Nyon MY21 - Initial Thoughts

Darlinsk

Member
Region
USA
The new Nyon MY21 was installed on my computer this week. I'd like to give a shout-out to Ravi Kempaiah who made it his personal project to get that computer on my bike. Thank you, Ravi!

The Bosch Nyon is, by far, the best bike computer I have ever used. It's elegant, intuitive, and robust -- quite an upgrade from the simplistic Purion display that came with the bike. It's got a beautiful touch screen that changes color based on the assistance level as well as a touchpad operating unit. My touchpad is mounted by the left brake lever which enables me to easily switch screens and change the assistance level without taking my hands off the handlebars; a real safety improvement.

Screen editing is simple and intuitive. Surprisingly, I already hit the limit of 24 data tiles, forcing me to remove redundant data (e.g., "Trip Distance" in multiple screens.) It's helpful to have the additional information, including power output (me vs. engine), time in assistance zones, granular battery status, ascent, gradient, cadence, and of course, navigation. I paired the Nyon with a Polar Verity Sense armband heart rate monitor, which is comfortable and worked flawlessly. All in all, I'm delighted.

I purchased both the Custom Riding Modes and Lock Feature. I might not ever use the Lock feature; I have an irrational fear of losing the computer and finding myself SOL. Isn't it like that? The more you worry about making a mistake, the more likely you are to do it.

Now, the Custom Riding Modes is another story. I couldn't wait to start messing with that. My bike, with an 85 Nm Performance Speed motor, is probably overpowered for what I'm doing, even though I'm an almost 68-year-old woman riding in hilly Western North Carolina. I insisted on a 1X drive train but now find that I am too often in the slightly cross-chained and decidedly noisy highest gear. I typically spend 55% in Eco; 30% in Tour and 15% in Sport. I never use Turbo. I've been fiddling with bringing the support levels down in all of the modes. Interestingly, a relatively minor change resulted in significant battery savings. Just taking each of the bottom three levels down 10% (60->50, 140 ->130, and 240 ->230) reduced my battery consumption from 53% to 40% on the exact same ride (27 miles, 2500 feet of climbing), with nearly identical speed and assistance. Unfortunately, I was still too often in the highest gear. I will continue tinkering with the assistance modes and report back. BTW, I like that I can change from custom riding modes to the Bosch default modes on the fly. It gives me the confidence to experiment.

Now for the wishes, questions, and problems:

  1. Navigation/Route Planning: Sometimes I can't turn a ride into a route. The Bosch ebike Connect site gives me the following message: "Could not map your route to existing roads. Your route will be visible on Nyon without turn by turn directions." This happens when I import the ride as GPX tracks from RideWithGPS and when I select Convert to Route in eBike Connect. None of the roads are new. This is a real problem for me, as I generally don't ride in the navigation screen and depend upon it telling me when to turn. Does anyone know of a work-around?

  2. Is there any way to see what the default Power Assistance profiles look like? Are they flat power, or are they curved? And how does the top Nm for each mode fit in with customized modes? There doesn't seem to be an option to fiddle with that when customizing the assistance modes. My guess is that it's a top-end limit, which wouldn't impact an old fart like me, but still, idle mind want to know. Also, I'm assuming that the Range is less meaningful for customized zones?

  3. There is data on the Nyon which is not accessible on the app or website, and is lost once the trip is reset (e.g., maximum slope, max/average power). I wish there were a way to select which data elements are accessible post-ride. I also wish that there were a field for battery watt consumption; my husband gets that on his Specialized Turbo Creo. It can be calculated reasonably accurately for a brand new, full battery, but otherwise is unattainable.
That's it for now. Should I post my navigation question to the Bosch Problems area?
 
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Darlinsk

Member
Region
USA
Update: After hours of fiddling, I might have come up with a work-around to my route planning woes. First off, I believe the issue is caused by small sections of the route that are unknown. And when I say small, I mean small ... like 143 feet! The Nyon is fairly tightly coupled with Komoot. Specifically, it can automatically download to Komoot, and more importantly, for me, routes created in Komoot are visible on the Nyon. So, I pulled the GPX Tracks info into Komoot to see what it would do. It complained a bit about the small off-grid section but gave me the option of modifying the route to be on-grid or accepting it as is. Needless to say, I took both options and now have two routes, both visible on the Nyon navigation screen. They both appear to offer turn-by-turn directions, so I might be in business. I'll let you know. Dogged determination pays off!
 

