Brake Pads

retiredNH

Active Member
Region
USA
An FYI regarding "Florida". I get most people's take on Florida, as many vacation orientated areas are just that - flat! The reason though, that I even considered an e-bike to start with was hills. Big hills. Think sand dunes that have been around long enough to have serious vegetation. Called a rolling coastal area. We hunted all over the place and finally located a place we liked, and one of the reasons we liked it was it's proximity to a 46 miles bike trail system located about 6 miles away.

So we bought it. As it turns out, hills that didn't seem like much while driving a car turned out to be much bigger than we thought when riding our bikes. 1st ride out to this major bike trail just about killed us, leaving enough energy left when we arrived to turn around and head home! As it turn out, our new house was located right smack in the middle of a large area rolling hills, with no way to get out other than to ride over them. Super disappointed, we had pretty much decided there would be no bike riding in Florida.

Until somebody mentioned the potential of an e-bike. The rest is history.

Point being, there ARE hills in Florida.....
The highest point in Florida is Britton Hill, 345 feet high. The highest. That's about how much I climb at the START of most of the rides from my house. Or I go DOWN at least that much. Of course folks out west think in terms of thousands of feet, not hundreds.

I can also assure you that descending hundreds of feet over a 1/2 mile or so is a good test for brakes, especially if you're on a dirt/gravel road, like I frequently am. You want to stay under control. The last thing you want is inconsistent braking. Would cheap no name pads work? Probably, but I don't want to be the one to find out the ones I got (remember, no name) have "issues" because some of these steep roads also cling to steep hillsides. You get off the road on the downhill side, your ride will become very interesting indeed.
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
I can also assure you that descending hundreds of feet over a 1/2 mile or so is a good test for brakes, especially if you're on a dirt/gravel road, like I frequently am. You want to stay under control. The last thing you want is inconsistent braking. Would cheap no name pads work? Probably, but I don't want to be the one to find out the ones I got (remember, no name) have "issues" because some of these steep roads also cling to steep hillsides. You get off the road on the downhill side, your ride will become very interesting indeed.
and think of that on a tandem when the weight is about 400 pounds.
 

AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
The highest point in Florida is Britton Hill, 345 feet high. The highest. That's about how much I climb at the START of most of the rides from my house. Or I go DOWN at least that much. Of course folks out west think in terms of thousands of feet, not hundreds.

I can also assure you that descending hundreds of feet over a 1/2 mile or so is a good test for brakes, especially if you're on a dirt/gravel road, like I frequently am. You want to stay under control. The last thing you want is inconsistent braking. Would cheap no name pads work? Probably, but I don't want to be the one to find out the ones I got (remember, no name) have "issues" because some of these steep roads also cling to steep hillsides. You get off the road on the downhill side, your ride will become very interesting indeed.
As mentioned, deal with your level of paranoia, and be happy. Maybe I could add local conditions to that thought?
 

AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
and think of that on a tandem when the weight is about 400 pounds.
I just wanted to mention, SOME of us are approaching 400 lbs while stopping a bike designed for a single rider. (315 pound rider on a 65 pound bike?)
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
I just wanted to mention, SOME of us are approaching 400 lbs while stopping a bike designed for a single rider. (315 pound rider on a 65 pound bike?)
on a 20% grade? or 5 miles of downhill? when I am riding in the rain and its dark and car pulls out in front of me I want to know my brakes will stop me in time even at 20mph. this has happened several times. would you buy brakes for your car from some no name Chinese company for 1/4" the price?
 

m@Robertson

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
My Vado is American/Swiss, proudly made in Taiwan, with the motor from Berlin/Germany. My Trance E+ has been made in Taiwan with a Japanese motor. RFtH was mentioning big brands. I don't know bigger brands than these two, Trek being of similar size, Cannondale the fourth.
Well, when Specialized and Trek etc. combined sell motors in the hundreds of thousands, Bafang is selling them in the millions. Its not immediately obvious to us living in the West, but the Far East is an order-of-magnitude-plus larger ebike market than the entire Western world. So if you want to point to big, established manufacturers who have loads of experience in the marketplace... look to China. The Chinese are primarily catering to utilitarian riders who depend on a motorized bike for reliable transportation vs. recreational riders. So while there is an engineering excellence advantage in the West, in terms of value for the dollar from manufacturers who cater to those of modest means who need reliable transportation... that is a nut the West has not yet cracked (or even tried to).

How big of a market gap are we talking about? This graphic uses 2015 volumes, so the West has moved the needle some when it comes to showing up on the graph, but there is still a lonnnng way to go if a Western company is going to even approach being anything but 'tiny' by comparison.

wwseb.png


Given Bafang's new factory in Poland designed to end the EU's restrictive production and content tarriffs that have protected native manufacturers' margins over the last few years, we're about to see some serious competitive pressure be applied to the Bosch's and Brose's of the world.,

While I'm a big fan of what have proven for me to be the economical, day-to-day dependability of Chinese motors, I look forward to that new in-your-face competitive pressure on Western industry. they gave themselves a breather by championing the EU tarriffs to try and protect their marketplace. Now, with Bafang playing on their home turf prices can only come down if they expect to survive. As always, competition is a win for consumers.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
This graphic uses 2015 volumes
Name a single modern e-bike made back in 2015.

Given Bafang's new factory in Poland designed to end the EU's restrictive production and content tarriffs that have protected native manufacturers' margins over the last few years, we're about to see some serious competitive pressure be applied to the Bosch's and Brose's of the world.,
Bafang will be forced to make 250 W nominal, 25 km/h limited motors in Europe, or they will be eaten alive by European government agencies. With such motors, they would only be able to take the entry-level market. EU is not United States.
 
