Bafang 500W Mid Drive Kit Availability

jfny1978

Active Member
Region
USA
Hi everyone - I placed an order on Amazon.com for a 500W Bafang Mid-Drive Kit and it is estimated to arrive anywhere between 3 and 7 weeks from now. I am pretty sure it's coming directly from China. I know Bafang doesn't even have these available on their own site right now, and I confirmed by contacting Bafang directly, that they don't have their own stock of them.

Just wondering if anyone knows of anywhere in the US with these in stock, or if I am just going to have to be patient. :)
 

tomjasz

Well-Known Member
Hi everyone - I placed an order on Amazon.com for a 500W Bafang Mid-Drive Kit and it is estimated to arrive anywhere between 3 and 7 weeks from now. I am pretty sure it's coming directly from China. I know Bafang doesn't even have these available on their own site right now, and I confirmed by contacting Bafang directly, that they don't have their own stock of them.

Just wondering if anyone knows of anywhere in the US with these in stock, or if I am just going to have to be patient. :)
Email jeannette@california-ebike.com

That said, why a 500W?

Screen Shot 2021-03-02 at 10.51.30 AM.png
 

tomjasz

Well-Known Member
Thank you, I'll check that out. I have a lot of reasons not to want over 500w, from money, to legality issues, to weight, to my own safety.
BBS02B motors are a "riders" choice. They need to be ridden using assist and shifting as one would without a motor. Using the throttle to take off from a stop, without having changed gears, can easily overheat a BBS01 or BBS02. NOT a problem if we ride and shift and don't throttle from a dead stop, for example, without shifting as you normally would.

I'm offering a clumsily written explanation, I hope it makes sense...

Amazon, in my experience, is full of companies in China with no impetus to ever accept a return, or the price of shipping a return is outrageous. Regardless of the source, shipping batteries back to China, well, it just won't happen.

Suddenly that great price just evaporates.
 

jfny1978

Active Member
Region
USA
BBS02B motors are a "riders" choice. They need to be ridden using assist and shifting as one would without a motor. Using the throttle to take off from a stop, without having changed gears, can easily overheat a BBS01 or BBS02. NOT a problem if we ride and shift and don't throttle from a dead stop, for example, without shifting as you normally would.

I'm offering a clumsily written explanation, I hope it makes sense...

Amazon, in my experience, is full of companies in China with no impetus to ever accept a return, or the price of shipping a return is outrageous. Regardless of the source, shipping batteries back to China, well, it just won't happen.

Suddenly that great price just evaporates.
I agree with what I want in the motor.

In terms of buying direct from China, it seemed to be my only choice. I hope it all goes well and that if I have any problems that Amazon will stand behind it. We shall see! I had a panic attack the other night that I wouldn't be able to find a 500w motor if I waited a few weeks, so I just ordered what I could. It really concerned me when even Bafang didn't have one in stock. :)
 

tomjasz

Well-Known Member
Is that not an affiliate?
Absolutely not.

This from Bafang, I deleted the address, email address, and phone number since it is not a resource for the general public.

Bafang hereby declares that www.bafang-e.com is the one and only official website of BaFang Electric (SuZhou) Co.,Ltd.. Any other non-official websites with the word "bafang" in the url (e.g. www.bafange.com, www.bafangusadirect.com, etc.) has nothing to do with our company.

Bafang is not responsible for any problems resulting from any repair parts that are bought on these non-official websites instead of our Bafang official website, and does not provide any after-sales service. Bafang have already received complaints from customers saying that the goods they ordered from these non-official websites are not delivered after the payment, or wrong goods are delivered.

Bafang kindly reminds customers to be more vigilant. Feel free to forward this email to all your customers/dealers in order to reduce the probability of being deceived. If you have any questions, please find attached the statement for your reference.

Please also find the contact info below as the only official portal in the US for Bafang after-sales service. If you have any technical questions, please scan the WeChat QR code attached for a direct conversation with us. Bafang will reply you within 24 hours.

Johnny Qin / Techincal Support Executive
Bafang Science Inc.


Best regards,
Johnny Qin
 

JES2020

Active Member
I agree with what I want in the motor.

