E-bikes under fire as fatalities climb in NYC

Ravi Kempaiah

Well-Known Member
Region
Canada
City
Halifax
As the heading mentions, throttle-operated E-bikes and reckless E-bike riders will ruin it for everyone else. This news article popped up on my news feed.


Without proper riding infrastructure within the cities, both the rider and the general public are always at risk.
As more and more cases pile up, the hammer will drop and this will affect the responsible riders in a negative way.
 

reed scott

Well-Known Member
Hmmm...if you just read the article sounds like a big problem but...
233% increase, what is the increase in ebike riders?
8 fatalities, how many acoustic fatalities in NYC per year?

Seems to me a lot of stats with no real info.
It is written from an anti-ebike slant. And as you point out, surely many people are run over by regular bike riders but that is not reported. I'm sure that many MORE people are injured on or by regular bikes than involving ebikes. But that would not suit the agenda of the publisher of this article.
 

Ravi Kempaiah

Well-Known Member
Region
Canada
City
Halifax
Hmmm...if you just read the article sounds like a big problem but...
233% increase, what is the increase in ebike riders?
8 fatalities, how many acoustic fatalities in NYC per year?

I am not sure if you read the entire article!
The fatalities are not because some E-biker got into an accident and died. It is because an over-speeding electric scooter rider crashed into pedestrians at 30mph and the pedestrian died!

On an acoustic bike, to reach 30mph, that too in NYC cities, is quite hard. Even if a rider reaches 30mph on an acoustic bike, the rider must be quite fit and seasoned to be able to do that.
High-powered scooters, on the other hand, empower irresponsible riders to be reckless and that's a problem for everyone. If I had a small toddler, I would be super hesitant to be anywhere those scooters and bikes. To quote directly from the article:

“You don't hear them,” he said. “They have the momentum of a motorcycle. I have some sympathy for people who use these to survive … But they go faster than the fastest cyclist … They go faster than some cars.”

"Queens real estate broker Kelly Killian was walking in Astoria on May 28 when she was struck by a deliveryman riding an e-bike around 8:30 p.m., police said. The 54-year-old woman was cut down at the corner of 21st Avenue and 31st Street, just around the block from where she lived, the Astoria Post reported. She later died from her injuries."
 

reed scott

Well-Known Member
I am not sure if you read the entire article!
The fatalities are not because some E-biker got into an accident and died. It is because an over-speeding electric scooter rider crashed into pedestrians at 30mph and the pedestrian died!

On an acoustic bike, to reach 30mph, that too in NYC cities, is quite hard. Even if a rider reaches 30mph on an acoustic bike, the rider must be quite fit and seasoned to be able to do that.
High-powered scooters, on the other hand, empower irresponsible riders to be reckless and that's a problem for everyone. If I had a small toddler, I would be super hesitant to be anywhere those scooters and bikes. To quote directly from the article:

“You don't hear them,” he said. “They have the momentum of a motorcycle. I have some sympathy for people who use these to survive … But they go faster than the fastest cyclist … They go faster than some cars.”

"Queens real estate broker Kelly Killian was walking in Astoria on May 28 when she was struck by a deliveryman riding an e-bike around 8:30 p.m., police said. The 54-year-old woman was cut down at the corner of 21st Avenue and 31st Street, just around the block from where she lived, the Astoria Post reported. She later died from her injuries."
How do they know how fast these evil ebikes were actually going when they hit someone? I assure you I could do real damage to a human body at 20mph on a regular bike if I plowed into them and I would have been even quieter doing it. I still maintain they have purposely left out statistics of people injured on or by regular bikes very much on purpose.
 
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Gionnirocket

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Y. O.
As the heading mentions, throttle-operated E-bikes and reckless E-bike riders will ruin it for everyone else. This news article popped up on my news feed.


