT: TORQUE SENSOR BOTTOM BRACKET price is $200.00..
[[ This/these thread(s) refer to my 2020 SWIFT ebike and are a continuation-on-a-theme. Prior to viewing this thread, you first need to read my Posting #1: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/threads/2020-swift-on-day-10-mileage-264.34577/
and Posting #2: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/threads/my-2020-swift-at-day-150-and-mileage-2-130.38726/ thread postings on this BikTrix forum.
So, having read my two previous threads regarding the 2020 BikTrix SWIFT ebike, you are now aware of the fact that something just did not seem “right” with how this ebike performs. I tried various options, as far as CDU (computer display unit) settings were concerned. Nothing dispelled the nagging sense that, when riding this ebike, there was probably an electrical anomaly running amok within.
[[[ Here is my Oct 27th email to BikTrix describing complete details as to the erratic behavior of my SWIFT ebike (one of 30 back-and-forth emails):

Hi,
Here are some of the items I'm dealing with in regards to my 2020 SWIFT at mileage 2,000+:
1). On level ground and cruising (not pedaling), occasionally the power suddenly kicks in for 1 or 2 seconds. This is rather unnerving since I am not anticipating same (hand off handlebar to click + or -, etc).
2). Going up an incline (equivalent to a highway overpass as far as gradient) and shifting rear derailleur from 3rd to 2nd or 1st, the power cuts out (feels dead) but everything is still “on” . The only way for me to get added boost is to press and hold the thumb throttle for the duration. This takes ALOT of battery consumption. Increasing PAS from 5of9 to higher does nothing.
3). When transitioning from sitting to standing while pedaling, sometimes the power cuts out for a few seconds. This is dangerous in the sense that I can be thrown forward (over the bars) if I'm not alert.
4). I need to use PAS 5 of 9 on smooth level terrain. Any “climb” requires 8of9, or even 9of9. I ride at weight of 200 pounds. Shouldn't I be able to use lower settings PAS 2 or 3of9, etc? My speed is usually at/below 15mph-- I'm just a cruiser and I seldom use/need the thumb throttle.. ]]]
-- So, if YOUR ebike is guilty of the above-mentioned abnormalities, by the time you have finished reading this very long thread posting, you will be completely informed as to what to do/what ebike to not spend your hard-earned $$ on. I have no loyalty to any ebike company-- my only goal is to inform potential ebike buyers on how to avoid flushing their own hard earned $$$ down the toilet.

Over the series of 30 very pleasant emails of back-and-forth inquiries/recommendations between BikTrix and myself, it was finally decided that the most likely culprit in the “e” misconduct was the torque sensor located in/on the bottom bracket. Whenever I did a tight turnaround (within the dimensions of a 10 foot wide concrete bike path), or tried to ascend a hill, the SWIFT would stop-start-stop-start hurky-jerky hiccup. However, using ONLY throttle, things were smooth . If I performed this identical maneuver on my larger, heavier (by at least 25 pounds) M2S (brand) Fat Tire ebikes, their operation was always buttery smooth. No surprises.. No power bursts.. No on/off burpy farty darting (quite dangerous, by the way). However, those two M2S ebikes use a cadence sensor at their bottom bracket-- NOT a torque sensor as is installed on my 2020 SWIFT ebike.
I had never put any thought into the gizmo known as TORQUE SENSOR-- I just figured that it was pretty much the same operating principle/price as a cadence sensor.. HOT DAMN WAS I WRONG!! So, go grab a brewski and settle in for a VERY extended read and a most valuable lesson in Ebike Component Smoke and Mirrors Fiasco .'

Well, my most recent baptism by fire is about to begin. First of all let me tell you about my personal four NEW IMPROVED criteria for any rear hub ebike purchase:
1). The battery MUST be a Reention Dorado 48v (or 52 volt) “long” battery. By “long” I mean a length of 460mm (18 inches), not 390mm (15.4 inches--the length of a 10.4ah battery). If the battery has 16ah/17ah/21ah, it is definitely a long battery.
As a sidenote: JUICED (brand) and RAD ROVER (brand) ebikes use “proprietary” batteries, which means that you are pretty much restricted to them if you want/need to purchase replacement batteries..
2). Braking system must be hydraulic, not mechanical (wire cable). I cannot understate the superiority of the hydraulic units when you are dealing with a 50-80 pound (or even heavier) motorized bicycle. If you do decide to go with mechanical brakes, you will be constantly adjusting the slack due to cable stretch.
3). Bottom Bracket
Cadence Sensor is mandatory. Should you ever need to deal with a replacement unit, the cost is $20.00. And they are easy breezy to install https://support.biktrix.com/hc/en-us/articles/360033119552-Stunner-LT-Cadence-Sensor-Replacement-DIY
You will notice that this instructional link is by BikTrix AND that it is for the Stunner LT rear hub fat tire ebike. The only problem is that the 2020 Stunner LT ebike is now equipped with the $200.00 torque sensor bottom bracket. I sure am curious as to WHY BikTrix replaced the $20 cadence sensor with the $200 (pea's of chit) torque sensor. As far as I can tell, the 2020 BikTrix Stunner LT fat tire 750watt rear hub ebike is the ONLY one out there in ebike world using the torque sensor system.
All four of my other ebikes (including the two 750w fat tire ebikes) use the cadence sensor system and it works just awesome on each of them. NEVER a problem/glitch with any of them. As a matter of act, 99.9% of all Fat Tire rear hub ebikes use the bottom bracket cadence sensor system. If it ain't broke don't try to “fix” it. So, why would BikTrix do EXACTLY THAT??!! $200 wasted-- no matter how you look at it..
4). [this is a really long one] The rear hub motor MUST be a BaFang brand. My other four ebikes each uses this brand of motor. It is the holy grail of rear hub ebike world. The two M2S(brand) fat tire bikes use the 750 watt (1 horsepower) beast of a motor-- remember that it is better to have that power available and seldom use it than to need it and not have it-- especially for, basically, the same $$$ as a less powerful ebike..
My 2018 M2S (brand) KUSH (model) dual-suspension ebike is still, after 2.5 years and 16,000+ miles, purring along just as quiet AND efficient as the very first mile (its name was changed from KUSH to R750 FS in late 2020). The same goes for the 2019 M2S(brand) R750(model) at mile 7,500 after 1.5 years.. This exact same fat tire motor is still in use (and has been since at least 2017) on many 2021 fat tire ebikes which use a rear hub motor. You can locate many sources of BaFang internal gears/ motors/ components on the internet. However, the MXUS rear hub motor used on the 2020 SWIFT is pretty much non-existent out the in ebike/parts world. If it goes kaput, you are screwed-- just like for the $200 bottom bracket torque sensor (more on that item later).
Yet another item to consider: my four ebikes utilizing the Bafang rear hub/motor assembly have remained mechanically consistent for the past 3+ years/30,000+ total miles (since at least Nov. 2017-- when I purchased my first ebike). During that same time frame there have been many new mid-drive motor units, manufactured by a variety of companies (Shimano/ Bosch/ BaFang/CaaCaa-DooDoo), introduced into production. More motor varieties= more specific replacement parts. Ebike companies do not/will not have the luxury of stocking the vast diversity of components (kind of like BikTrix with the torque sensor bottom bracket-- read on).
[[As a sidenote in regards to mid-drive motors: I know zilth about them other than the internet forums-verified fact that they rapidly ruin drivetrain components-- front chainring (3,000 miles), chain (1,500 miles) rear cassette/freewheel (3,000 miles), rear derailleur (3,000 miles). For me, having 31,000 total miles on my 5 ebikes (including the 2020 SWIFT), I have replaced 1 chain, 1 rear cassette, 1 rear derailleur. All of those items were on the 2018 KUSH and were swapped out at around the 12,000 mile mark. In hindsight, I really only needed to replace the rear cassette and the chain. I will leave you to do the math in regards to a mid-drive bike(s) maintenance upkeep/$$$ with the same amount of total mileage]].
--END of my (4) criteria for any rear hub ebike purchase--

Now that I have conveyed my thoughts as to what I look for/expect in an ebike, I shall get to the crux of this thread/post: the $200.00
torque sensor bottom bracket. Want to know the differences between the 2 types of sensors??: https://ebikes.ca/learn/pedal-assist.html
Just to give you yet another angle from which to examine the cadence sensor/torque sensor fiasco, let me present the unit as used by JUICED (brand) on their ebikes:
https://hilleater.ca/juiced-crosscurrent-torque-sensor/ How's that item for an attention getter?
Now, here is a 12 magnet cadence sensor, as used on both of my 750w fat tire ebikes:https://eunorau-ebike.com/collectio...s-install-on-the-right?variant=37781644673175 $12.00-- Who da thunk it? But NOOOO!!! Instead, I get a BikTrix ebike that spec's a $200 torque sensor bottom bracket consisting of Unobtainium (more on that later) material...
Need to find a torque sensing bottom bracket?? Good luck on dat crap (go ahead and
Google it).. However, I did stumble upon this most interesting website: https://ebikes.ca/catalogsearch/result/index/?p=1&q=Torque+Sensing+Bottom+Bracket .. You will see that prices vary between $150 and $240.. You will also see “OUT OF STOCK” on most of the items.
A bit of advise to every ebike company: The casual ebike rider does NOT want to have to exert more energy /power/pressure to attain a faster speed-- they only want to either push a PAS button or press a thumb throttle paddle to gain that extra speed. The cadence sensor takes care of the aforementioned. A torque sensor bottom bracket requires more exertion on the pedals for additional power. It ain't rocket science, ya know.. Anyway, back to my own current dilemma.


So, after 30 emails, it was decided that BikTrix would send me a replacement torque sensor bottom bracket. And, it was done. When it arrived, I looked it over and, fortunately, discovered the “special purpose” of this type unit AND the very specific/ precise method of its' installation. A piece of cake-- now that I knew its little secrets. By the way, it is possible to install it backwards. That means it will only function when you back-pedal. Then, time for a complete dis-assembly /re-assemble. No fun at all.
So, first, I remove the black control box cover (located on the seat tube) to gain access to the connector. I trace the wire from the bottom bracket torque sensor only to discover that it is
completely severed inside the black box. s*it Fire. Now I know why the SWIFT has been acting in “stupid” mode since mile #1.. I disconnect the useless wire. Then, I get out my special crankset/bottom bracket removal tools and commence the operation. Out comes the torque sensor bottom bracket gadget. No problemo. However, to my surprise the wire connection at the bottom bracket is also frayed-- a round 6-wire unit that has been flattened with multiple wires exposed (see the photo at the end of this posting)... So much for “quality control”. The replacement unit uses a flat 6-wire connector-- common sense, fer sure..
But, now that I know who the “e”culprit is (“Quality Control” at BikTrix), I go about installing the new unit. Patience is a virtue (hell yes). Everything goes according to plan.
I re-install the black cover over the control box wiring, etc. I install the ebike 48v battery and spin the crankset.. NOTHING.. Holy s*it-fire. Now what? I remove the black cover and there it is-- the new wire was completely severed. Though I was careful to re-insert all of the VERY MANY wires back inside the cover, I neglected to allow for the fact that the bottom opening (where all the wires exit the box) was not all that wide/deep and
also that the base plate had a very sharp edge. If you ever need to open that black cover (Lordy help you if you do), run your fingers along that base plate. See how frigging sharp that edge is-- not razor sharp, but definitely QC “negligent” sharp.
Anyway, the very first thing I do is get my little saw and cut out the entire bottom section of the black cover. Won't ever be having wire decapitation occurring again (I can always use duct tape across the bottom). After completing that task, I removed the replacement bottom bracket unit. I didn't even get 1 wheel revolution out of it. Un-frigging-believeable.
I'm pretty good at dealing with bike maintenance stuff (I've been dinking with bikes since 1983), but this scenario had blown me completely away. Not only was BikTrix guilty of
incompetence/negligence/ irresponsibility by specifying this type of sensor on a basic one thousand seven hundred dollar recreational ebike, but, by default, so was I.
I should have caught the deviation (torque vs cadence) when I first perused their website when considering the purchase of this
one thousand seven hundred dollar ebike. But, then again, who would have factored in such a “trivial” item??
Now, onto the internet to email BikTrix in regards to my latest adventure. After explaining my debacle and pointing out their unacceptable “quality control” system (also referenced in post #1 and #2), I received the following reply:
Hi ZZZZZ,
Apologies for the delay.
We can provide you with a new torque sensor if that is what you mean by the bottom bracket. Please confirm.
The cost for the torque sensor will be $200. If you cover 50% ($100) we can send it to you free of extra shipping fees right away. Let me know if that works for you and I will send you the invoice.
Have a great day!
Warmest regards,
XXXX

TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS!!! Jezzus H. This item is just a $20 run-of-the-mill basic bottom bracket with a thin sensing unit wrapped around the main body. I sure as hell DID NOT see $200, or even $100 for this joke of a device. Why in the heck would BikTrix spec such a convoluted piece of ebike technology on a
one thousand seven hundred dollar pure street cruiser-style ebike?? My god, neither of my two Fat Tire beasts (nor any other ebike brand) utilizes this system!!! Oops, my bad-- the 2020 STUNNER LT fat tire/rear hub ebike also uses the torque sensing bottom bracket, as does RIDE1UP (brand) on their $1,800 LMT'D ebike-- buyer beware.. $200.. $200.. $200.. RIDE1UP also uses the same 1,000watt(?) MXUS rear hub motor on some models.. Lucky you..
On Dec 2nd (31 days ago), I placed the order for the $100 replacement sensor (yahoo!! Lucky me.. A $100 discount. Back flips, etc.). By Dec 18th I still had not heard from BikTrix in regards to the shipping of unit #3. Also, since I now had 2 basically
useless $200 bottom brackets (a total of $400-- say that a few times) setting in my living room, I sent off an email to BikTrix:

Dec 18, 2020

HI,
Any idea as to when this gadget/sensor is going to actually ship??
Also, I need to get the address of the company that assembles this item so I can see if I can ship my 2 current sensors to them for installation of a new wire cable.
I already own two of these contraptions:

#1 has 2,300 miles total on it..
#2 has ZERO miles on it.
Pretty good waste of $$$ for $200 (retail) per pathetic unit..
zzzzz


And here is BikTrix response:


Hi ZZZZZ,
We are currently out of stock of the bottom bracket (with torque sensor) for the SWIFT. We currently do not have an ETA on it as well. The company who makes these are somewhere located in China. It wouldn't make any sense sending it back to them.
Great care needs to be taken while installing these as the cables have a tendency to get cut off if not done well.
We will update you as soon as these arrive in stock. Sorry for the inconvenience caused and thank you for your patience and understanding.

As you can see from their response, the issue of cables being cut is apparently NOT an uncommon occurrence. And yet, they CONTINUE to install this bullsheet gizmo on their products.
And, they do not even know who/where their component manufacturer(s) location is. Mighty pathetic, fer sure. I guess that is what you get when you only pay
one thousand seven hundred dollars for what is a basic ebike. Maybe if their component-of-choice was a $20 cadence sensor unit INSTEAD of a $200 torque sensor unit, things would be better all around. Also, I most definitely believe that paying $50 (?) worth of shipping costs to send $400 worth of bottom brackets back to the factory in China for repair is not at all out of the question (apparently, with this product, you can never have too many on hand). DUH!!
In addition, during the course of the 30 emails, I asked if I could install a magnetic Cadence System to replace the Torque Sensor system:
me: Also, do I have the option of being able to install a normal ebikes magnetic ring/electronic pickup (flashing red light) system at the bottom bracket axle, if I choose to do so. I know that cadence sensors have this setup.. Just wondering..
BikTrix: Unfortunately, this is not possible as the controller does not have a separate input for registering cadence.
Warm Regards, XXXX
So, If I should decide to go to the trouble of doing BikTrix's job for them, I would need to locate
and purchase another controller box that is compatible with the basically nonexistent MXUS rear hub motor and which also has Cadence Sensor plug-in capability and is compatible with the SWIFTs peas o' chit multi-color handlebar mounted computer display unit (cdu). See the ripple effect when a product is not “correct” from the get-go?? What to do?? What to do??
For now, I will await the arrival of the 3rd torque sensor unit because, never having had to deal with this gizmo, I am definitely very curious as to how it actually conducts its' $200 real-world bicycling business as compared to the magnificent performance of the $20 cadence sensor installations on my other 4 ebikes.

Today is Jan 1, 2021.. Still no delivery information. Hey, I know: maybe BikTrix needs to go to this website to buy the correct (hopefully) torque sensor bottom bracket for my SWIFT ebike: https://ebikes.ca/catalogsearch/result/index/?p=1&q=Torque+Sensing+Bottom+Bracket
After all, $100 out-of-pocket shouldn't bother them-- it sure didn't bother me to do so.
My 2020 SWIFT arrived on May 28, 2020. It's 1-year warranty period is up on May 27, 2021. However, since I am “without” my ebike (since Dec 2nd) until the 3rd sensor arrives, do I get an “extension” of the warranty based upon how damn long it takes to actually deliver the new sensor?
If I have any further “situations” with this “quality (very questionable)”
one thousand seven hundred dollar ebike, will I be able to send it back to BikTrix for a refund?? After all, if they cannot deliver initially on “quality” issues, AND since they cannot deliver on inventory stocking issues, they don't deserve to retain possession of my (or your) hard earned one thousand seven hundred dollars.

My take on the 2020 SWIFT ebike:
It is not worth $1,700 because it uses a torque sensor bottom bracket.
It is not worth $1,500 because it uses a basically non-existent MXUS rear hub motor.
It is worth $1,300
only because it uses the Reention Dorado 48v “long” battery and a hydraulic disc brake system.

Remember Studebaker? Rambler? DeLorean?-- automobile companies that no longer exist because of??? Maybe BikTrix will be included in the ebike equivalent thereof. Not totally undeserved, fer sure..

From reading various forum postings, it seems that the vast majority of ebike riders do not perform their own repairs/maintenance/tire changes. Instead, they go to their Local Bike Shop (LBS). However, those same shops can, and will, refuse to deal with these ebikes due to an unwillingness to take the chance of their own liability to have to replace a $200 torque sensor bottom bracket (or whatever) due to a wire being inadvertently snipped-- even if that item was not the intended repair. Strange things can/will occur when you are dealing with lots and lots of ebike wires. THEN you, the ebike owner, are really gonna be screwed. Just some food for thought.
As for a comfortable and dependable ebike: pretty much any Fat Tire ebike that uses the BaFang 750 watt rear hub motor. Said ebike can use 26” tires ,or 24” tires, or even 20” tires. I am seeing more and more 20” fat tire ebikes out on the local bike paths and they appear to be quite fun/nimble/ maneuverable. Some of them are straddled by very large mammals (250+ pounds) and they still git down the road like a scared rabbit. Here is one excellent example and it costs the same as the 2020 BikTrix SWIFT ebike: https://shop.m2sbikes.com/collections/all-terrain-electric-bike-series/products/all-terrain-scout
Another deed to do: go get a square of toilet paper.. use a sharpie to write “$1,700.00” on it.. go to the bathroom.. throw the paper into the toilet bowl.. flush.. that is ONE example of flushing one thousand seven hundred dollars down the crapper. Another option: buy the BikTrix SWIFT ebike.
By the way, I fully expect to have to “eat” this newest unworthy toy, but at least I have been able to (hopefully) save you from the exact same $1,700 fate.

My corral of ebikes (all are rear hub motor):
#1. [Oct 2017--1,500 miles] 2018 Xtreme(brand) TrailMaster Elite.. BaFang 250watt motor/9.6ah 24v battery($849): https://www.ebay.com/i/361493378890?rt=nc&_trkparms=aid=1110006&algo=HOMESPLICE.
#2. [Dec 2017-- 3,879 miles] 2018 Xtreme (brand) Sedona.. BaFang 500watt motor/10.4ah 48v battery.. ($1600): https://www.ebay.com/itm/X-treme-Se...in-Bike-Blk-/122088413914?hash=item1c6d095ada
#3. [May 2018-- 15,788 miles] 2018 M2S(brand) KUSH dual-suspension.. BaFang 750watt motor/16ah 48v battery.. ($1,800):
https://shop.m2sbikes.com/collections/all-terrain-electric-bike-series/products/full-suspension-electric-fat-bike
#4. [May 2019--7,425 miles] 2019 M2S (brand) R750.. BaFang 750watt motor/16ah 48v battery (the step-thru model uses 24” fat tires).($1,600): https://shop.m2sbikes.com/collections/all-terrain-electric-bike-series/products/all-terrain-electric-fat-bike
#5. [May 2020-- 2,397 miles] 2020 BikTrix (brand) SWIFT.. MXUS 1000watt(?) motor/14.5ah 48v battery($1,700): https://www.biktrix.com/pages/swift-details
Hmm.. Interesting: the BikTrix website now (on Jan 1, 2021) shows the SWIFT to be equipped with a CADENCE SENSOR.. I wonder what's up wit dat??? Time will tell.
The reason I posted my 5 ebikes and their prices is because #1, #2, and #5 are each basically an overpriced peas o' chit in their own special way (for what you actually get $$$ wise)– so, that is a total of $4,149 down der terlet. Now, where is my sharpie pen and a sheet of toilet paper? But lessons learned-- or is it??
As for #3 and #4: I was SO impressed by #3 that I went ahead and bought #4, too. A total of $3,400 very well spent. I just wish that #3 would have been ebike #1, but, live and learn. I try to go on a 50 mile ride every day and I know that I can hop on either #3 or #4 and they will flat out get the job done—beautifully.. By the way, my “out-the-door ebike riding” weight is 205 pounds.
So, ya win a few/ya lose a few.. You, the reader, can either learn from my mistakes-- or not..

Well, that's all for now.

View attachment 75683In regards to the photo: the unit at the bottom is the original installation. Magnify the photo and examine bottom bracket/wire juncture. See the flattened/frayed wires? Also, notice that both wires have been cut at exactly the same length (going into the black controller box). BikTrix “Quality Control” at work..


HAPPY HOLIDAYS
Hi Sic Puppy,

Thanks for making your detailed post. I didn't read all of it as the bold hurt my eyes, but what I gather is this:
- You bought a Swift from us (for $1700)
- You discovered that the torque sensor had 2 issues:
1. When coasting, not pedaling, the motor may kick on for a second or two (no mention of whether your foot was on the pedals thereby applying torque or not)
2. When shifting to a lower gear while pedaling (eg 3-2) you notice power drop for a few seconds and you use the throttle to power up
3. When going sitting to standing while pedaling, power cuts off for a fraction of a second
4. You need to use level 5-9 often (you want to use lower levels)
- Very unhappy with the delays involved with getting the part.
5. Then you go on and list 4 other bikes that you have, that have worked great for you. Worth noting that none of them have torque sensor, just cadence sensor.
6. You also post pictures of 2 torque sensors - both with freyed wires.

Okay, so here is my comment on the issues you are having. Please don't think I am dismissing this, but please hear me out.
- Honestly, I am of the opinion that you should NOT have got a torque sensing bike as you are very used to and very well versed with a cadence sensor. Cadence and torque sensors are completely different in the way they work and each person likes one or the other. Some people like both. Some hate one or the other.