In terms of buying direct from China, it seemed to be my only choice. I hope it all goes well and that if I have any problems that Amazon will stand behind it. We shall see! I had a panic attack the other night that I wouldn't be able to find a 500w motor if I waited a few weeks, so I just ordered what I could. It really concerned me when even Bafang didn't have one in stock. :)
Ouch,
I thought you ordered direct from Amazon. That seller has a pretty low rating and after reading some of their reviews returns and communication seem to be an issue.
Always buy for a high rated seller with lots of reviews on Amazon. If it was me I would try to cancel that order ASAP and buy from a more reputable dealer.
BTW a 750 w will only do about 25 ish throttle only. But if money is an issue...I'm repeating myself here , go with a rear drive hub (geared is my favorite).
Good luck
 

jfny1978

Active Member
Region
USA
Wow, that's not good! Ok I emailed Jeannette and will consider purchasing from your company if I can cancel the Amazon order and if I feel like it makes sense for me to. Thank you for the info.
 

jfny1978

Active Member
Region
USA
Ouch,
I thought you ordered direct from Amazon. That seller has a pretty low rating and after reading some of their reviews returns and communication seem to be an issue.
Always buy for a high rated seller with lots of reviews on Amazon. If it was me I would try to cancel that order ASAP and buy from a more reputable dealer.
BTW a 750 w will only do about 25 ish throttle only. But if money is an issue...I'm repeating myself here , go with a rear drive hub (geared is my favorite).
Good luck
Thank you. I wouldn't say that money is an issue, but I just really don't think I need a 750w motor, and I don't want to spend money for no reason.

As for the Amazon thing, yeah, I was panicked that there were no other places to find them. I will see about cancelling if I can find one somewhere else. I don't think Amazon direct has them in stock.
 

JES2020

Active Member
Ebikeling is out of Illinois, probably 1 week shipping USA. plenty of cheap 750 watt hubs, no mid drive stock tho.:(
When it comes to technical things, my mantra is KISS, keep it simple stupid.
 

Dewey

Well-Known Member
Wow, that's not good! Ok I emailed Jeannette and will consider purchasing from your company if I can cancel the Amazon order and if I feel like it makes sense for me to. Thank you for the info.
FWIW I've had great service and parts support for my BBS01 I bought from California EBike, Tom is right.
 

jfny1978

Active Member
Region
USA
FWIW I've had great service and parts support for my BBS01 I bought from California EBike, Tom is right.
Good to hear! I've cancelled my Amazon order and will look at California EBike. The woman answering my questions on email is great so far. I already learned from her that I can basically program a 750w motor to only out out 500w if I want, so that's awesome.
 

JES2020

Active Member
Good to hear! I've cancelled my Amazon order and will look at California EBike. The woman answering my questions on email is great so far. I already learned from her that I can basically program a 750w motor to only out out 500w if I want, so that's awesome.
You should have MUCH better luck with them, May cost a lot more for their mid drives, but you will get customer support from most USA sellers.
 

creativepart

Active Member
Region
USA
Dillenger has the BaFang kits as well. They are in Australia but they have a distribution warehouse in California that ships same day. It took 4 days from order to receipt of my rear hub kit.

 

EMGX

Well-Known Member
People tend to recommend what they have if they like what they have. The less experience usually the more dogmatic the recommendation. I'm not making a recommendation, that is a decision you have to make weighing pros and cons according to your preferences and your bike characteristics but as I have noted before I own, have installed, and ridden the Tongsheng mid drive, both front and rear geared hub motors and own and extensively ridden a Yamaha PW-SE mid drive gravel bike so I have that breadth of experience . If cost is a consideration you can get a Tongsheng TSDZ2 48v 750w with a nice small display for $415 (without the battery) from ecocycles. I bought the 36v 500w version from them, they are based in Tennessee, shipped quickly and answered a post purchase question quickly and comprehensively. I saw this '17 comparison review between the BBS02 and Tongsheng 500w, it sounds like a balanced review from someone not trying to push their opinion - why anyone would want to do that is beyond me but it is a common practice especially on anonymous forums.

