Bosch 2020 error 510 due to EM interference

baxuz

New Member
This is my first post here and I wanted to share my super-weird experience with the new 2020 Performance motor on a Cube Touring Hybrid.
Take this as a heads-up warning but I'd also like to hear your experiences. So here it goes.

What happens is that the system displays "Error 510" and while the display can be operated, the motor is not outputting any power until a system reset. Sometimes multiple resets were necessary to get it to work again, as the motor works for a few seconds and the displays the error again. I've recorded each instance of the error.

The dealer service wasn't able to find any errors with the system, but has updated the firmware and has told me to monitor the behaviour of the system to try and find a pattern when the error triggers.

The errors continued and I've found a pattern looking at the recording information: it was invariably on the same ~500m stretch of the road.
On every other route, riding condition or intensity the bike behaves perfectly.

I've also done a test by avoiding that stretch of road, getting no errors, circling back and taking that stretch that I suspect produces the error — and had the error appear as expected.

The dealer also lent me an older Gen2 Performance CX MTB to test, and that one did not produce any errors on that spot.


Afterwards, the dealer tried it for themselves on 2 other 2020 Bosch ebikes and they all produced the same error on that spot. In the meantime we've found two other places in the city where the error appears. Seems that the issue is systematic and affects all 2020 Bosch ebikes, or at least those made by Cube. They obviously changed something between generations.

I've brought this issue up with Bosch as well and they asked me, among other things, to use a compass or a magnetometer app to see how it behaves, to see if the crankset is magnetizable, and if there are any visible power lines around.
I did so and this is the recording on a normal stretch of the road, while this is the recording where the error triggers. You can clearly see the difference. It might be an underground powerline, the nearby hospital with an MRI machine, inductive loops for vehicle detection, or some other thing. As for the other two locations I've no idea.

At the moment Bosch is investigating the issue and has told me to avoid that road or turn off the motor. The bike is sitting in the dealer's service center since I don't want to add aditional wear & tear if I'm planning on returning it.

I'm in a pretty weird situation right now and I'm not sure whether to just return the bike, or keep it and hope that it will get fixed by a newer motor revision in the near future.

I'd love to hear your take on this.

Cheers!
 
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duffy0

New Member
I have noticed the same thing with my Trek Allant+ 8s. I get a "Error 510" on the same spot on Market St in San Francisco. For those in the area it appears to be between 7th and 6th when riding towards the Ferry building (east bound) and not when heading towards the Castro. I haven't been able to isolate what is causing it because sometimes nothing happens but at least twice a week I get the error and need to pull over and reset (take the battery out and put it back in). I don't know if there will be a hardware or software fix for it, but I assume it will have to be hardware and I doubt they will do repairs. They will likely fix it next year which is a bummer. I am hoping that there will be a fix.

I thought I was going crazy so thanks for sharing.
 

steve mercier

Well-Known Member
This is my first post here and I wanted to share my super-weird experience with the new 2020 Performance motor on a Cube Touring Hybrid.
Take this as a heads-up warning but I'd also like to hear your experiences. So here it goes.

What happens is that the system displays "Error 510" and while the display can be operated, the motor is not outputting any power until a system reset. Sometimes multiple resets were necessary to get it to work again, as the motor works for a few seconds and the displays the error again. I've recorded each instance of the error.

The dealer service wasn't able to find any errors with the system, but has updated the firmware and has told me to monitor the behaviour of the system to try and find a pattern when the error triggers.

The errors continued and I've found a pattern looking at the recording information: it was invariably on the same ~500m stretch of the road.
On every other route, riding condition or intensity the bike behaves perfectly.

I've also done a test by avoiding that stretch of road, getting no errors, circling back and taking that stretch that I suspect produces the error — and had the error appear as expected.

The dealer also lent me an older Gen2 Performance CX MTB to test, and that one did not produce any errors on that spot.


Afterwards, the dealer tried it for themselves on 2 other 2020 Bosch ebikes and they all produced the same error on that spot. In the meantime we've found two other places in the city where the error appears. Seems that the issue is systematic and affects all 2020 Bosch ebikes, or at least those made by Cube. They obviously changed something between generations.

I've brought this issue up with Bosch as well and they asked me, among other things, to use a compass or a magnetometer app to see how it behaves, to see if the crankset is magnetizable, and if there are any visible power lines around.
I did so and this is the recording on a normal stretch of the road, while this is the recording where the error triggers. You can clearly see the difference. It might be an underground powerline, the nearby hospital with an MRI machine, inductive loops for vehicle detection, or some other thing. As for the other two locations I've no idea.

At the moment Bosch is investigating the issue and has told me to avoid that road or turn off the motor. The bike is sitting in the dealer's service center since I don't want to add aditional wear & tear if I'm planning on returning it.

I'm in a pretty weird situation right now and I'm not sure whether to just return the bike, or keep it and hope that it will get fixed by a newer motor revision in the near future.

I'd love to hear your take on this.

Cheers!
Fascinating!
 

steve mercier

Well-Known Member
I have noticed the same thing with my Trek Allant+ 8s. I get a "Error 510" on the same spot on Market St in San Francisco. For those in the area it appears to be between 7th and 6th when riding towards the Ferry building (east bound) and not when heading towards the Castro. I haven't been able to isolate what is causing it because sometimes nothing happens but at least twice a week I get the error and need to pull over and reset (take the battery out and put it back in). I don't know if there will be a hardware or software fix for it, but I assume it will have to be hardware and I doubt they will do repairs. They will likely fix it next year which is a bummer. I am hoping that there will be a fix.

I thought I was going crazy so thanks for sharing.
WOW this is freaky.
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
iH ave seen many weird things that electronics do. just a couple months ago att found out garage door opener's rf receiver was broadcasting on their frequency and causing problem. They had a guy out with this big hand head receiver and hardware and pinpoint it. but this is a device designed to receive signals not broadcast them.
 

JohnDoe1983

Member
Saw a lot of young people when I was a cop who opened the garage door of their neighbours with a RF transmitter.
 

MKIS

New Member
Thnxx Baxuz for sharing your experience, it helped me to understand the cause of my similor problem I had with my week old bike a Conway Cairon C229 also with a Bosch Performance gen3.
Suddenly it stopped with a an error “510” and I clouldn’t find the cause untill I read your story. So I went back to the same spot in Amsterdam, got the same error and I measured a magnetic field of 106microT! My conclusion is that the Bosch Performance gen3 doesn’t resistent magnetic fields above 100microT.
I informed my dealer and will inform Conway and Bosch.
Did you keep you bike and did you haar anything from Bosch?
I’ll keep mine because it’s a fine bike!7E11A513-15D8-441C-9018-C0CE09AB6E07.jpeg88ADA293-4948-4B34-B480-262F0209E00E.jpeg
 

JohnDoe1983

Member
Just download 2 apps regarding magnetic field on the apple store. Brought my cell close to different item in the house and the meter got crazy specially near radio and speaker. The tightness of the seal around the handle on the microwave let some field escape. Fun Apps. Thanks