ew rear wheel opinions?

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
I weight 200 or so pounds my bike is a mid drive e bike its a bosch motor so not a motorcycle.the bike is 70 pounds with all my gear and I can carry upto 30 pounds of stuff. it is my commuter and i put 6000 miles a year on it. the stock wheel is having issues and my local high end bike shop trued it up and thinks it will always have issues. I want them to build it but it may be 3 weeks and they are out of the rims. not sure what parts they are using though they had a dt swiss rim and spokes then a dt swiss hub so I can change the end caps to a through axle when I get a new bike. the bike is 700 with a 135 spacing and a qr right now. 10 speed shimano. what I dont know is what rim width I need I run 300x38 tire. a different place to go would not be a problem.
https://www.prowheelbuilder.com/
  • Drillings​

    32 Rim - Recommended | Hub - Recommended
  • Rim​

    DT SWISS EX 471 29IN BLACK DISC BRAKE RIM $114.00
    700c / 29er
    Tubeless Tape for 1 wheel Installed NO Valve (works with tubes as well) (Not available as Rim Only) + $6.00
  • Hub​

    DT SWISS 350 REAR BLACK CENTERLOCK DISC HUB $221.00
    Spoke Type: J Bend
    QR Rear 10x135mm (Does Not Include Lockring)
    *Shimano HG/SRAM 8,9 or 10spd (Dyna-sys Mountain Bike 11 spd compatible)
    *No Bearing Upgrade
    Shimano Centerlock Lockring (works with all axle types) + $13.00
    *Stock 18 Point Engagment 20 Degrees
  • Spokes​

    DT SWISS COMPETITION 14|15|14 GAUGE BLACK SPOKES $1.58 Recommended
  • Lacing Pattern​

    Three Cross Recommended
  • Nipples​

    DT SWISS BLACK 14G 12MM BRASS NIPPLE $0.20 Recommended
  • Weight​

    1016.16 grams
  • Price​

    $410.96
 

kmccune

Well-Known Member
I understand "Mags" are heavier, aren't they stronger than spoked rims and since weight is not an issue with you can you find a 29 incher?
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
I understand "Mags" are heavier, aren't they stronger than spoked rims and since weight is not an issue with you can you find a 29 incher?
no because they have no flex. its why you only see them on really cheap bikes or really high end bikes for aero. spokes are stronger.
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
here is the wheel I got my bike is so stable now that wheel has been causing issues long before it showed therm.
IMG_2613.jpeg
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
because it has flex and it is under tension. I am sure if the wheel was made out of the right material it would be strong. but it would have other problems like weight and such. but I am sure if you want to research if you will find more. but its pretty simple you only see mag wheels on cheap bikes. and on them they may be better. but a wheel built spoke wheel will outlast it. Plus those wheels come with crappy hubs and parts.
 

kmccune

Well-Known Member
(old thread alert) so for the money and because I do not "BMX" or serious MTB, alloy wheels are better -thanks, for the serious downhill champ or Alaskan road Warrior spokes are better even at the risk of repair or replacing bad spokes, ease of tubeless conversion cannot hurt on the Alloys either.
I will be totally destroyed by the "spoke mafia" so bring it on.
 

AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
I'm curious why a heavily loaded wheel and hub like this wasn't spec'd out with 36 spokes rather than 32?
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
I'm curious why a heavily loaded wheel and hub like this wasn't spec'd out with 36 spokes rather than 32?
because a. it is or was really hard to get 36 spoke parts and 2 its to needed. a very well built 32 spoke wheel is plenty strong. with triple butted spokes and such it is a very strong wheel. the higher end components don't come in 36 for a lot of the hubs and rims. it costs less to make a cheaper 36 spoke wheel then a well built 32 spoke wheel.
 

AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
because a. it is or was really hard to get 36 spoke parts and 2 its to needed. a very well built 32 spoke wheel is plenty strong. with triple butted spokes and such it is a very strong wheel. the higher end components don't come in 36 for a lot of the hubs and rims. it costs less to make a cheaper 36 spoke wheel then a well built 32 spoke wheel.
You sir, are tripping over your (my way is best) ignorance again. Recently having been down this (rather expensive) road I can say with a certain amount of conviction that the same hub you used (or a very similar one by the same manf.) is available in a 36h, and there are very high quality 36h rims available that come standard with reinforced spoke holes that virtually guarantee no issues if properly assembled. Both would be able to use the same spokes you used. The ONLY half decent arguments for not using either in your case might be due to the difference in the weight of the 36 spokes vs. 32 (please don't even go there for a bike like we're talking about), and possibly supply issues. When I ordered the parts for the build I did in December, they were available. Now, who knows? I went 36h to hold the power of my Bafang Ultra powered bike (the same as it was equipped when new), as well as the fact my weight means my bike is heavily loaded.
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
well I only went to two master wheel smiths to make my choices. plus 36 hole was very scarce last year. but neither one of them felt I needed 36 hole. Plus the hub choice did not come in 36 hole anyway. but I will trust the guy who has been building wheels for 20 years on this. how often have you had to true that wheel?
 
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AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
well I only went to two master wheel smiths to make my choices. plus 36 hole was very scarce last year. but neither one of them felt I needed 36 hole. Plus the hub choice did not come in 36 hole anyway. but I will trust the guy who has been building wheels for 20 years on this. how often have you had to true that wheel?
There's no reason "master wheel smiths" would/should be shy of a 36 spoke hub and wheel for heavy duty applications. If there is, I'd like to hear it. I'm not going to disagree with the concept 32h will work for your purposes. If it hadn't been for this, I wouldn't have said a thing "the higher end components don't come in 36 for a lot of the hubs and rims. it costs less to make a cheaper 36 spoke wheel then a well built 32 spoke wheel" That's not true at all, and likely misleading to those that don't know any better. If buying a new hub and rim, there's no good reason to avoid a 36h assuming you aren't in a hurry with an availability issue.

Easy to understand staying 32h if you were re-using existing components (good hubs aren't cheap!!), but clearly the hub you used is not OEM....

We're at about 300 miles since the wheel I built was installed, and it's running as true as the day I installed it. Same as the front one I built for it. The thought behind this question please?

The bike I built the wheels for was originally a fatty, but since converted to 27.5 using all new bits and pieces. MUCH happier with it since the conversion. Suits my purposes much better.
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
There's no reason "master wheel smiths" would/should be shy of a 36 spoke hub and wheel for heavy duty applications. If there is, I'd like to hear it. I'm not going to disagree with the concept 32h will work for your purposes. If it hadn't been for this, I wouldn't have said a thing "the higher end components don't come in 36 for a lot of the hubs and rims. it costs less to make a cheaper 36 spoke wheel then a well built 32 spoke wheel" That's not true at all, and likely misleading to those that don't know any better. If buying a new hub and rim, there's no good reason to avoid a 36h assuming you aren't in a hurry with an availability issue.

Easy to understand staying 32h if you were re-using existing components (good hubs aren't cheap!!), but clearly the hub you used is not OEM....

We're at about 300 miles since the wheel I built was installed, and it's running as true as the day I installed it. Same as the front one I built for it. The thought behind this question please?

The bike I built the wheels for was originally a fatty, but since converted to 27.5 using all new bits and pieces. MUCH happier with it since the conversion. Suits my purposes much better.
He and the other one never thought it was needed knowing my weight and riding. Plus 36 rims and hubs had a big shortage. this wheel will outlast my bike and I doubt it will ever need trued. There is no reason go with 36 if you don't need it it does not mean the wheel will be stronger if the wheel is built right. when I buy wheels I go the pros for advice. you make your choices I will make mine. I ride hard with a load and my wheels will be true for years. so you think yo cam Mae a wheel built 32whieel for the same cost as a cheap 36"?
 

AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
He and the other one never thought it was needed knowing my weight and riding. Plus 36 rims and hubs had a big shortage. this wheel will outlast my bike and I doubt it will ever need trued. There is no reason go with 36 if you don't need it it does not mean the wheel will be stronger if the wheel is built right. when I buy wheels I go the pros for advice. you make your choices I will make mine. I ride hard with a load and my wheels will be true for years. so you think yo cam Mae a wheel built 32whieel for the same cost as a cheap 36"?
This defies/flies in the face of any logic I've ever seen - "it does not mean the wheel will be stronger if the wheel is built right." If that were true, please explain why the 36 spoke wheels and rims are available? And maybe why the 32 holes rims and wheels are "better" than those with fewer spokes?