Without proper riding infrastructure within the cities, both the rider and the general public are always at risk.
As more and more cases pile up, the hammer will drop and this will affect the responsible riders in a negative way.
I'm going with the gun argument.
eBikes don't hurt people.... People hurt people.
 

retiredNH

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
After reading all too many posts on this board by people who like to ride fast, some even always in turbo, I don't think the NYP is that far off base. The unfortunate fact is that a pretty big subset of ebike riders have them for the speed. Even class 1 at full speed would be like a missile in a crowded city like NYC. So what's so bad about getting ebikes off the bike lanes in NYC?

For the record, I live, and ride, in a rural area. No bike paths. No bike lanes. No pedestrians. Even so, I only use my motor for hill climbing, and never use power at speeds above about 10 MPH, but then, I ride to enjoy the ride and the view.
 

reed scott

Well-Known Member
After reading all too many posts on this board by people who like to ride fast, some even always in turbo, I don't think the NYP is that far off base. The unfortunate fact is that a pretty big subset of ebike riders have them for the speed. Even class 1 at full speed would be like a missile in a crowded city like NYC. So what's so bad about getting ebikes off the bike lanes in NYC?

For the record, I live, and ride, in a rural area. No bike paths. No bike lanes. No pedestrians. Even so, I only use my motor for hill climbing, and never use power at speeds above about 10 MPH, but then, I ride to enjoy the ride and the view.
Because there is no honest rationale to punishing all ebike riders due to the execrable actions of the few. Just enforce the law. Bad riders should get painful fines.
 

Gionnirocket

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Y. O.
After reading all too many posts on this board by people who like to ride fast, some even always in turbo, I don't think the NYP is that far off base. The unfortunate fact is that a pretty big subset of ebike riders have them for the speed. Even class 1 at full speed would be like a missile in a crowded city like NYC. So what's so bad about getting ebikes off the bike lanes in NYC?

For the record, I live, and ride, in a rural area. No bike paths. No bike lanes. No pedestrians. Even so, I only use my motor for hill climbing, and never use power at speeds above about 10 MPH, but then, I ride to enjoy the ride and the view.
Speed can be exhilarating, especially when you feel it even if only partially under your own power. But when and where you go for it is the important part.
I own a sports car and never weave in and out of traffic. But if I'm on an open stretch and the right song comes over the speakers.. I'm running with the devil. I do the same with my eBike. I've done 30mph+ many times, but on an empty path with plenty of forward visibility.
 

tomdutchie

Member
Region
Europe
City
Utrecht, Netherlands
Just reading the article: so the NY law saying 25mph is the maximum speed for an e-bike?
From a European point of view that's crazy fast, that's moped speed and here - in cities - they are directed to the car lane.
An e-bike is a bike with electric help to get you toward normal bike speed (max. in E.U. 15-16mph/25kmh).
One of the popular bikes (vanMoof) now getting into trouble it is possible going to 20mph, in "us settings" [software], and the fact the boost/throttle is also not permitted.
[goes against the definition of helping: it's taking over]. And they pushing the update to the bikes.
But what I am reading in the comments here is that people going faster than law permits? How? [they (re)build their own bikes, or it's not illegal to sell this kind of bikes?]
Problem with the speed of bikes, it's harder to enforce: no licence plate, and harder to follow. That's why enforcing should also be done at the moment of buying.
Maybe I'm getting old, don't understand the need for speed (on public roads) but I'm glad that there is not so much difference in speed on bike-infra here [different/unexpected speed->accident]
 

Ebiker01

Well-Known Member
This has been an issue in Nyc forever. They banned them for a while then when CITIbike made the rental ebikes possible they change the law just for them and legalized ebikes and now LOTS people in Nyc WFH (work from home) , order online , click on delivery ASAP and Expect the ebiks to go slow, doesn't make sense... either a cold dinner from a slow E bike or a hot dinner from a fast E bike. Or no dinner delivered , pick it up.

Keep In mind that in NYC we're talking about big buildings so the order has to go to the building sec., could be a looooong elevator ride and going past the security desk is more time so they are always under pressure, pressure to make the trip fast.