1. When coasting, not pedaling, the motor may kick on for a second or two (no mention of whether your foot was on the pedals thereby applying torque or not):
Okay, this behavior is triggered if one of your foot is applying more pressure on the pedals than the other. As torque sensors measure torque from both pedals and uses that to determine pedaling effort, if there is any differential in torque (force applied by your foot), it is reflected in the assist.
2. When shifting to a lower gear while pedaling (eg 3-2) you notice power drop for a few seconds and you use the throttle to power up
Consider a regular non-electric bike. If you look at how much force is applied on the pedals, you will see that the lower the gear you're on, the lower force/pressure you apply. Unless you are standing on the pedals of-course. What I mean is, if I'm pedaling the same terrain on gear 2, vs gear 3, I need to apply more pressure in gear 3 to go the same speed. This is just how gears work. Lower the gear, easier to pedal and hence lower pressure required by your foot.
Now, consider the effect of what I just said on a torque sensor that is measuring the force applied by your feet. You'll understand why the power drops when you downshift. (Ie. because the torque you're applying has inherently dropped when you shifted)

3. When going sitting to standing while pedaling, power cuts off for a fraction of a second
When there is an abrupt change in torque applied (eg. standing to sitting, sitting to standing, or pedaling hard from standstill on a higher gear), the torque sensor tells the controller that there is a sudden spike in the differential. Rather than take that true differential and boost power, the controller cuts power for a fraction of a second to see what the next reading from the torque sensor looks like. So that it can offer assist appropriately.
4. You need to use level 5-9 often (you want to use lower levels)
Okay, this, is relatively easy to tune. On Bafang controllers, the power for each assist level is programmed on to the controller. Like shown below:
1609968380229.png

You can change the settings on the Limit Current% to higher percentages on each levels 1-5 and you will get more power in levels 1-5
6. You also post pictures of 2 torque sensors - both with freyed wires.
We have sold 10s of 1000s of bikes with this torque sensor (Swift and Stunner LT). Of these, we have had less than 0.5% issues with the bikes which include torque sensor issues. The freying you've seen can easily be duplicated on more sensors, if the sensor was uninstalled improperly from the bike. There is exactly 1 way to install and uninstall the torque sensor on these bikes due to the limited room in the bottom bracket and if not done properly, the wires will get freyed or even cut.

From my answers above, you'll see that the initial issues that you were having weren't really torque sensor related issues. It could have been fixed by tweaking the torque sensor parameters like sensitivity etc.

I would not recommend going with alternate torque sensors as we cannot guarantee that they will work for you.

I also have to say that we made the wrong call on asking you to swap the torque sensor the first time around. It has been difficult to find technical staff that could work in customer service. This is something we are working on but is an issue that a lot of companies face.

PS: MXUS is a HUGE company that has been around even before Bafang. Their motors are more expensive (like 1.5-2x more) than Bafang which is why most of our competitors don't use them. Bafang doesn't make a true 750W hub motor that fits a normal bike dropout. They make the G06 which is for fat bikes. This is why we spec'd this bike with MXUS. It's not because we like to spend more money to offer less.
 
Last edited:

burlguy

Member
What happens if they send you a 2nd unit and during installation the harness gets cut again? I understand this has become a mission for you and I respect that. I just like to fix things....

I offered to fix the harness for the cost of shipping and my offer is still open. Jeremy James Po Box 381 Fort Bragg, Ca. 95437.

Send me a message as to when I should expect it and I will try to get it back out to you same day.
 

BigNerd

Well-Known Member
To BigNerd [712 messages]: Ah, young grasshopper, the answers lie in the ability to actually read, and comprehend, what has been presented. A former neighbor of mine once asked the same basic questions as you. He was a simpleminded fellow. Sadly, he was trampled by a herd of stampeding Galapagos tortoises—14 to be exact. It took 3 days for the carnage to finally end. It could have ended in 2 days but, according to the autopsy results, more than a few of the beastly reptiles stopped to have their way with him. The Horror, The Horror. If only he hadn't taken so long trying to decide in what direction to walk so as to avoid the onslaught/carnage. Fortunately, he was later the cover story in Tortoise Monthly magazine. So, I guess you might say that he was flattened and flattered.
By the way, every viewer of this complete thread posting knows the answer to your “lazy” questions.
Over a period of 39 months, the total purchase price for all 5 of my ebikes is $9,249.. That is also the average cost of 1 jet ski with trailer, or one ski/bass boat without trailer, or 1 quad runner with trailer, or 1 snow machine with trailer, or 1 custom golf cart, or 1 camper travel trailer, or ½ of a Harley Davidson motorcycle. So, it's all relative: toyz is toyz.
To a person who works the front counter at the local haberdashery, the purchase of an ebike needs to entail the ability/moxey to spend those sparse $$$ in the most efficient manner the first time around. However, to the rest of us, it /they are just another toy.
So I get the toys are toys thing... but still didn't answer my question about if the other 2 bikes were so good... why did you switch brands?

And while I enjoy the creativity of your post, you will not further your cause with me by veiled name calling.

Good luck and I hope this works out for you.

- The Simpleminded, Lazy, Unable to Read and Comprehend BigNerd
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
From Sic Puppy [48 messages]:
To J.R. [ 3,413 messages]
: I'll get around to “cleaning up” the format/bold letter situation within the next 6 months, or so. Sorry to hear about your old eyes. I imagine that bi-focals are part of your world. The only glasses I use are sunglasses when on my bike rides. I go to the humongous VA Regional hospital located on the east side of town for my annual lobotomy/physical/eye tests. The doctor always tells me, for a person born in 1951, my 20/25 eyesight is pretty awesome and to just keep doing whatever I've been doing to keep things sharp. Also, your “BikTrix seems like a responsive company” is the definitive phrasing, for sure.

To BigNerd [712 messages]: Ah, young grasshopper, the answers lie in the ability to actually read, and comprehend, what has been presented. A former neighbor of mine once asked the same basic questions as you. He was a simpleminded fellow. Sadly, he was trampled by a herd of stampeding Galapagos tortoises—14 to be exact. It took 3 days for the carnage to finally end. It could have ended in 2 days but, according to the autopsy results, more than a few of the beastly reptiles stopped to have their way with him. The Horror, The Horror. If only he hadn't taken so long trying to decide in what direction to walk so as to avoid the onslaught/carnage. Fortunately, he was later the cover story in Tortoise Monthly magazine. So, I guess you might say that he was flattened and flattered.
By the way, every viewer of this complete thread posting knows the answer to your “lazy” questions.
Over a period of 39 months, the total purchase price for all 5 of my ebikes is $9,249.. That is also the average cost of 1 jet ski with trailer, or one ski/bass boat without trailer, or 1 quad runner with trailer, or 1 snow machine with trailer, or 1 custom golf cart, or 1 camper travel trailer, or ½ of a Harley Davidson motorcycle. So, it's all relative: toyz is toyz.
To a person who works the front counter at the local haberdashery, the purchase of an ebike needs to entail the ability/moxey to spend those sparse $$$ in the most efficient manner the first time around. However, to the rest of us, it /they are just another toy.

To Thomas Jaszewski [5,076 messages]: Looks like someone touched a nerve (or popped a 'roid). I remember back in May 2020 when I was doing a search on this website for the MXUS motor, etc. There was one poster, who I believe to be you, promoting the brand. Otherwise, there wasn't much else to go on. However, now is your time to shine. Since 7 is always considered to be a lucky number (at least in Las Vegas), it would be awesome if you could post on this thread, the links to 7 ebikes that use the MXUS rear hub motor system. That shouldn't be a problem for you at all . The only stipulation is that every ebike must retail for at least $1,500 US. That way, no AliBaba/Amazon throw-away ebikes will be factored in the mix. You can even include the two ebikes that I mentioned in my post. And remember: inquiring minds want to know..
As far as punctuation/structure is concerned: I'm sure that anyone with the IQ of a hamster will be able to easily decipher the info that I've posted. Sorry that you had such a very difficult time of it.
As for self-support: it's the only way to go. You should have picked up on my ability to perform bike maintenance when you read that I removed the torque sensor bottom bracket. To do so requires a crankset removal tool and a bottom bracket removal tool. Neither of those items are standard in any HomeDepot tool kit. You now see the reason I included “messages” along with each poster who replied. I want the casual viewer to be aware that, to some people, it is easier to just post something (anything) than it is to take the time to actually form an actual educated response. Their priority is in the form of tapping on those keyboard alphanumerics so they can see their post displayed on the website, and thus, increase that “message” count. So sad.
I refuse to take my business to any bike shop. Bikes are not difficult to maintain/repair. Likewise for Ebikes, but they just require a little more of an expanded thought process. All of my eight bikes (I also own 3 old school bikes) are always in 100% perfect mechanical condition and I can ride any of them at any time - even the BikTrix. On it, I would just be confined to “throttle” only for extra gitty-up-go.
Remember that, if all else fails, I'll just buy yet another ebike. No problemo.

Burlguy [14 messages]: I appreciate the offer, but, truth be told, I only presented that back-to-supplier option to see what the BikTrix reaction would be. I was quite surprised by their response. Besides, I would only trust a brand new unit at that precarious/confining location. Lets face it, the factory in China would just send me two new units. The items I mailed to them would end up in their own junk drawer. Realistically , my two useless units will be put in my Junk Drawer along with the 4 brand new, but also useless (to me), rear racks from my ebikes.
One way or another, I will obtain a new torque sensor bottom bracket. I always have $$$ available for my many toyz. It's just that the ball is in BikTrix court now. If ya can't trust a Canuck, who can ya trust??

jangles [200 messages]: Chandler.. Mesa.. Flagstaff.. Lived there, done that.. Gotta love Arizona.
I'd really like to give the torque sensor unit on my ebike a fair unbiased shakedown but, in 2,300 total miles, it is still an electrical anomaly. Time will tell. It currently serves as a $1,700 rack to hang my 6 helmets on.
As for having too many toyz: never gonna happen. But, I think your post might have made one of the other posters cry a little. Lately, out on the local bike paths, I've seen some “e” one-wheel boards that use what appears to be a 20” wheel. I sure do think about it, but at 70 years old, I'll be pressing my luck. Or not.

Roshan [458 messages]: BIKTRIX Numero Uno.. Da Big Dawg.. Glad to hear from you. I knew that your people had just returned from holiday vacation on Monday so I have been biding my time as I await your input.
I get a real yuck out of the bold thing. So many viewers with delicate eyes. Using a cell phone as a viewing device is a sure way to rapidly ruin your vision. You need to view via an actual laptop computer screen (mine is 15”) or a large monitor (mine is 32”).. I'll correct the font item with the same rapidity that your BikTrix people have shown towards me in sending that replacement sensor unit (that I paid $100 for). Besides, I have a feeling that many, many people will be viewing this particular thread. I have already fixed the (Post #2) fonts. As for this reply, I have used [ ] to indicate your post reply info.
Your person said (in his Dec 2nd email) that the item would be shipped to me immediately. Today makes 36 days since that day. And then there is the Dec 18th email.
This is the link to your BikTrix website: https://www.biktrix.com/pages/ebikes .. Now scroll down to “The SWIFT Series”. Now look under SWIFT information and find these two words Cadence Sensor . So, that being the case, when I purchased my 2020 SWIFT ebike in May 2020, I did so as the purchaser of a cadence sensor equipped ebike - just as your website advertises. You haven't got any way to walk this back. You screwed up. Not me.
You accused me of, basically, being too stupid to know how to ride a torque sensor ebike. You owe me an $1,800 apology on that mis-information alone. I can't trust you/your company even if I were to be permitted to ship the SWIFT ebike back to Canada. I'd never see that $1,800 ($1,700 + $100).
Remember, I have multiple ebikes so I have a basic “feel” for these beasts. I know full well how to install/ maintain/adjust/improvise/ improve components, including a cadence sensor unit. Dealing with your ridiculously overpriced torque sensor qizmo has just added to that knowledge base.
A person with only the one SWIFT ebike, and who was not familiar with the peculiarities of ebikes, can easily be deflected in regards to its riding behavior so as to enable BikTrix company avoiding having to part with an item having a $200 retail price – “Oh, that's just the way an ebike behaves. It's a little different than a regular bicycle”. I can see that happening - often, too. Just like a used car salesman. Motivation to save a $$. Shame.. on.. you..