WinterKill

Member
Region
USA
City
East Bethel
I just got my bike back from my LBS last week after getting it upgraded from the Purion to the Nyon 21. I very much agree with your write up above.

I have been looking at Ride w/ GPS and Komoot since I picked it up. I had never previously used either. From the little I know so far it I think I like Ride w/ GPS better except for the fact that Komoot and Nyon are linked together.

I did try importing a FIT file into Komoot that I created in Ride GPS. It converted and it looked good. But when I used it it seamed a little confused. My start and Finish points where in the same location. The Nyon kept saying I was at the finish when I was starting out. Then I turned off the route rode a 100yards farther up the route and restarted the route. This time it wanted me to do it in reverse. I reversed the route and then I got a cookie trail with no turn by turn, I was on a bike trail so maybe this was it. I am new to this so most of these could still be user error.

It does look like Komoot will Import various file types in addition to GPX an FIT so I plan to experiment to see if any work better than others.

I do wish the Nyon would allow importing more file types, I would like to import Fit or TCX files made in Ride GPS.

I did make a route in Komoot with some off grid routing by using clicking in waypoints along a logging trail I wished to follow, I have not been able to ride it to see how well it works.
 

Ravi Kempaiah

Well-Known Member
I am glad you are enjoying the bike w/ the Nyon display. By far, it is the best E-bike computer on the market.
The amount of insight one can get about one's riding habits, power delivery, assistance, heart rate, etc, is amazing.
 
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Alaskan

Well-Known Member
The new Nyon MY21 was installed on my computer this week. I'd like to give a shout-out to Ravi Kempaiah who made it his personal project to get that computer on my bike. Thank you, Ravi!

The Bosch Nyon is, by far, the best bike computer I have ever used. It's elegant, intuitive, and robust -- quite an upgrade from the simplistic Purion display that came with the bike. It's got a beautiful touch screen that changes color based on the assistance level as well as a touchpad operating unit. My touchpad is mounted by the left brake lever which enables me to easily switch screens and change the assistance level without taking my hands off the handlebars; a real safety improvement.

Screen editing is simple and intuitive. Surprisingly, I already hit the limit of 24 data tiles, forcing me to remove redundant data (e.g., "Trip Distance" in multiple screens.) It's helpful to have the additional information, including power output (me vs. engine), time in assistance zones, granular battery status, ascent, gradient, cadence, and of course, navigation. I paired the Nyon with a Polar Verity Sense armband heart rate monitor, which is comfortable and worked flawlessly. All in all, I'm delighted.

I purchased both the Custom Riding Modes and Lock Feature. I might not ever use the Lock feature; I have an irrational fear of losing the computer and finding myself SOL. Isn't it like that? The more you worry about making a mistake, the more likely you are to do it.

Now, the Custom Riding Modes is another story. I couldn't wait to start messing with that. My bike, with an 85 Nm Performance Speed motor, is probably overpowered for what I'm doing, even though I'm an almost 68-year-old woman riding in hilly Western North Carolina. I insisted on a 1X drive train but now find that I am too often in the slightly cross-chained and decidedly noisy highest gear. I typically spend 55% in Eco; 30% in Tour and 15% in Sport. I never use Turbo. I've been fiddling with bringing the support levels down in all of the modes. Interestingly, a relatively minor change resulted in significant battery savings. Just taking each of the bottom three levels down 10% (60->50, 140 ->130, and 240 ->230) reduced my battery consumption from 53% to 40% on the exact same ride (27 miles, 2500 feet of climbing), with nearly identical speed and assistance. Unfortunately, I was still too often in the highest gear. I will continue tinkering with the assistance modes and report back. BTW, I like that I can change from custom riding modes to the Bosch default modes on the fly. It gives me the confidence to experiment.

Now for the wishes, questions, and problems:

  1. Navigation/Route Planning: Sometimes I can't turn a ride into a route. The Bosch ebike Connect site gives me the following message: "Could not map your route to existing roads. Your route will be visible on Nyon without turn by turn directions." This happens when I import the ride as GPX tracks from RideWithGPS and when I select Convert to Route in eBike Connect. None of the roads are new. This is a real problem for me, as I generally don't ride in the navigation screen and depend upon it telling me when to turn. Does anyone know of a work-around?

