Darwinian mode in eBike industry

Ravi Kempaiah

Well-Known Member
For the last few months, whenever I open a EBR page, something related to Storm or some CF bike pops up at the top. I understand that Sondors/Storm et al., bikes are questionable but I am simply stunned by the staggering amount of time people put into debating things endlessly. I stopped reading them a month ago.

I understand we human beings are highly territorial, physically and mentally, basically mirroring darwinian concept of "survival of the fittest" but WOW.... these CF, Sondors threads remind me of Nat Geo videos!!

On the flip side, EV industry has people like Elon who make their patents open to public, create wonderful products.... Thank you for restoring the faith :)

If only we had used all that energy of criticizing Sondors into biking or exploring places, EBR would be so much more fun to read and learn.

End of rant...
 

PowerMe

Well-Known Member
Here, here, Ravi!

I thought about this the other week: there are so many great ebikes and the tech is so cool and people like me are doing their research and finally taking the plunge into ebikedom and want to talk about it, and what gets 97% of the discussion time and effort on EBR? The Sonders thing. It's depressing to see as the bike is pfffttt and the campaign is ... whatever... I thought it would eventually die down as it got more than it's 15 min of famewhoredom but no.

The shift in interest and resulting devoted conversation around crowdfunding is (I believe) partly responsible for some good EBR members fading away in frustration. Sad, that. The industry is so much more than some crowdfunding Chinese bikes, but you'd not know that if you only saw active discussions from the last 2 months.
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
Ravi, good post. Last Saturday there was a big flurry on the SS threads and I wanted to read other stuff here. I guess I was in a petulant mood and I posted the following in the DD thread but removed it five minutes or so later.

"Some members here may take offense to this post and it may not appear to be evidence, but it is! Evidence of overload. Today I reached a critical mass, so to speak. I check in here on EBR frequently and I click on "new posts" to read all the forum posts, I suspect many do that. This whole sondors thing pops up to the top just about everytime and at the moment I'm overloaded with sondors, storm, ivers, a2.0, the lot of them. New members here may wonder what's the problem? It's storming all day, everyday and has been for three months. I'm a rational man, I realize folks got to get all this stuff out of their system, just like I have to get this rant out of my system. I wonder if those involved know or care about the damage being done. This was supposed to be the great experiment that would change the way people thought about ebikes! This may well be the worst thing to have ever happened to ebikes.

Broken Arrow!

Don't worry about it, I'll get over it. I feel better now, thanks. Oh and yes, I know the irony of it is; I'm part of the problem."

I removed the post because I realized it was petulant and there's plenty to read about other stuff. I guess we all get tired of seeing certain things in our peripheral vision and end up looking and wished we hadn't. I guess you've had a broken arrow moment as well, I can sympathize.
 

Ravi Kempaiah

Well-Known Member
Thanks JR, it indeed was a broken arrow moment!
Whether do it knowingly or unknowingly, I have taken a stance that it's their karma and life circumstances & time will balance their actions :)
Life is a great equalizer.
Anyway, this video is dedicated to all those SS/CF thread active people. I hope they don't end up like this..

 

PowerMe

Well-Known Member
PowerMe's battles against her roads and car racks
LOL
Car rack has been conquered!

I've been pimping my ride a bit, while waiting for the rains to stop (which they finally have today!!) I put a Suntour suspension post on my bike (aka the cheapskates ThudBuster).
 

stevenast

Well-Known Member
To me, Darwinian, in the e-bike space, means survival of shops and brands that competitively offer what consumers need.

Falling to the wayside will be those who do not offer ongoing support, reliability, and value.

Looking at it from the standpoint of the EBR community , there is a very close parallel to the entire ebike marketplace in the United States. Both are small, spirited, and struggling to grow.

We (ENR community and e-bike riders) are a sprout in the forest of conventional bicycles.
 

George S.

Well-Known Member
I've learned a lot about the parts market. I've learned a lot about batteries and chargers, and would now be willing to build both the bikes and power packs. I'd like to see AliExpress mature into something more like Ebay. The Storm changed my thinking rather completely, made me look at prices. I don't need to surrender all my rights to acquire a bike. I think it's more about getting stuff direct from China than it is about IGG, etc.

There are people on IGG who want to form communities, want to be a part of the ebike thing, and many are on a budget. I hope they work together to solve any problems that occur.

Court has to decide if he wants to review bikes like the Wave. It's hard not to have an opinion about A2 and IGG, probably Storm. Anyone in the industry will have to figure out what CF bikes mean. I don't. But I think it has been a liberating experience. A good 1960's term.
 

PowerMe

Well-Known Member
The issue for Court reviewing any crowdfunding eBike is he needs to have time to spend with one. So he either needs to purchase one himself or someone needs to let him have some time riding/testing one. It's not like he can pop into an eBike store like he does with the other brands/models and test one whenever.
 

Ravi Kempaiah

Well-Known Member
There are lots of smart people on this forum and they learn, share and represent the potential of what eBikes can do.
When I read those CF threads, it reminds me of this Nat Geo video.

Plankton--> Fish--> seal--> whale--> Human this is the ecological cycle.

But in this case, Seal = Sondors and Orca whales = those who routinely try to post there and malign the brand.
It's fascinating to see how it closely matches the survival or hunting behavior.

 

stevenast

Well-Known Member
The issue for Court reviewing any crowdfunding eBike is he needs to have time to spend with one. So he either needs to purchase one himself or someone needs to let him have some time riding/testing one. It's not like he can pop into an eBike store like he does with the other brands/models and test one whenever.
...and the bike he tests will have to be same specs, components, etc as the final product. That doesn't seem likely with the crowd sourced projects!
 

Ann M.

Well-Known Member
Well, Court did contribute to the Sonders CF and is waiting like everyone else for his bike. Hopefully, owners of Wave and other crowdfunded bikes will allow him the opportunity to review these items too. There's no reason the bikes he tests would be different than anyone else's, @stevenast and Court's been clear when a bike was a prototype, like the Sonders 'test' ride in Ca.
 

stevenast

Well-Known Member
Court is always clear, no doubt. Who said he isn't?

You implied yourself the reason that test bikes would be different: phony "prototypes" that have little relation to the finished product, if the finished product ever appears at all.