E-Bike hatred is out there!

kathik

Active Member
I have been riding E-bikes for the last six plus years and just had my first experience with a hater. Yesterday i went cycling on the D &L Trail with three friends on regular bikes. We had a shuttle from Jim Thorpe to White Haven reserved and paid for with Pocono Bike Rentals owned by Tom Williams. He pulled up with the van and trailer which already had at least six rental bikes laying all over the trailer in a disarray. Two other girls were also waiting but never made reservations in advance so the driver was already annoyed by the cancelation and the new people that hadn't paid in advance. After getting the trailer in order, he started to load our bikes and when he saw my Turbo Levo went into a rant about those awful e-bikes! First of all he was mad they were not made aware this bike was being shuttled and it was $5 more, not because it was a problem, but because he hates them. He went on and on about how people are running all over the trail out of control going 23 mph crashing into everybody and how the state should not allow them on any trails. I tried to explain to him how it is pedal assist only and it only goes as fast as I pedal. I also made it clear that the majority of people riding electric bikes very well, like myself, are doing so due to medical issues. He said I shouldn't waste my time discussing this with him. He hates them. End of story.
I gave him the extra $5 for his trouble which he took and thanked me. When we got to our destination and were ready to depart, he came to me and returned the money. Sorry, too late.
I am posting this to make other e-bike riders aware of the poor service I received from this business and recommend looking for a different shuttle service if you are interested in doing one of these trips.
Sadly, I let this ruin the rest of the day for me.
 

Cramer Long

Active Member
Region
USA
I have been riding E-bikes for the last six plus years and just had my first experience with a hater. Yesterday i went cycling on the D &L Trail with three friends on regular bikes. We had a shuttle from Jim Thorpe to White Haven reserved and paid for with Pocono Bike Rentals owned by Tom Williams. He pulled up with the van and trailer which already had at least six rental bikes laying all over the trailer in a disarray. Two other girls were also waiting but never made reservations in advance so the driver was already annoyed by the cancelation and the new people that hadn't paid in advance. After getting the trailer in order, he started to load our bikes and when he saw my Turbo Levo went into a rant about those awful e-bikes! First of all he was mad they were not made aware this bike was being shuttled and it was $5 more, not because it was a problem, but because he hates them. He went on and on about how people are running all over the trail out of control going 23 mph crashing into everybody and how the state should not allow them on any trails. I tried to explain to him how it is pedal assist only and it only goes as fast as I pedal. I also made it clear that the majority of people riding electric bikes very well, like myself, are doing so due to medical issues. He said I shouldn't waste my time discussing this with him. He hates them. End of story.
I gave him the extra $5 for his trouble which he took and thanked me. When we got to our destination and were ready to depart, he came to me and returned the money. Sorry, too late.
I am posting this to make other e-bike riders aware of the poor service I received from this business and recommend looking for a different shuttle service if you are interested in doing one of these trips.
Sadly, I let this ruin the rest of the day for me.
Forgive if you expect to be forgiven : Maybe he was having a bad day . Maybe he can't afford one . Maybe he caught his wife in bed with his BF, Who knows
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
Sorry, he was the owner of this business. You do not treat a customer this way. From some of the online reviews I have seen, I am not the only one he has been rude to.
Sad. Nobody has a filter these days. Even the land managers that were against us were better behaved than this.
 

kathik

Active Member
Sad. Nobody has a filter these days. Even the land managers that were against us were better behaved than this.
I tried to refrain from being from being nasty as to not embarrass the others in my group.
I will be rating this business online in a few days. It's best to cool off before doing a review.
 

