Elektrek Ebike of the Year: HyperScorpion

Mike TowpathTraveler

Well-Known Member
At 100 lbs, the pedals there are for show only. This is not an ebike, it is a moped, not much different in execution then my old and long gone 1979 AMF Roadmaster Moped. Actually, I could only dream of the kind of torque, power and speed that McCullouch 1hp powered 2 stroke engine could put out that the Juiced moped does today.
 

Bruce Arnold

Well-Known Member
At 100 lbs, the pedals there are for show only. This is not an ebike, it is a moped, not much different in execution then my old and long gone 1979 AMF Roadmaster Moped. Actually, I could only dream of the kind of torque, power and speed that McCullouch 1hp powered 2 stroke engine could put out that the Juiced moped does today.
Are you speaking from experience? Do you own one?

I do. I pedal all the time. The pedals are not for show. I rarely use the throttle. I ride it the same as I did my old CCS -- pedaling most of the time, using throttle occasionally for specific purposes. (Just posted a thread on using the throttle on the Juiced Bikes subforum.)

Yeah, I bet a lot of people use it as an electric moped. But you could do the same thing with any ebike that has a throttle, which covers a lot of models.

That's the big argument some know-it-alls use against having a throttle at all -- "you might as well get a moped."

I will say that if you are over 5'8", you'll want the Tall Seat accessory, to make pedaling more efficient. But from all the way back on the seat, riding it like a pedal-forward bike, it was not uncomfortable. If the Tall Seat didn't exist, I'd still like this bike. Just not as much. I'm 5'10", and the ergos work just fine for me.

I ride just as much (or more) for exercise as for fun and utility. The HyperScorpion fits the bill just as well as the CCS did. Since it's a step-through, and the arthritis in my knees was making it hard to get on and off the CCS, this bike is a god-send.

I don't mind reality-based criticisms. For instance, I don't like the way the torque sensor is configured on the HS. Nowhere near as good as it was on the CCS. This is a real disappointment to me, because I loved how well the torque-cadence combination worked on the CCS. It's ignorant criticisms that ruffle my feathers.

Get a couple hundred miles on one and see what you think. Buy the Tall Seat if you need it (my wife doesn't, at 5'6".) If you're not a convert, you'll have no trouble selling it.
 

mogulskier

Active Member
Meh. Not my style. I am more of an e-mtb type biker.

That said, any ebike that is going 33mph on throttle alone and encourages throttle over pedaling, I don't consider this an ebike at all. I saw one while waiting a stoplight (in a car) and for the first time, I saw an ebike moving without pedaling. I just get used to seeing bikes being pedaled so it was weird to see it. I am not anti-throttle and do not buy the argument that having one automatically makes it a moped, no.

But this Juice HS does seem to make the focus and marketing on throttle top speeds.
 

Mike TowpathTraveler

Well-Known Member
Bruce, all the best with your Juiced. If it works for ya, that is the only bottom line that counts. With so much invested in my own Haibike, one is enough!

I'd be curious as to how long your bicycle trips are on this bike, what your average speeds work out to be, average mileage gained from a fully charged battery.

Mind you, it looks neat. But a 30 mph possible top end speed is just the ticket here in socialist NJ to require all electric powered ebikes to be required to buy some kind of registration and licensing fees; this after recently winning state approval to allow Class One ebikes on state park lands and trails.

The below is not my own old moped, but you can see the family connection.....

amf roadmaster moped.jpg


I kinda miss that old moped. Riding without the gas motor assist, though, makes one ensure the motor stayed in tip top condition.

Ride on and have fun!
 

sc00ter

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Norfolk, VA
I came so close to pulling the trigger and getting a Hyper Scorpion over the holiday but I still like my slower RadRunner1. Yes, the HS will draw more attention from law enforcement because it looks like a moped and is much faster than my 'Runner. But so far the HS is my upgrade dream. I consider it a ebike and not a emoped. And about mopeds, I LOVE them but no longer own one. I had a Baretta moped at 14 years old and finally sold it when the stater plate cracked the case when I was 34! It did 45mph rock solid. Modded with great care. Great 'ped and like you with your Roadmaster, I do miss it. I've also owned several 50cc motor scooters. Mostly Yamaha Zuma's. Great fun.
 

ElevenAD

Well-Known Member
man these were a steal for a while around 2 grand, i tried to get some friends to bite but nothing, i think when they are on sale they are very good value! i would have to get the seat riser for sure! The suspension, new motor,battery and Mag wheels are all big selling points for me!
 

Timpo

Well-Known Member
Meh. Not my style. I am more of an e-mtb type biker.

That said, any ebike that is going 33mph on throttle alone and encourages throttle over pedaling, I don't consider this an ebike at all. I saw one while waiting a stoplight (in a car) and for the first time, I saw an ebike moving without pedaling. I just get used to seeing bikes being pedaled so it was weird to see it. I am not anti-throttle and do not buy the argument that having one automatically makes it a moped, no.

