My Civante reivew

Greydog

Member
Region
USA
Were you able to find out which cassette comes stock on our Civante?

I will find out today or tomorrow. The mechanic fixed my crank noise but could not fix the headset noise as the bearing is bad. Unfortunately, he did not change the chain or the cassette because he said there was nothing wrong with the old ones as they look brand new. He thought he was doing me a favor. So I will pick up the bike later today or Sunday with the new cassette and chain installed.

It looks like I am going to need a new frame. By the way, when he fixed the crank, he found that it was put together poorly and there was no grease to be found anywhere.
 

Oski1997

Active Member
Region
USA
City
San Diego
I will find out today or tomorrow. The mechanic fixed my crank noise but could not fix the headset noise as the bearing is bad. Unfortunately, he did not change the chain or the cassette because he said there was nothing wrong with the old ones as they look brand new. He thought he was doing me a favor. So I will pick up the bike later today or Sunday with the new cassette and chain installed.

It looks like I am going to need a new frame. By the way, when he fixed the crank, he found that it was put together poorly and there was no grease to be found anywhere.
I have headset noise too. greased the bolts on the headset so the problem is within the spacers (I believe). I haven’t gone in yet to do that. I’ll be watching YouTube videos soon to see what’s involved. I agree the bike was put together poorly. I thought I needed new front and rear derailleurs because the shifting took a couple of tries to work. My mechanic took them off to install Dura Ace ones when he saw that they were just installed incorrectly. I tightened the motor bolts but I didn’t check to see if they needed grease. I’ll be doing that next (thanks for the heads up).

Keep us posted and I hope you won’t need a new frame. That sounds a bit extreme (especially on an aluminum frame). But who knows. Thanks again
 

Greydog

Member
Region
USA
I just got my bike back. The Cassette is a CS-HG500-10. My mechanic greased the headset bearing and the sound is better but not gone.

The Cassette is a Tiagra Cassette. It weighs about 100 grams more than the 105 cassette.

With the new tires and drop in weight overall the bike definitely is more nimble and more responsive. Next up is to replace the seat and get a carbon seat post, new short reach handlebars, get rid of the 34t small chain ring and replace it with a 39t and eventually get the Schwalbe Aerothane tubes. This should shave another pound off the bike and make it more comfortable.
 
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Oski1997

Active Member
Region
USA
City
San Diego
I just got my bike back. The Cassette is a CS-HG500-10. My mechanic greased the headset bearing and the sound is better but not gone.

The Cassette is a Tiagra Cassette. It weighs about 100 grams more than the 105 cassette.

With the new tires and drop in weight overall the bike definitely is more nimble and more responsive. Next up is to replace the seat and get a carbon seat post, new short reach handlebars, get rid of the 34t small chain ring and replace it with a 39t and eventually get the Schwalbe Aerothane tubes. This should shave another pound off the bike and make it more comfortable.
Nice, thanks for the info on the Cassette. I’ll definitely get the 105 when it’s time for me to update. I don’t think Tiagra has a dedicated cassette thought. It’s under the Gravel groupsets (GRX, GRX 11-speed, GRX-10-speed). What do you think of the new e-bike rated Shimano chain on the 105? Doesn’t it make a world of difference! I saw a youtube video that rattling can come from inside the frame if the internal routing of cables aren’t in styrofoam?? Anyways, nice job on getting these upgrades. Enjoy your new ride!!
 
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Greydog

Member
Region
USA
I haven't had a chance to try the bike since I got it back due to rain. I will report back tomorrow if the rain stops although, we really need it. Global warming has really screwed up the weather. Too hot and too little rain in Minnesota is a bad sign for the world.

Here is the Tiagra Cassette on Amazon-
 

Oski1997

Active Member
Region
USA
City
San Diego
I haven't had a chance to try the bike since I got it back due to rain. I will report back tomorrow if the rain stops although, we really need it. Global warming has really screwed up the weather. Too hot and too little rain in Minnesota is a bad sign for the world.

Here is the Tiagra Cassette on Amazon-
That is so weird. On the Shimano website it shows this: https://bike.shimano.com/en-EU/product/component/grx-10-speed.html
 

Greydog

Member
Region
USA
It looks like they are using the the same cassette for both lines. Time will tell how the 105 cassette holds up to the torque. My mechanic said that the 105 is not as robust as the Tiagra but as long as it is locked down tight there should be no problems.
 