As far as this - "so you think yo cam Mae a wheel built 32whieel for the same cost as a cheap 36"?" - 😁 if you are asking about the cost of building a 32 spoke wheel as compared to a 36 spoke, based on what I saw while shopping for the parts to do mine, all else being equal, the difference was the price of the 4 additional spokes required for the 36 spoke hubs/rims.

I'll be the first to agree with "you have a choice, do as you wish". Where I struggle is when asked why you came up with the choice you made, you don't come up with some BS excuse and try to cover it up with more BS. -Al
 

rtp

Active Member
Region
USA
So, actually - I was looking to build my first set of wheels, and there is some weirdness out there RE: 32h vs 36h rims and components from what I saw.
Neither WTB KOM nor Raceface ARC rims, for example, are available in 36H at this point in time.

DT Swiss 350 Hybrid does come in 32H or 36H, while other DT350 hubs, even the newer Straight-pull spokes - do not.
I'm sure each builder has their own preferred components, and may say whatever in the event they don't carry or can't easily get something.

DT XM521, also a popular rim - doesn't come in 36H either. Their model names drive me insane as they're not logical that I can tell, still looking at other rims but it's still somewhat uncommon, or so it seems. DT's line of Hybrid (ebike) specific times - also doesn't seem to come in 36H at the moment..
 
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AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
So, actually - I was looking to build my first set of wheels, and there is some weirdness out there RE: 32h vs 36h rims and components from what I saw.
Neither WTB KOM nor Raceface ARC rims, for example, are available in 36H at this point in time.

DT Swiss 350 Hybrid does come in 32H or 36H, while other DT350 hubs, even the newer Straight-pull spokes - do not.
I'm sure each builder has their own preferred components, and may say whatever in the event they don't carry or can't easily get something.

Agreed, I think that's a safe bet. But that doesn't automatically mean they are "better". It's means they have experience with them, and likely a source to get them easily....

DT XM521, also a popular rim - doesn't come in 36H either. Their model names drive me insane as they're not logical that I can tell, still looking at other rims but it's still somewhat uncommon, or so it seems. DT's line of Hybrid (ebike) specific times - also doesn't seem to come in 36H at the moment..

I guess my point is/was, there should be no trouble finding 36h rims that most would agree are high quality. I narrowed those down further by considering only rims with reinforced spoke holes. That did make finding something I could use, including only those with a width suitable for use with 2.3-2.8" tires, kinda challenging. Admitted, it did take a while. Finally found one on e-bay....
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
This defies/flies in the face of any logic I've ever seen - "it does not mean the wheel will be stronger if the wheel is built right." If that were true, please explain why the 36 spoke wheels and rims are available? And maybe why the 32 holes rims and wheels are "better" than those with fewer spokes?

As far as this - "so you think yo cam Mae a wheel built 32whieel for the same cost as a cheap 36"?" - 😁 if you are asking about the cost of building a 32 spoke wheel as compared to a 36 spoke, based on what I saw while shopping for the parts to do mine, all else being equal, the difference was the price of the 4 additional spokes required for the 36 spoke hubs/rims.

I'll be the first to agree with "you have a choice, do as you wish". Where I struggle is when asked why you came up with the choice you made, you don't come up with some BS excuse and try to cover it up with more BS. -Al
I came up with my choice by talking to pros. how about you? every wheel builder I talked to said 32 is fine and plenty strong. 36 hole parts are getting less and less as they are not in demand anymore. I went with their recommendations. I told them what I needed showed them my bike and I bough the wheels. I checked out the recommendations locally too. 5 star ratings and I have a lot of places here in portland to choose from. high end shops too.
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
I guess my point is/was, there should be no trouble finding 36h rims that most would agree are high quality. I narrowed those down further by considering only rims with reinforced spoke holes. That did make finding something I could use, including only those with a width suitable for use with 2.3-2.8" tires, kinda challenging. Admitted, it did take a while. Finally found one on e-bay....
I think you forgot about the pandemic. it was almost impossible to find 36 hole parts last year I was told that by several shops. spoke count is not as important as high quality components and expert build.