Full Suspension vs. Fat Tire

baxterblack

Member
Good grief, some of the information passed on. Most of it is good, alot misinformed!:rolleyes:

Scramjett: I'm the owner of two fatbikes. The first, a Specialized Fatboy. Hard tail, no suspension save for the Cane Creek Thudbuster LT I installed. 4.6 inch wide tires, ridden up to 20 psi on asphalt roads. I have about 4000 miles on my Fatboy; bought new.

My other bike, which has effectively knocked out further use of the Fatboy, is my Haibike Full FatSix. One of the premium fatbikes out there, with top tier components compared to that Bixtrix fatbike mentioned elsewhere. Yamaha PW drive. Fully decked out by me with front and rear racks to accomodate all kinds of Ortlieb bags for day rides or touring. Front Schmidt SON28 dyno hub powering up a front German made Schmidt Edelux II headlight and Schmidt Son rear tail light. Tubeless tires. Cane Creek Ergo bar ends on a 60mm riser bar by Spank. Ergon saddle. Abus Bordo lock.

With that out of the way, I ride this bike anywhere, anytime, any condition except water fording. As it should be with any other ebike.

The Fatboy convinced me I could ride this bike on asphalt, albeit it's gonna be averaging about 13 mph. But no bike ever made me smile as to the "feel" of the bike when starting out on every single ride.....there is simply no substitute for the feeling of control and stability on the fat tires. None.

Unlike skinnier mtb tires, my fatbikes easily go through the deep sugar sand of the New Jersey Pine Barrens. THIS is where a fatbike really shines, sugar sand and snow. It's just a matter of airing down to 6 or 8 psi and you are good to go. Done with the deep sand? Air back up and bike on!

Truth is, most of my miles accumulated on the Haibike is on asphalt roads. Last count, 9400 miles on the odometer after putting her into full time service in the late spring of 2017. Asphalt roads mean nothing with this Yamaha ebike drive. In the height of summer when I am in the best of cycling shape, I can linger at 19-20 mph at the motor cutout on a 16mph plus average speed on a 20 mile run that I typically make.

Any ideas of a fat tired ebike not good on riding asphalt roads is rubbish. This past summer, I ebiked the Full FatSix from home on the western side of NJ, to the east coast of NJ at the Atlantic Ocean, then turned around back home. Summer time, 90 degrees plus, 95 miles. All on asphalt.

A fat tired ebike can go anywhere a mtb can go....and then some. It may not be faster (who really cares about that?) or lightning twitch-quick maneuverable on some Alpine Pass (who really goes down that stuff on a forum such as this one?); but it is like a Jeep Rubicon of all bicycles, hands down. The Rock Shox front and rear suspension on the Haibike takes out the dips and crowns of the local roads I ride here in NJ. Suspension on high end bikes are nothing like the dual suspension bikes that first came out in the 1990's. They are a real game changer in rider comfort!

Some pics of the Fatboy and the Haibike Full FatSix......
4269942700
 

Mike TowpathTraveler

Well-Known Member
Good grief is right Mike TowpathTraveler. I guess we should be thankful you straightened everyone out! :rolleyes:
Hey, no problem, Rich. Still looking forward to that tutorial of yours regards to poking about battery terminals, regardless of not knowing which terminal(s) are which! 1-2-3, it don't matter!;)

Now, I must be off, practicing quick steering & biking maneuvers cause as you personally know, a fat bike is poor in that department. Nor is it worth a darn going in puddles as per your personal experience...... let alone riding in "the wet" thanks to these knobbies; another poor riding trait you found in thousands of miles of riding one of these rigs. Any ideas as to how I can eliminate this "crown" in my Schwalbe Jumbo Jims? It seems you are holding back on us on how we might be able to do that. Does it involve a 5 inch reciprocating disc sander?

LOL, Rich. I just have this thing about some people (you) passing along wives tales to new comers who are just trying to seek legit advice. It's comically clear to me you don't know what you're talking about.
 

Attachments

Nomad

Member
I say take a closer at things one could ask question like why are they putting plus tire on some MTB and I'm not just talking about low end ones. My point is not to kick up dirt in anybodys face. It just to say while a fat tire bike may not be your cup of tea for mountain riding don't think it can't be a setup for serious mountain biking that would be false Statement and yes I do like MTB. Some people just pick a different line:) and sometimes ones just different not just better over all. Well for the person who started this post I hope you got some good info from here and reguardless what end up getting I hope it ends up being a good fit for you!
 

bob armani

Well-Known Member
Good grief, some of the information passed on. Most of it is good, alot misinformed!:rolleyes:

Scramjett: I'm the owner of two fatbikes. The first, a Specialized Fatboy. Hard tail, no suspension save for the Cane Creek Thudbuster LT I installed. 4.6 inch wide tires, ridden up to 20 psi on asphalt roads. I have about 4000 miles on my Fatboy; bought new.

