Input for long range commuter build?

4speed

Member
Region
Europe
Pasion Ebike is run by a lady named Wendy Xie. She's pretty well known in some ebike circles as a community member early on - nowadays mostly a vendor. Her company is the USA supplier of parts for at least a couple of popular ebike companies most USA riders have at least heard of. In the early years of the Sondors ebikes, she was the one who figured out how to give owners amp'd up parts (controllers, displays) that let owners turn underpowered bikes into hot rods.

I would classify her as one of the good guys. She's one of the few vendors I would buy a battery from (if I had to buy from China), although not my first choice. Look at her 30ah pack and note the size of it vs. the size of your triangle. The battery and wheel kit could turn into a 1-stop solution for you. Battery plus kit would be US$1300. Select UK shipping on the lower left hand corner of any page on the site. Its still in USD though on purpose according to the dropdown that denotes USD for everything.

She uses quality parts. That LCD8H is probably the best KT display available. And notice how the bigger wheels use MTX39 rims. I use those on my cargo bikes, and would have used them on the compact emtb I am building if I could have just gotten hold of a set (I used DT Swiss FR560's instead). MTX39's run at least $65 each retail. So she's using good parts in those kits.

edit: I have bought a bunch of stuff from her, albeit mostly throttles and sensors and displays. I did buy a G060 cassette motor from her a few years ago.
Thanks for the info! 👍

Just spotted though that their cassette wheel is 145 mm wide and my bike is 135. No question it can be spread 10 mm by force, but I would be hesitant to apply that constant bending force to tubes and welds in addition to everything else it will have to take.
 
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4speed

Member
Region
Europe
Something potentially interesting entered the stage. Would any of you gentlemen have anything to say for or against a motor named MXUS XF40-30H ?
 
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indianajo

Well-Known Member
As for the torque, swift acceleration and stop-and-go really is of little use for me. I start pedaling when I leave my house and stop 30 km down the road. I just want to be able to keep the speed up.
DD motor would seem to be perfect for you. Top torque at 90-100% of top speed. Otoh in geared motors 10t winding is fast enough to be illegal in most states (25 mph) and 8t winding even faster and slower
accelerating.
I went front mofor to avoid replacing the 8 speed 11-32 cassette OEM to the bike with 7 speed freewheel. Could not find a 12 to 32 7 speed freewheel inside the US. Ali won't sell to me, I'm not giving away my birthdate. They'll have to pay a credit agency if they want it. Or the ****ese government, they hacked birthdate from the US government employee website.
 
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4speed

Member
Region
Europe
There. New discs and new organic pads made all the difference in the world.

Also bedding in gave a most unflattering reminder of my present [lack of] stamina. 😅
 

m@Robertson

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
Thanks for the info! 👍

Just spotted though that their cassette wheel is 145 mm wide and my bike is 135. No question it can be spread 10 mm by force, but I would be hesitant to apply that constant bending force to tubes and welds in addition to everything else it will have to take.
I forgot about that. Funny thing because I am building a bike right now that has 135mm spacing and I had a hell of a time finding the hub I wanted in a Shimano 9spd compatible cassette that was able to accept that old-school size.

You could spread the frame (I wouldn't unless you were forced), and it would be fine long term so long as its steel and not alloy. Its only 5mm per side. Dropouts would no longer be parallel to one another but with only 5mm spread on each side, its not a big deal. I spread a 135mm steel frame to 165mm once no issues (widened a single-speed G060 to a 7-spd 750w G060). But it was steel.


Something potentially interesting entered the stage. Would any of you gentlemen have anything to say for or against a motor named MXUS XF40-30H ?
Freewheel. I think you're going to have to step back and use one if you want to use a hub motor on 135mm dropouts.
 
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4speed

Member
Region
Europe
You could spread the frame (I wouldn't unless you were forced), and it would be fine long term so long as its steel and not alloy.
No steel here.
Freewheel. I think you're going to have to step back and use one if you want to use a hub motor on 135mm dropouts.
Maybe not necessarily, on the shop's photos it has cassette hub. Could be that there are both versions. I am double checking with them that cassette is the case.
 

m@Robertson

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
No steel here.

Maybe not necessarily, on the shop's photos it has cassette hub. Could be that there are both versions. I am double checking with them that cassette is the case.
Sure enough. At this Ali ad, they show blueprints of a cassette version and it shows 135mm spacing.

 

4speed

Member
Region
Europe
Short update,
I have let go of my initial idea for DD rear wheel drive. Not that I don't think it would be the best option for my use, but I have not been able to find a suitable supplier in Europe that sells just what I am looking for. So now a BBSHD is heading my way from pswpower German stock, and a 48 V / 24,5 Ah battery from Polish company MGVOLT.

Obviously I am overshooting my initial budget, landning somewhere around EUR 2000 for the whole thing. Still I have not found anything ready-made that ticks my boxes short of things like Riese & Müller Charger or Supercharger for 3-4 times the money.
 
