Opinions on Gain M20i for a decent women cyclist

MartinPL

New Member
Region
USA
Hi folks
My girlfriend (52) is a decent cyclist: front group within her age minus 15 (amateur) and OK with rides up to 80 km. We ride often together and here she suffers a bit and I get very little workout. Riding together is pleasant while riding at more aggressive pace and longer distances would be fantastic (for both of us :). She rides De Rosa size 54cm (reach 389, stack 550) which is a bit big for her (size smaller would have much shorter stack) with Di2. She rides well in pace line, descends fast, and is a good climber considering her physique and age.

I enjoy riding primarily in the mountains and this terrain creates biggest differences in our riding pace. In addition she wants to ride gravel which I ride a lot (gravel terrain also is quite hilly). And so here comes the concept of M20i which would allow us to ride together at faster pace, longer distances and also gravel. US spec with motor support up to 20 mph.

Main questions/concerns (except of availability which is a big unknown now; in store availability would also answer some of the below questions but ....)
- general handling and balance of the bike. those of you who rode on race bikes before would you have any comparison? I like the bike that is like on rails. One of my favorites is Cannondale SuperSix Evo - a blast climbing, going fast down, turning, lightweight enough and aero enough. I feel like one on that bike. I wonder what Gain is like
- lack of torque sensor. How does X35/X35+ deal with it. what happens when you are on level 1 pushing hard on a slight 4% incline near max motor support speed of 20 mph. what happens if you are on level 3 as above but on 8% incline?
- (question was asked in a different tread but ..) what happens to the 20 mph max motor support speed when the bike is brought to Europe?
- size? M20i size M is R:388, S:575. size S is R:377, S:550. So with S she would be same as on De Rosa with 1cm longer stem and it gives her possibility to ride smaller geometry than 54cm De Rosa. She is 174cm with rather longer legs and shorter torso. According to Orbea charts size M covers 170-180cm tall individuals but as we know personal preferences might move you up or down a size. What do you think?
- How is the bike on gravel. The geometry is rather endurance than race so that should be good but how is stiffness and compliance on not-so-smooth terrain?
- how good are the OC2 carbon 42mm wheels? Stiff? any flexing when pushed hard out of the saddle? They would be used with 28mm road tires and 35 to 40 mm gravel tires
- OEM OC2 road carbon bars - do they look the same as non-carbon. If so I might consider getting aftermarket ones with flatter tops (more aero looking too)
- any other comments related to this bike used for purposes described above?

Many thx for any input
 

Ebiker01

Well-Known Member
Tiny battery. It is a 180wh b/c u should not use it below 20% cappacity or start with 100%. 25%- 95% is the wh range.
Also this motors (ebikemotion/fazua type) r very weak on inclines above 6%.
 

MartinPL

New Member
Region
USA
Thanks @Ebiker01 . Good info about recommended usable range of the battery.
I was under impression that X35 will do quite well for cyclists that still want to put big effort into riding and climbing. It's the on-line reviews that led me to this conclusion. One of them being the Bikeradar's review of Scott Addict eRide.
"What most people in the market for a bike like the Addict eRIDE want to know though is how it climbs. The short answer is brilliantly." and on and on ..
 

Ebiker01

Well-Known Member
D
how it climbs. The short answer is brilliantly." and on and on ..
Depends on who test it the ebike , their weight/fitness ;one rider could put 125watts of their own, another 300watts .

See if in any of the reviews they mention
their weight and how much wattage they were putting.

There could be a thread or 2 about the Orbea gain or other eroad bikes that have this motor and battery , check if there are any. Ebr own membrs reviews are much better 😉
 

MartinPL

New Member
Region
USA
Surely there is a diff between someone producing very low Wattage/kg verus someone average of good. What we are looking for is to support the rider's effort rather than almost entirely provide it. My GF puts easily over 2.5 W/kg meaning she can push the bike up. The q is if she can do it faster on an ebike. I just looked at one of the comparisons of X35 vs. Fazua (performed on the hill) and X35 looks really good. Considering the stealthiness and the weight of the X35 ebikes it's a winner compared to the other bikes for us. The rider must push the bike by herself at speeds above 15.5 mph (Euro) or 20 mph (USA). Drafting only in a pace line at 25 mph on an ebike that is 12 kg is not peanuts and on the 14kg bike is hardcore if possible at all for anyone but uber fit - this person might not need an ebike after all.

We still have only the concerns listed in the original message. X35 power is not an issue for us. Thank you no matter what
 

Pete D

New Member
I have a Gain D30 and use it to keep up with my biking group. I really like it for this purpose and have level 1 (low) reduced to 80% and can do 30 mile rides with 1000+ feet of climbing using about 40% of the battery. I probably weigh much more than your wife.
Regarding the lack of a torque sensor I’ve noticed that on hills matching speed exactly with my fellow riders can be inefficient if that makes sense. But I’m very happy with the X35 for road or gravel use.
 
