Long Range E-Bikes ?

JRA

Well-Known Member
I wouldn't consider folding bikes nor fat bikes to be "long range e-bikes". More like something with a dual battery setup like some of the Riese und Müller bikes have.
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Mike TowpathTraveler

Well-Known Member
It's all too subjective with varying elevation, wind direction and temperature; but my long term ownership of the Yamaha PW powered Haibike Full FatSix has shown I can get close to 40 miles at an average speed of 13 mph on a fully charged 500wh battery. And I certainly can believe that a Yamaha motored mtb or commuter style bike frame and 2.4 wide tire can deliver the expected 53 miles that Yamaha predicts in that high power setting; based off what I achieve with the 26 x 4 inch wide fat bike tires. I do believe Yamaha beats Bosch and the other mid drives in the "fuel mileage" department.

I had to go back in my Time Machine a bit, but in July of 2018, using my original 400wh battery and a combination of power settings (most of the miles done in Eco and Eco+ for maximum mileage), I did a canal towpath ride of 95 miles and had 18% power remaining in the battery. After that run, I learned that for the most fun, carrying multiple spare batteries with me was the ticket to running in High power vs those lower power settings. Here are a few pics of that ride.

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You can say I'm partial to Yamaha power....
 

mschwett

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
range is really a simple equation for eBikes. power available (battery size), efficiency (there’s a small range here, as long as you keep the motor in the sweet spot of speed), and power required to go the speed you want to go. that’s the big variable. by FAR the largest force acting up cyclists on level ground is drag from the air, so the longest “range” eBike is the one with the largest battery that allows a comfortable low-drag riding position, skinny, smooth tires, etc. such a bike ridden on level ground at low speed with a reasonable contribution from the rider will go very, very far. on the drops on a road bike it only takes 100 watts to go 16mph. If the rider provides 50 watts (which is nothing, practically ghost pedaling!) and the bike provides 50, a 500wh battery would last 10 hours, and you’d go 160 miles without breaking a sweat.

fat knobby tires sitting straight up trying to go 25mph, same 50w rider input, it would take 10 times the power from the bike. you’d go 25 miles, in one hour, and then the battery would be dead.
 

indianajo

Well-Known Member
But the really important question does your butt outlast the battery runtime?
Well, no. My hips have had it after 3.7 hours & 30 miles. But if the wind wasn't 25 mph in my face, my 840 wh battery has about a third charge left when I get there. Using the Mac12t motor: the ebikeling was about 1/3 less efficient, and the DD motor 2/3 of that. That was hauling 50-60 lb of cargo + me + 18 lb tools, tubes, water, bags. Next year, I'm sewing a seat cushion! A leather triangle holding in 3" of foam out of a sofa pillow & held in place by laces. There may be a new record distance coming up.
Bike has knobby 2.1"x26" tires, and I sit upright, so I break all the rules.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
What mschwett said is true. There are four major factors that are responsible for long range of an e-bike:
  • Air drag: high speed and upright riding position eat the battery tremendously
  • Elevation gain: the more climbs on the trip and the heavier bike/rider/cargo, the faster the battery is eaten
  • The battery capacity (you need electrons to be assisted!)
  • The rider's own input. Give more yourself and you'll ride farther.
(Other factors are not that critical).

@mschwett is an example of a healthy, strong person who can ride his lightweight, low power, and small battery road e-bike in aero position for long miles virtually unassisted. I am on the other end of the spectrum: my state of health requires me to use a lot of assistance to complete a long journey in reasonable time (as if I were a sporty and younger traditional cyclist). That calls for the spare battery on any ride longer than 40-50 miles for me. Now, can the spare battery be easily obtained? Can you afford it? Are you ready to carry it in a pannier on your rides, @e-boy?

Of your list, the Trek Allant+ 8S is what I call "a capable quality e-bike" that could be a long range steed, especially with a spare battery. I don't want to be an advocate for any brand but here are my example ride data (bear in mind e-bike is something to turn me from an unhealthy elder into a fit 40-yo person):
  • Specialized Turbo Vado 5.0: 168 km (104 mi) elevation gain 588 m (1,930 ft). 1,061 Wh used (two 600 W batteries, 6.05 Wh/km, 9.73 Wh/mi). Average speed of 22.9 km/h (14.2 mph), moving time 7 hours 20 minutes. Rider's own contribution 29.3%
  • Specialized Turbo Vado SL 4.0 EQ: 116 km (72 mi) elevation gain 244m (800 ft). 436 Wh used (main 320 Wh battery and a 160 Wh Range Extender. 3.75 Wh/km, 6.03 Wh/mi). Average speed 20.4 km/h (12.7 mph), moving time 5 hour 41 min. Rider's own contribution 50.4%
Both rides were taken under ideal cycling conditions (pleasant temperature, moderate wind).
Note that the SL e-bike, which is a lightweight, low power, and small battery ride allowed me a 70 mile trip without carrying a heavy spare battery, and a small Range Extender carried as if it were a water bottle was enough.
 
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Timpo

Well-Known Member
Pick a bike you like

Get an extra battery from Jenny.
(Such as Reention Polly, 48V 24.5Ah)

Parallel connect them using converter.
Eunorau Dual Battery Conveter

WattWagons Dual Battery Conveter

Bolton Dual Battery Parallel Connector
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
80 miles
Flat bar commuter / touring , 27.5 or 700c .
Not on a single battery unless you are strong and want to pedal a lot without assistance.

Here are my 80 mi ride data:
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Vado 5.0, a spare 604 Wh battery. Flat area, strong headwind for the half of the ride. Quite good average speed. A strong 38-yo female traditional rider was setting the pace...
 
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Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
I'm looking forward to test ride a Vado 5.0 EQ if one ever comes to my local dealer .
Please do not confuse a Vado with Vado SL. The first one is the full power/large battery one, the SL is a low power, small battery, lightweight e-bike. If you mention EQ it probably is the SL. Note: I have not tried an 80 miler on the Vado SL yet.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
P.S. I have a second Range Extender + 220 mm SL Cable for Vado SL on order. When I get it, the way for 80 milers is open. The RE is not dramatically expensive, and the extra battery with cable just weighs 2.4 lb... Good to be carried in a backpack!
 

6zfshdb

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Northeast Pennsylvania

You need to define "long range". As posted above, there are many contributing factors

The range of any bike can be extended if you carry spare batteries. I can easily exceed 100 miles with mine by carrying 2 spares. On most rides however, the bikes range exceeds my "butt" range.

Unless you are physically fit, the effective range is usually determined by the rider, not the bike.