Motor cuts on and off

SteveD225

New Member
Region
USA
Hello! This is a question for riders using the Mahle ebikemotion system. I have a Cannondale Treadwell Neo. When in high assist and pedaling along, the bike starts to feel jerky. I'm nearly certain that the motor is cutting in and out. Is this the way the motor behaves when you reach the top speed (20 mph)? At the top speed I would expect the motor to give less and less assist but not cut out completely. It doesn't seem to happen at lower speeds. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks.
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
It sounds like that is what it is doing. Orbea Gain's do the same thing. But at about 15.3 Mph. The European standard for a sucky riding experience.
 

SteveD225

New Member
Region
USA
Thanks! I'll check it out again with a speedometer. I suppose it will be smooth up to max, jerky at max, and smooth again above max (no assist).
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
When I make bikes I normally disable this feature. Because it is APITA. Here is one of my unlimited bikes. Matching leather washers were used to hold the fenders. It is sooo much fun to blast past guys in spandex on a bike that does not really look electric. You can see the wire from what appears to be a range extender, if you look closely.
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PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
When I make bikes I normally disable this feature. Because it is APITA. Here is one of my unlimited bikes. Matching leather washers were used to hold the fenders. It is sooo much fun to blast past guys in spandex on a bike that does not really look electric. You can see the wire from what appears to be a range extender, if you look closely.
View attachment 122265
 

SteveD225

New Member
Region
USA
I road tested the bike again, this time with a speedometer. The assist gets uneven and jerky at about 15mph, so I guess it's another bug. This bike has had troubles since I purchased it.
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
A dealer can reload the firmware and check the hub lockring pickup. Cleaning the speed pickup magnet may do the trick. It is all proprietary. Not DYI on these bikes. 15.3Mph is the European limit for speed. 19.5 is the US limit. That is where is shutters and cuts out.
 

SteveD225

New Member
Region
USA
I think it gets uneven at around 10-15 mph. I pretty sure it keeps assisting after 15 mph so that doesn't appear to be the max. I haven't gotten up to 20 mph to see what happens there. Need to do more testing with speedometer. Thanks!
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
At the hub there is a magnet and a pickup. As the wheel rotates it calculates speed. Metallic crud from the road or chain and cog ware is attracted to the magnet and dirties it. Removing that dirt could potentially fix the bike. I am not a expert on these and last rode one three or four years ago. But I used to sell them and have some idea. I also work on eBikes daily. Good luck. What did you think of the bike I made a mid-drive and posted photos of above?
 

SteveD225

New Member
Region
USA
I'll look at that and also tell the repair guy your advice. Thanks very much. I think your bike is beautiful. I've never seen one with leather trim like that. The attention to detail is outstanding.
 

SteveD225

New Member
Region
USA
Yes, I saw the leather washers. Nice touch!

I did some more riding and discovered that the uneven assist occurs at about 15 mph (consistently). The resistance is smooth again at about 16 mph but I can feel no assist. I had the battery replaced recently to solve a charging problem - now my theory is that somehow the software got initialized to the European max speed of 15 mph. That would explain it!
 

Katy

New Member
Region
USA
I’ve had a similar issue with the Mahle ebikemotion hub motor briefly cutting out on my Cannondale Neo Tesoro SL, but for me it happens when I’m pushing hard on the highest level of assist, generally when I’m going up a hill. It also won’t charge, which apparently is an issue with the charger. Anyway, thanks for the tips above, I’ll pass them on to the bike shop. I miss being able to run errands on my bike!

Also the bike with the leather trim is GORGEOUS! You can’t even spot the motor!
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
Thanks, @Katy. Hub motors are well known to cut out under high load. Oddly this is the sign of a good motor. It is a failsafe to not burn out the motor. Cheaper ones will melt the internal gears or windings before they cut out. It is what also happens at the speed limit. I remove speed limiters when I use small mid-drives between the pedals. Here is one from last week for a commuter. I set the top speed at 45 with a wheel size of five inches.
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SteveD225

New Member
Region
USA
I’ve had a similar issue with the Mahle ebikemotion hub motor briefly cutting out on my Cannondale Neo Tesoro SL, but for me it happens when I’m pushing hard on the highest level of assist, generally when I’m going up a hill. It also won’t charge, which apparently is an issue with the charger. Anyway, thanks for the tips above, I’ll pass them on to the bike shop. I miss being able to run errands on my bike!

Also the bike with the leather trim is GORGEOUS! You can’t even spot the motor!
I was able to resolve my problem by contacting mahlesupport@qbp.com. The team in Spain sent over new software to reprogram the motor. Apparently my motor was cutting off at approx 15mph, which was incompatible with the U.S. gearing. The correct behavior is to cut off at approx 20 mph and to ease back on as you dip below the threshold so that the transitions feel smooth.
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
@Katy, I am giving it's older brother a total rebuild and makeover today. It has been ridden hard daily for years. These Crème bikes are only available in North America from BC and Montreal at about $1200 before shipping and not yet electric or with the special custom details. This one is getting all new goodies.
 

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Katy

New Member
Region
USA
@PedalUma That's very helpful, though disheartening (that it's normal and intentional behavior for the motor to cut out under load). I've found that it only happens after the battery has been run down a little bit, to below 75%. Is that still normal behavior?
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
@Katy, This is part of the nature of hub-drives. These drives are not run through the drivetrain's gears. These motors are stuck in one gear. If you had a Corvette or Porsche that was stuck in third gear it would lug in some situations and over-rev in others. Try putting 'hub-motor cuts out ebr.com' into a Google search or search from within EBR. I cannot call it normal, it is very common with these types of bikes particularly on climbs. @SteveD225's problem was firmware and that was solved.