.
"Comparing the BBS02 with the TSDZ2

I had the BBS02 for a couple months, and then installed the TSDZ2 a few weeks ago. Here are my thoughts:

Equipment:
Motors: Bafang BBS02 750w vs Tongsheng TSDZ2 500w
Battery: 48V 11.6AH battery—same for both motors
Display: Bafang C965, Tongsheng VLCD5
Price (approx.): BBS02: $400, TSDZ2: $300
Bike: 2013 Specialized Rockhopper mountain bike, hard tail, front shocks
Testing terrain: Flat city streets of Shanghai

Summary: I prefer the Tongsheng and here’s why: It’s much smoother and blends into the normal bike riding experience, but still giving a nice boost. Although the Bafang is more powerful, it’s more like riding a moped and not as intuitive. With the BBS02, you just spin the pedals and go. With the TDSZ2 you have to apply pressure to the pedals and so it feels more natural. That said, I highly recommend both, but I prefer the TSDZ2.

Power: The BBS02 delivers 100% power as soon as you start rotating the pedals. It can be too much power if you have it on a high setting. The BBS02 can be set on levels 1-9. Typically, I started out on a 1 and increased as I started going. I typically kept mine on 4. It’s only when I wanted turbo speed that I increased it to 9. I found that I frequently adjusted the power levels, like gears, so I could keep it in control. If I had it on a high level, it could lurch unexpectedly. The TSDZ2, on the other hand, is torque-sensitive, so it detects how much pressure is put on the pedals and delivers more power the harder you pedal. The TSDZ2 delivers the power more smoothly, so I never feel the need to adjust the levels. The second I reduce pressure on the pedals, the motor slows down. The TSDZ2 has 4 levels. I usually leave mine on 3 and forget about it.
The BBS02 can be programmed using a special cable to adjust how quickly it reacts to pedal inputs. Some people insist this improves the performance and smoothness, but I haven’t tried this.

Brakes: With the BBS02, I often used the ebrakes to cut-off the motor. I would often gently squeeze the brakes, even if I was still pedaling, if I’m going near traffic or pedestrians. Then I would release the brakes and the motor would re-engage. You don’t really need ebrakes with the TSDZ2. I would just pedal more lightly and the motor turns off. It’s more intuitive. In fact, I re-installed my regular brakes instead of using ebrakes (bonus: less wires). There is no fear of lurching. It’s just smoother. Most TSDZ2 kits don’t come with ebrakes or a throttle and you don’t need it.

Gear sensor: Also, I purchased and installed a gear sensor for the BBS02. Changing gears under power can cause them to grind and get damaged. The gear sensor temporarily cuts off the motor as the gears change. The TSDZ2 doesn’t have this option, but, again, it doesn’t seem to need it. The motor cuts off very quickly when you stop pedaling or reduce pressure on the pedals. It’s like how it works normally on a bike.

Speed: The BBS02 is faster and more powerful. The speed limiter on the BBS02 can be removed (up to 99km/hr) with the C965 display. The TSDZ2 speed limit can be set up to 45km/hr (although you can set the wheel size to smaller than actual to bypass this, although the speedometer will not be accurate).
Also, I have found it difficult to get past 40km/hr on flats with the TSDZ2. I think that is because the assist cuts out beyond a certain level of RPM. A larger front chain ring would help if speed is what you need. The default chain ring is 42T. There is also a setting for “power adjustment”, which may help if I increase it.
With the BBS02, pedaling is just for looks. You don’t put much pressure on the pedals. However, the power is great. The BBS02 has great torque and you can fly off the starting line. With the TSDZ2, you will put in slightly more effort. But let’s be clear, it’s still a powerful electric motor and with not much effort, you can get quickly up to top speed.

Throttle: Throttle is available for both, but it’s unnecessary with the TSDZ2. I didn’t use my throttle either with the BBS02. I preferred to engage the pedals. I found it uncomfortable using the throttle exclusively, since you are putting 100% of your weight on your seat. That is why ebikes need softer seats, full-suspension or seat shocks. I did use the BBS02 throttle sometimes when I didn’t have my feet in the right position and I needed to accelerate quickly.

Display: The Tongsheng VLCD5 display is big. Slightly too big. I wish it were smaller. Although it has a USB port. I ordered the smaller XH18 display which fits on the left handle.
Bafang has a range of displays that are good size (about the size of a deck of cards).

