Call to App designers!!

GypsyTreker

Active Member
A battery calculator App ( iPhone/Android)! for eBikes would be useful. Perhaps one exists. I would love to know how long I can expect to travel ( range) by plugging in some variables ( voltage, ah, pedal assist level, speed average). I am new to eBiking but have some basic understanding of batteries usage from having drones also from using my Goal Zero Yeti 400 and Solar panel when dry camping with my Aliner Scout. I know I would gladly pay for a phone app that helped me figure range. I don't use throttle and actually use zero motor if on flat ground. Contrary to what I had read the Ecotric 26" Fattie pedals fine as a bike on paved flat or mild rollers. Any thoughts?
 

Mr. Coffee

Well-Known Member
You might want to look at the Bosch Range Assistant, as it is doing (for Bosch powered e-bikes) much of what you describe.

For me, I'd like to (1) be able to calibrate the range assistant to my e-bike and to a lesser extent my riding style, and (2) feed it routes from Google Maps, ridewithgps, or Garmin Connect and have it estimate how many watt-hours it would take me to cover that route.

Keep in mind that things like temperature, wind, and road surface conditions can have sometimes dramatic impacts on estimated range. Also, range estimates are more accurate on the top 25 percent of battery charge and much less so on the bottom 25 percent.
 

GypsyTreker

Active Member
Thanks for replying. I actually discovered the Bosch calculator after I posted this. I think I need to get my brain into thinking Watts and install a good voltage meter on my bike. I am a PAS rider, I don't use throttle. In fact on flat ground I have more than enough gearing (7) to ride w/o any assist, motor off. My wife and I plan to begin some range testing next week. We are both fine at 12-13mph, cruising along taking in what's around us. So my thoughts on a calculator. Watts available ( using a decent meter) level of assist, average mph, average surface/road conditions.( Gravel, dirt,paved, flat, hilly) = approximate range left. I suspect you could do the same thing with a calculator and knowing how your bike performs.
 

Thomas Jaszewski

Well-Known Member
IME we all overthink the mileage issue in the beginning. It's just foreign to us. No more simple miles to the gallon. I found that after a few months I had a pretty good sense about how far I could go. Every once in awhile I'll run a battery down to the system LVC, low voltage cutout and have a pretty clear idea of what the battery will give me.
 

GypsyTreker

Active Member
IME we all overthink the mileage issue in the beginning. It's just foreign to us. No more simple miles to the gallon. I found that after a few months I had a pretty good sense about how far I could go. Every once in awhile I'll run a battery down to the system LVC, low voltage cutout and have a pretty clear idea of what the battery will give me.
That's pretty much what I figured. Once you get in touch with how you ride and when you hit LVC you develop a sense of what you can do to extend range. I did order a meter to give me specific voltage readings rather then the useless graph/bar gauge on the controller.
 

GypsyTreker

Active Member
I had my LBS install a Grin Cycle Analist V3 https://www.ebikes.ca/product-info/cycle-analyst-3.html on my fatbike last April and that info taught me volumes about battery use and range estimates.I have not run out of battery on any ride yet,very close but not out of power.
Thanks for that. I can't seem to find pricing on that link you sent. I actually have a much more basic version of this on its way. It will show actual voltage in r/t. Then it would be simply a time / distance per watt I would think. Its been a really busy holiday season and we have had little time to play with our bikes ( non stop rain doesn't help). I am very interested in bikepacking, my wife, not so much. So range is more pressing for my needs than hers. No doubt as eBikes start to gain more popularity, someone will create an application ( like in the drone world) and be able to make a few $.
 

Thomas Jaszewski

Well-Known Member
Thanks for that. I can't seem to find pricing on that link you sent. I actually have a much more basic version of this on its way. It will show actual voltage in r/t. Then it would be simply a time / distance per watt I would think. Its been a really busy holiday season and we have had little time to play with our bikes ( non stop rain doesn't help). I am very interested in bikepacking, my wife, not so much. So range is more pressing for my needs than hers. No doubt as eBikes start to gain more popularity, someone will create an application ( like in the drone world) and be able to make a few $.
In order to adapt the CA to some systems soldering or making new connections will likely be necessary unless your controller has a CA ready connection. The link was for the information page. You have the URL, just go to the dropdown menus and select, eBike parts, cycle analysts.

I do customer support for a battery seller that users cell level fusing and a Bluetooth BMS that gives real-time battery information.