The people who complain about fast restaurant ebikes should quit asking for take out and walk or jog to get their food...They r all mostly fat anyways( >60 %) , a little exercise will save them.
Lazy , rude , self entitled Ny'ers. Better yet, learn to cook NYC !

Those ebikes used for food delivery and the Revel moto scooters are mostly to blame, but WHY r the drivers going fast ?
The food is geting cold....well
we got the bottom of the issues.
If they ban them , the grubhub orders will be postponed unless Ny'ers will go and pick it up.


Does anyone know how they do this in Eu or Canada ? I mean , I know they also have food delivery with the ebikes but I'm saying do they also have lots of accidents ?


It will be a shame to illegalize the ebikes in Ny just because of the laziness of the take out crowd who wants it fast(we all know that we have an option in the delivery apps to choose our delivery and I'm sure most ppl.choose ASAP). The same crowd then when in the street is asking for civility and for the food ebikes to go slow...doesn't make sense.

Fyi, when i order , i always go and pick it up . Or just make a delicious red quinoa with farm raised sauteed goat😋 that no rest . offers.

As far as the Revel scooters, I don't think that those are mentioned in the article or referred to but some of the riders may not have the experience to use those.
 

Ebiker01

Well-Known Member
don't understand the need for speed
It has to do with large crowds in Nyc still working from home and ordering food for ASAP delivery. That results in massive orders for the delivery peiple who are then pressured to deliver them yesterday or @ warp speed.

Nypost as a shitty click bait toilet paper doesn't really put any effort into investigating the causes and ramifications of what and why exactly happened.
 

BlackHand

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Western WA
I'm not saying it's not a problem, but after looking at the data from crashmapper it seems that banning SUVs from car lanes would be far more beneficial than banning e-bikes from bike lanes:

YTD 2021
SUVs were involved in 6884 crashes with 29 fatalities and 9864 injuries. Those numbers about double if you add in cars.

motorcycles & mopeds/e-bikes & scooters/other & unspecified COMBINED have been involved in 1187 crashes with 26 fatalities and 1290 injuries

cyclists account for 1377 crashes with 1 fatality and 1437 injuries (110 injuries to pedestrians or motorists, the rest to the cyclists)
 

tomjasz

Well-Known Member
Google “stealth ebike” then check out the other DIY folks putting 35mph plus motors on $250 walfart bikes . I’m glad I’m satisfied with 15-20MPH max. The Shite will hit the fan. Regs coming in all our back yards. OSHA would never have survived without the bad decisions workers and employers made.

it has pedals…


E6508A28-0C8E-4D94-AB6C-35647857D7B6.png
 

tomdutchie

Member
Region
Europe
City
Utrecht, Netherlands
It has to do with large crowds in Nyc still working from home and ordering food for ASAP delivery. That results in massive orders for the delivery peiple who are then pressured to deliver them yesterday or @ warp speed.

Nypost as a shitty click bait toilet paper doesn't really put any effort into investigating the causes and ramifications of what and why exactly happened.
Seems like a local (NY) thing then? Here (Netherlands/Europe) also people want their stuff delivered warm, on time and at low cost

Food is done by [cargo] bike/e-bike/moped and on rare occasions even by car: depending on order, traffic and distance. Not sure the inhabitants of NY are more inpatient than all the other hungry people, but if looking at time from order->doorstep doesn't it make more sense to look at prep. time of the food itself? Except for the big fast-food chains, the majority of time goes into making, according to the apps.

Timewise it would not make a (notable) difference if all traffic (>16mph) would be banned from the (overcrowded) cycle path, and would overall increase appreciation of (e)bikes as a safe way to get around in the city I think?

Maybe also have to look at rider side: those delivery people are not really well-paid, mostly paid by delivery instead of time: so the risk of fluctuating demand is put on them, where it may be better to put in on the company?
The (unhealthy) drive to go beyond traffic rules is great if your livelihood depending on the extra deliveries, and if not stopped by the company you work for and the lack of law-enforcing.