Dangerous bike?

Well, I have more information as to why I have been unable to get my Teo bike here in Oregon. Finally received this memo from DHL-

I am deeply sorry for all the troubles.
As per my system, this package was on hold in Montreal because it was considered a dangerous good, it never left the origin country, it was returned to the sender. Please contact the shipper for further details.

Apparently they thought it was a bomb strapped to the frame rather than a battery. Explosive speed? Bike way too fast? Canadians trying to bomb the USA? The possibilities are endless. I just want my bike, dangerous or not.
 
We're big on nuclear power here. I'm guessing, if they won't ship one with a battery, they'd never ship one with a nuke.
 

jazz

Well-Known Member
If you can't get one in the end, just drive up to Seattle and pick up a Rad Rover
 

Alex M

Well-Known Member
Make that Clean Coal!
Careful here, a lot of people voted for Mr T :)... In 4 years it will be suddenly - duh, coal and oil are not clean again...

Back to the subj - US customs at the pre-clearance depot in Canada probably didn't like the Lithium battery. Poor job on part of DHL customs brokers, or inadequate packaging.
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
Many ebike sellers charge $200 +/- to ship an ebike with battery. The seller needs to be certified for hazmat shipping and packaging needs to meet a standard. Few ever get shipped legally by air, it's just too expensive. I've had 2 ebikes shipped to me via ground, and there were hazmat labels on the exterior of the box. We as end users can't legally ship batteries back to the seller, even for replacement. Most times the seller will ship the replacement and never ask for the bad pack to be returned. I'm not sure what to do with old dead packs.

I'm not suggesting anything has been done incorrectly or illegally, just this wouldn't be the first time there's been a hiccup with hazmat shipping reported here. Maybe shipping ground is the answer.

There's some interesting information in this thread about shipping ebike battery packs.

https://electricbikereview.com/forums/threads/battery-shipping.3213/
 

Alex M

Well-Known Member
Tell the seller to get his act together and follow CAN/US hazmat packaging rules.

Or - a hiccup at the border. In light of the recent "US first" - widely publicized albeit poorly executed policy to curtail the inflow of goods and people - the chances of this to happen are higher.

Yeah, old battery packs are a problem. Not quite a recycling item. Don't remember now, - something about high costs of materials recovery, zero to negative profits.
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
Yeah, old battery packs are a problem. Not quite a recycling item. Don't remember now, - something about high costs of materials recovery, zero to negative profits.
IF! If you have 40% capacity left in your pack, some small energy storage companies will take them, but if they aren't in your town..... Always something new to learn with LEV's.
 

Ann M.

Well-Known Member
@j petersen, someone at Teo E. must have not included a required bit of documentation with the bike or put a specific sticker in the wrong spot or left off a required phone number...it's a tedious task to properly package anything with a lithium battery. Even little lithium powered headlights or the like from Amazon have hazardous material stickers on them!

The only way a lithium powered ebike can be shipped here is via Ground and Canadian customs is very strict. Some of the ebike kits we order from a manufacturer in Canada ship the battery separate from the rest of the product and the battery is always slower to arrive. Don't know if that's the US or Canada slowing the process.

Also, there are a few places that will take spent ebike lithium packs for recycling but not many. Discount Electronics, a local chain of computers & supplies has accepted a few old ebike batteries from us; so I suggest that you check with other computer shops to see if they will do the same. Shops and repair centers that handle the smaller lithium hand held tools don't recycle these larger batteries; we tried and all refused.

Sure hope Teo gets the shipping issue fixed soon! I know this is frustrating.
 
So, WOW. A little heads up would have been nice. Here I sit , like a mushroom in the dark, eating 'you know what' while my bike is mysteriously 'ON HOLD' with DHL in Montreal. No explanation from Benoit @ Teo or from DHL. Now, I am told it's E-bikes dirty little secret. They use dirty little batteries that require an FBI clearance and a sealed hazmat container to transport. Teo had to have known it was going by air if the estimatted shipping was 3 days. I am having the bike shipped here to my soon(hopefully) to be retirement home. I flew here and modified my trip for the principal purpose of receiving the bike. Bummer. I guess the good news is, they are going to try to smuggle it in by truck next. I'm coming back here next month so hopefully it will be here by then.
 
