E-Bike Navigation

Jim1348

Member
I am still still giving some thought to what navigation device I want to use on my Gazelle Ultimate C380+.

I know that Garmin makes some dedicated cycling devices, like their Edge line.

I already have a Garmin Zumo XT, which I use on my Can-am Outlander Max 450 ATV.

If I get an appropriate mount, would that be a suitable e-bike GPS?

I gather that the Garmin Edge series have performance monitoring, but that really doesn't interest me at this time.

I also know that some people simply use a mount for their smartphone.

The other thing I am wondering about is bicycle maps.

I see that Garmin offers Cycle Map North America.

How helpful are those compared to Garmin City Navigator North America?

Their website does not list the Garmin Zumo XT as compatible with Cycle Map North America.

Does anybody here know why it is not compatible?

Are there other bicycle maps that cam be downloaded onto a Garmin Zumo XT that would work as well or better than Cycle Map North America?

Also, I didn't see any reference made to Garmin Cycle Map North America being a Lifetime Map, does it not get or need updating very often?

Is this essentially just an overlay to Garmin City Navigator?

 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
First of all, neither Garmin Edge nor Wahoo ELEMNT (cycling GPS computers) communicate with the Bosch motor of the Gazelle so any GPS bike computer will be used exactly as for a traditional bike. You might therefore consider a Hammerhead Karoo2 as well.
Cannot answer your question on NA maps.
 

mschwett

Well-Known Member
Region
USA

I also know that some people simply use a mount for their smartphone.

The other thing I am wondering about is bicycle maps.

this is my vote unless the other cycling functions of a garmin are crucial to you. frankly, the navigation software and map quality on these devices seems like a science fair project to me in comparison to things like google maps, apple maps, RwGPS, etc, which just keep getting better and better and better at zero cost.

imagine how much google spends on r+d for maps compared to garmin.

however, if you’re a very heavy map/screen user, you may find battery life limited to 6 hours or so.
 

ava1ar

Active Member
Region
USA
City
Leonia, NJ
I usually plan my longer rides and build routes in Komoot, which usually does descent job in selecting bike-friendly roads. Komoot integrates with Bosch, so I have all my routes on sync up on my Nyon and use it for turn-by-turn navigation over the route.
For ad-hoc cases I prefer something like Google Maps navigation using smartphone mounted on my handlebar.
 

Mr. Coffee

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
A Demented Corner of the North Cascades
I use a Garmin Edge for data collection and for puzzling out my location in emergencies.

For turn-by-turn navigation and route planning I prefer Ride With GPS. I also take a couple of small Goal Zero power packs with me so I have enough battery life, even in airplane mode navigation really eats the battery.

If I just want to know, "How far to X?" Google Maps with the cycling option turned on is easiest.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
I use RideWithGPS for route planning only. Wahoo does everything else for me. But I ride a Specialized.
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
@Jim1348, Get a sense of direction and you won't need this useless toy distraction. I was once in a Vegas parking lot and the taxi driver got lost by using GPS. He had no idea how to get out of a parking lot and go six blocks South. He didn't know which way was what. No situational awareness. That guy couldn't find his own butt using both hands. The Polynesians could navigate to Rapanui and Hawaii without things that go beep because they were aware. Explorers. Not order takers. Do you want to give up your autonomy and privacy to become dependent and beholden?
 

Mr. Coffee

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
A Demented Corner of the North Cascades
@Jim1348, Get a sense of direction and you won't need this useless toy distraction. I was once in a Vegas parking lot and the taxi driver got lost by using GPS. He had no idea how to get out of a parking lot and go six blocks South. He didn't know which way was what. No situational awareness. That guy couldn't find his own butt using both hands. The Polynesians could navigate to Rapanui and Hawaii without things that go beep because they were aware. Explorers. Not order takers. Do you want to give up your autonomy and privacy to become dependent and beholden?
That stuff about the Polynesians sounds great until you start listening to stories about their discoveries and how many of them were caused by people being blown off course or making pretty major navigational errors. One has to wonder how many of their people just disappeared into the void.

GPS is a useful tool and when used properly makes it possible to puzzle out your location and get un-lost in situations that would have freaked Daniel Boone out. In particular in flat or nearly flat terrain with no visible reference points GPS is pretty darned handy.

And even expert navigators with high situational awareness sometimes get terribly lost. To quote Daniel Boone, "I ain't never been lost, but I've been a mite confused for a couple of days."
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
GPS is a useful tool and when used properly makes it possible to puzzle out your location and get un-lost in situations that would have freaked Daniel Boone out. In particular in flat or nearly flat terrain with no visible reference points GPS is pretty darned handy.
The GPS is especially useful when riding in the places you've never been to. How many times I was asked for directions by helpless hikers perusing their paper maps!
 

Mr. Coffee

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
A Demented Corner of the North Cascades
The GPS is especially useful when riding in the places you've never been to. How many times I was asked for directions by helpless hikers perusing their paper maps!
I've found that using paper maps, a compass, and an altimeter the skilled navigator can usually figure out their location, sometimes with astonishing precision and ease. Again emphasis on the "skilled" and the "usually".

