Karmic Kickstarter launched

PowerMe

Well-Known Member
Get a little old lady to ride your eBike up one of the steep hills in SF and film that. Nothing like the visual of someone not a conditioned cyclist or athlete to make the point that the eBike with mid drive is a powerful climber. Maybe get a young dude on a regular bike to ride the same hill at the same time. He'd be huffing & puffing and little old lady would be having a breeze getting up the hill.
 

Cameron Newland

Well-Known Member
Get a little old lady to ride your eBike up one of the steep hills in SF and film that. Nothing like the visual of someone not a conditioned cyclist or athlete to make the point that the eBike with mid drive is a powerful climber. Maybe get a young dude on a regular bike to ride the same hill at the same time. He'd be huffing & puffing and little old lady would be having a breeze getting up the hill.

...but that assumes that the bike has gears. the standard Karmic Køben doesn't have any gears to speak of.
 

Hong

Active Member
It's a shame you're not shipping to Europe, but that may end up being a wise decision. You don't want to get too dispersed at this point in time. In any event, best of luck with what looks to be a very good start to your campaign.

Thanks JayVee. We are focused on the US market. European operations will come later. We want to improve the quality of ebikes here in America first. :)
 

Hong

Active Member
Get a little old lady to ride your eBike up one of the steep hills in SF and film that. Nothing like the visual of someone not a conditioned cyclist or athlete to make the point that the eBike with mid drive is a powerful climber. Maybe get a young dude on a regular bike to ride the same hill at the same time. He'd be huffing & puffing and little old lady would be having a breeze getting up the hill.

Did you watch the video? ;)
 

pxpaulx

Well-Known Member
Good luck Hong. I think some other CF ebike has taken most of your potential customers.

I kinda doubt it! This is a different bike entirely (I am getting a radrover myself, but am still considering the karmic as well) than the recent CF bikes that have sold well - they might have big $ donations, and have sold several thousand bikes, but reality is last year in the US there were close to 200,000 e-bikes sold and that number is growing - I have no doubt the karmic will do well on its own merits.
 

Llcjay

Member
It's not the ebike market I'm talking about its the Crowdfunding ebike market. And whether Sondors delivers or not that money is spent.

Hong and others better hope Sondors delivers because all CF will suffer if he doesn't.
 

PowerMe

Well-Known Member
There's quite a difference between a $400 - $500 eBike and a $1500 eBike. I'm sure some significant % of those who decided to invest in the Sonders bike campaign did so spontaneously. Spending upwards of $1.5K often takes more consideration and thinking since it's not an insignificant amount to most people. Some of those Sonders investors never would spent over $900 for a bike so they would never be potential customers of Karmic or other higher end eBikes.
 

pxpaulx

Well-Known Member
It's not the ebike market I'm talking about its the Crowdfunding ebike market. And whether Sondors delivers or not that money is spent.

Hong and others better hope Sondors delivers because all CF will suffer if he doesn't.

Gotcha! If Sondors doesn't deliver you're right, the black eye on crowd-funding will stretch well beyond the bike segment. If the bikes are delivered (which I hope they are) and anywhere close to (realistic) expectations, all the legal discussion and back and forth between the vehement supporters and opponents will fall by the wayside. We'll just have to wait and see on that one.

Meanwhile, the Karmic is taking aim at the industry as a whole, this a well conceived bike from a few people that are known quantities with innovative backgrounds that are making something new in the battery pack style that is definitely welcome to the market.

@Hong - I saw reference to a kit in a few previous discussions here and on reddit - any chance that is going to happen with the campaign or will that be done outside of the kickstarter project?
 

pxpaulx

Well-Known Member
@Hong - I've read over the page a few times but don't think I saw the shipping cost mentioned - and I've probably already asked - is the shipping going to be fixed for both bike versions at $163, totaling $1,500 or $1,800 for the super early birds?
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
@Hong, I tried to start a private conversation with you, but your personal settings don't allow private messages to be sent to you. So with no other choice, here is the message I attempted:

Hello Hong,

I don't want to post this message to the open forum, hence this private message. I'm close to backing your bike, but want to see detail specifications posted on your Kickstarter campaign. The battery specifications are of the highest priority. It would be all well and good for you to provide me with them, but I think they should be made public for accountability. Any response to this message will remain private on my end.

