Ongoing issues with LMTD

LAMike240

New Member
@krdugger
Please contact me regarding continued issues with my LMTD received in Sept. 2020. I’ve been patiently trying to work through issues, but communication and responsiveness has been lacking. I’m currently on my 3rd controller and consider this bike unsafe to ride.

If you wish to contact me privately, you have my contact information in your system. I would appreciate a phone call and resolution. We are now in the 5th month of trying to get resolution.
 

krdugger

Member
What was the issue? Why is in unsafe to ride? My CS team said that you had a complaint about the power application, or the application of power via the torque sensor system. If you could share more information, that would be great. Saying that it is unsafe and has been 5 months is a bit misleading, as the complaint of the torque application was resolve initially, but when brought up again, our team has worked to gather data from you and find the correct solution. Each time the respond rapidly during business hours. I'd like to help you, but I am guessing our support has already provided updates?
 

LAMike240

New Member
Hi Kevin,

I had asked that you contact me off list, but since you responded here, i'll go ahead.

For the details and data, please check with Ryan as to what the issues are, how long I've owned the bike, the fact that while he has been trying to work through the issue with me, to date, there is no resolution.

Issues started with this bike as I picked it up from the LBS after being assembled. I didn't even make it out ot the parking lot before it through an Error 21. I contacted Support and it took a couple of weeks, but i received a new controller that solved that issue. My friend who picked up his LMTD the same day threw the same error code as well. This was a known issue and rectified promptly.

Since replacing that 1st controller, on just about every ride, the power cuts out. 99% of the time, the cut out is on hills. Not mountains, not steep hills. Moderate to shallow, varying durations. The last time I rode the bike, the power cut out twice on flats as well. Support has all the details.

Support sent me a new controller (#2). It did not fix the issues. Support then sent me another controller (#3). This is the one that has cut out on the flats. A number of emails transpired where I have given Support more information, so much so, that I felt like we were going around in circles with no movement towards resolution. I've actually asked, what was the path towards resolution of this matter. Support had me take multiple shots of the Torque sensor wire, as well as all the wiring from the controller and display.

I am now waiting for my 4th controller and a new display unit.

Support has responded promptly within business hours? I do not agree with that. I'll give you that 2 days may be prompt. 4 days waiting for an email asking for more information is not prompt. I will give you that the rep i've been working with, does respond late evenings sometimes. It usually takes a call to Support and a voicemail to prompt a response. I've also asked Support to have the rep i'm working with call me back. I think I was able to speak with him directly once or twice.

I realize that the ebike business is booming due to the pandemic and everyone is trying to play catch up, but "email only" support is not the way keep customers happy. It may be fine for the guy who is missing a part when the bike is delivered, but for more indepth service and troubleshooting needs, there must be other options and more communication. In this day and age, a Zoom or Facetime call to have some interactive support during the troubleshooting process may be helpful.

As to why do i consider this bike unsafe? When the PAS quits on a hill and all momentum is lost, I consider that usafe. The number of times this bike has cut out is unacceptable. If your car stalled out on in traffic, multiple times, would you not call that "unsafe"? I think many would.
In 5 months I've only put 300 miles on the bike. The bike is sitting awaiting the new parts, with little confidence that they will rectify my issue. I've spent $1,800 on a piece of equipment that does not work properly and at this point appears to not be fixable. I surely hope that is NOT the case, as when the bike works, its a blast.

Once again, I make the offer to discuss this privately off line. Perhaps open the discussion up discussing ways to improving the Support experience for everyone. Once again, I think the staff does a great job working with the tools they have, I think the process needs improvement.
 

krdugger

Member
Hello, When you say "on just about every ride, the power cuts out. 99% of the time, the cut out is on hills. Not mountains, not steep hills. Moderate to shallow, varying durations. The last time I rode the bike, the power cut out twice on flats as well. Support has all the details." Are you referring to PAS, throttle, or both? If PAS, which PAS setting was it in when it 'cuts out'? Additionally, is it dropping gradually from high wattage, or slowly? Do you have a video you could share? We have heard this comment three times before, but in all three cases, it was normal functionality. The PAS will stop providing assist if there is too much resistance for the motor. Also, there is overheat protection for the motor and controller on the LMTD. Finally, the torque sensor requires application of torque for PAS to be engaged. If you could share any specifics on how exactly the power is 'cutting out' that would help greatly. Thank you.
 

LAMike240

New Member
Kevin, thanks for you quick response. Honestly, Support has all the details that I’ve reported and I’m not going to rehash them here. Please look through the email thread I have with them. I don’t have any video, as I don’t have anything but my phone camera available and cannot mount it in such away as to shoot the display. This was explained to Support.

Yes, 99% if the rides. I’ve probably only had a handful of rides where I wasn’t forced to stop and re-cycle the power on the display a few times to get power back.
 

GenXrider

Active Member
It's normal functionality for power to cut out on shallow hills. Try riding downhill or on flat ground. You're expecting too much from the LMT'D. :D
 

LAMike240

New Member
Kevin, thanks for you quick response. Honestly, Support has all the details that I’ve reported and I’m not going to rehash them here. Please look through the email thread I have with them. I don’t have any video, as I don’t have anything but my phone camera available and cannot mount it in such away as to shoot the display. This was explained to Support.

Yes, 99% if the rides. I’ve probably only had a handful of rides where I wasn’t forced to stop and re-cycle the power on the display a few times to get power back.
Kevin,

when power cuts out, it does so quickly and immediately. No gradual decrease as far as I can tell. In addition, on the hills this is usually PAS 2-3 and I am up out of my seat pedaling, so there is surely torque being applied. I never try to motor my way up a hill on throttle alone.
Please know, I am a casual / leisure rider. The hills I talk about are my local streets, not MTB or dirt trails.

