i wonder what would happen if...

bikerjohn

Well-Known Member
This omni wheel design looks very interesting! The latest info is that it will be shipping in May. Pre-orders get a $200 discount, but the cost is steep at $1000 -$1250 deal priced
Want the lowdown on the Omni Wheel by Evelo? http://www.omni.evelo.com/
 

Ann M.

Well-Known Member
Think about it, all of the weight is in the front wheel; rotating weight of a battery, tiny motor & controller which affects how the bike steers and handles. There's also hardware on the cranks which they fail to picture. The concept is interesting as is the iphone run Copenhagen wheel, but not really ready for prime time. The motor size is not mentioned in Evelo's material and you have to pay more to get the 40 mile range (figure more weight too, for the bigger battery).

Evelo makes some nice bikes and for that amount of cash, you can even buy a whole ebike from some manufacturers. Currie Tech had an 'all-in-one' that got swept under the rug after a very short production run. Logistically, its difficult to cram a big motor together with heat sensitive controllers & batteries under a skin that's going to have heat dissipation issues. Just didn't have much power. Yes, I actually rode one, too :D.
 

bikerjohn

Well-Known Member
According to Customer Service personnel at Evelo, the wheel will fit the rear wheel drop-outs on my FWD Quest Cruzbike. But I do have some resistance to the high price (priced from $999 to $1299 on deal), and some concern about the added weight...

Specifications
BATTERY LIFE
750 Cycles
( ~ 3 years of use )
RANGE
8.7Ah Battery: 15-25 Mi
14.5Ah Battery: 25-40 Mi
TOP SPEED
Up to 20 Miles/Hour
WEIGHT
19 to 21 pounds
CHARGE TIME
8.7Ah Battery: ~4 hours
14.5Ah Battery: ~9 hours

WATTAGE / MOTOR POWER
350W / 24V
Multiple Levels of Assist
POSITION ON BIKE
Front Wheel
DISPLAY
Wireless LCD DIsplay
SIZE
26”
700C (28”)
COLORS AVAILABLE
White
DISK BRAKE COMPATIBLE?
Yes!



Pre-order now:
Use code "preorder" to get $200 off
-priced from $999 to $1299 on deal


 

Ann M.

Well-Known Member
@bikerjohn I get it that you want to preserve your 3-speed internal Sram hub; the Cruze Quest is a nice 'bent. You're talking rear wheel and this is really a front wheel all-in-one; its in the specs you show above. Here's a little at home experiment to understand the impact of having all the weight of a motor, battery, controller, rim & axle inside the wheel vs. just a motor: Take a large (couple of gallons capacity) rigid bucket and add say a quart of water to it--now swing it in a circle to your side. Not too bad, a little awkward, but doable, like a typical hub motor for instance. Now, repeat the experiment with a gallon of water (yes, half of the bucket). Try that swinging again-- it's not so easy plus you're more likely to end up with an unplanned bath. Its a lot of weight. The idea is to get perspective on what a typical motor system feels like compared to an all-in-one. They're very different. And yes, I'm a bit of a skeptic on the extended range battery even approaching 40 miles, the math doesn't add up.

Ride it first before plunking down your $$; there are lots of proven systems if you want to do a rear or front wheel conversion with a Lithium system for $1K+
 

bikerjohn

Well-Known Member
@bikerjohn I get it that you want to preserve your 3-speed internal Sram hub; the Cruze Quest is a nice 'bent. You're talking rear wheel and this is really a front wheel all-in-one; its in the specs you show above. Here's a little at home experiment to understand the impact of having all the weight of a motor, battery, controller, rim & axle inside the wheel vs. just a motor: Take a large (couple of gallons capacity) rigid bucket and add say a quart of water to it--now swing it in a circle to your side. Not too bad, a little awkward, but doable, like a typical hub motor for instance. Now, repeat the experiment with a gallon of water (yes, half of the bucket). Try that swinging again-- it's not so easy plus you're more likely to end up with an unplanned bath. Its a lot of weight. The idea is to get perspective on what a typical motor system feels like compared to an all-in-one. They're very different. And yes, I'm a bit of a skeptic on the extended range battery even approaching 40 miles, the math doesn't add up.

