A Little Self Indulgent Comparison Test

Saratoga Dave

Well-Known Member
No great wisdom here, but we’re a friendly bunch and it’s a quiet Sunday. A little Giant/Yamaha shootout for the fans:


For a little informal comparison, I rode the same 31 mile, 1200 foot elevation route 2 days in a row. Both days very humid, high around 90 degrees, winds no more than 5 mph. Went at my usual comfortable pace, riding almost always in Eco (the base mode in my 3 assist level Giant Toughroad, the second mode in the four level Yamaha Civante, which has a very low assist eco+ as the first level). Next level Normal (Giant), Standard (Yamaha) for the two significant climbs, never into the top assist.

Interesting! The gravel Giant, with 50mm gravel tires, ended up using less battery, and I had a very slightly higher average speed and five minutes quicker elapsed time than the road bike Civante. Again, I was just riding my bike, and I expected them to be close, but it was funny that the bigger and heavier bike was more efficient.

Both of these run Yamaha motors, both have 500Wh batteries. The Giant has 4300 miles on it, the Civante is only two weeks old.


And the ride? By the numbers? (Check Dustin Klein’s great YouTube channel)

Giant showed 58% battery remaining, ride time was 2:03 minutes at 15.1 mph. Yamaha had 49% remaining, 2:08 minutes at 14.5 mph.

Also interesting, the Giant shows 53 miles of range left at Eco, while the Yamaha shows 23 at it’s version of Eco. Now I know damn well the Giant is lying, since I have learned the range falls out of bed below 20% charge... haven’t figured out Yamaha’s shtick yet on this.

I know the assist levels on the Yamaha are 50% Eco+, 100% Eco, 190% Standard, and 280% High. I can no longer find the numbers for the Giant, though I believe the equivalent High percentage is more like 350 or 360%.

I very much like riding both bikes, depending on my mood or trip plan on any given day. I’m so impressed by that damn ToughRoad though, who’d a thunk it? This particular ride is equal parts paved bike path and paved roads. Even with those big whining tires, it held it’s ground to this upstart road bike. Get off into the bushes and it’s game over in ten feet. Nice job, Giant!

We can also state that for “real” road riding, that class 3 Civante will outrun the other bike in a heartbeat just by going to Standard and chewing up the miles. That’s for another day.
 
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Buckdubay

Active Member
No great wisdom here, but we’re a friendly bunch and it’s a quiet Sunday. A little Giant/Yamaha shootout for the fans:


For a little informal comparison, I rode the same 31 mile, 1200 foot elevation route 2 days in a row. Both days very humid, high around 90 degrees, winds no more than 5 mph. Went at my usual comfortable pace, riding almost always in Eco (the base mode in my 3 assist level Giant Toughroad, the second mode in the four level Yamaha Civante, which has a very low assist eco+ as the first level). Next level Normal (Giant), Standard (Yamaha) for the two significant climbs, never into the top assist.

Interesting! The gravel Giant, with 50mm gravel tires, ended up using less battery, and I had a very slightly higher average speed and five minutes quicker elapsed time than the road bike Civante. Again, I was just riding my bike, and I expected them to be close, but it was funny that the bigger and heavier bike was more efficient.

Both of these run Yamaha motors, both have 500Wh batteries. The Giant has 4300 miles on it, the Civante is only two weeks old.


And the ride? By the numbers? (Check Dustin Klein’s great YouTube channel)

Giant showed 58% battery remaining, ride time was 2:03 minutes at 15.1 mph. Yamaha had 49% remaining, 2:08 minutes at 14.5 mph.

Also interesting, the Giant shows 53 miles of range left at Eco, while the Yamaha shows 23 at it’s version of Eco. Now I know damn well the Giant is lying, since I have learned the range falls out of bed below 20% charge... haven’t figured out Yamaha’s shtick yet on this.

I know the assist levels on the Yamaha are 50% Eco+, 100% Eco, 190% Standard, and 280% High. I can no longer find the numbers for the Giant, though I believe the equivalent High percentage is more like 350 or 360%.