Must be using a dirty bomb E-bike. By truck it's 46 hours with no fuel, sleep, or Starbucks stops. Oh, you have Horton somebodies up there, right?
 

Scooteretti

Active Member
Unfortunately many retailers think that creating a website and just shipping product without properly knowing their business is pretty scary. All lithium battery shipments on electric bicycles MUST be shipped as Dangerous Goods and packed and shipped by a certified shipper.

Too often there are retailers who are either naive about the products they sell or simply try to cheat the system to save $$ on shipping costs. If a product is shipped by air without proper documentation this puts everyone in danger as there are proper and safe ways these batteries must be shipped by to avoid a serious disaster. Ground shipping also requires items to be shipped as Dangerous Goods. More and more carriers are inspecting / scanning packages and refusing to transport non declared DG shipments. Most carriers will also be reporting non DG declared shipments to Transport Canada and the appropriate DOT departments in the US.

Honestly this is a good thing as is makes things safer for everyone and those who try to bypass the system to avoid training costs, higher shipping costs, proper packing materials and labels should be fined. Fines for non compliance now in Canada are hitting $15,000 for the 1st offence and up to $50,000 in the US for a 1st offense. In the event of a catastrophic incident or death there will also be a criminal investigation. So in short never try to bypass the laws here, it simply is not worth it and ethically not right.

There are a few retailers like ourselves (Scooteretti) who play by the rules and absorb the thosuands of dollars of additional costs for training, materials, and additional shipping costs but many are still not, which is in our opinion dangerous to air travelers, package handlers etc.....

So whatever you do we always suggest making sure you work wih a retailer who is knowledgeable and certified in the safe handling of lithium ion batteries and with shipping product that contains them.
 

Scooteretti

Active Member
Hello Stocker,

Good reply. Indeed there were serious incidents with UPS aircraft in the past due to non declared lithium batteries. UPS and FedEx having a ZERO tolerance for non declared DG and DHL also getting more serious about this. If these shipments are by air this is even more strict. Which is good.

UPS Crash Dubai: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UPS_Airlines_Flight_6

UPS Cargo Plane Fire Philly PS DC-8 in Philadelphia, PA

Asiana Airlines 747 near South Korea on July 28, 2011

FAA Lithium Battery Incident Log: https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/ash/ash_programs/hazmat/aircarrier_info/media/battery_incident_chart.pdf


International air shipping carriers are members ICAO and IATA and follow the strict guidelines set out in the proper handling of DG shipments. Once again this is serious and those thinking they will cheat the system will get caught and when they do it will be serious and expensive. I personally would be really upset knowing that a DG shipment ended up on my flight where someone tried to cheat the system to save a few $$$ this is simply not acceptable.

Many people know that I am a strong advocate or shipping lithium batteries within full compliance of the law. We go so far as having all of our suppliers (major one's in the industry) sign off on an annual document from senior management that also confirms that everything they ship to us is in full compliance and the when we ship to our customers that we are also shipping product to them in full compliance of all international laws.

Here is a link to the IATA page where one can read about shipping lithium batteries by air.

https://www.iata.org/whatwedo/cargo/dgr/Documents/lithium-battery-guidance-document-2017-en.pdf
regards,


Will
shop.scooteretti.com
 

Sonoboy

Active Member
Here is the link about the rules to flight with batteries.
http://www.catsa.gc.ca/guidelines-batteries
I heard crazy story in the past when lithium battery were first introduce and it almost took the plane down...
Just ask Boeing about this. They spent reams of money on the design of the 787, with its carbon fiber tube airframe which required the largest autoclave in the industry to 'bake' the finished tube. To meet the spec for weight, they replaced all 'standard' batteries on board with lithium cells, and almost lost the prototype several times due to fire. Not good. I believe they had to enclose all the lithium cells in a heavy fireproof container that negated any weight savings.