But this Juice HS does seem to make the focus and marketing on throttle top speeds.
yeah I'm not sure if this is an ebike.

It doesn't look like a bicycle.

It's a lot closer to Honda Super Cub.
 

Bruce Arnold

Well-Known Member
I'd be curious as to how long your bicycle trips are on this bike, what your average speeds work out to be, average mileage gained from a fully charged battery.
The longest ride I've taken on this bike so far (I've had it for about two months) is 20 miles. Average speed on that ride was 15.32 mph. That's a typical speed for Bonnie and I on recreational rides. Faster in the summer, to get more wind chill. The battery went down from 58.0 V to 51.7 V. (There's a quick drop-off from max voltage to around 55 V -- like in the first mile or so -- and then it really flattens out for a long time.) Average miles gained from a full battery: Our daily ride is just under 10 miles. I go 3 days between charging. The bike is down around 45% state of charge at that point, from a max of 95%. I've gone lower than that a couple of times on longer rides. Voltage drops off more quickly towards the end. So 45-95% is nominally 50% capacity, suggesting that you'd get 60 miles (with my weight, on my terrain, at X temperature, etc.), but really it would be more like 55. Someday I'll take it all the way down to 20% and see what the total miles on that particular charge cycle was.
 

Bruce Arnold

Well-Known Member
Yes, the HS will draw more attention from law enforcement because it looks like a moped and is much faster than my 'Runner.
I haven't had any attention from law enforcement yet. I live in a town of around 25,000. I wave, they wave. I really don't know if it's because I pedal pretty much all the time. Maybe if I was jetting around at max speed on throttle-only they'd look closer. But so far, no hassle. It really doesn't look much like the Vespa-style mopeds that are so common hereabouts. (We call them "drunk cycles", because so many people riding them have lost their license due to multiple DUIs and this is their popular alternative.)

If I'm forced to register it, I will. I don't see it happening, though, if the last two months are any indication. 5 months, if you count when I was riding a Scorpion, before I got the HS.
 

Bruce Arnold

Well-Known Member
It's a lot closer to Honda Super Cub.
Having grown up on Super Cubs, it doesn't look like one to me. Superficial similarities, I guess. Micah Toll just did a review on Electrek of an electric scooter (no pedals) that really does look a lot like a Super Cub.

 

Timpo

Well-Known Member
Having grown up on Super Cubs, it doesn't look like one to me. Superficial similarities, I guess. Micah Toll just did a review on Electrek of an electric scooter (no pedals) that really does look a lot like a Super Cub.

Yeah I just watched that.

Super Cub was an example, I was saying that it did look like a bike in the class of Super Cub.

When I look at Hyper Scorpion, it does not look like a bicycle to me.

I have actually seen a Rize that looked exactly like Scorpion.
It was parked on bike rack, and other people were saying how it didn't even look like a bicycle and wondering if it was legal.

Anyways, I know Scrambler and Moped type ebikes have been gaining popularity, but it's not for me.
I feel like I'd be catching too much unwanted attention.

But maybe if there are tons of moped ebikes, it will become normal and people won't notice it anymore.
 

Bruce Arnold

Well-Known Member
Yeah I just watched that.

Super Cub was an example, I was saying that it did look like a bike in the class of Super Cub.

When I look at Hyper Scorpion, it does not look like a bicycle to me.

I have actually seen a Rize that looked exactly like Scorpion.
It was parked on bike rack, and other people were saying how it didn't even look like a bicycle and wondering if it was legal.

Anyways, I know Scrambler and Moped type ebikes have been gaining popularity, but it's not for me.
I feel like I'd be catching too much unwanted attention.

But maybe if there are tons of moped ebikes, it will become normal and people won't notice it anymore.
Well, people always need time to get used to something new. This kind of moped-style ebike (and Tora is upfront about evoking a 70s moped vibe when designing this bike) was nowhere to be seen when I started my ebike journey back in 2013. A couple of years from now, they will be ubiquitous and no one will think of them as strange or out-of-the-ordinary. Just another style among many. Remember when mountain bikes were new and exciting and different? Fat bikes? Bikes so light you could lift them with one finger? I do. None of that raises any eyebrows any more.

I have held off on saying this, because some might take it personally, but what the heck. The deal is that a lot of folks who simply don't like the Scorpion style -- a legitimate preference -- are looking for reasons why it is wrong, instead of just something they wouldn't buy. I've never seen a trike I really liked, but I get their appeal and utility for many, many cyclists, and don't consider my tastes to be normative.

This is exactly the way a lot of pedal cyclists view all ebikes. Every one of them, regardless of type. And we're all certain that they are just being narrow-minded. Verbum sap.
 