Last edited:

Gionnirocket

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Y. O.
Perhaps you ride a crap made in People's Republic of China.
I find comments such as this rather comical... especially when coming from someone who lives in a country known for.... well nothing.
Add that this country has no mention in world history other than being quickly defeated and you may want to curb your comments going forward as you know not who you are offending and that your only relavence to the EU is geographical.
On your bright side this will be changing soon as in short you will be known as the EU source for Bafang, BBS's and throttles👍
... though again, the only real contribution is geographical. Coincidence?

Name a single modern e-bike made back in 2015.


Bafang will be forced to make 250 W nominal, 25 km/h limited motors in Europe, or they will be eaten alive by European government agencies. With such motors, they would only be able to take the entry-level market. EU is not United States.
And Poland decides nothing and speaks to even less in the EU.
 

m@Robertson

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
Name a single modern e-bike made back in 2015.


Bafang will be forced to make 250 W nominal, 25 km/h limited motors in Europe, or they will be eaten alive by European government agencies. With such motors, they would only be able to take the entry-level market. EU is not United States.

I don't see how thats relevant. Focusing on the bikes themselves misses the point, which was that dismissing an industry that is colossal compared to its relatively tiny Western competition is going to end only one way. The example of the EU, which has been playing out for years, is instructive on what happens when a behemoth gets the door slammed in its face like China did with the EU tarriffs. They are implementing a total workaround by moving production inside the EU.

Bafang has to make 250w nominal motors in the EU just like every other EU mfr so there's no advantage there for any side.

But again, I wasn't talking about bikes. The point was not to dismiss an industry that has proven itself extremely capable of operating on a level that Western manufacturers can only dream of.
 
Last edited:

tomjasz

Well-Known Member
I find comments such as this rather comical... especially when coming from someone who lives in a country known for.... well nothing.
Seriously? Why the insult?

Made in Poland: inventions
  • Kerosene lamp. Probably the oldest invention from our list, dating back to 1853 when Ignacy Łukasiewicz made it in Lwów, formerly in Poland. ...
  • Esperanto. ...
  • Bulletproof vest. ...
  • Paper clips. ...
  • Toothpaste. ...
  • Walkie-talkie. ...
  • Mini-computer. ...
  • Graphene production.
 

Gionnirocket

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Y. O.
Seriously? Why the insult?

Made in Poland: inventions
  • Kerosene lamp. Probably the oldest invention from our list, dating back to 1853 when Ignacy Łukasiewicz made it in Lwów, formerly in Poland. ...
  • Esperanto. ...
  • Bulletproof vest. ...
  • Paper clips. ...
  • Toothpaste. ...
  • Walkie-talkie. ...
  • Mini-computer. ...
  • Graphene production.
Insult? Just my view.. But I guess it could be taken as insulting as his remarks and when painting with such broad strokes.
As for the rest.. Seems like a Google search result. NOT anything worth mentioning. Forgive me if I don't respond again... My kerosene lamp is running low 🙃
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
Seriously? Why the insult?

Made in Poland: inventions
  • Kerosene lamp. Probably the oldest invention from our list, dating back to 1853 when Ignacy Łukasiewicz made it in Lwów, formerly in Poland. ...
  • Esperanto. ...
  • Bulletproof vest. ...
  • Paper clips. ...
  • Toothpaste. ...
  • Walkie-talkie. ...
  • Mini-computer. ...
  • Graphene production.
Nicholas Copernicus. Frédéric Chopin. Marie Curie. Stanisław Ulam. To name just a few.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
Ever heard of Stromer Stefan?
Stromer e-bikes have their edge in Switzerland and outside EU. Stromers are speed-restricted for sales in the EU. Again, you seem to know very little of Europe.


Bafang has to make 250w nominal motors in the EU just like every other EU mfr so there's no advantage there for any side.
The only strength for Bafang worldwide are their powerful motors (and these are not allowed in Europe). Bafang stands no chance in the EU save the low cost ebikes. And well cargo ebikes too. The point is, there is only a single European country I know of where cargo bikes are popular: Denmark. (I could be wrong but I have travelled a lot).
 

Gionnirocket

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Y. O.
Nicholas Copernicus. Frédéric Chopin. Marie Curie. Stanisław Ulam. To name just a few.
Correction: To name the few.

I used a paper clip to pull up the wick and some toothpaste to raise the level of kerosene in my lamp so I could post again
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
Stromer e-bikes have their edge in Switzerland and outside EU. Stromers are speed-restricted for sales in the EU. Again, you seem to know very little of Europe.



The only strength for Bafang worldwide are their powerful motors (and these are not allowed in Europe). Bafang stands no chance in the EU save the low cost ebikes. And well cargo ebikes too. The point is, there is only a single European country I know of where cargo bikes are popular: Denmark. (I could be wrong but I have travelled a lot).

P.S. Let us take Norway as example. Norway, same as Switzerland is not in the EU but the country follows EU rules. And Norway is very rich, and it's the leader in EV. What sells in Norway? Riese and Müller. Moustache. Tern. And plethora of expensive e-MTB. No space for Bafang.
 

RunForTheHills

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
Bafang stands no chance in the EU save the low cost ebikes.
Could it be that the high end ebikes outsell the low cost ebikes in Europe? Judging from the price range of most prospective ebike owners asking for advice on this site, low cost ebikes seem to outsell the high end ebikes by an order of magnitude.