I somehow managed my first year without anything more than a multimeter and a cheap bar display. You won't kill a battery by charging it fully and riding until you get an LVC. Low Voltage Cutout. Then just never ride that far again. Originally I figured it out by the mileage. I went 27 miles before my battery wouldn't fully power, and never went more ta 22 miles after that. Once I got a bit more sophisticated I started charging to 90% and checked my LVC mileage again. Most older riders, IME, aren't riding beyond the mileage of a 14Ah battery. Situations vary, but the smiles do not!
 

GypsyTreker

Active Member
Sometimes the KISS method works best. So is there an advantage to having our batteries increased to 17.5 ah? They are 36v @ 12.4 ah I believe and I'm pretty sure there is enough room in both our casements for additional cells. Fact is a 30-35 mile run on a planned route would be fine. That's really all I'm trying to figure out. Pretty sure I'm going to be a B&B 2 B&B rider if my wife has any say so, and she does. As far as Solo bikepacking, 12 miles in 12 out will find any solace I'd be looking for. As I mentioned earlier , we both are PAS riders and use level 1 or 2 ( I mean I want the exercise). My wife uses a throttle only to get started, that will change when we upgrade her 3 level controller to 5, like mine. You know if they ever said look here is a 50 mile battery but you will be limited to a Max speed of 14mph I'd be fine. :)
 

BBassett

Active Member
A battery calculator App ( iPhone/Android)! for eBikes would be useful. Perhaps one exists. I would love to know how long I can expect to travel ( range) by plugging in some variables ( voltage, ah, pedal assist level, speed average). I am new to eBiking but have some basic understanding of batteries usage from having drones also from using my Goal Zero Yeti 400 and Solar panel when dry camping with my Aliner Scout. I know I would gladly pay for a phone app that helped me figure range. I don't use throttle and actually use zero motor if on flat ground. Contrary to what I had read the Ecotric 26" Fattie pedals fine as a bike on paved flat or mild rollers. Any thoughts?
All I need to determine range is to be able to read the voltage on my ebike battery. I know I will not deplete the pack past 45.4V (20% capacity) and from experience have learned that with the 500C display (hands down the best display I have used) gives me 10 to 13 miles per each power-bar on the display. The initial charge point determines the max range (obviously) and all I have to do is ride, pedal, and monitor the voltage until a battery swap is necessary. I can charge to a specific voltage with a Satiator, transfer the battery to the bike and see that same voltage on the display (upper Right corner), ride, watch the mileage climb and the voltage drop. It is pretty intuitive after just a couple rides. Not that all the normal factors don't/can't screw with any further range of course. The best part is specifically that you Don't Need an App for any of it. Just another thing that can stop working for no reason what-so-ever. Apps are all cool and nifty until you are depending on them (unnecessarily) and they cease to work, or the phone craps out, the carrier changes something, the cell access isn't available, and on and on. Don't let someone "sell" you on the idea of something that is mostly being used to pocket money on the transaction. 1st it a display control that is designed to collect and store all the battery data... and doesn't ($100+ dollars wasted), next it's BT ability on packs increasing the cost (and Profit)... they are all ideas spurred more for sales than for practical use and you don't need any of them to track your power consumption. Get a great pack and a 500C display and you have everything you need.

Ride safe.
 

Attachments

Last edited:

BBassett

Active Member
I had my LBS install a Grin Cycle Analist V3 https://www.ebikes.ca/product-info/cycle-analyst-3.html on my fatbike last April and that info taught me volumes about battery use and range estimates.I have not run out of battery on any ride yet,very close but not out of power.
The Satiator along with the 500C display gives me everything I ever need to monitor both range and power consumption. Why mount the Satiator? Do you remove it and the battery to charge in cold weather, bring the bike inside a heated space to charge, or just not have to consider temperature?

Ride safe.
 

GypsyTreker

Active Member
I tried to like this but it asked for a reply. Thanks for a simple solution. All I wanted was a more accurate way to figure range left. These answers are suberb for helping new eBike owner/riders. :)
 

BBassett

Active Member
I tried to like this but it asked for a reply. Thanks for a simple solution. All I wanted was a more accurate way to figure range left. These answers are suberb for helping new eBike owner/riders. :)
I think showing new-ebike owners that they Don't need to spend more money on gimmicks like Apps to achieve the same ends is better than trying to "help" them by getting them to buy something and become dependent on it, something that can fail for many different reasons at any time. Although know people that WILL disagree with me because it means they don't get any money for "helping" you spend your money. Pick the right hardware, learn how to use it, and then ride, ride, ride, all of it falls into place. There is no better or easier way to determine possible range than knowing the battery's voltage (at any time) and how to extend your range by huffin' and puffin' through lots of practice.

