Daunting E bike Touring Problems and Logistics.

reed scott

Well-Known Member
You know what? I love that Surly, and I also built out a very strong mid-tail bike that I used before it. On the Surly, those are 2x138L panniers - actually big duffel bags with a QD super strong attachment mechanism - and I have had that bike loaded to over 560 lbs total system weight where I have to travel about 10 miles loaded like that. Even at 8 mph with that much weight down low on the sides its *quite* a handful.

But there's a totally different type of bike that makes loads like that almost irrelevant to handling. I would not have believed it if I hadn't experienced it. In Feb of 2021 I completed a build of a Bullitt cargo frontloader. On my first Costco run, I couldn't believe the handling. It was almost unaffected. The issue of momentum and inertia were of course there, but the bike was literally no different in handling.

This 'Long John' type of bike is common in Europe and they are notoriously loopy/flexible. But the Bullitt is the exception. Super strong and stiff, actually nimble. The only reason I am bringing this up is there are a couple of crazy Germans out of Berlin who are making plans available for low tech, 3rd world bike construction, and the version of this bike is made for all terrain. Its beefy as hell and runs two big hub motors in an awd configuration. You could take those plans and make a bike that changes your game entirely.

Check this out:

Amazing! The 'hunting' bike people could go far with this design. 👍 👍
 

K PierreR

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
You know what? I love that Surly, and I also built out a very strong mid-tail bike that I used before it. On the Surly, those are 2x138L panniers - actually big duffel bags with a QD super strong attachment mechanism - and I have had that bike loaded to over 560 lbs total system weight where I have to travel about 10 miles loaded like that. Even at 8 mph with that much weight down low on the sides its *quite* a handful.

But there's a totally different type of bike that makes loads like that almost irrelevant to handling. I would not have believed it if I hadn't experienced it. In Feb of 2021 I completed a build of a Bullitt cargo frontloader. On my first Costco run, I couldn't believe the handling. It was almost unaffected. The issue of momentum and inertia were of course there, but the bike was literally no different in handling.

This 'Long John' type of bike is common in Europe and they are notoriously loopy/flexible. But the Bullitt is the exception. Super strong and stiff, actually nimble. The only reason I am bringing this up is there are a couple of crazy Germans out of Berlin who are making plans available for low tech, 3rd world bike construction, and the version of this bike is made for all terrain. Its beefy as hell and runs two big hub motors in an awd configuration. You could take those plans and make a bike that changes your game entirely.

Check this out:

That is something I would be interested in as can build machines. I have a lot of steel laying around and access to chrome Moly. I have access to a full fab shop if I want to use it.
 

K PierreR

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
I finished up the protection for the batteries. No difference in handling. IMG_1912.JPGIMG_1914.JPGIMG_1915.JPGIMG_1916.JPG
 

mschwett

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
Fascinating thread, and props for all the dedicated and unrelenting work to make this thing happen.

It seems like a bit of a vicious spiral though, the bike gets heavier and heavier and has more and more friction and wind resistance which means you need more and more power which means...

I don’t know much about touring these distances off road, but if you could eliminate the need to carry extra tires, and just carry tubes and a charger and a spare battery or two, wouldn’t a much lower resistance and lighter touring bike have the same range? I’m an amateur and routinely use only about 3-4 watt hours / mile with an average speed of 15mph, which would give you a massive range with two totally conventional 500wh batteries.