EMGX

Well-Known Member
Some self anointed "serious" cyclists are bigoted imbeciles. They like to claim cult like victim status because "cagers" disapprove when they hog a road riding outside of bike lanes or otherwise purposely block traffic when that isn't necessary - even though many of them mostly drive cars themselves, often impatient of others. Then they turn their noses up to anyone who rides differently then they do like a "Fred" on a "BSO" (bicycle shaped object, inexpensive bike that is unworthy to be ridden in their opinion) or an ebike. I've known a few of these types of cyclists - it's best to ignore comments of stupid people.
 

hypersailor

Member
Region
USA
Glad you could keep your cool, and represent e bikers as this will continue for a few years. Park City, UT has 400 miles of trails, big no e bike on single tracks signs. But they offer a Park City Municipal pass for free if disabled or over 65. The program was 'too popular' so it's in suspense. I've ridden 960 miles on expert trails and display the pass like a race plate. Glad to listen to analog bikers' concerns. The ONE safety issue is: when an e mtb is hitting a fast switchback in boost mode, the biker coming down is not used to how much LESS time is available to react, on both ends. So go slower as an e biker, turn on the Timberbell, keep your slower cadence and listen for riders. Anyone who has ridden mine is blown away, they want one instantly! At Corner Canyon, Draper UT it's cross country heaven, thousands of riders a week, and they all get along. E bikes are here to stay, from high-end 39lb Orbea Rise models, to $899 Ecotric beach bombers (repair anyone?) so this is a critical time period where true e bikers need to educate. Bike shops post Covid are happy to sell e bikes. IMG_20210613_063904928.jpg
The Crest is the best.jpg
 

kathik

Active Member
Some self anointed "serious" cyclists are bigoted imbeciles. They like to claim cult like victim status because "cagers" disapprove when they hog a road riding outside of bike lanes or otherwise purposely block traffic when that isn't necessary - even though many of them mostly drive cars themselves, often impatient of others. Then they turn their noses up to anyone who rides differently then they do like a "Fred" on a "BSO" (bicycle shaped object, inexpensive bike that is unworthy to be ridden in their opinion) or an ebike. I've known a few of these types of cyclists - it's best to ignore comments of stupid people.
I checked this person out online and yes, he is your stereotypical "Jock of all trades" type. His bio lists all of his accomplishments such as professional skier, mountain biker, kayaker and white water rafter. He certainly fits the bill.

If he had been a stranger on the trail I would have just laughed and kept right on going.
 

Gordon71

Well-Known Member
I had two incidents in the past couple of days. One good and one a bit odd. Both were in an ocean side park near where I live. The first was on one of the bike/hiking trails. I was passing a woman struggling up a hill. As I went by she said: "I sure wish I had one of those." The other was along the road through the park along the shore. I went by a girl less than half my age who was stopped and taking pictures or video of the coastline. I was just kind of ambling along enjoying the scenery. Next thing I knew she was zooming past me peddling like crazy. Pretty soon I went by again while she was stopped taking more pics. Soon after she went zooming by again only this time close enough I could have touched her even though it was a two lane wide one way road so there was loads of room. Happened once more and then we were out of the park. I followed her for the next couple of miles. She was hunched over peddling for all she was worth and I was easily keeping up with her,peddling upright, and not working too hard. I could have easily passed several times but just stayed behind. At the next intersection she went left and I was going right.
 

Cramer Long

Active Member
Region
USA
Sorry, he was the owner of this business. You do not treat a customer this way. From some of the online reviews I have seen, I am not the only one he has been rude to.
SO what : You said I gave him the extra $5 for his trouble and he thanked me . It also sounds like he needed an ear . Which it sounds like you generously gave him . It really sounds like he just wanted someone he could relate with to bitch to . I'm sure he's not always a prick . In the same repect his points are valid . People are disrespectful of trails . Who cares if they medically need the E-bike . What he probably actually hates is that E-bike have brought everyone and their brothers out . People who normally wouldn't be there .
It's the same thing that has happened to Golf since Covid . You have all these extra people out . Who don't have any etiquette. Don't know the proper pace of play and don't respect the course . This guy is probably experiencing the same thing with the Average E-bike crowd .
I notice myself on the trails . There's occasionally garbage thrown where-ever . Just sayin
 

RunForTheHills

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
While the guy was definitely out of line, I have mixed feelings about negative online reviews. They are important for steering other people away from truly bad businesses. However, they have the power to affect someone's livelihood and shouldn't be used vindictively.
 

kathik

Active Member
While the guy was definitely out of line, I have mixed feelings about negative online reviews. They are important for steering other people away from truly bad businesses. However, they have the power to affect someone's livelihood and shouldn't be used vindictively.
I seldom leave a bad review for anything or anyone. I usually just move on. This is a case where I am just letting other e-bike riders know this might be a business to avoid unless you enjoy being verbally abused. I also feel some constructive criticism might help this gentleman improve relationships with future customers.
 