[1. When coasting, not pedaling, the motor may kick on for a second or two (no mention of whether your foot was on the pedals thereby applying torque or not):
Okay, this behavior is triggered if one of your foot is applying more pressure on the pedals than the other. As torque sensors measure torque from both pedals and uses that to determine pedaling effort, if there is any differential in torque (force applied by your foot), it is reflected in the assist.]
I've been cycling since 1983. I know how to “coast”. Again, you use a play on words to insult my intelligence.
Concerning the chart for PAS % power settings: those are common knowledge, be it 1-9(11%,etc) or 1-5(20%,etc) or 1-3(33%,etc) .. Simple math-- even for a hamster.

[I would not recommend going with alternate torque sensors as we cannot guarantee that they will work for you.]
I'm going to install/use the torque sensor that I paid your company $100US for. Mail it to me.
And again:
[ I would not recommend going with alternate torque sensors as we cannot guarantee that they will work for you and: We have sold 10s of 1000s of bikes with this torque sensor (Swift and Stunner LT). ]
Really?? Then you need to include the torque sensor (and its $200 price) in the parts/accessories section(s) of your website. You also should actually physically stock the item, too – assuming that you can eventually locate that pesky China supply source. After all, you cannot even locate a single unit to send my way. Also, your word is not to be trusted, be it item shipping time, cadence sensor/torque sensor advertisement deception, or the correct 28.6mm seat post size for the SWIFT ebike (as opposed to the size advertised on your website).You should not deduct any $$($100) from a persons account until you actually ship an item.

[I also have to say that we made the wrong call on asking you to swap the torque sensor the first time around. It has been difficult to find technical staff that could work in customer service. This is something we are working on but is an issue that a lot of companies face.]
This is hilarious. We are not dealing with rocket science, here. I re-installed that replacement unit perfectly AFTER I took the time to carefully inspect it. Definitely a unique/concise/precise piece of ebike electrical equipment, but not something which is NASA-only special. In my situation, the control box was the evil wire-severed culprit on #2-- which never would have happened if the original unit was installed correctly at the factory. And, you are also insulting every mechanic who performs maintenance/ repair work on any type of ebike. So, they, too, are stupid/incompetent. Dang. Get a grip, fella. Since your website has many tutorials on ebike maintenance, etc. you need to include an instructional video on the $200 torque sensor bottom bracket. That way every person will be able to deal with the repair. Again, it's not rocket science.
When you finally deliver the torque sensor to me, I will install it, ride the SWIFT ebike for 100 miles as a “shakedown” test, and then determine whats what.

As for “ [This is something we are working on] “
My advice for you is to spend a lot more time improving your companies business plan and a lot less time pounding your computer keyboard in order to post 458 messages on this website forum. By the way, in my case, instead of continuously abusing a computer keyboard, I do 50 mile rides pretty much every day-- 53 miles yesterday.. 51 miles today.. etc. And, always on one of my 2 ultra-dependable M2S(brand) fat tire beasts (16,000+ miles and 7,000+ miles respectively ).

BikTrix email to me on Nov 17, 2020:
[ Hi xxx
Thanks for sharing the detailed description again.
It seems to be the torque sensor that is not working properly. However, there are many variables to consider.
Could you please provide us with your order number? We can send you a new torque sensor. ]
It would seem that your professionally trained employee is the one who initially identified the torque sensor as the culprit. I didn't even register “torque sensor” until that email because “cadence sensor” was my only mindset (once again, see your own website SWIFT data/info)..

This statement: [Bafang doesn't make a true 750W hub motor that fits a normal bike dropout. ]
http://dbikes.com/https://www.juiceproducts/crosscurrent-s2?variant=36449086226 Now, lets see, what motor (BaFang) and power rating (750 watt) is installed on this awesome JUICED(brand) ebike? And, those are not fat tire wheels (don't give me the 700c wheels vs 26” wheels smoke-and-mirrors diversion ).

[PS: MXUS is a HUGE company that has been around even before Bafang. Their motors are more expensive (like 1.5-2x more) than Bafang which is why most of our competitors don't use them. Bafang doesn't make a true 750W hub motor that fits a normal bike dropout. They make the G06 which is for fat bikes. This is why we spec'd this bike with MXUS. It's not because we like to spend more money to offer less.]

MXUS motor unit. This is the motor (XF19R) I have installed on my 2020 SWIFT ebike. : https://www.aliexpress.com/item/400...o_expid=875f3ad2-1500-451e-80e8-d00a371208ad- Price: $242.16
I couldn't locate the BaFang rear hub motor identification/type number(?SW02?) on the JUICED CrossCurrent ebike link mentioned above, but it should not exceed the price of this fat tire motor. However, this unit should serve as a $$$ reference:
BaFang motor unit (750watt rear wheel DC26); https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001896102254.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.32504f43kerwxG&algo_pvid=cd699f51-22cd-4b21-8599-250d38b76d8b&algo_expid=cd699f51-22cd-4b21-8599-250d38b76d8b Price: $229.99

You must be using some kind of Canadian math formula because this USA resident does not see (like 1.5-2x more) at all.. Also, lets see, MXUS motor and $200 torque sensor bottom bracket unit or BaFang motor and $20 cadence sensor unit. Either way, you sure are one heck of a shrewd businessman.
By the way, everything you referenced in regards to the operating characteristics of a torque sensor bottom bracket unit point out just how dangerous/hazardous this item can be to a novice/recreational ebike rider. My advice for those riders is to avoid, at all costs, any rear hub ebike using the torque sensor system.

As far as my situation is concerned, my 2020 SWIFT ebike has been malfunctioning since day 1/mile 0. From the outset, I felt that something was amiss. And now, 222 days after its FedEx delivery, I still have not been able to go on a 100% reliable bike ride on it. But, I really look forward to that day finally arriving- it is 100% up to you.
Let me re-emphasize to you/ your company/ your minions: I don't give a dang about anything concerning you. My only intent is to look out for my fellow ebike riders/owners because, in this internet day and age of disconnected involvement by ebike companies and their consumers, consumers can/will “get the shaft” in a variety of ways. After all, BikTrix is located in Canada-- pretty much insulated from any potential customer legal actions originating from within the USA.
Who knows, maybe ebikes are not your forte.. maybe toilet bowls/flush handles are..

I have to discount the “input” of some of the other posters on this thread because, as far as I can tell, not a one of them actually owns a 2020 SWIFT ebike. Therefore, that makes their keyboard entries a mute issue. Just your minions doing your bidding. Pathetic. Which reminds me, this paragraph was originally part of my initial #3 post:
"As an aside, I honestly expect to get more than a little flak as a result of posting this thread because BikTrix ebike company has a large cadre of minions perusing this particular forum. However, I am otay wit dat. I have no loyalty to any ebike company-- my only goal is to inform potential ebike buyers on how to avoid flushing their own hard earned $$$ down the toilet."
However, I decided to omit it just so I could see what the reaction to my posting would be. ChaChing..

Remember, certain select minions: If you want to run with the Big Dawgs, you have to do a lot more than just sniff butt and lay around licking yourself -- and stop humping dat leg...

In closing, regarding your initial sentence on this post:
" Hi Sic Puppy,
Thanks for making your detailed post. I didn't read all of it as the bold hurt my eyes, but what I gather is this:"
You once again throw your own self under the bus by admitting that you are too unconcerned with the total content and too lazy to do the leg (eye) work, but you sure are eager enough to pound those keyboard keys so you can present your side. So sad. You must be related to some of your minions.
By the way, I'm going to attach this thread as a link to all future EBReview postings of mine because inquiring minds want/need to know.
Well, it's time to post this response and then go out for my (almost daily) 50+ mile ride on my absolutely dependable M2S (brand) fat tire beast(s)...
So, send me that torque sensor bottom bracket so I can ride ebike #5..
It's a curious thing, that people throw insults at strangers that only wish you the best or try to help. No matter, insults from a stranger that I neither respect or disrespect will never hurt my feelings. Just words. One has to respect or be as insecure as the person insulting you for it to hurt. Best of luck with whatever you are trying to accomplish.

Sincerely,
Mr. Magoo

 

roshan

Well-Known Member
From Sic Puppy [48 messages]:
To J.R. [ 3,413 messages]
: I'll get around to “cleaning up” the format/bold letter situation within the next 6 months, or so. Sorry to hear about your old eyes. I imagine that bi-focals are part of your world. The only glasses I use are sunglasses when on my bike rides. I go to the humongous VA Regional hospital located on the east side of town for my annual lobotomy/physical/eye tests. The doctor always tells me, for a person born in 1951, my 20/25 eyesight is pretty awesome and to just keep doing whatever I've been doing to keep things sharp. Also, your “BikTrix seems like a responsive company” is the definitive phrasing, for sure.

To BigNerd [712 messages]: Ah, young grasshopper, the answers lie in the ability to actually read, and comprehend, what has been presented. A former neighbor of mine once asked the same basic questions as you. He was a simpleminded fellow. Sadly, he was trampled by a herd of stampeding Galapagos tortoises—14 to be exact. It took 3 days for the carnage to finally end. It could have ended in 2 days but, according to the autopsy results, more than a few of the beastly reptiles stopped to have their way with him. The Horror, The Horror. If only he hadn't taken so long trying to decide in what direction to walk so as to avoid the onslaught/carnage. Fortunately, he was later the cover story in Tortoise Monthly magazine. So, I guess you might say that he was flattened and flattered.
By the way, every viewer of this complete thread posting knows the answer to your “lazy” questions.
Over a period of 39 months, the total purchase price for all 5 of my ebikes is $9,249.. That is also the average cost of 1 jet ski with trailer, or one ski/bass boat without trailer, or 1 quad runner with trailer, or 1 snow machine with trailer, or 1 custom golf cart, or 1 camper travel trailer, or ½ of a Harley Davidson motorcycle. So, it's all relative: toyz is toyz.
To a person who works the front counter at the local haberdashery, the purchase of an ebike needs to entail the ability/moxey to spend those sparse $$$ in the most efficient manner the first time around. However, to the rest of us, it /they are just another toy.

To Thomas Jaszewski [5,076 messages]: Looks like someone touched a nerve (or popped a 'roid). I remember back in May 2020 when I was doing a search on this website for the MXUS motor, etc. There was one poster, who I believe to be you, promoting the brand. Otherwise, there wasn't much else to go on. However, now is your time to shine. Since 7 is always considered to be a lucky number (at least in Las Vegas), it would be awesome if you could post on this thread, the links to 7 ebikes that use the MXUS rear hub motor system. That shouldn't be a problem for you at all . The only stipulation is that every ebike must retail for at least $1,500 US. That way, no AliBaba/Amazon throw-away ebikes will be factored in the mix. You can even include the two ebikes that I mentioned in my post. And remember: inquiring minds want to know..
As far as punctuation/structure is concerned: I'm sure that anyone with the IQ of a hamster will be able to easily decipher the info that I've posted. Sorry that you had such a very difficult time of it.
As for self-support: it's the only way to go. You should have picked up on my ability to perform bike maintenance when you read that I removed the torque sensor bottom bracket. To do so requires a crankset removal tool and a bottom bracket removal tool. Neither of those items are standard in any HomeDepot tool kit. You now see the reason I included “messages” along with each poster who replied. I want the casual viewer to be aware that, to some people, it is easier to just post something (anything) than it is to take the time to actually form an actual educated response. Their priority is in the form of tapping on those keyboard alphanumerics so they can see their post displayed on the website, and thus, increase that “message” count. So sad.
I refuse to take my business to any bike shop. Bikes are not difficult to maintain/repair. Likewise for Ebikes, but they just require a little more of an expanded thought process. All of my eight bikes (I also own 3 old school bikes) are always in 100% perfect mechanical condition and I can ride any of them at any time - even the BikTrix. On it, I would just be confined to “throttle” only for extra gitty-up-go.
Remember that, if all else fails, I'll just buy yet another ebike. No problemo.