Oski1997

Active Member
Region
USA
City
San Diego
It looks like they are using the the same cassette for both lines. Time will tell how the 105 cassette holds up to the torque. My mechanic said that the 105 is not as robust as the Tiagra but as long as it is locked down tight there should be no problems.
I wonder why “not as robust”. If it’s a 10-speed, it should be just as thick, no? Maybe the old 10-speed 105 (5700)/Ultegra (6700) isn’t as thick as the newer 10-speed Tiagra (4700).

I just looked up the specs for the old Ultegra 6700 chain. The 105 ((5700) might have the same specs but it is heavier 304 grams compared to 6700 Ultegra 280grams. So maybe there are some differences that makes the new Tiagra (4700) cassette more robust (thicker??) than the older group sets

6700 Ultegra Features & details​

  • Redesigned inner and outer plates
  • New shaped outer plate, 116 links
  • New shaped inner plate for smoother rear shifting
  • Enhanced press-in construction for stable shifting
I am curious if you’ll notice worse/or the same shifting with the 5700 105 cassette because of the pull-ratios of our 4720 hydraulic levers and derailleur shift ratios compared to the cog pitches of the 105 cassette. I don’t have the info on the newer lever pull-ratios (4720) and the Cog pitches of the CS-HG500-10 cassette. Please let us know after you’ve had a chance to ride with the new cassette. I am learning that Shimano group sets are closed systems that include levers, derailleurs, calipers, cassettes, crank sets, chains. My view of bicycles (real bicycles) has expanded. They really are complete systems. Here is a list of cable ratios, derailleur ratios, cog pitches, etc from 2015. Does anyone have a newer graph that includes the newer group sets (9100, 8000, 7000, 4720 series)??
 

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Greydog

Member
Region
USA
The Tiagra uses steel and the chainrings are bonded together for lack of a better term. The 105's are not and use aluminum. If the 105 comes loose you can damage the freehub. That's why it needs to be on tight.
 

Oski1997

Active Member
Region
USA
City
San Diego
The Tiagra uses steel and the chainrings are bonded together for lack of a better term. The 105's are not and use aluminum. If the 105 comes loose you can damage the freehub. That's why it needs to be on tight.
Ah ok
 

Oski1997

Active Member
Region
USA
City
San Diego
The Tiagra uses steel and the chainrings are bonded together for lack of a better term. The 105's are not and use aluminum. If the 105 comes loose you can damage the freehub. That's why it needs to be on tight.
Any updates? How do you like your nee cassette and chain?
 

Greydog

Member
Region
USA
Any updates? How do you like your nee cassette and chain?

The chain does shift a little smoother.

I like the new cassette. I can't say it made shifting better but I now have more usable gears. Before I was mainly using gears 8 ,9 and 10 except for hills. Now I am using 6,7,8, 9 and 10 due to the narrow spacing. It also lightens the bike by about 100 grams. It does not seem like a lot but when you look at the total weight savings of what I have done to the bike it adds up to about 2 pounds and I should be able to drop another 1/2 pound or more with a Carbon seat post and new seat.
 

Oski1997

Active Member
Region
USA
City
San Diego
The chain does shift a little smoother.

I like the new cassette. I can't say it made shifting better but I now have more usable gears. Before I was mainly using gears 8 ,9 and 10 except for hills. Now I am using 6,7,8, 9 and 10 due to the narrow spacing. It also lightens the bike by about 100 grams. It does not seem like a lot but when you look at the total weight savings of what I have done to the bike it adds up to about 2 pounds and I should be able to drop another 1/2 pound or more with a Carbon seat post and new seat.
Wow, 2 lbs is a lot!! Was that just from the cassette, chain, new wheels?
 

Greydog

Member
Region
USA
Wow, 2 lbs is a lot!! Was that just from the cassette, chain, new wheels?
The new tires saved over 300 grams each, the cassette saves around 100 grams, the chain about 15 grams, the smaller tubes saves about 20 grams each and a new stem saves about 50 grams. So maybe 100 grams less than 2 pounds. 454 grams to a pound.
 