Cramer Long

Active Member
Region
USA
Listening to you rant and rave is like a replay of yesterday.
Is your real name Tom Williams?😁
You talking to me ? If you are no not him . Lets just say I listen to people for a living . I've learned over teh years people like to talk more about themselves then anyone else . Plus I play Golf . But lets be fair You were ranting not me
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
SO what : You said I gave him the extra $5 for his trouble and he thanked me . It also sounds like he needed an ear . Which it sounds like you generously gave him . It really sounds like he just wanted someone he could relate with to bitch to . I'm sure he's not always a prick . In the same repect his points are valid . People are disrespectful of trails . Who cares if they medically need the E-bike . What he probably actually hates is that E-bike have brought everyone and their brothers out . People who normally wouldn't be there .
It's the same thing that has happened to Golf since Covid . You have all these extra people out . Who don't have any etiquette. Don't know the proper pace of play and don't respect the course . This guy is probably experiencing the same thing with the Average E-bike crowd .
I notice myself on the trails . There's occasionally garbage thrown where-ever . Just sayin
You should try to better understand the facts and circumstances before going deep into personalities. The trail is a tourist destination with hundreds of thousands of visitors a year. They have a tourist excursion train that accepts bikes and many stops along the way. There aren't hoards of ebikers, but there are hoards of visitors. If the guy can't deal with the hoards of people, he shouldn't work in the tourist industry. The tourist boards of these towns rely on visitors to these venues and they'd be appalled by this kind of treatment by one of the service businesses. Tourism is one of the biggest industries in the region. I think the town tourism committee might be interested to know this guy is charging more for an ebike that's no bigger or heavier than an average bike. In Kathi's case its smaller and lighter than a lot of hybrid bikes.
 

Cramer Long

Active Member
Region
USA
You should try to better understand the facts and circumstances before going deep into personalities. The trail is a tourist destination with hundreds of thousands of visitors a year. They have a tourist excursion train that accepts bikes and many stops along the way. There aren't hoards of ebikers, but there are hoards of visitors. If the guy can't deal with the hoards of people, he shouldn't work in the tourist industry. The tourist boards of these towns rely on visitors to these venues and they'd be appalled by this kind of treatment by one of the service businesses. Tourism is one of the biggest industries in the region. I think the town tourism committee might be interested to know this guy is charging more for an ebike that's no bigger or heavier than an average bike. In Kathi's case its smaller and lighter than a lot of hybrid bikes.
People are people JR . I'm not defending the guys actions . And the OP is only doing exactly what the guy he's complaining about did . That's complaining . None of us is any better then the other . We just think we are . Everyone deserves consideration . I read the thread . What you are saying is you agree with the OP seeking a sort of revenge justification / Everyone deserves consideration . You know the do unto others as you'd want done to you thing . Nobody is perfect . Obviously the guy has some issues . Why add to them ?
 

kathik

Active Member
You talking to me ? If you are no not him . Lets just say I listen to people for a living . I've learned over teh years people like to talk more about themselves then anyone else . Plus I play Golf . But lets be fair You were ranting not me
Yes, I was talking to you. You are the one that's ranting about how terrible everything is on the trail. You are correct. This past year with Covid everyone has moved outside and many things have been destroyed. There is litter everywhere. I also started hiking to get further away from people for that reason. This is not an electric bike problem. Most places I ride see very few electric bikes. This guy just hates e-bikes and anyone who rides one. I am more than willing to lend an ear to anyone with a problem that wants to have a civil conversation.