My other bike, which has effectively knocked out further use of the Fatboy, is my Haibike Full FatSix. One of the premium fatbikes out there, with top tier components compared to that Bixtrix fatbike mentioned elsewhere. Yamaha PW drive. Fully decked out by me with front and rear racks to accomodate all kinds of Ortlieb bags for day rides or touring. Front Schmidt SON28 dyno hub powering up a front German made Schmidt Edelux II headlight and Schmidt Son rear tail light. Tubeless tires. Cane Creek Ergo bar ends on a 60mm riser bar by Spank. Ergon saddle. Abus Bordo lock.

With that out of the way, I ride this bike anywhere, anytime, any condition except water fording. As it should be with any other ebike.

The Fatboy convinced me I could ride this bike on asphalt, albeit it's gonna be averaging about 13 mph. But no bike ever made me smile as to the "feel" of the bike when starting out on every single ride.....there is simply no substitute for the feeling of control and stability on the fat tires. None.

Unlike skinnier mtb tires, my fatbikes easily go through the deep sugar sand of the New Jersey Pine Barrens. THIS is where a fatbike really shines, sugar sand and snow. It's just a matter of airing down to 6 or 8 psi and you are good to go. Done with the deep sand? Air back up and bike on!

Truth is, most of my miles accumulated on the Haibike is on asphalt roads. Last count, 9400 miles on the odometer after putting her into full time service in the late spring of 2017. Asphalt roads mean nothing with this Yamaha ebike drive. In the height of summer when I am in the best of cycling shape, I can linger at 19-20 mph at the motor cutout on a 16mph plus average speed on a 20 mile run that I typically make.

Any ideas of a fat tired ebike not good on riding asphalt roads is rubbish. This past summer, I ebiked the Full FatSix from home on the western side of NJ, to the east coast of NJ at the Atlantic Ocean, then turned around back home. Summer time, 90 degrees plus, 95 miles. All on asphalt.

A fat tired ebike can go anywhere a mtb can go....and then some. It may not be faster (who really cares about that?) or lightning twitch-quick maneuverable on some Alpine Pass (who really goes down that stuff on a forum such as this one?); but it is like a Jeep Rubicon of all bicycles, hands down. The Rock Shox front and rear suspension on the Haibike takes out the dips and crowns of the local roads I ride here in NJ. Suspension on high end bikes are nothing like the dual suspension bikes that first came out in the 1990's. They are a real game changer in rider comfort!

Some pics of the Fatboy and the Haibike Full FatSix......
Hey Mike- How are the knobbiies holding up after all of those asphalt miles? I was told they can wear down quite quickly doing those kind of surface rides. I ride on 2.8 knobbies on tarmac as well and was curious if you have had to replace them yet (the original Jumbo Jims)? Nice post!
 
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TForan

Well-Known Member
Hey Mike- How are the knobbiies holding up after all of those asphalt miles? I was told they can where down quite quickly doing those kind of surface rides. I ride on 2.8 knobbies on tarmac as well and was curious if you have had to replace them yet (the original Jumbo Jims)? Nice post!
I couldn't stand riding on pavement with the stock Kenda knobbies on my bike. Went to 3.5 in street tires and it made an amazing difference.
 

bob armani

Well-Known Member
I couldn't stand riding on pavement with the stock Kenda knobbies on my bike. Went to 3.5 in street tires and it made an amazing difference.
This is good to know. I have been using stock knobbies. When they are worn, I will have to consider these options before replacement. Thanks for the heads up!
 

Nomad

Member
I couldn't stand riding on pavement with the stock Kenda knobbies on my bike. Went to 3.5 in street tires and it made an amazing difference.
That is good point one can change tires to better suit there own personal needs. I remember reading an articial about some riders many years ago using a fat slick to ride on rock believe it or not. The "slick" part is kinda miss leading it was a sticky tire and the rock was like ledge or like a big smooth MT. top. When you said that about the tires I thinking of the old ground controls and how much drag and noise they made on the pavement
 

Mike TowpathTraveler

Well-Known Member
Hey Mike- How are the knobbiies holding up after all of those asphalt miles? I was told they can where down quite quickly doing those kind of surface rides. I ride on 2.8 knobbies on tarmac as well and was curious if you have had to replace them yet (the original Jumbo Jims)? Nice post!
Hi Bob,
The center tread seems to take the most wear from what I've observed. Noted too, the Jumbo Jims seem to have a softer, faster wearing tire compound (Addix) compared to the Ground Control 4.6's on the Fat Boy. I used to run at 30 psi, the rated Schwalbe max tire pressure, but have since eased off that setting by operating at 25 psi for the best possible battery range.

