My Creo (and other bikes probably) has a clutch on the rear derailleur and I did not know it

kahn

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
northWET washington
I got a flat the other day and the tire was really gashed and probably the tube. But when trying to remove the rear wheel I ran into an impossibly tightened through-axle. I could not get it loosened. I tried using a metal tire level. I even took off my shoe hoping to pound it loose. Neither scheme worked and I finally called for a ride, a semi-willing friend! While waiting for her, a truck drove into the lot and he had a heavy duty rubber mallet. It too three good zetz to loosen it. I probably could not have fixed it as it was quite a gash. And as I noted in another thread, I might have tried creating a tire boot or patch but with covid I no longer carry around any cash, the "old fold up a dollar bill" into a patch to line the inside of the tire as a temporary measure.

Okay, getting to the CLUTCH issue. Got home and decided to drive the wheel and tire to the bike shop for replacement/repair. Dropped the gear to the smallest gear. Undid the now loosened through-axle. The wheel dropped out without any issue whatsoever. Drove to bike shop, repair, and home. But waited till the next day to reinsert the wheel.

Well, I fought system/derailleur tooth and nail. I could not insert the wheel and engage the sprockets. Climbed from the basement to the second floor and reviewed videos of the method. Yes, that is what I thought I was doing. Back down and more thwarted efforts. Finally, I somehow managed to spring the derailleur and thread the wheel/gears and disc brake rotor and through-axle. Wheel spun. I was exhausted. Riding a bit later the darn chain popped off the front gear. Friend helped and mentioned the chain/derailleur seemed very stiff and resistant. I had read about CLUTCHES but did not know I had one or anything about them. Got chain back on by hook or crook.

This morning I learned about clutches and that my bike has one. I now even know where the lever is!!!

So, this was a tale of the CLUTCH and the KLUTZ.

Just in case this is new information to others.
 

kahn

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
northWET washington
ya when our derailleur got replaced on our tandem the new one had a clutch what is it for?
As Pedaluma's video link shows, it apparently provides more tension and therefore, takes up slack and prevents a "soft spring tensioned" derailleur from bouncing around and creating/removing slack.

But it was new to me and trying to re-insert the wheel was a real task since I did not know to release or turn it off.
 

Rider777

New Member
Region
USA
City
Vegas
V

I’m more interested in why you don’t carry cash ”because of COVID”?

Otherwise thanks for sharing your experience.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
ya when our derailleur got replaced on our tandem the new one had a clutch what is it for?
High end Shimano derailleurs have the Shadow Plus, or the clutch. The intention is to keep the chain tightened at all times. It makes hard for the chain to drop from the chainring in rough terrain, as it prevents the forward movement of the derailleur cage. You need to disable the clutch on the wheel removal.

The thru-axle threadlocked? Unheard-of-thing. A thru-axle is to be easily removed or tightened as often as necessary. Typical Specialized torque is 15 Nm, which is a high value.
 

kahn

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
northWET washington
V

I’m more interested in why you don’t carry cash ”because of COVID”?

Otherwise thanks for sharing your experience.
Not that I used cash much anyway but always had $15 or $20, singles, a five or ten. Well, for one, many shops were closed for a while like small coffee shops. Two, rather than dealing in cash in both directions, using the credit card even for small purchases became more of a standard. And, yes, we now know that it probably does not spread that way. Even now when I go into a shop, signs say "Credit cards preferred to cash"

And, now, I will find something to toss in the bike bag to create a boot/patch, probably an old piece of inner tube. (and I just had to check that 'boot' was the correct term for patching a gashed tire)
 

Rider777

New Member
Region
USA
City
Vegas
.
Here’s what I carry in my tool kit:

1629757669257.jpeg
 

wmason

Member
.
Here’s what I carry in my tool kit:

View attachment 97579
Since the topic has digressed to flat prevention here's a suggestion in the tubeless game. I fitted Vittoria Air Liner inserts three months ago and could not be happier:
Running Vittoria Corsa c30 tires. Just a wonderful combo for a great road experience. I too came to understand the clutch issue EVENTUALLY.
 

Prairie Dog

Well-Known Member
Region
Canada
City
Red Deer
There is also something called a cage lock. That is very different.
I have great faith in the Trance’s Shimano clutch system as I’ve actually forgotten to engage it on several occasions and the chain has never come off on any of those particular trail rides.

