Luna Smoothie cruiser... almost like Biktrix Stunner

Alex M

Well-Known Member
Luna Smoothie: (Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
Biktrix Stunner: (Link Removed - No Longer Exists) (Court reviewed an early version, now it's got better, with internal gears and front disc brake).

Both are step-through, mid-drive Bafang, rear internal cassette gears, downtube-mounted battery, flat-foot position (more pronounced in Luna).

Differences between the two:

Biktr: battery 36V/11AH, Luna: 52V/14A.
Biktr: motor BBS01 @500W, Luna: BBS02 @750W, and Luna offers $100 upgrade to BBSHD @1000W. The word is - BBS02 @750W is a bit under-built for peak outputs, while BBSHD "can" do 1,000W but is programmed for 750W, so it's actually over-built in this bike and thus not over-heating. I am ignorant in motors, go easy on me.

Luna: gear sensor for smoother shifting, Biktr - no. A matter of self-discipline, not too important.

Brakes:
Luna: rear coaster, front V-brake.
Biktr: rear drum brake, front disk.

Other distinctions:
Biktr tires 2.3.
Luna tires 1.95, somewhat skinny for a cruiser, "probably" could squeeze 2.3 there?

Price:
Luna: $1,730 with lights + S/H ($100? 200? don't know).
Biktr: $1,900 with lights, free S/H from some dealers (can always ship free to dealer and pick up, if I'm correct).

Nothing about controller of Luna Smoothie, or PAS levels, or throttle - override, trigger, squeeze? They could've done a better self-marketing job.

The ONLY review of Smoothie doesn't open on Luna website.

Any comments? Court, Roshan ;) ?
 
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Cameron Newland

Well-Known Member
With all due respect to the fine folks at Luna, that Smoothie is absoultely hideous. Specifically, the battery placement is atrocious and is much too high. On the Stunner, the battery was placed within the frame trapezoid and it looks like it belongs there. The Smoothie's battery just does not belong on that bike (at least aesthetically). Considering that you're allowed the option to spec the BBSHD on the Smoothie, I'd say that's too much motor for a bike with no suspension. The BBS02 would be a better fit on a smoothie as the power/speed is less extreme. Considering the aesthetic compromise (the poor fit of the battery up high on the downtube), I don't know if it's worth buying this bike unless you were planning on building your own DIY cruiser ebike and just wanted to save the time putting it together by having Luna do it for you.

It's true that the Stunner offers less power, however, on a casual bike like these cruisers, there's no need for the 1,500W that the BBSHD provides.
 

Alex M

Well-Known Member
BBSHD is nominal 1,000W. They program it on Smoothie to nominal (or peak?) 750W for street driving.
BBS01 of Stunner is nominal 500W, peak 750W.

No front suspension on a cruiser bike appears to be a norm. I would love to see more cruisers with front suspension, but they don't make them too often.

Yes, Smoothie somehow looks unusual. I'm wouldn't worry about battery being TAD high. There are other bikes with battery up high, and not protected by the "second downtube", and this is still better for balance than if it were on the rear rack. Also note that the "U" of Smoothie step-through is wider than average too, so stepping through shouldn't be too bad. Maybe this wide U is what makes it looking odd.

The picture with geometry shows 12" frame height - now, this is hard to understand, though with their "flat-foot" being that far forward maybe it works. Just thinking aloud.
 
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Alex M

Well-Known Member
Forgot to mention: if battery placed few inches lower and within the frame trapezoid is more important than the ease of stepping-through, here is Luna Comfort Cruiser: (Link Removed - No Longer Exists). It's not more "comfortable" than Smoothie - there is a top tube, though lowered a little.

Everything else is the same as in Smoothie - 700WH battery (!), 750W motor with optional upgrade to 1,000W, flat-foot.

Somehow they've found a back door to China, selling motors and batteries in the US at Chinese prices. BBS02 $350 bare motor, $450 with the kit.
 

harryS

Well-Known Member
I'm with Cameron here on the looks. If I had that bike and motorized it, I'd use a rack battery. It's a cruiser. No one is going to be leaning it in a turn or getting air. The Luna rack battery is only six pounds. I have one in 52V.
 

Joe Remi

Active Member
My main issue with it is the HEY I'M SUPER OBVIOUSLY AN EBIKE look with that battery in the air. A rack mount at least looks something like a regular bike.
 

Alex M

Well-Known Member
I used to think thought that looks were less important than safety/balance issues. You can't completely conceal the fact that it's an ebike.

700WH battery probably weighs over 10 pounds. Battery on the rack is more weight in the rear. On a step-through this is not as bad as on a regular bike where you have to swing your leg over the rack, but still more weight, especially if you add another 10-15 pounds of groceries.
 

Joe Remi

Active Member
I used to think thought that looks were less important than safety/balance issues. You can't completely conceal the fact that it's an ebike.

700WH battery probably weighs over 10 pounds. Battery on the rack is more weight in the rear. On a step-through this is not as bad as on a regular bike where you have to swing your leg over the rack, but still more weight, especially if you add another 10-15 pounds of groceries.

To clarify my clearly not clear comment, I don't actually care that folks know my bike is an ebike. I just think the Smoothie is egregiously obvious and weird-looking about it. I also think it's probably a really nice cruiser, and if one were on sale down the street for a nice price, I would buy it. It looks like a fun, kinda-like-riding-a-chopper bike.
 

ranny_v

New Member
Having had a bike with a rear mounted battery, I agree that it's not an ideal location for balance or for picking up the bike (rear heavy). Add loaded panniers and it gets even worse. The downtub mount is much better.