Timpo

Well-Known Member
Well, people always need time to get used to something new. This kind of moped-style ebike (and Tora is upfront about evoking a 70s moped vibe when designing this bike) was nowhere to be seen when I started my ebike journey back in 2013. A couple of years from now, they will be ubiquitous and no one will think of them as strange or out-of-the-ordinary. Just another style among many. Remember when mountain bikes were new and exciting and different? Fat bikes? Bikes so light you could lift them with one finger? I do. None of that raises any eyebrows any more.

I have held off on saying this, because some might take it personally, but what the heck. The deal is that a lot of folks who simply don't like the Scorpion style -- a legitimate preference -- are looking for reasons why it is wrong, instead of just something they wouldn't buy. I've never seen a trike I really liked, but I get their appeal and utility for many, many cyclists, and don't consider my tastes to be normative.

This is exactly the way a lot of pedal cyclists view all ebikes. Every one of them, regardless of type. And we're all certain that they are just being narrow-minded. Verbum sap.
No, I do not remember when MTB first came out. 1970s would be decades before I was born, so I guess I'm too young for that, but whatever.

"Getting used to" or "normative" isn't the sole problem of HyperScorpion.
Other bicycles can be out of norm, and people will still see it as bicycle.

Those scrambler/moped ebikes are way too much of motorcycle looking. Thus, catching unwanted attention.
You could argue that people aren't getting used to, or maybe their norm isn't quite there, but the fact is that, to many people's eyes, they look like motorcycles.

Let's talk about norm.
Japanese ebikes, so called "mamachari" style ebikes are very rare in the US.
Therefore, the Japanese style ebikes are out of the US norm.

However, if people in the US see Japanese ebikes for the first time, (Suzuki, Yamaha, Panasonic, Bridgestone, etc) do you think they would go like "Is this even legal??", "this look too much like a motorcycle", "it doesn't look like a bicycle"

Because HyperScorpion will have that problem.
 

Bruce Arnold

Well-Known Member
No, I do not remember when MTB first came out. 1970s would be decades before I was born, so I guess I'm too young for that, but whatever.

"Getting used to" or "normative" isn't the sole problem of HyperScorpion.
Other bicycles can be out of norm, and people will still see it as bicycle.

Those scrambler/moped ebikes are way too much of motorcycle looking. Thus, catching unwanted attention.
You could argue that people aren't getting used to, or maybe their norm isn't quite there, but the fact is that, to many people's eyes, they look like motorcycles.

Let's talk about norm.
Japanese ebikes, so called "mamachari" style ebikes are very rare in the US.
Therefore, the Japanese style ebikes are out of the US norm.

However, if people in the US see Japanese ebikes for the first time, (Suzuki, Yamaha, Panasonic, Bridgestone, etc) do you think they would go like "Is this even legal??", "this look too much like a motorcycle", "it doesn't look like a bicycle"

Because HyperScorpion will have that problem.
So you believe. But you state it as actual fact. That's the part that I'm disagreeing with. State your preference all you want. State your opinion all you want. But call it that.

Will you have the honesty to say "I was wrong" if, a couple of years down the line, moped-style bikes are accepted as just another ebike and they have caused zero legal hassles?
 

Timpo

Well-Known Member
So you believe. But you state it as actual fact. That's the part that I'm disagreeing with. State your preference all you want. State your opinion all you want. But call it that.

Will you have the honesty to say "I was wrong" if, a couple of years down the line, moped-style bikes are accepted as just another ebike and they have caused zero legal hassles?
??? 🤨 okay???
I found that you state things as actual fact too.
And I am not sure which part of my comment was stated as actual fact.

You always say how Juiced have sold thousands of bikes and people who have been having problems with their bikes are "whining" and talk about them as if they were statistical outliers.

As for moped style ebikes, I stated that it might become normal and people won't notice it anymore.
So obviously I believe there's a good chance that moped ebikes will a norm.
For example, I didn't think that fat bike swill be this popular.
 
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Mike TowpathTraveler

Well-Known Member
Please, please, people. We are all enthusiasts of ebiking or we would not be here. Please, don't make this into a flame war back and forth. The OP is a perfectly reasonable fellow from everything I have read from his posts here on EBR. So too is everyone else here. I want to believe I am as reasonable as well.

I know how the politics of my home state operates. I know that only recently in the past year or so, my Haibike Full FatSix was finally allowed to be considered a legal bicycle, after some long fought legislation and lobbying by ebike friendly people. And even at that, there are folks who will deny me my right as a bicyclist, to use the Full FatSix on the Penn Branch MTB trail within Wharton State Forest.....there are still miles to go before we are recognized in a legal sense.

If "blame" were to go anywhere, it should not be pointed towards Mr Arnold, who rides his Juiced in a reasonable, adult manner. Instead, that blame goes towards folks like Tora Harris, who sells these high powered bikes to anyone who comes forth with the cash. Then again, I'm going to shoot holes in my own argument here by stating that anyone with the cash can go down to their local automobile dealer and pick up a car (or motorcycle) that can get very close to topping out near 190 mph on our local highways.

It's all a matter of personal responsibility and accountability.