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m@Robertson

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
I finished my 135mm BBSHD'd bike in the interim since I last mentioned it above.


It went to the Grand Canyon with me a couple weeks ago for its maiden voyages (not in the canyon... they don't let you do that)
 

4speed

Member
Region
Europe
I finished my 135mm BBSHD'd bike in the interim since I last mentioned it above.
It went to the Grand Canyon with me a couple weeks ago for its maiden voyages (not in the canyon... they don't let you do that)
There are worse places for a maiden voyage. :)

Upside with the BBSHD instead of DD hub is that with a different chain ring I hope to use the same bike to pull a trailer with kids (at a whole different speed). :)
 

4speed

Member
Region
Europe
Motor arrived, on the bike. Battery arrived, huge, not on the bike yet. Need to decide on the least bad place and mounting for it...
 

4speed

Member
Region
Europe
Too heavy for the two rivets nuts in the frame tube, or for any number of rivet nuts really. Thinking of making a couple of Delrin clamps around the tube(s) to fit the battery base plate on.
 

4speed

Member
Region
Europe
There's always The Dark Side
Well written article, and certainly a way. But I have a handful of alternatives to try, and fail, before going there. The bike has racks both front and rear, and the front rack seems more and more tempting. We'll see. :)
 

mikeschn

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
SE Michigan
Too heavy for the two rivets nuts in the frame tube, or for any number of rivet nuts really. Thinking of making a couple of Delrin clamps around the tube(s) to fit the battery base plate on.
Something like this?

IMG_3123.JPG
 

indianajo

Well-Known Member
I cut clamps out of box fan shell, 1" wide by however long necessary. I use weiss shears. I drill a 13/32" hole on one end and several similar holes on the other end so I don't have to custom measure the length. Those will clear #10-32 SS machine screws. I file the strut edges & corners to prevent pants rips. I paint them, but raggedy appearance probably helps my bike from being stolen at stores, restaurants, meetings, job. I hold on torque arms from motor to fork and mounts for controller (under seat).
Elastic stop nuts prevent the screws from coming undone. In Europe you would probably find 5 mm screws easier. I find the 340 SS or mil-spec 18 SS screws made in ******* at mcmaster.com don't have hydrogen embrittlement. EU probably has a regulation against consumers buying machine screws.
 

4speed

Member
Region
Europe
I cut clamps out of box fan shell, 1" wide by however long necessary. I use weiss shears. I drill a 13/32" hole on one end and several similar holes on the other end so I don't have to custom measure the length. Those will clear #10-32 SS machine screws. I file the strut edges & corners to prevent pants rips. I paint them, but raggedy appearance probably helps my bike from being stolen at stores, restaurants, meetings, job. I hold on torque arms from motor to fork and mounts for controller (under seat).
Elastic stop nuts prevent the screws from coming undone. In Europe you would probably find 5 mm screws easier. I find the 340 SS or mil-spec 18 SS screws made in ******* at mcmaster.com don't have hydrogen embrittlement. EU probably has a regulation against consumers buying machine screws.
Language barrier here, sorry - what is box fan shell?

The tube is >2" diameter and thin walled, so I want any type of fixture to squeeze as uniformly around the tube as possible. Today's idea is fixing a mounting rail using 4-5 regular hose clamps, I imagine that will be pretty gentle to the tube. Unfortunately the tube is not entirely round so the type of clamps that @mikeschn suggested will not fit well (unless they are machined to the exact profile of the tube).

As for dimensions, I would have a hard time locating a 13/32" drill or a #10-32 screw. :) Anything in this size range is millimeters here, as you say.
But I have never heard of restrictions on consumers buying machine screws. Anyone can buy any type of screws they like, as long as you find a supplier who will sell small enough quantities.
 

indianajo

Well-Known Member
A box fan is an appliance of 24"x24"x5" containing an electric motor and a fan. These appear regularly on the curb at garbage day. Especially in the spring. Conversion of inches to centimeters is accomplished by multiplying by 2.54 .
The shell of the box fan is the sheet metal wrapper. The grills front back are plastic and not useful. Neither is the stuck motor. Box fans are easier to cut up than toaster or microwave ovens, or washers or dryers. The leftovers will fit in a trash can.
If you use 5 mm screws, you will need a clearance drill for 5 mm. Exactly the same size is not recommended.
Sorry I can no longer provide pictures. Pictures are produced by ****ese appliances which I refuse to buy.
I emit extreme sarcasm at the Euro recycling, food, electric bicycle, appliance housing and other regulations. It appears to be prohibited in Europe to repair any appliance, especially sound equipment. This would deprive the local government of their recycle fee. Also deprive huge party donor corporations their profit at replacing appliances every 5 years after they cease to function. Most of the foods I eat are prohibited in Europe, also. Funny, I'm not dead yet.
 
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