Ride it first before plunking down your $$; there are lots of proven systems if you want to do a rear or front wheel conversion with a Lithium system for $1K+
Because the Quest is a FWD MBB set-up and the desire for maintaining the Sram components, using a front wheel e-motor is perfect on the back wheel. The neat thing with a Cruzbike is that the Back Wheel is actually a front Wheel mounted where the back wheel would be and vice versa. Without changing the Sram drive set-up, adding an electric motor to the "rear wheel" is as easy as installing a front wheel e-motor where the back "non-drive" wheel is located.

As far as range goes, the 350 what front wheel motor on the EG Zurich uses a 12AH Li-On battery. I have been able to extend battery power over a range 50+ miles using the E-motor conservatively.

On the matter of an "all-in-one" set-up, I can imagine there could be handling issues with the wheel design. There are other front wheel e-motor kits that may be better for aerodynamics and weight distribution. The all-in-one cost is a bit steep too.
 

Ann M.

Well-Known Member
Of course, the EG Zurich is a 36V 12ah LiIon system so you have more watt hours to use. Remember, the Evelo all-in-one from Evelo is a 24V system, thus my question about real range. You better get 40+ miles with some pedaling on the Zurich! :D
 

Alex Stegemann

New Member
Hey Guys!

This is Alex from EVELO Electric Bicycles.

I just wanted to touch base on the EBR forum, and answer some questions for you.

Regarding compatibility with FlyKly, Copenhagen, or any other RWD system, there should realistically be no issues as far as cadence sensing since our system utilizes an external system near the bottom bracket, and our wireless signal would not interfere with any of these other products wireless interface.

However, it isn't something that we've tested or can recommend one way or another. In my opinion, with the entire weight of both systems combined, you're approaching the weight (and cost) of a complete electric bicycles. I think our Mid Drive systems would be a more efficient system to consider. While running both systems, you would enjoy additional torque, but top end speed would not increase, and you would have 3 chargers and a cell phone to deal with every ride. Yikes!

Our cadence sensor is designed for a painless installation on the bottom bracket shell, with a magnet disc that securely clips into place on the bottom bracket spindle. This works well with any square taper bottom bracket, with at least 3.5mm between the end of the crank arm, and the bottom bracket shell of the frame.

In reference to the Currie Electron wheel, while it is a similar concept, our design, manufacturing process, and overall execution of the idea is completely independent and this wheel has been engineered from the ground up to provide consistent and reliable service.

Last but not least, everyone want to know how this thing rides! We will be shooting some videos and reviews once the weather improves here in New York, but I have personally spent time with this wheel, and there are no noticeable adverse side effects to the additional weight, and / or the wheel cover design with the Evelo Omni wheel. The centrifugal force generates a bit of a gyroscopic effect, which actually assists in keeping the bike going in whichever direction you choose. As for crosswind issues, since you have this rotating gyroscopic effect, I haven't personally noticed any resistance, or side to side movement when riding in windy situations (the Manhattan Bridge for example, lots of wind!). The cadence sensor is smooth, and its assistance engages naturally once you pedal. While there is currently no throttle, you can also pedal lightly to keep the motor engaged - basically if you keep your legs moving, the wheel will pull you along quite well.

Obviously there are a ton of eBike kits out there, from BionX to Hilltopper, to Dillenger kits, eBay motors, and a ton of other options. We developed the Omni wheel to focus on the ease of installation, with a typical install possible in a realistic 20 minutes, for an average non-mechanically inclined cyclist. Its perfect for the "set it and forget it" crowd looking for a bit of a boost. As many of you know, the idea of getting an electric bicycle kit and "throwing it on there" is generally much more difficult than anticipated. The Omni is truly the easiest eBike conversion system available.

The ability to assemble a complete electric bicycle from scratch for well under $1500, that weighs between 40 and 45lbs total, from a reputable and reliable company with a solid background, killer customer service team, and experience in the industry is also pretty cool!