I'm owner for a WilierCento1hybrid which weight 12,5 kgs , mounted with Shimano Ultrega 50/34-11/34 , powered by Ebikemotion X35 +.I'm 66 years old,1,77 tall for 75 kgs , with a quite good and long past as cyclist but due to a sudden health problem , I have been forced to avoid heart range above 145 bpm. Now I can easily ride on flat without support at 30 km/h , with level 1 ( tuned at 100%) up to 10% at speed around 12/15 km/h, above 10% gradient with level 2 tuned at 90%....level 3 never used.
One of my last ride was totalling 120 km, 1480 mt elevation gain , 8% average gradient with max 15%, back home still with 20% battery .
For sure the Ebikemotion requires < good legs> to give the best being the optimum range in between 70-90 rpm and 15-25 km/h ( EU's version).
Regards
Blackvipergts
 

Captain Slow

Well-Known Member
I'm not quite sure of the differences in fitness between you and your girlfriend. It may or may not do the trick.

I bought a Specialized Creo Feb 2020 and I only got one ride in with my friends (some who race Cat 3 at the fast end, others just enthusiasts at the other end) before the restrictions began and I haven't ridden with them since. But my experience on that one ride was that on the flats when they took off I was limited by the 32 km/hr. speed limiter and I was simply riding a heavier bike that they were and given that I would be a beginner Cat 5 rider there was no way I was keeping up with them.

We rode up a hill that I'd estimate was about 1- 1.5 km's long. I finished about mid-pack using the lowest assist level. I could have used more power and kept with the fastest riders, but it was my first group ride on the bike and I wasn't told how far we were riding so I didn't want to use too much battery. As it was I think when I got home after about a roughly 50-60 km ride (I'll have to go check my Garmin data) I think I still had around 70% battery left.

So I'll throw out a wild guess that if you live in the US and the speed limiter is set to 28 mph and you bring enough spare batteries that yes it should do the trick for your girlfriend to ride with you.
 

MartinPL

New Member
Region
USA
Valuable info. Thx.
I used to be Cat 1/2 master racer and for the last 4 years have not raced. It is great to know she would be able to keep up on the hills and while she won't be able to stay with me on the flats I don't mind slowing down to around 32kmh to stay with her - this is not much of a trade off for the gain of being able to ride the hills together.
The riding will be in Europe as I have moved here 3 years ago. The idea is to buy the bike in the US to get that extra 4.5 mph of motor assist. Getting motor assist up to 28 mph would be fantastic.
Thx again
 
Valuable info. Thx.
I used to be Cat 1/2 master racer and for the last 4 years have not raced. It is great to know she would be able to keep up on the hills and while she won't be able to stay with me on the flats I don't mind slowing down to around 32kmh to stay with her - this is not much of a trade off for the gain of being able to ride the hills together.
The riding will be in Europe as I have moved here 3 years ago. The idea is to buy the bike in the US to get that extra 4.5 mph of motor assist. Getting motor assist up to 28 mph would be fantastic.
Thx again
Be aware that in EU the legal speed limit is fixed at 25km/h .Above the bike is classified as motorcycling which require insurance, plate ,tax...The main concern , penalties aside, should be the personal liability in case of accident .
 

lowb35

New Member
Don't know if you've made your decision yet, but you may also want to check out Argon 18's Subito offerings. Argon 18 is a Canadian performance manufacturer, and the Subito is an absolutely brilliant bike. (I have the North American e-gravel variant with 650b wheels, but the e-road variant is also more than gravel capable.) Bicycling magazine recently listed it among their best e-bikes https://www.bicycling.com/bikes-gear/a22132137/best-electric-bikes/, and this review captures what I agree is special about this bike https://gravelbikes.cc/tests/argon-18-subito-ebike-review/. I am not a competitive cyclist by any means, but before I swapped out my old PowerPod meter for something that measured just *my* power, the bike added 35W to my FTP and Garmin thought my VO2 max jumped from a reasonably fit-for-my-age (57) but non-athletic 35 to an elite 46. I've since put a crank meter on my bike so now I'm back to my previous non-athletic self. :) Except now I can climb hills.

My daily gravel/dirt ride out and back on my road is 22km w/520m climb, max gradient 15% (though most climbs are in the 7-12% range). The local ride with the most climbing I've done was 680m on a 35km gravel ride. Gone much longer/further on other (flatter) rides, but this is typical of what I encounter pulling out of my driveway, since I live in a very rural, hilly area with more dirt/gravel roads than paved.

Even without power assist, it's a fast bike. My previous bike was a carbon Specialized Diverge, so no slowpoke, but I don't notice the speed at all on the Subito it is so solid on all surfaces. Speeds that scared me on the Diverge on loose surfaces are no problem on this bike. I was originally in the market for an Orbea Gain D30 but my dealer services both brands and sold me on this one. Don't regret it for a minute.

But whichever way you go... Orbea or something else... the x35 should work well for you, especially since your gf is far more athletic than I am.
 

MartinPL

New Member
Region
USA
Very cool option. I know the brand while I see the Subito for the first time and I like it a lot. At this moment availability is our main concern. Newly ordered Gain can be received in 2023 :-(. I will check on the Subito. Many thx
 

lowb35

New Member
Very cool option. I know the brand while I see the Subito for the first time and I like it a lot. At this moment availability is our main concern. Newly ordered Gain can be received in 2023 :-(. I will check on the Subito. Many thx
Agreed. That’s the other reason I didn’t get the Gain. I was able to get the Subito within days of ordering. That was almost a year ago though so not sure about availability now.