Build Quality: The Tongsheng seems like a nicer build quality. Both drives are solid. The Tongsheng is a little lighter than the Bafang (but also less powerful). The chain ring on the BBS02 seems cheap and people often replace them. The chain ring protector on the BBS02 is plastic and the one on the TSDZ2 is metal.

Noise: The Tongsheng is quieter. While the BBS02 is quiet, there is still a humming sound. I can barely hear the TSDZ2.

Battery usage: I didn’t really test it scientifically, but the TSDZ2 seems to last much longer. Which makes sense, since it has a lower wattage and it doesn’t deliver quite as much power.

Installation: Basically, the same. However, if you don’t have to install ebrakes or a gear sensor, then that saves time. I have not done much bike maintenance before this, so it took me a while, but it was still easy to figure out. I needed to go to the bike shop to have them help me remove the bottom bracket since I didn’t have the right tools for that.

Community: The Bafang products are more popular and have been widely used, tested, and customized. There are more tutorials, information and guides by far than for Tongsheng products.

Bottom line:
I recommend the TSDZ2 if you want an electric motor to assist you, but still retain the intuitive feel of riding the bike. It’s much better for a novice rider or someone who isn’t comfortable dealing with the complexity of controlling the motor.
I recommend the BBS02 if you value high speed and power and don’t mind giving up the bike-like feel. Or upgrade to the BBSHD for even more power."
 
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tomjasz

Well-Known Member
People tend to recommend what they have if they like what they have.
I had an evaluation sample. I was disappointed, but then my personal preference these days are Eezee and MAC gear drive hubs. The fellow I gave the bike, motor, and battery is thrilled with its performance and torque sensing.
www.eco-ebike.com ›

Eco cycles is a great store too. Empowered Cycles is another good USA reseller.
 

linklemming

Well-Known Member
While my post wordcount wont match that of the positive opinions/experiences above let me add a few things.

As someone who has owned a BBS02 and TSDZ2, I would recommend the BBS02 or BBSHD. Personally I hate the BBS02 PAS but the BBS02 and BBSHD is a way more robust mid-drive than the TSDZ2.

I owned a BBS02 for a few hundred miles a few years back, got rid of it due to hating the PAS. I only like torque sensing ebikes.

I owned a TSDZ2 for about 6 months(bought from ecocycle) ran it at 48V 500w until that battery died then ran it at 52V 750W till the bearings died (about 1k miles). I ran opensource software on it which made it ALOT better in feel and even efficiency being FOC. I am a software developer and played with modifying the code myself for the 6 months I owned the unit.

People seem to dismiss my TSDZ2 thoughts on things like my installation quality, mechanical abilities, a bad run of bearings, my inability and/or unwillingness to replace bearings or even that the only possible way to have a good running TSDZ2 is with ecocyles software/parameter changes despite me being an embedded software developer (with experience doing brushless motor controllers).

The endless sphere review posted above is only one input anyone should consider. There are TSDZ2 posts all over the place on endless sphere with people having negative experiences as well. The first time I went thru all the posts, took around 30 hours(2 years ago) but I went thru each post to make sure I understood it. All said and done, I went thru all the posts 4 times over several months.

In the end, the TSDZ2 might be the mid-drive for you but it is by no means as perfect as others seem to want imply.

If you really start pushing the TSDZ2 you might want to get an extra blue gear or even a brass gear (ecocycles installed the brass gear as part of my order). Adding the brass gear will make the TSDZ2 pretty noisy.

FWIW, despite me not liking the BBS02 and PAS as soon as I can find the bare frameset I want (surly bridge club), Im going to try a Bafang BBSHD at 52V and play with the settings now that I have more experience in ebike setup compared to a few years ago. If that doesnt work out like I want, I will likely try a Grin Phaserunner and CA3 with the BBSHD just to play with it all
 
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harryS

Well-Known Member
Back in 2016, when I bought my 750W BBS02, the only difference between it and the 500W model, in my opinion, was the sellers's big mouth. Same eveything, except someone reprogrammed the current levels to 750W, Really. Just get the 750W, Use the nut behind the handlebars to keep things safe.

I don't even consider the BBS02 that powerful these days, I've always ridden my bikes like bikes. Shifting is fun. Good old Archimedes can rest easy knowing the world is still using his studies on levers/gears.