I’ve received the new controller today and will be replacing both that and the new display tonight. Weather and workload allowing, I plan to get out on a ride tomorrow per Supports recommendations.
Thank you.
 

krdugger

Member
When it cut's out, does the throttle stop working as well? If you were to stop, and lift up the wheel, would the throttle not work? I'm just trying to figure out if it was an overheat protection, if something else was wrong, or if it was an expectation issue. I'm still not sure. Your latest explanation did help though, thank you.
 

LAMike240

New Member
It's normal functionality for power to cut out on shallow hills. Try riding downhill or on flat ground. You're expecting too much from the LMT'D. :D
When it cut's out, does the throttle stop working as well? If you were to stop, and lift up the wheel, would the throttle not work? I'm just trying to figure out if it was an overheat protection, if something else was wrong, or if it was an expectation issue. I'm still not sure. Your latest explanation did help though, thank you.
Yes, every time the power cuts to the motor, the throttle is also cut. Display still has power. If I power cycle the display 2 or 3 times over a few minutes it comes back. This occurs on almost every ride at some point.
I was able to get the new controller and display installed tonight. Hoping to get out on a flat ride tomorrow. Thank you.
 

krdugger

Member
Okay, let us know. I wonder if it could have possibly been overheat protection. This only happens up hills? Overheat wouldn't happen every ride though, so not likely.
 

LAMike240

New Member
Okay, let us know. I wonder if it could have possibly been overheat protection. This only happens up hills? Overheat wouldn't happen every ride though, so not likely.
I’ll start using All Trails to map the rides. It seems like it shows better altitude and grade information. Most of the rides in the area I live in are a combo of flats and the grades I’ve described earlier. I was surprised when the last ride cut out on the flats towards the end of the ride.
 

GenXrider

Active Member
Good luck with the 4th controller finally resolving the issue. I was considering a LMT'D myself, but I hate to lose half the riding season swapping controllers. :confused:
 

LAMike240

New Member
I’ll start using All Trails to map the rides. It seems like it shows better altitude and grade information. Most of the rides in the area I live in are a combo of flats and the grades I’ve described earlier. I was surprised when the last ride cut out on the flats towards the end of the ride.
Kevin,

Did about 9 miles, very windy, about 600’ elevation gain. A short ride, no issues. Rode mostly with PAS. 1-2 for most of the ride, 3 when into strong headwinds. Ambient temperature about 62.
 

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GenXrider

Active Member
I wouldn’t knock the entire run of LMTD bikes. Buy what you need. Good luck.
Knocking a "run"? I'm just saying that I wouldn't want to spend a lot of time working out controller issues. Seems like a lot of people had issues with them. 4 might be a record, though. I don't really "need" any ebike, it's more of a "want" for me. The Core-5 or 700 might be safer bet.

I would recommend riding further to test the new controller including up some big hills.
 

Dallant

Well-Known Member
4 different controllers and still having problems? Unacceptable. Time to spend a little more and buy a Trek.
 

LAMike240

New Member
Hi Kevin,

I wanted to give a quick update to you and the thread with some updated information. I’ve gone on 4 rides since installing the new controller and display. Yesterday’s ride was the longest at 22 miles and had the most elevation changes of the four.

Ambient temps were about 60° And there were some decent winds in the area.
The bike performed flawlessly throughout this ride and the previous 3. I was using PAS 2/3 for a good portion of the uphills, pulling 700-950W at times with no issues.

While I’m hoping the issue has been resolved, I am curious to how the bike will perform as we head into Spring and Summer with higher ambient temps. Hopefully this was not an issue with overheat protection kicking and and the bike will remain fully functional.
I’ve reported these finding to Ryan in Support as well.

Thank you,

Michael
 
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Region
USA
City
San Diego
I wouldn’t knock the entire run of LMTD bikes. Buy what you need. Good luck.
Hang in there Mike.
Hi Kevin,

I wanted to give a quick update to you and the thread with some updated information. I’ve gone on 4 rides since installing the new controller and display. Yesterday’s ride was the longest at 22 miles and had the most elevation changes of the four.

Ambient temps were about 60° And there were some decent winds in the area.
The bike performed flawlessly throughout this ride and the previous 3. I was using PAS 2/3 for a good portion of the uphills, pulling 700-950W at times with no issues.

While I’m hoping the issue has been resolved, I am curious to how the bike will perform as we head into Spring and Summer with higher ambient temps. Hopefully this was not an issue with overheat protection kicking and and the bike will remain fully functional.
I’ve reported these finding to Ryan in Support as well.

Thank you,

Michael
22 Miles? I get maybe 17 miles before charge is falling rapidly.
And my controller acts intermittently different, cutting out sometimes, some not - with both the thumb throttle and the new twist throttle.
Are you running stock settings via the display? My PAS settings were set at 0-9 with "9" providing only 80%.
To be honest, I just went back into the settings > current limit and found it set at 4 amps? I'd say, considering the controller is 'nominal' 11A and 22A peak - an almost scary thought considering how much power I now now have - my machine is being strangled.
Also, this may contribute to the jerky ride. You're at 4 amp and it cuts out ... not much power range available.
You seem way ahead of me on this problem, so I assume you have have the manual and have gone over the settings.
file:///C:/Users/Media/Desktop/R1U%20KD218-Display-Manual-Gen2.pdf
I'm heading out now for a test run. I really feel dumb not spotting that setting. Sheeeesh.

Fn'F