  2. Is there any way to see what the default Power Assistance profiles look like? Are they flat power, or are they curved? And how does the top Nm for each mode fit in with customized modes? There doesn't seem to be an option to fiddle with that when customizing the assistance modes. My guess is that it's a top-end limit, which wouldn't impact an old fart like me, but still, idle mind want to know. Also, I'm assuming that the Range is less meaningful for customized zones?

  3. There is data on the Nyon which is not accessible on the app or website, and is lost once the trip is reset (e.g., maximum slope, max/average power). I wish there were a way to select which data elements are accessible post-ride. I also wish that there were a field for battery watt consumption; my husband gets that on his Specialized Turbo Creo. It can be calculated reasonably accurately for a brand new, full battery, but otherwise is unattainable.
That's it for now. Should I post my navigation question to the Bosch Problems area?
Definitely post your ideas to the Bosch brand forum. They will report up the food chain to corporate. You never know what good idea will be adopted and included in the next firmware update.
 

Captain Slow

Well-Known Member
Agreed, but I think I'll stick with my Creo and the Aethos I've got on order for the road. I'm thinking in another couple of years of getting a Bosch powered bike for an errand runner/grocery getter. I think a high torque motor that will tow a trailer so I can do reasonable sized grocery runs. But maybe that's just me trying to find an excuse to buy another bike! In reality I'm still going to own a car so who am I fooling ...............

But the Nyon is just so cool that it's making me want a Bosch powered bike!
 

Ricky_1973

New Member
Region
Europe
I've asked this in another thread but that got burried somehow - does anyone of you know what these icons do/mean when starting a route? I haven't found anything in a manual yet...
nyon_icon.png

Thanks!
 

retiredNH

Active Member
Region
USA
It's too bad Trek specified the smartphone hub with its Allant 8s. The smartphone hub is a far less flexible device, with some odd quirks and terrible documentation.
 

amayers

Member
Region
USA
I've asked this in another thread but that got burried somehow - does anyone of you know what these icons do/mean when starting a route? I haven't found anything in a manual yet...
View attachment 87334
Thanks!
The left one with an A starts the planned route from the beginning. So if the route was from A to B, and you are at C, it will route you to A, and then B. The right one navigates from your current position C directly to B. So for me, the right one is what I want 99% of the time.
 

Alaskan

Well-Known Member
@William - Bosch Team This was posted on the Facebook Riese & Muller group today by a rider in Denmark. Has he correctly identified a possible cause for the problems in navigation that people outside of Germany have been experiencing with getting their Nyon to route them correctly on bike lanes and paths because that is verbotten with high speed bikes in Germany?

"As I’ve mentioned before the gps is not only crap but absolutely useless if you’re on a HS bike. It will only allow directions on main roads and therefore it will convert any route you make in a third party app to a route without bike paths or forest routes. It’s the law in Germany apparently so they just make this a standard on the Nyon instead of customizing them for different markets like they do with the motors. In Denmark HS bikes can go wherever normal bikes can go but I’m stuck with using my phone because of this intrusive limitation that neither R&M or Bosch advertise anywhere
😤
"
 

retiredNH

Active Member
Region
USA
So add this to the list of undocumented "features" on Bosch products. Their German centrism is a bit much, isn't it?
 

Alaskan

Well-Known Member
So add this to the list of undocumented "features" on Bosch products. Their German centrism is a bit much, isn't it?
It is a minor foible that the USA Bosch team is working to rectify.

Bosch is a huge135 year old company with a broad range of product lines, divisions, distribution and facilities all over the world.

It is a company that 50 years of driving experience has taught me to trust. The electrical components of most high end German cars are made by Bosch. Bosch makes some of the best and most reliable power tools with the most durable rechargeable batteries.

Like all relatively new and rapidly changing product lines, there are growing pains with some of their ebike products, but so much fewer with far superior support than any other company.
 
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Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
Bosch closed ecosystem reminds me of cars equipped with a GPS navigation system in their main console. Such systems are fixed, and not necessarily best fit to local traffic conditions (that might frequently vary; for instance a detour because of construction works or sudden traffic jam). Open GPS navigation systems (especially these locally made and supported) can detect traffic obstruction almost immediately; or report a police speed trap in minutes.

Having said the above, I can be only glad to own a non-Bosch e-bike that is not display-centric but (quite oppositely) based on connectivity with external devices (displays, smartphones/apps, sports wearables).