Oski1997

Active Member
Region
USA
City
San Diego
The new tires saved over 300 grams each, the cassette saves around 100 grams, the chain about 15 grams, the smaller tubes saves about 20 grams each and a new stem saves about 50 grams. So maybe 100 grams less than 2 pounds. 454 grams to a pound.
Wow, nice!!! Thanks for the breakdown. I’m jotting it down for my future upgrades
 

Greydog

Member
Region
USA
I will be saving additional weight with my new short reach handlebars, new lightweight seat, carbon seat post and the Schwalbe Aerothane tubes. The tubes will save about 80 grams each over my current tubes. I figure it will drop another 3/4 to 1 pound.

The bike definitely feels more responsive mainly due to the tires and shorter reach stem but the weight helps. I enjoy tinkering. I do like saving weight though. I use to have a 19 pound bike and it was a lot of fun to ride.
 

Oski1997

Active Member
Region
USA
City
San Diego
The chain does shift a little smoother.

I like the new cassette. I can't say it made shifting better but I now have more usable gears. Before I was mainly using gears 8 ,9 and 10 except for hills. Now I am using 6,7,8, 9 and 10 due to the narrow spacing. It also lightens the bike by about 100 grams. It does not seem like a lot but when you look at the total weight savings of what I have done to the bike it adds up to about 2 pounds and I should be able to drop another 1/2 pound or more with a Carbon seat post and new seat.
Can you explain how the 105 cassette (5700) allows you to use more gears compared to the CS-HG500-10 cassette? Does this mean the 105 cassette is “shorter” = makes finding a nice cadence easier Bc you now use gears 6 and 7? The narrow spacing allows for more fine tuning in? Does this mean the 105 isn’t as good as gears 1 and 10 as the CS-HG500-10 cassette Bc of spacing = “shorter” cassette?
 

Greydog

Member
Region
USA
You are correct that the 105 allows me to find a more comfortable cadence due to not as big a tooth gap between cogs. Below compare the spacing (number of teeth of each cog) of the 105 11-28t vs the Tiagra 11-32t. It does not seem like much of a difference but it is.


11-12-13-14-15-17-19-21-24-28 -105
11-12-14-16-18-20-22-25-28-32- Tiagra

There is no 11-28t for the Tiagra, only 12-28t. Shimano probably wants you to step up to a 105, as it makes no sense.

If you are doing mountains then stick with the Tiagra. I believe you can get an 11-30t or 32t 105 cassette though.
 

Oski1997

Active Member
Region
USA
City
San Diego
You are correct that the 105 allows me to find a more comfortable cadence due to not as big a tooth gap between cogs. Below compare the spacing (number of teeth of each cog) of the 105 11-28t vs the Tiagra 11-32t. It does not seem like much of a difference but it is.


11-12-13-14-15-17-19-21-24-28 -105
11-12-14-16-18-20-22-25-28-32- Tiagra

There is no 11-28t for the Tiagra, only 12-28t. Shimano probably wants you to step up to a 105, as it makes no sense.

If you are doing mountains then stick with the Tiagra. I believe you can get an 11-30t or 32t 105 cassette though.
I do a lot of climbs. Which cogs help with climbs most? The next time i ride, I’ll Pat attention to the cog I’m in to see if I would miss those teeth if I did change to a 105 :) Are you on Strava? Want to connect?
 

Greydog

Member
Region
USA
If you do really steep long climbs and use the small chainring upfront and are still working hard in the 28 or 32t cog you will want to stay with the Tiagra. If you find you can get by with the 28t cog then it may be worth it to upgrade. I never use the small chainring. I find that I can get by with gears 6-10 in STD or High mode for hills here in MN. Even the former Pro racer that I take my bike to rode the Civante and said it really does not need the small chainring and that is more of a 5 speed bike due to the power of the bike. Now I do not ride into canyons like you do or can in southern Cali. so I might use gears 1-5 if I was in your situation. I like to be in a comfortable cadence as much as possible and do not like the fast cadence of gears 1-5.

I do not have Strava. Maybe next year as I cut my hours back a little bit and have more time to ride. I wish I could ride daily.