Ride safe.
 

Thomas Jaszewski

Well-Known Member
News flash. You're not an example of the market and what the market demands. No display provided the data a BT BMS provides. They're popular because they demystify battery troubleshooting. You may not need it. Fine, but demeaning anything you don't like as the market trying to money grab is just plain missing the boat. Jeebus fella, in my 5 years of thousands of support cases BT is a tool. In the end, it doesn't add a significant cost to a battery pack. The more sophisticated mid-drive systems, Bosch, Shimano, and others offer even more sophisticated battery management. BT has been a huge success in the DIY market. Giving builders a better management tool and sellers a better support tool.
Hopefully, the weather will improve and you can ride rather than deride.
 

Thomas Jaszewski

Well-Known Member
The Satiator along with the 500C display gives me everything I ever need to monitor both range and power consumption. Why mount the Satiator? Do you remove it and the battery to charge in cold weather, bring the bike inside a heated space to charge, or just not have to consider temperature?

Ride safe.
The Grin Cycle Analyst, CA3, isn't a Satiator. It's a full-featured display well beyond the scope of the displays you're using. It has functions best suited to motors other than BBSxx series. Typically hub drives.
 

BBassett

Active Member
The Grin Cycle Analyst, CA3, isn't a Satiator. It's a full-featured display well beyond the scope of the displays you're using. It has functions best suited to motors other than BBSxx series. Typically hub drives.
I thought he was referencing the Satiator, not the CA... but I think you knew that Tom, I said as much in the comment to the person I was replying to. I have a CA on the shelf, don't plan on installing it now, too much space necessary with everything else mounted on the bars, and because the combination of 500C and the Satiator give me all the necessary info on power usage... lol it or hub-motors.

Just had to add that the Satiator is designed to be able to be mounted and fully weather-proof.
 

GypsyTreker

Active Member
Ok so I'm going with the KISS program. I bought the bayrite dc 6v-100v multi meter. My question .....do I need the shunt? I didn't realise it wasn't weatherized so my idea it to essentially create a plug in and keep the meter in my frame bag. Is wiring on this +/- ? If not I'm lost..lol . 43537
 

6zfshdb

Well-Known Member
If you want to keep it simple & cheap, check out this free smartphone app: http://www.esb.bike/ It costs nothing and requires no installation other than pairing your battery BMS with your smartphone via Bluetooth.

It is compatible with a number of different battery / drive systems including MPF, Continental, Brose, Bafang, Hitech Energy, Tranzx, BMZ and DLG. It is sometimes difficult to tell what drive system your bike uses. In my case, I had to contact my bike maker to confirm the app would work.

There are other similar apps available for other battery / drive types. Most don't provide all the bells & whistles of dedicated display products but It's worth checking out before spending $$ on a wired system.
 

GypsyTreker

Active Member
If you want to keep it simple & cheap, check out this free smartphone app: http://www.esb.bike/ It costs nothing and requires no installation other than pairing your battery BMS with your smartphone via Bluetooth.

It is compatible with a number of different battery / drive systems including MPF, Continental, Brose, Bafang, Hitech Energy, Tranzx, BMZ and DLG. It is sometimes difficult to tell what drive system your bike uses. In my case, I had to contact my bike maker to confirm the app would work.

There are other similar apps available for other battery / drive types. Most don't provide all the bells & whistles of dedicated display products but It's worth checking out before spending $$ on a wired system.

Thanks for that....I can't imagine my $750 Ecotric has BT capabilities. I apparently purchased a solar unit as a moniter. It was like $15. Cheap mistake. I'm now thinking a simple multi tester will do the trick. Just need to know where to get the reading while the battery is in the bike. Once I get a general idea of how much voltage I actually use on a charge I'm good to go.
 

Thomas Jaszewski

Well-Known Member
Ok so I'm going with the KISS program. I bought the bayrite dc 6v-100v multi meter. My question .....do I need the shunt? I didn't realise it wasn't weatherized so my idea it to essentially create a plug in and keep the meter in my frame bag. Is wiring on this +/- ? If not I'm lost..lol .
The most commonly used solution among DIY builders is Turnigy Wattmeters. Cheap and quite reliable.