I hope you Richard would not mind my little but honest critics of the Bosch bike system ;)
 

Alaskan

Well-Known Member
Bosch closed ecosystem reminds me of cars equipped with a GPS navigation system in their main console. Such systems are fixed, and not necessarily best fit to local traffic conditions (that might frequently vary; for instance a detour because of construction works or sudden traffic jam). Open GPS navigation systems (especially these locally made and supported) can detect traffic obstruction almost immediately; or report a police speed trap in minutes.

Having said the above, I can be only glad to own a non-Bosch e-bike that is not display-centric but (quite oppositely) based on connectivity with external devices (displays, smartphones/apps, sports wearables).

I hope you Richard would not mind my little but honest critics of the Bosch bike system ;)
I do not mind at all. To each his own.

Personally, I don't like using my phone as a critical part of my bike. I would rather leave it protected, in its case sitting securely in my pocket. I would much rather rely on securely mounted, purpose built display/computer/navigation devices, fully integrated with the bike's own sensors and data system.

My preference is an artifact of my career as a professional mariner, where I learned that dedicated electronic navigational devices that did not have to perform all manner of unrelated functions, were far more reliable and subject to way fewer connectivity issues and system crashes. PC navigational programs had many attractive features. I used them extensively and found them useful. I also preferred their mouse and keyboard user interface rather than joy stick and touch pad common to marine dedicated devices. However when it came to reliability, they were a distant second best option. Fortunately on a 28 meter boat, there is plenty of real estate on the dash in the pilot house to accommodate multiple systems and redundancy. In a smaller environment, my choice will always go toward stability, reliability and full system integration. In the case of a Bosch Ebike that means Nyon, not smart phone hub or outside vendor phone navigation.

7299268_20200115144559113_1_XLARGE.jpg
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
If you say Richard the new Nyon can display the Motor/Biker's Power Ratio then I'm completely bought!

(Well, the display is the feature that cannot be taken off the handlebars and tucked into jersey back-pocket. Smartphone can. Think e-MTB).
 

William - Bosch Team

Active Member
@William - Bosch Team This was posted on the Facebook Riese & Muller group today by a rider in Denmark. Has he correctly identified a possible cause for the problems in navigation that people outside of Germany have been experiencing with getting their Nyon to route them correctly on bike lanes and paths because that is verbotten with high speed bikes in Germany?

"As I’ve mentioned before the gps is not only crap but absolutely useless if you’re on a HS bike. It will only allow directions on main roads and therefore it will convert any route you make in a third party app to a route without bike paths or forest routes. It’s the law in Germany apparently so they just make this a standard on the Nyon instead of customizing them for different markets like they do with the motors. In Denmark HS bikes can go wherever normal bikes can go but I’m stuck with using my phone because of this intrusive limitation that neither R&M or Bosch advertise anywhere
😤
"
Thanks for sharing this! I'll pass it along to the team.

They are still working on the navigation topic that was brought up for NYC. It's a bit of a process as it involves interfacing with the company that provides the maps, etc. Based on some of the info we've looked at for NYC, and other places, I'm not sure if it's the 45km/ Speed pedelec issue, or something else.
 

Darlinsk

Member
Region
USA
Nyon Bluetooth Connection Woes - Solved!

Over the past month, I've struggled mightily with the Nyon Bluetooth connection to my phone. The Nyon connects to my heart rate monitor flawlessly, but would often fail to connect to my phone, or randomly (so it seemed) disconnect. I went through the process of forgetting the devices on both my phone and the Nyon over and over, reconnecting, failing, disconnecting, restarting ... oh woe is me. I felt like one of those crazy people who keeps doing the same thing over and over despite it not working!

I even called Bosch twice about the issue. They answer the phone and are very responsive, but not terribly familiar with the product as it is so new in this country. They absolutely get an A for effort. :) Anyhow, as it turns out, the Nyon will only connect and stay connected to the phone when the Bosch eBike Connect app is opened. So there you have it! Why it took me so long to figure that out, is a mystery. I will say that it is not mentioned in the manual, and neither of the Bosch techs I spoke to was aware of that requirement. But now it works, and we're all happy. I will update the Bosch tech support with this information.
 
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retiredNH

Active Member
Region
USA
So many things poorly documented by Bosch! It's sad because it really lowers the quality of the products in my mind. I struggled for weeks with cobi.bike and the smartphone hub because of undocumented things. Wonder why they can't get these things straight?