I currently have a BBS HD bike and would not recommend anything less than disk brakes (Luna has V-Brakes?). And if there is no suspension, a tire greater than 2" width would be most welcome. Don't assume a larger tire can be fitted. Fender clearance would probably preclude that.

The BBS HD has proven to be reliable for me and it has tremendous power. Maybe even too much power for a DIY kit bike. The PAS sensor, throttle and super power promotes laziness, but my bike can climb any hill I need to go up and do it very quickly.
 

Alex M

Well-Known Member
Yes, by the pictures of Smoothie (and it's step-over cousin Comfort) the flat- foot is same far forward as the Townie. This is what I like about it. If they make it black/grey like Townie, the battery and motor will blend in better. I also like 700WH battery, gear sensor and BBS02 - for $1,700 this is a lot for a ready-made bike. 750W nominal motor won't have to work as hard as 500W nominal, and they've changed something on BBS02, upgraded mosfets.

I don't understand about coaster brake on Smoothie - they just don't tell anything, like there is no brake at all. On Non-powered Smoothie that they also sell, it's a coaster, but there can't be a coaster on mid-drive. Probably V-brake same as on Comfort.
 

Alex M

Well-Known Member
In defense of 3-speed Luna let's not forget that Biktrix is also 3 speed. Front disc brakes though. All they need is to wake up and put 700WH battery pack full of Korean cells in Chinese plastic box, shouldn't be too difficult or expensive. With 500W motor it will have a range of Tesla car then :)

Elegant fame in Biktrix, yes. Flat-foot of Luna and ape-hanger handlebars are there for comfort, not for elegance.
 

Tushar Patel

New Member
I am trying to decide between the Luna Smothie/Comfort and the eProdigy Banff. The Banff motor is nominal 750W, peak 1000 (website is not yet updated) just like the Luna cycle ones.

I live in San Francisco and have some large hills (23 degree incline) to navigate.

The main advantage of the Banff is that I like the looks more and it is sold through a local dealer. I would have to get the Luna online.

The Banff has a 3 speed standard but has an optional upgrade for 5 speed. The battery is in the rear. The motor is made by them.

Luna seems to come with a well known motor - BBS02 or BBSHD and battery is in front. But its a 3 speed.

Any thoughts or comments?
 

Alex M

Well-Known Member
Not having experience with either motor, I'm not supposed to talk much... But... Proprietary motor = limited replacement choice or no choice = higher replacement cost. Any e-bike shop will be able to handle Bafang hub or BBS or will have it in stock. OTH, Luna store provides too little info about other - many! - small things that are important to me, like controller settings, throttle design etc. Court here needs to take one for a ride and tell us what he thinks :)
 

Chris Nolte

Well-Known Member
Some of the Luna bikes are okay. But this bike is a death trap. It effective has no rear brake because the mid drive freewheels so you can't make use of the coaster brake. I would stay away from this. Also - don't be fooled in thinking that you need 750 watts in San Fran. There are plenty of 250 watt and 350 watt bikes that would power up the hill just fine.

I would really encourage you to visit a proper ebike shop like the New Wheel or Motostrano. I think it will help you to make an informed decision. Neither Biktrix or Luna have dealers so you're kind of on your own if you need support. I think this is a major component that many don't consider until it's too late.

I hope I'm not coming across as bashing these companies, I just think these bikes are best suited for DIY people and I feel like you might have eluded that your not that type of guy. I would also not assume that it will be easy or cheap for dealers to help support these bikes.

I hope that my feedback is helpful. Feel free to reach out if I can assist further. I just want to help you avoid some pitfalls I've seen many others experience.
 

harryS

Well-Known Member
Looking at the Bafang website, they have a (Link Removed - No Longer Exists), but is only 250W and it can work a coaster brake. Luna says they use BBS02 or BBSHD. As far as I know, these cannot be pedaled backwards to work a coaster brake, unless maybe Luna has changed the freewheel on the pedals.

Potential buyer? Better ask the seller how the rear brakes work.
 

Alex M

Well-Known Member
Lower powered Bafang motors are finicky as well. Unless the rider pays attention to gearing they are subject to overheating and needing replacement controllers. They are definitely a DIY, unless an established SF shop is working with eRad or another supplier. Shops aren't often excited about doing repairs on products they don't sell or have experience with.

Matt from Empowered, a BBSxx reseller reports DIY warrantee serve has become more and more difficult. Motors would have to be pulled and sent back to the reseller for repair if out of owners skill set.
How many casual riders would need motor repairs within one year warranty?

And, leaving warranty issues aside, how many shops would not be able to repair 350/500/750 Bafang, given the number of brands and models powered with these motors? In the end, the whole motor costs less than $500 to replace.
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
Other than the large reseller of BBSxx motors now building bikes and eRad with shops in their system, the Bafang mid drive is primarily a DIY motor. I find very few OEM's, in the ever growing list of reviewed bikes here, using the BBSxx.
Perhaps it's a failure of the search engine and Google, but maybe you found some here? I tried again and found none
Here's one, there maybe more.

https://electricbikereview.com/brand/bmebikes/
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member