However, my last road outing on the Creo, the chain did manage to slip off even with the clutch engaged which prompted a slight adjustment to the tension screw.
 

kahn

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
northWET washington
Since the topic has digressed to flat prevention here's a suggestion in the tubeless game. I fitted Vittoria Air Liner inserts three months ago and could not be happier:
Running Vittoria Corsa c30 tires. Just a wonderful combo for a great road experience. I too came to understand the clutch issue EVENTUALLY.
Yes, EVENTUALLY and not till after I got the wheel back on. I mean I really struggled and had arranged for a friend to come over and help me. But somehow I managed it alone on about the fifth try and watching a rear wheel replacement video a few times - saying "That's what I'm doing - dammit!" The tension in the derailleur was matched by the tension in my back and shoulders! :eek: Now I can kind of chuckle.

I've now seen the video Prairie Dog posted and see the floppy chain it counters. But why on a road bike - well, probably because Specialized has seen the potholes in Seattle! And the root heaves across the MUP's!!
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
I need to check our tandem see if it is engaged. we have had the chain climb up onto the larger chainring a few times but it has been on not really bumpy ground. but there is a chain there already and causes issues;
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
There is another part of some rear derailleurs that is often referred to as a cable pully clutch. See photo. Again, that is a different animal. It has nothing to do with chain tension. I just use a spare thumb to extend the cage to drop the wheel into the dropouts. A dab of grease on the thru axil threads goes a long way. I have seen piece workers assemble bikes without grease - that is bad. One common error that people new to bikes make is overtightening, combined without using assembly grease. That is super bad on cheap eBikes with bolts made of cheese.
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1629765820601.png
 

GrayFox

Member
When my Vado SL was relatively new I tried to downshift while starting up a hill. The chain slid down and fell off the rear gear cluster and got wedged between the cluster and the chain stay, bummer. I was able to get the chain back onto the cluster but it was a lot of work.
I took the bike back to the shop and one of the techies noticed that the clutch was disengaged and looked at me suspiciously. At that time I did not even know where the clutch lever was located. I suspect that the last time the bike was serviced that someone in the shop forgot to engage the clutch.
Anyway I now carry a pair of plastic gloves in my kit in case this happens again. But with the clutch engaged the chain has never dropped.
 

kahn

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
northWET washington
When my Vado SL was relatively new I tried to downshift while starting up a hill. The chain slid down and fell off the rear gear cluster and got wedged between the cluster and the chain stay, bummer. I was able to get the chain back onto the cluster but it was a lot of work.
I took the bike back to the shop and one of the techies noticed that the clutch was disengaged and looked at me suspiciously. At that time I did not even know where the clutch lever was located. I suspect that the last time the bike was serviced that someone in the shop forgot to engage the clutch.
Anyway I now carry a pair of plastic gloves in my kit in case this happens again. But with the clutch engaged the chain has never dropped.
Clutch, what clutch???? I used my latex gloves when I went through my gyrations trying to get the wheel back on the clutch-engaged derailleur. And I forgot them at home when on a ride, the chain came off up front. And my chain got caught between the gear and a slight bulge in the motor housing! So, yes, black fingers rubbed diligently all over the black bike shorts!!!

I guess some of us would benefit if the bike shop gave us a nice once-over about our new bikes. Through-axles, derailleur clutch, disc brakes (and don't touch the brake levers), etc. Oh, pressing and holding the power-mode button to disengage the motor while still leaving the power on (I got that one on a video).
 

mschwett

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
… So, yes, black fingers rubbed diligently all over the black bike shorts!!!

I guess some of us would benefit if the bike shop gave us a nice once-over about our new bikes. Through-axles, derailleur clutch, disc brakes (and don't touch the brake levers), etc. Oh, pressing and holding the power-mode button to disengage the motor while still leaving the power on (I got that one on a video).
i always try and re-engage my dropped chain near some grass, so at least i can spit on my hands, rub them together, and rub them all over the grass.

i also found the clutch confusing. what does “on” mean? a clutch is either engaged or disengaged, without the clutch the drive of a car would be engaged, so is “clutch feature on” disengaged?!? i also think i rode with it in the wrong position for a while.
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
With dry lube your chain will not attract grime, so gloves are not needed. I have tried several brands. This one is slick. I keep some in a zip lock bag for doing chains off the bike after an ultra-sonic bath.
 

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kahn

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
northWET washington
With dry lube your chain will not attract grime, so gloves are not needed. I have tried several brands. This one is slick. I keep some in a zip lock bag for doing chains off the bike after an ultra-sonic bath.
You mean you really can escape the "black glove" syndrome? I can hardy believe that. (I once broke a chain and by the time it was field repaired, it looked like I had elbow length black opera gloves on)
black gloves.jpg


I omitted the pearls - seemed to fussy for bike riding!