I would estimate 2 years of use out of the tires. Since putting this Haibike on the road, I've gone through 2 rear tire blowouts, one due to running over some kind of sharp metal debris on the shoulder of the road. The second was after a tire tube blew out internally; destroying the tire bead from ever sealing again. One front tire was lost after converting over to tubeless, where upon seating the tire to the wheel, the bead let go, again, making the inner tire bead unsealable.

To replace tires due to just plain old road mileage wear is one thing, but to lose perfectly good tires under those circumstances noted, it was a pretty tough, expensive bill to swallow.

The noise these tires make on the road sure gets the attention of everybody within range.

Mike
 

Ravi Kempaiah

Well-Known Member
Good grief, some of the information passed on. Most of it is good, alot misinformed!:rolleyes:

Scramjett: I'm the owner of two fatbikes. The first, a Specialized Fatboy. Hard tail, no suspension save for the Cane Creek Thudbuster LT I installed. 4.6 inch wide tires, ridden up to 20 psi on asphalt roads. I have about 4000 miles on my Fatboy; bought new.

My other bike, which has effectively knocked out further use of the Fatboy, is my Haibike Full FatSix. One of the premium fatbikes out there, with top tier components compared to that Bixtrix fatbike mentioned elsewhere. Yamaha PW drive. Fully decked out by me with front and rear racks to accomodate all kinds of Ortlieb bags for day rides or touring. Front Schmidt SON28 dyno hub powering up a front German made Schmidt Edelux II headlight and Schmidt Son rear tail light. Tubeless tires. Cane Creek Ergo bar ends on a 60mm riser bar by Spank. Ergon saddle. Abus Bordo lock.

With that out of the way, I ride this bike anywhere, anytime, any condition except water fording. As it should be with any other ebike.

The Fatboy convinced me I could ride this bike on asphalt, albeit it's gonna be averaging about 13 mph. But no bike ever made me smile as to the "feel" of the bike when starting out on every single ride.....there is simply no substitute for the feeling of control and stability on the fat tires. None.

Unlike skinnier mtb tires, my fatbikes easily go through the deep sugar sand of the New Jersey Pine Barrens. THIS is where a fatbike really shines, sugar sand and snow. It's just a matter of airing down to 6 or 8 psi and you are good to go. Done with the deep sand? Air back up and bike on!

Truth is, most of my miles accumulated on the Haibike is on asphalt roads. Last count, 9400 miles on the odometer after putting her into full time service in the late spring of 2017. Asphalt roads mean nothing with this Yamaha ebike drive. In the height of summer when I am in the best of cycling shape, I can linger at 19-20 mph at the motor cutout on a 16mph plus average speed on a 20 mile run that I typically make.

Any ideas of a fat tired ebike not good on riding asphalt roads is rubbish. This past summer, I ebiked the Full FatSix from home on the western side of NJ, to the east coast of NJ at the Atlantic Ocean, then turned around back home. Summer time, 90 degrees plus, 95 miles. All on asphalt.

A fat tired ebike can go anywhere a mtb can go....and then some. It may not be faster (who really cares about that?) or lightning twitch-quick maneuverable on some Alpine Pass (who really goes down that stuff on a forum such as this one?); but it is like a Jeep Rubicon of all bicycles, hands down. The Rock Shox front and rear suspension on the Haibike takes out the dips and crowns of the local roads I ride here in NJ. Suspension on high end bikes are nothing like the dual suspension bikes that first came out in the 1990's. They are a real game changer in rider comfort!

Some pics of the Fatboy and the Haibike Full FatSix......

Nice pictures, Mike!
Amazing how clean you have kept it 👍 and nice accessories too
 

bob armani

Well-Known Member
Hi Bob,
The center tread seems to take the most wear from what I've observed. Noted too, the Jumbo Jims seem to have a softer, faster wearing tire compound (Addix) compared to the Ground Control 4.6's on the Fat Boy. I used to run at 30 psi, the rated Schwalbe max tire pressure, but have since eased off that setting by operating at 25 psi for the best possible battery range.

I would estimate 2 years of use out of the tires. Since putting this Haibike on the road, I've gone through 2 rear tire blowouts, one due to running over some kind of sharp metal debris on the shoulder of the road. The second was after a tire tube blew out internally; destroying the tire bead from ever sealing again. One front tire was lost after converting over to tubeless, where upon seating the tire to the wheel, the bead let go, again, making the inner tire bead unsealable.

