Hub drive or mid drive.

Ken M

Well-Known Member
Here's my two cents....

If you plan to use the bike a lot on hilly commutes you probably do want to lean towards a mid-drive. But if you have a commute that you know you can spend much of the riding time above say 10mph a hub drive could actually be the wiser choice

Mid drives can take advantage of gear ratios when climbing but at higher speeds the gear ratio actually has a negative impact via reducing mechanical advantage of the higher gears. Hub drives apply their torque direct to the rear wheel so at higher speeds they can actually be more efficient and even easlier to sustain the higher speeds with. Typically cosmetically the mid-drive models tend to win out but with a hub you could long term just convert back to a conventional bike.

If you do go with a hub drive be sure to get one with regen braking - saves break wear and provides maybe 5% energy recapture.
 

john peck

Well-Known Member
You don't need to see it, in google earth just measure the distance between two points that you like to find the average grade, find the difference in height in between end points and divide it to the distance. The desktop version of earth actually have this as a feature built in but the web version does not.

View attachment 84428

I don't know if this is the part you mentioned. This section that I draw is 250m long and the elevation changes from 92m to 117m, 25m delta, hence the grade is around %10.
Golly, wait ´til yur 72 & lookin´ up from the bottom. My total vertical limit is not that far off.
 

john peck

Well-Known Member
You don't need to see it, in google earth just measure the distance between two points that you like to find the average grade, find the difference in height in between end points and divide it to the distance. The desktop version of earth actually have this as a feature built in but the web version does not.

View attachment 84428

I don't know if this is the part you mentioned. This section that I draw is 250m long and the elevation changes from 92m to 117m, 25m delta, hence the grade is around %10.
 

tomjasz

Well-Known Member
Looking good M@Robertson!
They have new a special box for shipping bikes.
I have been going gangbusters today. Working on these bikes is so much fun. I came directly to my office from the morning ride and diched the sweaty shammy. As I was in the process a guy walked in. I work by appointment only and someone left the front door unlocked. He wanted to do a surprise inspection. Surprise! The good news is that I passed and he is getting his gravel bike converted.
Wow! I’d freak out on that packing. I’m certain, but can often be wrong, that some ape man of a delivery driver could easily mangle that handlebar. Will ups and others allow that to be insured? Disclaimer... I don’t know IF it is a problem, I haven’t your experience shipping bikes. But lots of experience with damaged shipments.
 

mclewis1

Member
Region
Canada
City
Fredericton, NB
Here's my two cents....

...

If you do go with a hub drive be sure to get one with regen braking - saves break wear and provides maybe 5% energy recapture.
Ken, Unfortunately all the popular geared hub motors (not sure if this is really "all", but it's all the ones I'm familiar with) have a clutch so they freewheel with virtually no load when no power is being applied. That clutched setup means that they can't be used for regeneration. It's the direct drive hubs that can of course be setup for regeneration, but they also have a small loading effect when they are unpowered. Justen at Grin Technologies has suggested that it might be possible in the future to have geared hub motors modified to provide a controllable clutch mechanism. I assume this would allow the popular geared hub motors to be setup to offer regeneration.

Interestingly there is new setup software (v1.4) from Grin Technologies for their BaseRunner and PhaseRunner controllers that offers a feature (called Virtual Electronic Freewheeling) that applies a small amount of voltage to the motor which would allow direct drive motors to better freewheel and therefore coast easier when you stop pedaling. I guess this also assumes that you haven't enabled regeneration.
 

m@Robertson

Member
Region
USA
I don't know if I would want to care a whit about regeneration. Only as a curiosity. I have a charger at home, one at work and oftentimes I have one mounted on the bike. As for brake wear, pads are cheap even if I buy the manufacturer's brand at $30 a pop. I changed the Surly's pads yesterday and on that behemoth they lasted 1300 miles, which is about half what I'd expect. 8 months. I usually buy pads a half dozen sets at a time every couple years from Rose Bikes in Germany for about half retail so... cost on that part is not something thats noticeable.

I think if you commit to buying consumable parts like you commit to buying muffins at Costco, you change the game in terms of what equipment is affordable or even makes sense.
 

tomjasz

Well-Known Member
I don't know if I would want to care a whit about regeneration.
AGREED! However, I have a coaster brake Trek Pure 3spd SA, it has a front rim brake. Braking was inadequate with the front hub motor, but DD regen braking made it a really efficient braking system.
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
NICELY DONE!!
I like this system for regeneration, because it goes forever:
1618165683044.png

These electric airplanes save battery weight too:
1618165873892.png

The third image is of the Town Bike Mid-drives we rode today.
 

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PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
I like this system for regeneration, because it goes forever:
View attachment 84453
These electric airplanes save battery weight too:
View attachment 84454
The third image is of the Town Bike Mid-drives we rode today.
I converted those town bikes from Right Side Drive to Left to balance the chance of getting the Right cuff of your jeans caught in the chain.
 

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