Burlguy [14 messages]: I appreciate the offer, but, truth be told, I only presented that back-to-supplier option to see what the BikTrix reaction would be. I was quite surprised by their response. Besides, I would only trust a brand new unit at that precarious/confining location. Lets face it, the factory in China would just send me two new units. The items I mailed to them would end up in their own junk drawer. Realistically , my two useless units will be put in my Junk Drawer along with the 4 brand new, but also useless (to me), rear racks from my ebikes.
One way or another, I will obtain a new torque sensor bottom bracket. I always have $$$ available for my many toyz. It's just that the ball is in BikTrix court now. If ya can't trust a Canuck, who can ya trust??

jangles [200 messages]: Chandler.. Mesa.. Flagstaff.. Lived there, done that.. Gotta love Arizona.
I'd really like to give the torque sensor unit on my ebike a fair unbiased shakedown but, in 2,300 total miles, it is still an electrical anomaly. Time will tell. It currently serves as a $1,700 rack to hang my 6 helmets on.
As for having too many toyz: never gonna happen. But, I think your post might have made one of the other posters cry a little. Lately, out on the local bike paths, I've seen some “e” one-wheel boards that use what appears to be a 20” wheel. I sure do think about it, but at 70 years old, I'll be pressing my luck. Or not.

Roshan [458 messages]: BIKTRIX Numero Uno.. Da Big Dawg.. Glad to hear from you. I knew that your people had just returned from holiday vacation on Monday so I have been biding my time as I await your input.
I get a real yuck out of the bold thing. So many viewers with delicate eyes. Using a cell phone as a viewing device is a sure way to rapidly ruin your vision. You need to view via an actual laptop computer screen (mine is 15”) or a large monitor (mine is 32”).. I'll correct the font item with the same rapidity that your BikTrix people have shown towards me in sending that replacement sensor unit (that I paid $100 for). Besides, I have a feeling that many, many people will be viewing this particular thread. I have already fixed the (Post #2) fonts. As for this reply, I have used [ ] to indicate your post reply info.
Your person said (in his Dec 2nd email) that the item would be shipped to me immediately. Today makes 36 days since that day. And then there is the Dec 18th email.
This is the link to your BikTrix website: https://www.biktrix.com/pages/ebikes .. Now scroll down to “The SWIFT Series”. Now look under SWIFT information and find these two words Cadence Sensor . So, that being the case, when I purchased my 2020 SWIFT ebike in May 2020, I did so as the purchaser of a cadence sensor equipped ebike - just as your website advertises. You haven't got any way to walk this back. You screwed up. Not me.
You accused me of, basically, being too stupid to know how to ride a torque sensor ebike. You owe me an $1,800 apology on that mis-information alone. I can't trust you/your company even if I were to be permitted to ship the SWIFT ebike back to Canada. I'd never see that $1,800 ($1,700 + $100).
Remember, I have multiple ebikes so I have a basic “feel” for these beasts. I know full well how to install/ maintain/adjust/improvise/ improve components, including a cadence sensor unit. Dealing with your ridiculously overpriced torque sensor qizmo has just added to that knowledge base.
A person with only the one SWIFT ebike, and who was not familiar with the peculiarities of ebikes, can easily be deflected in regards to its riding behavior so as to enable BikTrix company avoiding having to part with an item having a $200 retail price – “Oh, that's just the way an ebike behaves. It's a little different than a regular bicycle”. I can see that happening - often, too. Just like a used car salesman. Motivation to save a $$. Shame.. on.. you..

[1. When coasting, not pedaling, the motor may kick on for a second or two (no mention of whether your foot was on the pedals thereby applying torque or not):
Okay, this behavior is triggered if one of your foot is applying more pressure on the pedals than the other. As torque sensors measure torque from both pedals and uses that to determine pedaling effort, if there is any differential in torque (force applied by your foot), it is reflected in the assist.]
I've been cycling since 1983. I know how to “coast”. Again, you use a play on words to insult my intelligence.
Concerning the chart for PAS % power settings: those are common knowledge, be it 1-9(11%,etc) or 1-5(20%,etc) or 1-3(33%,etc) .. Simple math-- even for a hamster.

[I would not recommend going with alternate torque sensors as we cannot guarantee that they will work for you.]
I'm going to install/use the torque sensor that I paid your company $100US for. Mail it to me.
And again:
[ I would not recommend going with alternate torque sensors as we cannot guarantee that they will work for you and: We have sold 10s of 1000s of bikes with this torque sensor (Swift and Stunner LT). ]
Really?? Then you need to include the torque sensor (and its $200 price) in the parts/accessories section(s) of your website. You also should actually physically stock the item, too – assuming that you can eventually locate that pesky China supply source. After all, you cannot even locate a single unit to send my way. Also, your word is not to be trusted, be it item shipping time, cadence sensor/torque sensor advertisement deception, or the correct 28.6mm seat post size for the SWIFT ebike (as opposed to the size advertised on your website).You should not deduct any $$($100) from a persons account until you actually ship an item.

[I also have to say that we made the wrong call on asking you to swap the torque sensor the first time around. It has been difficult to find technical staff that could work in customer service. This is something we are working on but is an issue that a lot of companies face.]
This is hilarious. We are not dealing with rocket science, here. I re-installed that replacement unit perfectly AFTER I took the time to carefully inspect it. Definitely a unique/concise/precise piece of ebike electrical equipment, but not something which is NASA-only special. In my situation, the control box was the evil wire-severed culprit on #2-- which never would have happened if the original unit was installed correctly at the factory. And, you are also insulting every mechanic who performs maintenance/ repair work on any type of ebike. So, they, too, are stupid/incompetent. Dang. Get a grip, fella. Since your website has many tutorials on ebike maintenance, etc. you need to include an instructional video on the $200 torque sensor bottom bracket. That way every person will be able to deal with the repair. Again, it's not rocket science.
When you finally deliver the torque sensor to me, I will install it, ride the SWIFT ebike for 100 miles as a “shakedown” test, and then determine whats what.

As for “ [This is something we are working on] “
My advice for you is to spend a lot more time improving your companies business plan and a lot less time pounding your computer keyboard in order to post 458 messages on this website forum. By the way, in my case, instead of continuously abusing a computer keyboard, I do 50 mile rides pretty much every day-- 53 miles yesterday.. 51 miles today.. etc. And, always on one of my 2 ultra-dependable M2S(brand) fat tire beasts (16,000+ miles and 7,000+ miles respectively ).

BikTrix email to me on Nov 17, 2020:
[ Hi xxx
Thanks for sharing the detailed description again.
It seems to be the torque sensor that is not working properly. However, there are many variables to consider.
Could you please provide us with your order number? We can send you a new torque sensor. ]
It would seem that your professionally trained employee is the one who initially identified the torque sensor as the culprit. I didn't even register “torque sensor” until that email because “cadence sensor” was my only mindset (once again, see your own website SWIFT data/info)..

This statement: [Bafang doesn't make a true 750W hub motor that fits a normal bike dropout. ]
http://dbikes.com/https://www.juiceproducts/crosscurrent-s2?variant=36449086226 Now, lets see, what motor (BaFang) and power rating (750 watt) is installed on this awesome JUICED(brand) ebike? And, those are not fat tire wheels (don't give me the 700c wheels vs 26” wheels smoke-and-mirrors diversion ).

[PS: MXUS is a HUGE company that has been around even before Bafang. Their motors are more expensive (like 1.5-2x more) than Bafang which is why most of our competitors don't use them. Bafang doesn't make a true 750W hub motor that fits a normal bike dropout. They make the G06 which is for fat bikes. This is why we spec'd this bike with MXUS. It's not because we like to spend more money to offer less.]

MXUS motor unit. This is the motor (XF19R) I have installed on my 2020 SWIFT ebike. : https://www.aliexpress.com/item/400...o_expid=875f3ad2-1500-451e-80e8-d00a371208ad- Price: $242.16
I couldn't locate the BaFang rear hub motor identification/type number(?SW02?) on the JUICED CrossCurrent ebike link mentioned above, but it should not exceed the price of this fat tire motor. However, this unit should serve as a $$$ reference:
BaFang motor unit (750watt rear wheel DC26); https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001896102254.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.32504f43kerwxG&algo_pvid=cd699f51-22cd-4b21-8599-250d38b76d8b&algo_expid=cd699f51-22cd-4b21-8599-250d38b76d8b Price: $229.99

You must be using some kind of Canadian math formula because this USA resident does not see (like 1.5-2x more) at all.. Also, lets see, MXUS motor and $200 torque sensor bottom bracket unit or BaFang motor and $20 cadence sensor unit. Either way, you sure are one heck of a shrewd businessman.
By the way, everything you referenced in regards to the operating characteristics of a torque sensor bottom bracket unit point out just how dangerous/hazardous this item can be to a novice/recreational ebike rider. My advice for those riders is to avoid, at all costs, any rear hub ebike using the torque sensor system.

As far as my situation is concerned, my 2020 SWIFT ebike has been malfunctioning since day 1/mile 0. From the outset, I felt that something was amiss. And now, 222 days after its FedEx delivery, I still have not been able to go on a 100% reliable bike ride on it. But, I really look forward to that day finally arriving- it is 100% up to you.
Let me re-emphasize to you/ your company/ your minions: I don't give a dang about anything concerning you. My only intent is to look out for my fellow ebike riders/owners because, in this internet day and age of disconnected involvement by ebike companies and their consumers, consumers can/will “get the shaft” in a variety of ways. After all, BikTrix is located in Canada-- pretty much insulated from any potential customer legal actions originating from within the USA.
Who knows, maybe ebikes are not your forte.. maybe toilet bowls/flush handles are..

I have to discount the “input” of some of the other posters on this thread because, as far as I can tell, not a one of them actually owns a 2020 SWIFT ebike. Therefore, that makes their keyboard entries a mute issue. Just your minions doing your bidding. Pathetic. Which reminds me, this paragraph was originally part of my initial #3 post:
"As an aside, I honestly expect to get more than a little flak as a result of posting this thread because BikTrix ebike company has a large cadre of minions perusing this particular forum. However, I am otay wit dat. I have no loyalty to any ebike company-- my only goal is to inform potential ebike buyers on how to avoid flushing their own hard earned $$$ down the toilet."
However, I decided to omit it just so I could see what the reaction to my posting would be. ChaChing..

Remember, certain select minions: If you want to run with the Big Dawgs, you have to do a lot more than just sniff butt and lay around licking yourself -- and stop humping dat leg...

In closing, regarding your initial sentence on this post:
" Hi Sic Puppy,
Thanks for making your detailed post. I didn't read all of it as the bold hurt my eyes, but what I gather is this:"
You once again throw your own self under the bus by admitting that you are too unconcerned with the total content and too lazy to do the leg (eye) work, but you sure are eager enough to pound those keyboard keys so you can present your side. So sad. You must be related to some of your minions.
By the way, I'm going to attach this thread as a link to all future EBReview postings of mine because inquiring minds want/need to know.
Well, it's time to post this response and then go out for my (almost daily) 50+ mile ride on my absolutely dependable M2S (brand) fat tire beast(s)...
So, send me that torque sensor bottom bracket so I can ride ebike #5..