Feel free to reach out to us directly with any other questions or comments - contact@evelo.com, or check out www.EVELO.com, and www.OMNI.evelo.com!
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
Hello @Alex Stegemann and welcome. With the Omni Wheel, how do you lock this 1500.00+ bike up with a standard U-lock? The U-lock is the standard in locking devices for most cyclists. This is a lot of money to trust with an easy to cut cable lock, even in the best and safest neighborhood.
 

Alex Stegemann

New Member
JR,

Great question. I personally recommend the Pinhead M10 Axle Nut Security System - as this makes for a clean and secure install. When installed properly, this hardware makes it nearly impossible to remove the OMNI wheel without the Pinhead key. I do agree with you in that a cable lock is not secure enough for most cases. Another option is a longer U lock through the valve opening, but clearance can be an issue.

I like a setup where the wheel is secured to the fork, fork is secured to the frame, frame is secured to your locking point. It also makes it easy and worry free to lock up your bike quickly, and with only one lock.

For anyone looking for the exact opposite - a quick release option, there is also a M10 Quick Release kit available from various retailers, allowing for the use of a QR on a solid axle.
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
JR,

Great question. I personally recommend the Pinhead M10 Axle Nut Security System - as this makes for a clean and secure install. When installed properly, this hardware makes it nearly impossible to remove the OMNI wheel without the Pinhead key. I do agree with you in that a cable lock is not secure enough for most cases. Another option is a longer U lock through the valve opening, but clearance can be an issue.

I like a setup where the wheel is secured to the fork, fork is secured to the frame, frame is secured to your locking point. It also makes it easy and worry free to lock up your bike quickly, and with only one lock.

For anyone looking for the exact opposite - a quick release option, there is also a M10 Quick Release kit available from various retailers, allowing for the use of a QR on a solid axle.
Alex, I suspected you were going to holler Pinhead about my question... Well that's the last time you'll insult me on this thread!:mad:

I was actually hoping you were going to report to us that the valve opening was large enough for a U-lock. I never use QR hardware for safety and security. Non-QR (Pinhead) is a good solution, maybe not an ultimate one but would be good enough for most of us.

I wonder if you offered tamper-proof hardware with the wheel if that would alleviate concerns buyers may have. It would cost you less in bulk and you could tack it on to the cost as any hardware would be. Just a thought...

Thanks for the quick reply and as I said welcome, don't be a stranger. We can always use more people in the biz around here!:)
 

Alex Stegemann

New Member
JR,

I like the notification feature of this forum, it allows me to keep on top of this thread.

To be honest, there is plenty of room for a U lock to fit through the valve opening on the OMNI. I try to steer folks to utilize the PinHead system because I am concerned that people will start busting valves when using a U lock, or if someone yanks on the bike when its locked - damaging the valve. Realistically it should be fine, both the 26" and 700c versions feature a deep walled rim, which should support the valve enough to prevent any damage from the occasional bump.

Offering an in house security system creates a whole other dimension as far as manufacturing, and supply chains are concerned, especially with uniquely keyed systems. I'm even aware of a particular manufacturer that keys all of their bicycles the same, so any owner can easily grab that $800 Samsung battery from any other bicycle on the street. So not cool.

Over the years, we've found it best to let the parts distributors do their thing, while we focus on the complete bicycles as a whole. Believe it or not, most inquiries are for Quick Release options, as customer want the ability to switch the wheel from bike to bike with relative ease, or even bring it inside for charging.
 

JoePah

Well-Known Member
@bikerjohn have you demo'd this wheel yet? Everything is based on personal experience, and before you blow a grand on something completely new, don't take anyone's word for it. Ride it.
 

bikerjohn

Well-Known Member
@bikerjohn have you demo'd this wheel yet? Everything is based on personal experience, and before you blow a grand on something completely new, don't take anyone's word for it. Ride it.
When the weather breaks around here I may get a chance to demo the system. I do have skepticism over the usefulness on 16-20 mile R/T commutes. And then there is the added weight making the set-up impractical for use as a supplemental power source for climbing on longer rides (25-50 mile tours). Finally, I continue to have reluctance over the price.
 
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