One time I camped next to a brushy trail right where it crossed a broad river at a ford. The water level was down quite a ways so there were wide and inviting sandbars to walk on. So after dinner in the early evening I went for a little stroll. On the way back in the dark I could not find where the trail was or my campsite. So I spent the better part of two hours in the dark looking for my campsite in an area that was less than 500 feet long. The area adjacent to the riverbed was head-high salmonberries that appeared mostly impassable, and it was impossible to figure out where the trail had been. I finally caught a glint of reflected light (that turned out to be a guy line for the tent) and figured my way back. So that after-dinner walk almost turned into a Jack London story.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
I've found that using paper maps, a compass, and an altimeter the skilled navigator can usually figure out their location, sometimes with astonishing precision and ease. Again emphasis on the "skilled" and the "usually".
We all were using paper maps in the past :) There is no time to study them while riding an e-bike!

On one of my trips, I was caught with the flat e-bike battery by a torrential rain. It was in a deep forest, and my ride was stopped by a railroad. If not the GPS navigation in my phone, I wouldn't have been able to find a small tunnel under the railway embankment... I'm sure it was not present in any paper map, and the railroad was not passable otherwise!
 

Nvreloader

Active Member
Region
USA
My "Go to" GPS is the 60cxs,
I have mounts made for the Ebike and ATV's and 4x4 PU's along with an external antenna, for the best location possible. With the switchable SD cards it seems to work and cover anywhere I have been so far in the Western US states of OR-CA-NV- ID- Colo-Montana etc.

Provides very accurate detailed information on just about everything I want.
It is getting OLD had it since late 70's and been VERY reliable bouncing thru all the above states, drowned with wet weather, hot 100* heat, below 0* and everything in between, and it also works with the Ebike battery system.
When it dies I'll get a Garmin,

GPSMAP® 66i​

Better than the 60 cxs with updated spec's etc .............
YMMV,
Tia,
Don
 

Sparky731

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
So many options!
AllTrails is my app for hiking and works equally well for biking.
Google maps works adequately, add my iPhone’s compass, and if need be, an altimeter app just for fun to check how high I am.
Then there is also the sun and stars if I am really lost. Or, just call my wife to come and get me.
 

Djangodog

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Claremont, NH
I have and use a Garmin 830 Edge. It works with my Garmin Varia to alert me to traffic coming from behind. It also works very well as a cycling computer and training tool.

Mine is paired with my phone, making it easy to review my ride, including ascension. It shows my route and vertical profile along with lots of data.

One of the nice features is that I can go back to any saved ride and save that as a route to be ridden again using the Garmin’s navigation. You can also map out a route using the Garmin Connect app and send it to the Edge.

There are many more features, but these tend to be what I use the most. In my opinion, it’s a great tool if you can justify the expense. I’ve had mine for three years and it has been with me for many miles. It moves easily from mountain to road to eBike.

Mine is mounted to a Garmin Out Front Mount with a built in GoPro mount underneath. I made an adapter for the Yamaha headlight to hang in the GoPro mount, (some lights can mount to the Garmin mount without an adapter). I have no complaints and if it ever fails, I will buy another.

396684C4-4CE1-4877-8B3E-CAF9FF56E69A.jpeg
 
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Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
Nice gear, Django! A Redshift, some Innerbarends (what make?), a Garmin Edge...
 

JES2020

Well-Known Member
Region
Other
I see that Garmin offers Cycle Map North America.

How helpful are those compared to Garmin City Navigator North America?
I have the Etrex HCX, which is old, but I was still able to download the bike maps, which is very useful. I found many local bike trails that I had no idea existed.
For $40 it is well worth it, not even considering the trip planing features.
 

DaveMatthews

Well-Known Member
I started using my phone with Strava, but am currently using a Garmin Edge 530 with remote to switch between screens.
Were I to do it again I'd go touch screen 830 etc.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
As I am riding all year long (often in thick gloves), the Wahoo ELEMNT Roam was a natural choice for me. The device is equipped with large & solid buttons; and the entire configuration is done on a smartphone. This makes the device complete, and it requires no remote.

Garmin Edge is certainly better on anything related to climbing. When my brother bought the 530 (per recommendation of Dave here), he was of course addicted to the thing. We both were on a mountain vacation trip that involved many climbs. Jacek was talking about what was awaiting us the whole time, which actually was making me sick :D Like, "There will be six climbs on the route, the worst of which being... elevation gain... grade..." etc. We were just climbing the worst of the ascents on the day, and he gladly informed me how many kilometres, stages between the grade change... And he was riding in the front. Whenever a grade change was ahead, he was raising a hand or both of them to show the awaiting grade with his fingers. Actually, he had not enough fingers to show an eleven degree grade climb... :D

Were I to buy a GPS computer today, it would be a Wahoo ELEMNT Bolt v2. USB-C charging, far more memory, better screen colours, elevation included in the maps: all the things the Roam is missing!
 

Djangodog

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Claremont, NH
Nice gear, Django! A Redshift, some Innerbarends (what make?), a Garmin Edge...
Thanks. The inner bar ends are an old set of Specialized S-Works Carbon bar ends that I relocated. I carefully removed the graphics and polished them. They provide some nice, alternative hand positions. I use them a lot, especially when climbing. These came off of my Stumpjumper. The Redshift stem is a worthwhile upgrade and the bars are Salsa Deluxe Bend, also a nice upgrade, at least to me. The Garmin is an Edge 830.
 
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