Clearly, you're the only smart guy around and we're all just idiots and salesmen.
The bike didn't work from day 1 but it magically has 2000+ miles on it.

You'll be notified by email when the 3rd replacement torque sensor arrives. I bet in a few months it'll magically have the same issue as your first two due to the reasons explained in my original reply. Oh well.
 

Sic Puppy

Member
To J.R. [3413 messages]: Once again, Mr. MaGoo, you bring nothing/zip/nada to the conversation. Just walk away. Go play in the dawg pound.
To Thomas Jaszewski [5,076 messages]: I'm still waiting to see those 7 ebike link listings for the MXUS rear hub ebike-- as are 450+ other viewers of this thread. Kinda shut ya right down there, did it?? I figured it would.
Burlguy [14 messages]: I believe I covered the repaired vs. brand new sensor bracket option in my previous rely to you.: [[One way or another, I will obtain a new torque sensor bottom bracket. I always have $$$ available for my many toyz. It's just that the ball is in BikTrix court now. If ya can't trust a Canuck, who can ya trust??]] Well, I'll be darned-- there it is again.
I think its cool that you love to tinker/solder, but I never go with “fixed” if I can go with “new” instead.
I notice your photo has a tan beret. I assume Desert Storm, etc. was/is your calling. I am a VietNam veteran (1970-71). When I moved into my current condo, one of my neighbors was also a VietNam veteran. How did I know? Because he wore the VietNam Veteran ball cap, had a few t-shirts, a special VV license plate and license plate holder, etc.
So, I'm chatting with him one day and it takes me about 2 minutes to figure out he is Smoke and Mirrors. He was in the military, but never in SouthEast Asia, let alone VietNam. The stuff he wore was just a facade to impress the unknowing civilians. So, I pressed him about his little lie. Sure enough, he fessed up. From that day forth, whenever I'd see him, I would in a very loud voice declare that he was a fraud.. a fake.. a poser.. I'd ask him if he had “VietNam Veteran” tattoo'ed across his butt cheeks because he already had it plastered everywhere else. Our neighbors loved the put-downs. One of them is also a VV, and he re-affirmed my observation. Two months later, the freak had sold his unit and moved out. Why? Because that lie was all he had to hang on to. His “career profession” was the type that other people dismiss immediately in a condescending way, so he discovered that his little fantasy could/would entertain gullible people. After all, he could get gobs of information on the internet, movies, tv, etc. And it worked just great-- until it didn't.
Anyway, as a result of that dufus fella, I devised a 100% foolproof method of immediately identifying fact or fiction. Whenever I encounter “the advertisement”, I walk up to the person and say just one thing, which any person who had ever actually stepped foot in VietNam would recognize. However, no one else would be able to respond correctly. And it could not be found in any movie, or Ken Burns PBS documentary, etc.
But, it was VietNam. It has since exposed 4 other Viet fakes so far. And every one of them fessed up immediately- in the military, but not over in Nam.
The reason I'm telling you this is so that you too, can devise such a trap/plan. There are many posers out and about. Have a little fun with them.
So, again, thanks but no thanks, on your offer. That rascal Roshan is just gonna have to eventually send me the new replacement $200 torque sensor bottom bracket so I can install it on my one thousand seven hundred US dollar 2020 SWIFT fraud ebike, and then fade away from this forum and migrate to the hallowed grounds of the M2S (brand) ebike EBR forum. You'd think that he'd have the sense to realize just that.. But, so far, nope.
To BigNerd [712 messages]: [[ So I get the toys are toys thing... but still didn't answer my question about if the other 2 bikes were so good... why did you switch brands? ]]
Hey there, fella. But I did answer your question-- in a sense. However, there are 450+ other thread viewers who did do their homework and can answer that question via “copy and paste”. But, will they??

And now, it is Jan 15th, onward and upward. Taa Daa..

My email to Biktrix:
[[[ Hi,
In regards to Roshans' quote on EBReview forum on April 20, 2020:
"It takes 10 seconds to switch between 500W, 750W or 1000W modes." How
do I accomplish this?
I am having a "situation" with my wonderful 2020 SWIFT and am
wondering if this will give me some insight as to how to deal with
it.. ]]]
Email from Roshan:
(( Removed by moderator - posting private conversations is not allowed ))

The 32kph equals 20mph. Another poster on another BikTrix thread asked you that very same question and, instead of just answering him on the thread, you told him to email support@BikTrix for the “secret formula”. Like it's some NASA-only covert thing. So, so lame.. Roshan, I continue to put you on the radar only because you constantly throw your own self “under the bus” – over and over again. It really is quite a hoot.
Plus, I have no idea how that restriction makes for only “500 watts”. I know of many ebikes using the BaFang 750w rear hub motor. Some of them are Class one (20mph top speed via throttle only). Yet they are still 750w motors. More BikTrix Smoke and Mirrors stuff, fer sure.
Let us continue..

My email to BikTrix:
[[[ OCT 26, 2020
On my 2020 SWIFT: where exactly is the torque sensor located? I
know that Ride1Up ebike company uses, on their M700 model with the
MXUS rear hub motor (1,000 watts, too), a bottom bracket sensor
location. But, on your ebike, I see nothing down there, nor back at
the hub/wheel location. Am I just missing something (visually)??
I am trying to track down a potentially dangerous "power
fluctuation" situation and hoping that it is just a connector item.
Xxxxx ]]]

Below is another one of my emails to BikTrix. I want it to be viewed in its entirety so that other 2020 SWIFT owners (and STUNNER LT ebike owners, too) can be able to compare “the characteristics” of their own ebike to how my unit behaves. Wouldn't it be hilarious is all of them performed identically? That would be a lot of new $200 torque sensor bottom brackets to replace ( but only if the China source factory AND a competent bike mechanic can be located). Of course, then there is the fact that you/BikTrix also lied to the SWIFT buyers.

Roshan conveniently clipped out only parts of this email in his previous “thread” response to me. The following is the unedited original email to BikTrix:
[[[ Oct 27, 2020
Hi,
Here are some of the items I'm dealing with in regards to my 2020
SWIFT at mileage 2,000+:
1). On level ground and cruising (not pedaling), occasionally the
power suddenly kicks in for 1 or 2 seconds. This is rather unnerving
since I am not anticipating same (hand off handlebar to click + or -,
etc).
2). Going up an incline (equivalent to a highway overpass as far as
gradient) and shifting rear derailleur from 3rd to 2nd or 1st, the
power cuts out (feels dead) but everything is still “on” . The only
way for me to get added boost is to press and hold the thumb throttle
for the duration. This takes ALOT of battery consumption. Increasing
PAS from 5of9 to higher does nothing.
3). When transitioning from sitting to standing while pedaling,
sometimes the power cuts out for a few seconds. This is dangerous in
the sense that I can be thrown forward (over the bars) if I'm not
alert.
4). I need to use PAS 5 of 9 on smooth level terrain. Any “climb”
requires 8of9, or even 9of9. I ride at weight of 200 pounds. Shouldn't
I be able to use lower settings PAS 2 or 3of9, etc? My speed is
usually at/below 15mph-- I'm just a cruiser and I seldom use/need the
thumb throttle..
5). (See photo's) I currently have a white crankset installed on my
SWIFT. I notice that the original black crankset has the rippled
silver ring at the axle hole. Is this ring part of the “torque sensor”
system?? If so, is it possible for me to get just that rippled ring,
or do I have to use only that original black crankset in order to have
a working/ trusted torque sensing setup?
Also, do I have the option of being able to install a normal
ebikes magnetic ring/electronic pickup (flashing red light) system at
the bottom bracket axle, if I choose to do so. I know that cadence
sensors have this setup.. Just wondering..
I own many ebikes and use many custom items (like the white
crankset) on them. Flexibility is the name of the game for me..
That's all for now.
Xxxxx ]]]
So, if you are also a 2020 SWIFT ebike owner who is experiencing the above-mentioned characteristics, a new $200 torque sensor bottom bracket is the only solution.

Again, Roshan, your own response from your previous thread:
[[ We have sold 10s of 1000s of bikes with this torque sensor (Swift and Stunner LT).]]
Now, lets say that 5s of 1000s of those ebike are the (new model in 2020) SWIFT. That means that you committed FRAUD to every buyer because, on the website, you list “cadence sensor”-- but, a torque sensor bottom bracket is the actual electrical component. Therefore, years down the road, if something goes amiss (as it did on my SWIFT ebike), the owner will be scouring the internet for the correct cadence sensor. But, nowhere to be found because it does NOT exist..

Ya know, when someone actually sends you (at least) one thousand seven hundred US dollars, they are expecting/demanding Truth In Advertising. After all, it's not like they can just drive across town to deal with your malicious, and deceptive, sales presentation-- and that is EXACTLY what internet sales are. 100% total good-faith purchases. You have always known about the sensor difference issue, but you chose to completely ignore it so you could spend your time pecking on your keyboard to post on this EBReview forum-- and lordy only knows how many other sites, too.
I believe there is something called a Class Action Law Suit that gives multiple consumers (who have been screwed over) a remedy to such devious business practices. Wouldn't your other customers just love it if your company went into bankruptcy as a result? Warranty? Too bad.. Parts? Too bad.. Cry me a river.

I think your true calling at BikTrix is to be Porcelain Sheen Enhancement Associate: toilet bowl cleaner/scrubber and floater stabber.
Roshan [458 messages]:
[[ Clearly, you're the only smart guy around and we're all just idiots and salesmen.
The bike didn't work from day 1 but it magically has 2000+ miles on it.
You'll be notified by email when the 3rd replacement torque sensor arrives. I bet in a few months it'll magically have the same issue as your first two due to the reasons explained in my original reply. Oh well ]]
Roshan, you're so cute when you get mad.. However, you just absolutely refuse to do your homework assignment. So, you get a time-out. Also, you don't even realize how absolutely absurd a garbage superlative like “I bet in a few months it'll magically have the same issue as your first two due to the reasons explained in my original reply.” appears to other viewers. You are Numero Uno at BikTrix? Grow up. And, after all, I completely destroyed your “reasons” in that prior post of mine.
You just need to concentrate on shipping that $200 torque sensor bottom bracket to my address. It has now been 44 days since Dec 2nd. Maybe you are figuring that, since I am a 70 year old rascal, you will just wait me out in the hopes that I keel over dead. Judging by how you conduct your “professional businessman” mindset, every viewer can see how you continuously make a fool of yourself.

[[[ (#2 of 3) My 2020 SWIFT ebike at day 150 and mile 2,130.
Oct 25, 2020
I may even have a “bad” motor setup/torque setting unit(wherever the heck that item is located-- I don't have any “visual” indicators).. I'll check with support@BikTrix after I am satisfied that it is not my own doing causing the problem. ]]]

So, you can see that I had no idea what a torque sensor bottom bracket was. That component is apparently commonplace in mid-drive ebikes. However, since rear hub ebikes are my “world”, I had never even heard of that particular item because using a “cadence sensor” (installed on all 4 of my other ebikes) is my focus. Why would I even consider anything else?
If you had indeed read my 3 posts in their totality, you'd know that I wanted to be 100% positive that I wasn't doing something wrong. As for the 2,000 miles: Those are accumulated through many, many daily rides. It was only when I was absolutely positive that I wasn't screwing things up, and thus commenced a dedicated exploratory 50 mile bike ride mission, that I resorted to emailing BikTrix. I had even considered that the computer display unit (cdu -- the screen mounted on the handlebars) might be the source of the problem since the battery % would never register higher than 92% -- and that is using 4 different ebike batteries. An electrical gremlin, for sure.
Thereafter, the “torque sensor” gizmo was offered up by your BikTrix person as the culprit. Until that email, “cadence sensor” was all I knew (on all of my other 4 bikes, too).Torque sensor was/is a component used on mid-drive ebikes. I don't do mid-drive, so it's not in my sphere of ebike reality – until your component selection screw-up. The torque sensor represents fraud/ false advertising-- pure and simple. Remember, I bought a 2020 SWIFT ebike with cadence sensor, per the BikTrix website. Check with your legal people.

