Falco 7.7, Catrike Villager, Hilly Terrain

davidsantafe

New Member
I recently 'electrified' my trike with the Falco 7.7 eSytem. It has been a struggle to setup despite help from Rakesh.
In particular, when going uphill the motor will cycle in, with a loud clunk then out again several times, while I am pedaling hard, at a good cadence.
Sometimes it seems to actually brake. On occassion, just a quiet, smooth motor engagement.

When it is working properly I love the product. I would appreciate anyone's help and observations on torque settings (see attached), hills, and loud clunking sounds. Is the 'clunking' from the motor engaging normal? I really want to resolve this, and look forward to some long rides.
 

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HarryB

Member
@davidsantafe
What is your TS Raw value when not sitting on the trike?
What is your TS Raw value when sitting on the trike?
When sitting on the trike with the brakes on, what happens to this value when you apply torque to the pedal? Does it go up or down?

Does this "clunking" occur in cruise mode?
Do you have the wired +/- control module?
If so, what happens with the drive wheel off the ground and you press the throttle? With and without cruise mode enabled?
Harry
 

davidsantafe

New Member
What is your TS Raw value when not sitting on the trike? 417
What is your TS Raw value when sitting on the trike? 407
When sitting on the trike with the brakes on, what happens to this value when you apply torque to the pedal? Does it go up or down? DOWN

Does this "clunking" occur in cruise mode? YES (see below)
Do you have the wired +/- control module? WIRELESS CONSOLE with +/- switch connected

I had the motor assembled at the shop where I purchased the Trike, and have only test ridden a few times, so I was surprised at the result of this test............... the motor wheel almost fell off as the bolts were so loose, no locking washers, loctite etc.. Is 'removable' loctite a good idea

I tightened them and no more clunking. I do notice a slight hesitation going uphill as the motor engages/cycles Any thoughts ?

Thanks for your help


David
 

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HarryB

Member
@davidsantafe
I would increase the dropout offset to 10.
I would decrease the torque sensor turn on value to 3.
I would ALWAYS turn on cruise mode before every ride.
I would make sure the axle nuts are torqued to 35-40 ft lbs.
I would install the torque arms!

Good luck and enjoy. You have the best, most sophisticated DD hub edrive system available!!

Harry
 

davidsantafe

New Member
Harry
Thanks. I will try your settings as soon as I get back from this trip. Seems like my bike shop forgot the torque bars...
Re Mode what does cruise mode achieve? I have also read about turbo mode but that does not appear on the console
 

HarryB

Member
David,

Cruise mode:
Without cruise mode enabled your bike is a class 1 ebike. Meaning, it will limit the pedal assisted speed to 20mph, no throttle (although the throttle still works), must be pedaled to enable the motor assist, and motor is limited to 750 watts (1 HP). Cruise mode turns OFF the speed limit!!
The best way to demonstrate this is to power up the edrive by turning on the battery. Do not make any other changes. It boots up in the default of assist level 5 and cruise mode is OFF.
Have the drive wheel off the ground and engage the throttle. You will see the motor pulse to speed then stop then pulse to speed then stop. It will continually repeat this behavior.
Now, without doing anything else, turn on cruise mode and repeat. You should (if this feature is enabled in your edrive) notice the motor will accelerate to the current limit of assist level 5 whatever it is set to. I did this in my garage. I set level 5 all the way to the max of 40 (amps) and with cruise mode enabled I pressed and held the throttle. Not recommended. It scared the sh*t out of me! It sounded like a jet engine and must have been spinning at 80mph!!! No joke!
I do not have the console. I use the iphone app and the wired +/-. I do not know how to turn on cruise mode on the console. On the app, the 3rd screen is a big padlock. You MUST first tap the lock to lock it then tap it again to unlock cruise mode.
As I said, I never ride without turning on cruise mode. I found the cycling on/off very annoying.

Turbo mode:
I do not currently have this feature. It is being added to the next update of the app. I was told (by Rakesh) that this feature IS available currently with the console.

I cannot wait to get this feature! I'll tell you why...

By design, the edrive will begin to roll back the available assist once the internal temperature reaches 60°C. This roll back percentage will increase as the temperature rises. By the time the internal temp reaches 90°C there is very little assist available. This is to protect the motor from overheating. Therefore, turbo mode must be used judiciously! If the internal temperature reaches 115°C, the motor will be shut off completely.
Turbo mode will allow the assist to stay at the level that turbo is set to and ignore these rollbacks. Except, of course the shut down at 115°C! Therefore, turbo mode must be used judiciously!

My primary home is in SE PA. It is rolling terrain and this is not a problem, usually. However, I have a second home in southern VT. Many looooong and arduous climbs! I must carefully manage the temperature of the motor or simply stop and rest my heart and let the motor cool. Pain in the A**!

Torque bars and washers:
See this document and make sure the torque bars and arms are installed!!!!!
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1gT814K7MvOe26p0GZuJBW3yXJcC04AXWsIWqsJZEPuU/edit?usp=sharing

Harry
 
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davidsantafe

New Member
Harry,

Tried your settings. I have app and console. The app padlock is unlocked, and the console shows cruise mode, but I am still getting that small, jerky, cycling effect every 4-5 seconds when pedaling . It is almost as if the brake is kicking in while going uphill. Perhaps that or regeneration. I was thinking that because I left with the battery WH at 170 and returned after riding for about 30-45 minutes with the app showing 267WH so I appear to be charging the battery. However the app also indicates I have ridden a total of 4.5 hours for a distance of 139 miles for an average speed of 31 mph............. not true, although I like the idea

Really appreciate your input. I still don't trust the motor for a longer ride
 

HarryB

Member
David,
I would suggest you CALL Rakesh. Send him an email @ rakesh@falcoemotors.com and ask if you can call him. He will give you his cell #
Something is not right. I am absolutely thrilled with my edrive. Just got back from 35mi in the mountains at my second home in VT. Awesome!!
Harry
 

davidsantafe

New Member
Harry,

I received torque arms from Rakesh. It took ages to get a working configuration but it made a huge difference. Uphill motor engages smoothly, but still drops out. Rakesh suggested setting torque and speed sensor option and drop out at 1 or 2. Looking forward to testing tomorrow. I have attached photo of torque arms installed on Catrike, and hope that might help other users
 

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HarryB

Member
David,
Sounds great! I knew he could help. He is amazing!
I also knew it could be adjusted to work as you wish.
Thanks for the update.
Harry
 

davidsantafe

New Member
Harry,

When riding you experience anything like a "clunk" and a small shudder through the trike frame every 4-5 seconds, when pedaling? The axle is tight, the spokes fine, the torque arms installed, and the axle nuts torqued correctly
 

HarryB

Member
I have not, sorry can't help there.
I would assume you have tried it with the e-drive turned off? if it goes away then you know it is e-drive related. if it stays, it is a mechanical issue.
 

davidsantafe

New Member
Harry
Did get one ride in since the upgrade. Suspiciously the original firmware seemed generic but the new one seems specific to my 750W motor.
Initial observations are very good............... clunking subdued to gone. The console now shows turbo mode (Have not tried it). Only negative is that back-pedaling to brake on a downhill does not appear to work any longer.

Looking forward to a longer ride this weekend, at which time I will try some of your suggested settings

David