Thanks for your consideration,
JR
 

Ravi Kempaiah

Well-Known Member
I was just on Endless Sphere and I would like to echo their sentiment. Vagueness of specs is not going to impress potential customers.

Clear details of specs and warranty is what really turns heads. If I were considering this bike, I would want full details like geometry, specs (Ah, Whr, motor rating, weight), warranty, shipping and you know what, a lot of people on Endless Sphere would love that battery. Keep an option of 48V, 16Ah battery (in a triangle bag) and you'll see a ton of them purchasing it. Range is everything on an e-bike. If I can get 60+ miles with that 48V 16Ah battery, then nothing else on the market comes close at that price point (2.5K with upgrades). After all, you're a battery company selling E-bikes ;)
 

Hong

Active Member
Hey Everyone,

Thanks for all the questions, but we're spending almost all our time on Kickstarter and doing press. We're not being shy about specs, just want to present them in a clean and clear format. Shipping is fixed $129 for either bike within the US. Folks in other countries can email me directly. I'm always reachable, I just don't use the messaging on forums.

Also not going to comment on other crowdfunding campaigns, because we're not the same, and our customers are not the same either. ;)

Cheers,
Hong
 

pxpaulx

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the reply Hong, I'm sure it is a busy time! We'll be anxiously awaiting the other details when they become available! As an aside, glad to see you chose kickstarter, their process of not charging unless a campaign is successful (v IGG) lend credibility to the crowdfunding process imho.
 

pxpaulx

Well-Known Member
We have a spec sheet up on the campaign, thanks for that Hong! So, is the bike being offered at $1637 with the nuvinci hub the koben s, or just a koben plus the nuvinci?

Edited, my question was answered in the comments section on Kickstarter!
 
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George S.

Well-Known Member
Hong,

I'm going to have to sell a bike or two, but I can't resist the specs on that Nuvinci Koben. So, count me in.

I was going to build a BBS02. I think the high powered versions are a bit of a waste, speed I don't need. But, the high power versions have issues with too much power on the chain. The Nuvinci solves that, to some extent, but it may be one of those things where you nudge it with the brake cut-offs on the motor. I could never sort it out. Even Shimano has some issues, their STEPS, with difficult shifts to climbing gears under load. You pay for Bosch.

Considering what's out there, it's hard to do better than this combo. If people want more power, they want more power. The BBS02 has been holding up pretty well. This is from a reviewer who seems to expect a lot from bike parts:

https://electricfatbike.wordpress.c...ly-take-the-abuse-of-singletrack-trailriding/

It's a beautiful bike. Glad you put a big pack on the S. The battery is probably the main thing with the bike, which is what you say on the campaign page. I hope I read that right, that people get the S model if they pledge for the CVT (comments to Marc).

Hope your campaign, and Kickstarter, help clarify some of the issues and problems that seem to have plagued crowdfunding. The way you are raising money is perfectly reasonable. I want you to make it work but if there are unknown calamities, that's life. Good luck.
 

pxpaulx

Well-Known Member
Hong,

I'm going to have to sell a bike or two, but I can't resist the specs on that Nuvinci Koben. So, count me in.

It's a beautiful bike. Glad you put a big pack on the S. The battery is probably the main thing with the bike, which is what you say on the campaign page. I hope I read that right, that people get the S model if they pledge for the CVT (comments to Marc).

It does sound like Hong is biting the bullet and selling the full S at the $1637 for the first 25 since they can't change the listing once it is created - that is what I read that comment to mean as well. I too will have to sell a few things now :)