Your post from the previous thread: [[ Honestly, I am of the opinion that you should NOT have got a torque sensing bike as you are very used to and very well versed with a cadence sensor. Cadence and torque sensors are completely different in the way they work and each person likes one or the other. Some people like both. Some hate one or the other. ]]
Roshan, I must be absolutely honest in saying that I bought the SWIFT because it did have the cadence sensor system. I know this because your website states that the cadence sensor is a unit of the components. Myself, and probably thousands of other buyers, stated the exact preference. We did it when we pressed the BUY button on your website. I mean, you said it yourself in the prior paragraph. And I purchased the ebike based on your website LIE.
[[ You'll be notified by email when the 3rd replacement torque sensor arrives. I bet in a few months it'll magically have the same issue as your first two due to the reasons explained in my original reply. Oh well. ]]
Well, lets see, since Dec 2, 2020: 44 days and counting. Also, Roshan, I need your word, typed on this very thread, your admission that my 1-year warranty will be extended accordingly after May 28, 2021. And remember that hundreds of viewers are/will be watching for your confirmation of same.
Roshan, you continue to make a fool of yourself with every new post that you type onto this thread. You need to just go ahead and actually ship to me the $200 torque sensor bottom bracket instead continuing to just rattle your yap-- and that is exactly what you are doing. I know it very much impresses your lil' posse, but I bet that you/BikTrix will suffer a much deserved decline in ebike sales in the future. Remember, many, many people are watching this fiasco just to see how it turns out. But, in the meantime, you/yours are doing irreparable damage to your business. By the way, another potential new company name: YUGO.
After all, all brand of ebikes are actually the same -- especially the multitude of mid-drive ebikes. Oh sure, different frame colors and different decals, but aside from the minor component difference, they are all the same basic beast. Now the consumer must decide upon which beast to spend their hard earned one thousand seven hundred US dollars-- and that is the absolute minimum $$ amount. Heck of a decision, isn't it. If I were an interested buyer, and then I stumbled across this string of posts/threads on EBRreview, I would run like heck to any other brand of ebike. You, Roshan, are single-handedly responsible for any/every aspect of your “brand”-- and you are failing miserably. Of course, you have your hamster posse to cheer you on, but they are basically here today-gone tomorrow-- as long as they can pound that keyboard.
Your minions are so cute, what with their 3rd grade-level emoji's and all. I think I'll call them the Notorious Gangsta Hamster Dawg Pound Posse (you know, sniff-- lick--hump). I'm sure that the 450+ viewers of this thread want to send each of them (and you) a furry little monkey-- so you can spank it.. Spank it good. Also remember: Viagra is not a suppository-- unless you are a hamster.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

roshan

Well-Known Member
To J.R. [3413 messages]: Once again, Mr. MaGoo, you bring nothing/zip/nada to the conversation. Just walk away. Go play in the dawg pound.
To Thomas Jaszewski [5,076 messages]: I'm still waiting to see those 7 ebike link listings for the MXUS rear hub ebike-- as are 450+ other viewers of this thread. Kinda shut ya right down there, did it?? I figured it would.
Burlguy [14 messages]: I believe I covered the repaired vs. brand new sensor bracket option in my previous rely to you.: [[One way or another, I will obtain a new torque sensor bottom bracket. I always have $$$ available for my many toyz. It's just that the ball is in BikTrix court now. If ya can't trust a Canuck, who can ya trust??]] Well, I'll be darned-- there it is again.
I think its cool that you love to tinker/solder, but I never go with “fixed” if I can go with “new” instead.
I notice your photo has a tan beret. I assume Desert Storm, etc. was/is your calling. I am a VietNam veteran (1970-71). When I moved into my current condo, one of my neighbors was also a VietNam veteran. How did I know? Because he wore the VietNam Veteran ball cap, had a few t-shirts, a special VV license plate and license plate holder, etc.
So, I'm chatting with him one day and it takes me about 2 minutes to figure out he is Smoke and Mirrors. He was in the military, but never in SouthEast Asia, let alone VietNam. The stuff he wore was just a facade to impress the unknowing civilians. So, I pressed him about his little lie. Sure enough, he fessed up. From that day forth, whenever I'd see him, I would in a very loud voice declare that he was a fraud.. a fake.. a poser.. I'd ask him if he had “VietNam Veteran” tattoo'ed across his butt cheeks because he already had it plastered everywhere else. Our neighbors loved the put-downs. One of them is also a VV, and he re-affirmed my observation. Two months later, the freak had sold his unit and moved out. Why? Because that lie was all he had to hang on to. His “career profession” was the type that other people dismiss immediately in a condescending way, so he discovered that his little fantasy could/would entertain gullible people. After all, he could get gobs of information on the internet, movies, tv, etc. And it worked just great-- until it didn't.
Anyway, as a result of that dufus fella, I devised a 100% foolproof method of immediately identifying fact or fiction. Whenever I encounter “the advertisement”, I walk up to the person and say just one thing, which any person who had ever actually stepped foot in VietNam would recognize. However, no one else would be able to respond correctly. And it could not be found in any movie, or Ken Burns PBS documentary, etc.
But, it was VietNam. It has since exposed 4 other Viet fakes so far. And every one of them fessed up immediately- in the military, but not over in Nam.
The reason I'm telling you this is so that you too, can devise such a trap/plan. There are many posers out and about. Have a little fun with them.
So, again, thanks but no thanks, on your offer. That rascal Roshan is just gonna have to eventually send me the new replacement $200 torque sensor bottom bracket so I can install it on my one thousand seven hundred US dollar 2020 SWIFT fraud ebike, and then fade away from this forum and migrate to the hallowed grounds of the M2S (brand) ebike EBR forum. You'd think that he'd have the sense to realize just that.. But, so far, nope.
To BigNerd [712 messages]: [[ So I get the toys are toys thing... but still didn't answer my question about if the other 2 bikes were so good... why did you switch brands? ]]
Hey there, fella. But I did answer your question-- in a sense. However, there are 450+ other thread viewers who did do their homework and can answer that question via “copy and paste”. But, will they??

And now, it is Jan 15th, onward and upward. Taa Daa..

My email to Biktrix:
[[[ Hi,
In regards to Roshans' quote on EBReview forum on April 20, 2020:
"It takes 10 seconds to switch between 500W, 750W or 1000W modes." How
do I accomplish this?
I am having a "situation" with my wonderful 2020 SWIFT and am
wondering if this will give me some insight as to how to deal with
it.. ]]]
Email from Roshan:
[[[ Hi xxxxx,
On your display if you set the speed limit to 32kph, the motor limits power to 500W.
Let me know how we can help.]]]

The 32kph equals 20mph. Another poster on another BikTrix thread asked you that very same question and, instead of just answering him on the thread, you told him to email support@BikTrix for the “secret formula”. Like it's some NASA-only covert thing. So, so lame.. Roshan, I continue to put you on the radar only because you constantly throw your own self “under the bus” – over and over again. It really is quite a hoot.
Plus, I have no idea how that restriction makes for only “500 watts”. I know of many ebikes using the BaFang 750w rear hub motor. Some of them are Class one (20mph top speed via throttle only). Yet they are still 750w motors. More BikTrix Smoke and Mirrors stuff, fer sure.
Let us continue..

My email to BikTrix:
[[[ OCT 26, 2020
On my 2020 SWIFT: where exactly is the torque sensor located? I
know that Ride1Up ebike company uses, on their M700 model with the
MXUS rear hub motor (1,000 watts, too), a bottom bracket sensor
location. But, on your ebike, I see nothing down there, nor back at
the hub/wheel location. Am I just missing something (visually)??
I am trying to track down a potentially dangerous "power
fluctuation" situation and hoping that it is just a connector item.
Xxxxx ]]]

Below is another one of my emails to BikTrix. I want it to be viewed in its entirety so that other 2020 SWIFT owners (and STUNNER LT ebike owners, too) can be able to compare “the characteristics” of their own ebike to how my unit behaves. Wouldn't it be hilarious is all of them performed identically? That would be a lot of new $200 torque sensor bottom brackets to replace ( but only if the China source factory AND a competent bike mechanic can be located). Of course, then there is the fact that you/BikTrix also lied to the SWIFT buyers.

Roshan conveniently clipped out only parts of this email in his previous “thread” response to me. The following is the unedited original email to BikTrix:
[[[ Oct 27, 2020
Hi,
Here are some of the items I'm dealing with in regards to my 2020
SWIFT at mileage 2,000+:
1). On level ground and cruising (not pedaling), occasionally the
power suddenly kicks in for 1 or 2 seconds. This is rather unnerving
since I am not anticipating same (hand off handlebar to click + or -,
etc).
2). Going up an incline (equivalent to a highway overpass as far as
gradient) and shifting rear derailleur from 3rd to 2nd or 1st, the
power cuts out (feels dead) but everything is still “on” . The only
way for me to get added boost is to press and hold the thumb throttle
for the duration. This takes ALOT of battery consumption. Increasing
PAS from 5of9 to higher does nothing.
3). When transitioning from sitting to standing while pedaling,
sometimes the power cuts out for a few seconds. This is dangerous in
the sense that I can be thrown forward (over the bars) if I'm not
alert.
4). I need to use PAS 5 of 9 on smooth level terrain. Any “climb”
requires 8of9, or even 9of9. I ride at weight of 200 pounds. Shouldn't
I be able to use lower settings PAS 2 or 3of9, etc? My speed is
usually at/below 15mph-- I'm just a cruiser and I seldom use/need the
thumb throttle..
5). (See photo's) I currently have a white crankset installed on my
SWIFT. I notice that the original black crankset has the rippled
silver ring at the axle hole. Is this ring part of the “torque sensor”
system?? If so, is it possible for me to get just that rippled ring,
or do I have to use only that original black crankset in order to have
a working/ trusted torque sensing setup?
Also, do I have the option of being able to install a normal
ebikes magnetic ring/electronic pickup (flashing red light) system at
the bottom bracket axle, if I choose to do so. I know that cadence
sensors have this setup.. Just wondering..
I own many ebikes and use many custom items (like the white
crankset) on them. Flexibility is the name of the game for me..
That's all for now.
Xxxxx ]]]
So, if you are also a 2020 SWIFT ebike owner who is experiencing the above-mentioned characteristics, a new $200 torque sensor bottom bracket is the only solution.

Again, Roshan, your own response from your previous thread:
[[ We have sold 10s of 1000s of bikes with this torque sensor (Swift and Stunner LT).]]
Now, lets say that 5s of 1000s of those ebike are the (new model in 2020) SWIFT. That means that you committed FRAUD to every buyer because, on the website, you list “cadence sensor”-- but, a torque sensor bottom bracket is the actual electrical component. Therefore, years down the road, if something goes amiss (as it did on my SWIFT ebike), the owner will be scouring the internet for the correct cadence sensor. But, nowhere to be found because it does NOT exist..