To replace tires due to just plain old road mileage wear is one thing, but to lose perfectly good tires under those circumstances noted, it was a pretty tough, expensive bill to swallow.

The noise these tires make on the road sure gets the attention of everybody within range.

Mike
Mike-Sorry to hear your bad luck with tires. :rolleyes: We live and learn. I also have the Schwalbe Addix tire compound on my Nobby Nics. I apparently have not been maintaining proper tire pressure based on your 25-30psi statement. I max out the pressure ratings @ 36-38psi thinking I would get max battery range. My strategy was that I would get the least rolling resistance at max pressure. Sounds like I'll have to reduce to 25psi and see where that takes me. Thanks for posting and ride safe!
 

Mike TowpathTraveler

Well-Known Member
Nice pictures, Mike!
Amazing how clean you have kept it 👍 and nice accessories too
Ravi, thanks, I appeciate that! Yep, after every ride, a wipe down and general look over to see if everything is in one piece. That dyno hub lighting system opens it up to riding anytime of the day if I choose to do so. No more worries about losing daylight. Every other ride-lubing up the chain using Dupont Chain Saver. Still running on the original chain!

9400 miles and last week I noticed the front brake lever was starting to lose it's firmness. So, replaced the front pads and re-bled the brake system. Used up about 50% of pad wear in those miles; not bad!

Cannot recommend Haibike any greater then I do; the bike has never let me down except for those tire issues. Oh, take that back......2 winters ago, the rear spoke magnet loosened up, throwing off the signal to the display. Tightened it back up and I was on my way.

This was a Crazy Lenny's purchase. Don't know if it was luck or the solid spec package of this bike; or just keeping up with things, but there simply have not been any issues with this bike at all to beef about. One of the best purchases I have ever made. Something in there for the original poster of this thread to mull over!
 

Thomas Jaszewski

Well-Known Member
Hey, no problem, Rich. Still looking forward to that tutorial of yours regards to poking about battery terminals, regardless of not knowing which terminal(s) are which! 1-2-3, it don't matter!;)

Now, I must be off, practicing quick steering & biking maneuvers cause as you personally know, a fat bike is poor in that department. Nor is it worth a darn going in puddles as per your personal experience...... let alone riding in "the wet" thanks to these knobbies; another poor riding trait you found in thousands of miles of riding one of these rigs. Any ideas as to how I can eliminate this "crown" in my Schwalbe Jumbo Jims? It seems you are holding back on us on how we might be able to do that. Does it involve a 5 inch reciprocating disc sander?

LOL, Rich. I just have this thing about some people (you) passing along wives tales to new comers who are just trying to seek legit advice. It's comically clear to me you don't know what you're talking about.
I think poor design and geometry is amplified by fat bikes. The budget bike I bought to kit sucks. Yesterday I tried a top tier KHS and it was a very different ride. I’m wanting to try a studded tire version for ice fishing. I’m thinking it’d be perfect.
 

Scramjett

New Member
Hello all,

Thanks for the feedback! Everyone has definitely given me something to think about here.

@Mike TowpathTraveler, I was looking at a Haibike for a commuter, specifically the SDURO Trekking S9.0. I went with a different bike but I may look at them for a mountain bike. Do they do direct sales? I ask because there are no Haibike dealers where I live. Also, what do you think of Bulls?
 

Nomad

Member
Hello all,

Thanks for the feedback! Everyone has definitely given me something to think about here.

@Mike TowpathTraveler, I was looking at a Haibike for a commuter, specifically the SDURO Trekking S9.0. I went with a different bike but I may look at them for a mountain bike. Do they do direct sales? I ask because there are no Haibike dealers where I live. Also, what do you think of Bulls?
Did you try going to www.haibikeusa.com?
 

Mike TowpathTraveler

Well-Known Member
Hello all,

Thanks for the feedback! Everyone has definitely given me something to think about here.

@Mike TowpathTraveler, I was looking at a Haibike for a commuter, specifically the SDURO Trekking S9.0. I went with a different bike but I may look at them for a mountain bike. Do they do direct sales? I ask because there are no Haibike dealers where I live. Also, what do you think of Bulls?
Scramjett: As poster @Nomad noted, they do have direct sales. But they also have a dealer network as well. Propel, Crazy Lenny's, Electric Bike Center (this is the shop that Court has done many bike reviews working with the owner, Sam and the bikes he brings for the test.)

Just based on the review that Court has done on Bulls, as well as the magazine reviews of Bulls in Electric Bike Action, I come across with the impression that Bulls is a premium brand; well designed, well built with a good drive system and well specced components.

I don't believe Haibike has a fat tired ebike in their lineup for this year. Bulls has the fat tired Monster in a hard tail or full suspension model, with the Bosch drivetrain.