I very much like riding both bikes, depending on my mood or trip plan on any given day. I’m so impressed by that damn ToughRoad though, who’d a thunk it? This particular ride is equal parts paved bike path and paved roads. Even with those big whining tires, it held it’s ground to this upstart road bike. Get off into the bushes and it’s game over in ten feet. Nice job, Giant!

We can also state that for “real” road riding, that class 3 Civante will outrun the other bike in a heartbeat just by going to Standard and chewing up the miles. That’s for another day.
The Toughroad is a fantastic bike. I have not run into the 20% battery pitfall yet. Usually back close to home by that point. I love the big tires give a super stable ride at higher speeds. I regularly run my bike 45 to 55 miles (mostly on eco) with battery to spare.
 

Saratoga Dave

Well-Known Member
<<I have not run into the 20% battery pitfall yet>>

You will, probably at the bottom of that hill going up from the lake through Moriah. You know, a nice easy Adirondack spot :)

You‘re right though, I‘ve never had a bike that was so all around competent.
 

Saratoga Dave

Well-Known Member
Hey JRA

Klein always ends every video with that “And the ride? By the numbers?” bit. I love his videos for the energy and the great crew of people involved in their rides. I may be an old grouchy bastard, but I appreciate the stuff this kid puts out and love his attitude.
 

FlatSix911

Well-Known Member
No great wisdom here, but we’re a friendly bunch and it’s a quiet Sunday. A little Giant/Yamaha shootout for the fans:


For a little informal comparison, I rode the same 31 mile, 1200 foot elevation route 2 days in a row. Both days very humid, high around 90 degrees, winds no more than 5 mph. Went at my usual comfortable pace, riding almost always in Eco (the base mode in my 3 assist level Giant Toughroad, the second mode in the four level Yamaha Civante, which has a very low assist eco+ as the first level). Next level Normal (Giant), Standard (Yamaha) for the two significant climbs, never into the top assist.

Interesting! The gravel Giant, with 50mm gravel tires, ended up using less battery, and I had a very slightly higher average speed and five minutes quicker elapsed time than the road bike Civante. Again, I was just riding my bike, and I expected them to be close, but it was funny that the bigger and heavier bike was more efficient.

Both of these run Yamaha motors, both have 500Wh batteries. The Giant has 4300 miles on it, the Civante is only two weeks old.


And the ride? By the numbers? (Check Dustin Klein’s great YouTube channel)

Giant showed 58% battery remaining, ride time was 2:03 minutes at 15.1 mph. Yamaha had 49% remaining, 2:08 minutes at 14.5 mph.

Also interesting, the Giant shows 53 miles of range left at Eco, while the Yamaha shows 23 at it’s version of Eco. Now I know damn well the Giant is lying, since I have learned the range falls out of bed below 20% charge... haven’t figured out Yamaha’s shtick yet on this.

I know the assist levels on the Yamaha are 50% Eco+, 100% Eco, 190% Standard, and 280% High. I can no longer find the numbers for the Giant, though I believe the equivalent High percentage is more like 350 or 360%.

I very much like riding both bikes, depending on my mood or trip plan on any given day. I’m so impressed by that damn ToughRoad though, who’d a thunk it? This particular ride is equal parts paved bike path and paved roads. Even with those big whining tires, it held it’s ground to this upstart road bike. Get off into the bushes and it’s game over in ten feet. Nice job, Giant!

We can also state that for “real” road riding, that class 3 Civante will outrun the other bike in a heartbeat just by going to Standard and chewing up the miles. That’s for another day.

Great comparo... thanks for sharing.
 
I was not aware of that channel, looks like a good one! Not sure if you know this one, but you might also enjoy Russ and Laura at Path Less Pedaled. Less of the serious stuff and more about riding your bike at "party pace." Many years ago he also ran the Epicurean Cyclist, which was even more retrogrouch. Plus, he recently reviewed a Rivendell, which would definitely be one of my dream bikes.


50+ miles out of the Civante is much less than what I wanted to hear. I wonder how much more you could eke out of it just leaving it in Eco+ (the lowest setting)?