Ya know, when someone actually sends you (at least) one thousand seven hundred US dollars, they are expecting/demanding Truth In Advertising. After all, it's not like they can just drive across town to deal with your malicious, and deceptive, sales presentation-- and that is EXACTLY what internet sales are. 100% total good-faith purchases. You have always known about the sensor difference issue, but you chose to completely ignore it so you could spend your time pecking on your keyboard to post on this EBReview forum-- and lordy only knows how many other sites, too.
I believe there is something called a Class Action Law Suit that gives multiple consumers (who have been screwed over) a remedy to such devious business practices. Wouldn't your other customers just love it if your company went into bankruptcy as a result? Warranty? Too bad.. Parts? Too bad.. Cry me a river.

I think your true calling at BikTrix is to be Porcelain Sheen Enhancement Associate: toilet bowl cleaner/scrubber and floater stabber.
Roshan [458 messages]:
[[ Clearly, you're the only smart guy around and we're all just idiots and salesmen.
The bike didn't work from day 1 but it magically has 2000+ miles on it.
You'll be notified by email when the 3rd replacement torque sensor arrives. I bet in a few months it'll magically have the same issue as your first two due to the reasons explained in my original reply. Oh well ]]
Roshan, you're so cute when you get mad.. However, you just absolutely refuse to do your homework assignment. So, you get a time-out. Also, you don't even realize how absolutely absurd a garbage superlative like “I bet in a few months it'll magically have the same issue as your first two due to the reasons explained in my original reply.” appears to other viewers. You are Numero Uno at BikTrix? Grow up. And, after all, I completely destroyed your “reasons” in that prior post of mine.
You just need to concentrate on shipping that $200 torque sensor bottom bracket to my address. It has now been 44 days since Dec 2nd. Maybe you are figuring that, since I am a 70 year old rascal, you will just wait me out in the hopes that I keel over dead. Judging by how you conduct your “professional businessman” mindset, every viewer can see how you continuously make a fool of yourself.

[[[ (#2 of 3) My 2020 SWIFT ebike at day 150 and mile 2,130.
Oct 25, 2020
I may even have a “bad” motor setup/torque setting unit(wherever the heck that item is located-- I don't have any “visual” indicators).. I'll check with support@BikTrix after I am satisfied that it is not my own doing causing the problem. ]]]

So, you can see that I had no idea what a torque sensor bottom bracket was. That component is apparently commonplace in mid-drive ebikes. However, since rear hub ebikes are my “world”, I had never even heard of that particular item because using a “cadence sensor” (installed on all 4 of my other ebikes) is my focus. Why would I even consider anything else?
If you had indeed read my 3 posts in their totality, you'd know that I wanted to be 100% positive that I wasn't doing something wrong. As for the 2,000 miles: Those are accumulated through many, many daily rides. It was only when I was absolutely positive that I wasn't screwing things up, and thus commenced a dedicated exploratory 50 mile bike ride mission, that I resorted to emailing BikTrix. I had even considered that the computer display unit (cdu -- the screen mounted on the handlebars) might be the source of the problem since the battery % would never register higher than 92% -- and that is using 4 different ebike batteries. An electrical gremlin, for sure.
Thereafter, the “torque sensor” gizmo was offered up by your BikTrix person as the culprit. Until that email, “cadence sensor” was all I knew (on all of my other 4 bikes, too).Torque sensor was/is a component used on mid-drive ebikes. I don't do mid-drive, so it's not in my sphere of ebike reality – until your component selection screw-up. The torque sensor represents fraud/ false advertising-- pure and simple. Remember, I bought a 2020 SWIFT ebike with cadence sensor, per the BikTrix website. Check with your legal people.

Your post from the previous thread: [[ Honestly, I am of the opinion that you should NOT have got a torque sensing bike as you are very used to and very well versed with a cadence sensor. Cadence and torque sensors are completely different in the way they work and each person likes one or the other. Some people like both. Some hate one or the other. ]]
Roshan, I must be absolutely honest in saying that I bought the SWIFT because it did have the cadence sensor system. I know this because your website states that the cadence sensor is a unit of the components. Myself, and probably thousands of other buyers, stated the exact preference. We did it when we pressed the BUY button on your website. I mean, you said it yourself in the prior paragraph. And I purchased the ebike based on your website LIE.
[[ You'll be notified by email when the 3rd replacement torque sensor arrives. I bet in a few months it'll magically have the same issue as your first two due to the reasons explained in my original reply. Oh well. ]]
Well, lets see, since Dec 2, 2020: 44 days and counting. Also, Roshan, I need your word, typed on this very thread, your admission that my 1-year warranty will be extended accordingly after May 28, 2021. And remember that hundreds of viewers are/will be watching for your confirmation of same.
Roshan, you continue to make a fool of yourself with every new post that you type onto this thread. You need to just go ahead and actually ship to me the $200 torque sensor bottom bracket instead continuing to just rattle your yap-- and that is exactly what you are doing. I know it very much impresses your lil' posse, but I bet that you/BikTrix will suffer a much deserved decline in ebike sales in the future. Remember, many, many people are watching this fiasco just to see how it turns out. But, in the meantime, you/yours are doing irreparable damage to your business. By the way, another potential new company name: YUGO.
After all, all brand of ebikes are actually the same -- especially the multitude of mid-drive ebikes. Oh sure, different frame colors and different decals, but aside from the minor component difference, they are all the same basic beast. Now the consumer must decide upon which beast to spend their hard earned one thousand seven hundred US dollars-- and that is the absolute minimum $$ amount. Heck of a decision, isn't it. If I were an interested buyer, and then I stumbled across this string of posts/threads on EBRreview, I would run like heck to any other brand of ebike. You, Roshan, are single-handedly responsible for any/every aspect of your “brand”-- and you are failing miserably. Of course, you have your hamster posse to cheer you on, but they are basically here today-gone tomorrow-- as long as they can pound that keyboard.
Your minions are so cute, what with their 3rd grade-level emoji's and all. I think I'll call them the Notorious Gangsta Hamster Dawg Pound Posse (you know, sniff-- lick--hump). I'm sure that the 450+ viewers of this thread want to send each of them (and you) a furry little monkey-- so you can spank it.. Spank it good. Also remember: Viagra is not a suppository-- unless you are a hamster.
No comment. I rest my case.
 

burlguy

Member
I have had several aged/mature veteran friends that write and speak in the same manner. Raw, unfiltered and just coherent enough to drive you nuts.... Its no coincidence. Its part of the high speed mindset that has trouble slowing down. I would send him a crank sensor if I had one...LOL
 

roshan

Well-Known Member
I have had several aged/mature veteran friends that write and speak in the same manner. Raw, unfiltered and just coherent enough to drive you nuts.... Its no coincidence. Its part of the high speed mindset that has trouble slowing down. I would send him a crank sensor if I had one...LOL
I would have to admit, I've never come across one like this.
 

Mike_V

Active Member
"Foolish Puppy" took up typing missives instead of rebuilding an uncalibrated rotating strain gauge with leads.
 

tomjasz

Well-Known Member
i
To Thomas Jaszewski [5,076 messages]: I'm still waiting to see those 7 ebike link listings for the MXUS rear hub ebike-- as are 450+ other viewers of this thread. Kinda shut ya right down there, did it?? I figured it would.
I probably shouldn’t bother. Fact is MXUS hubs are quite popular in the DIY market. We get to see the build quality when putting a new ride together. I have MXUS motors I’ve run them for half a decade.

The rest of your post is blather unlikely to be read by most. I was in the first lines, as far as I got. It’s always a disappointment when we get a new member brimming with attitude. Best place for you is the ignore function. Adios!
 

burlguy

Member
You a
From: Sic Puppy [50 messages] ..
Roshan [458 messages]
: No comment. I rest my case. C'mon dude. You have only succeeded in continuing to make a complete fool of yourself. This thread already has 636 views and they are not all laughing at me. You should have immediately sent me an email with the “sensor shipping” information, per Dec 1, 2020. That would be “good business”. Instead, you just had to pound that keyboard-- or in your case, shovel, because you keep digging a deeper hole for yourself AND for your company. If only 10% of the folks viewing this thread do the right thing and go shop elsewhere, I WIN.. And it's ALL your fault.
As for your minions, aka Notorious Gangsta Hamster Dawg Pound Posse (you know, sniff--lick- -hump): They are much fun to toy with because they, too, dig their own pathetic holes via the mighty keyboard.
Burlguy [14 messages]: I kind of figured that my previous response to you would “push a button”. People such as you are a very easy read. As for posting your mailing address on this thread: wouldn't it be a hoot if you received hundreds of letters, each filled with hamster dooty (courtesy of the local pet shops) and a sheet of toilet paper with $1,700.00 magic-markered on it. Think of them as my version of “emoji”. Go play on the hamster exercise wheel.
MikeV [155 messages]: Yet another sniffer from the Notorious Gangsta Hamster Dawg Pound Posse (you know, sniff-- lick--hump).. You, like the other hamsters, contribute nothing/zip/nada to the conversation. The Administrator/Moderator(s) despise posters like you hamsters, but they must tolerate your Plecostomus bottom-feeder crap. But, not me. It's best for you to just adjourn to the dawg pound to play with your posse mates. If ya can't do that, then just go stand in the corner of a round room and play with yourself. And yet a 3rd option: sell your ebikes, buy a bass boat, become a world championship fisherman, and, by default, become a Master Baiter. Kick rocks.
Thomas Jaszewski [5,076 messages]: I was in the first lines, as far as I got. That is because I made such a fool out of you. I'd stop reading, too. Just remember that it is your own pathetic keyboard that threw you under the bus. Besides, you don't get a “pass” on your mission. You came onto this thread spouting your mouth off, so I'm holding you to the task at hand; 7 ebike links. Just do it. Hundreds of viewers are watching you.
By the way: multiple quick-links on a chain work just fine. I have a total of 24,000 miles on my two fat tire ebikes. They each use 2 quick-links because I replaced the original 36t front sprocket with a 46t unit, thus extra chain links were required. If a person knows how to install, adjust, maintain, and ride the ebike equipment logically, they won't have any problems at all. Duh..
As for all of the Notorious Gangsta Hamster Dawg Pound Posse (you know, sniff-- lick—hump) and those thumbs-up and emojis: they are like a fart in a diarrhea ward; All of your fellow minions giggle, but everyone else just roll their eyes and pinch their nostrils.
Also, hamster posse, not a one of you even owns a 2020 SWIFT ebike. Plus, none of you have yet to defend the BikTrix brand or Roshan/the Thief of Baghdad -- because you can't.

Email from BikTrix to me on Dec 1, 2020
Ricky, Dec 1, 2020, 10:34 CST
>> Hi XXX,
>> Apologies for the delay.
>> We can provide you with a new torque sensor if that is what you mean by the
> bottom bracket. Please confirm.
>> The cost for the torque sensor will be $200. If you cover 50% ($100) we can
> send it to you free of extra shipping fees right away. Let me know if that
> works for you and I will send you the invoice.
>> Have a great day!
>> Warmest regards,
>> Ricky
So, let's see, it has now been 52 days since I sent BikTrix that $100.00 and I am still waiting for the sensor. Roshan: a true Canadian “professional businessman”. And a joke, for sure.
So, in closing (for now): Roshan/the Thief of Baghdad, you continue to fail to defend your “brand”-- because you can't. Just ship the torque sensor bottom bracket and I will magically disappear from your BikTrix forum. Otherwise, I'm here longtime and often.
You are far from pushing my buttons. But its now quite obvious that this is what gives your life meaning. I offered to repair your damaged item gratuitously.

Send me something unwanted/hazardous and have it become a Federal crime, I am state licensed employee, I dont think you want to start making po box threats..... where would you like to go with this?

In terms of this costing anyone business. You are also quite wrong...Anyone reading this knows that there is no satisfying your insatiable apatite to be loathed. You dont need to be mad at yourself and you dont need others to despise you. Enjoy your life and try and bring joy to others. Prayers be with you and may the peace of the Lord Jesus bring you comfort.
 
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