Question about experience of using Shimano Steps E6100 motor

FrancoPoz

Member
Greetings from Italy.
I am new and in the process of purchasing an eRoad.

I found it very interesting to read the posts of this forum because I clarified my ideas and found some excellent observations.

The purchase I have to make concerns a BMC AMP Sport Three 2021 with Shimano Steps E6100 engine or a Polini EP3 motorized Basso Volta.

For those unfamiliar with the Polini engine, I can tell you that it is also mounted on the Bianchi Impulso All Road but also on high-profile eMTBs.

I tried the Polini engine even if the test lasted a short time but I made a small but significant climb in time to understand the assistance logic.

I've never tried the Shimano Steps E6100 motor.

My most significant experience on eRoad is with a Pinallo Nytro with Fazua engine that provides equal torque to the Shimano ie 60 Nm. With the Nytro I did 180 km and 1800m + using only the ECO assistance uphill and never on other occasions. . But the bike is too heavy and has little autonomy with a 250Kw battery. I discarded it immediately.

The Polini instead has a power of about 75 Nm and five levels of assistance. It is good to say immediately that the first three levels are mainly used because the engine power is absolutely exaggerated.

My choice, even if I haven't tried the BMC, is for this type of bicycle which is not very common in Italy. I always talk about BMC eRoads because the muscular models are very much appreciated by Italian cyclists.

The use I will make of it will be mainly hilly and not in the plains. I live in a part of north-eastern Italy and I am a few kilometers away from the Dolomites and Alpine passes such as the Gavia Mortirolo rather than the Stelvio.

I also have a muscle bike that I keep and use regularly. It is a Pinarello F10 of Pete Kennaugh's Team Sky when the London 2012 Olympic champion was racing for Team Sky.

From what I have read and from what I have documented the BMC has an excellent weight / power ratio. You can use it even without assistance safely. It is light enough to be a mid-engined eRoad. It can be assumed that in exits of 100 120 km you can also do 50 60 km without assistance and if the slopes are not so important as to require the use of the engine. But as already written the battery life is linked to many factors that it is not possible to establish a rule for all situations.

The BMC is of excellent quality and finish. The components are dignified without looking for the top of the range version.

The question I ask is whether according to those who own this model of BMC it is possible to make a "fairly extreme" use for asphalted mountain roads. For example, is it conceivable to do laps of 140 150 km with an elevation gain of 2500m +?

I apologize if I have written a lot and I apologize for my translated English.

Thanks to all for those who read me and answer me. Franco
 

ephemere

Member
Region
USA
City
Bay Area, CA
Hi Franco. Greetings from the US.

You might want to post your question in this thread: BMC Alpenchallenge AMP E-bikes.

For some reason there doesn't seem to be a lot of activity in these forums about BMC, but the above thread has experiences from several owners. Mostly it's about the E8000 models from the prior model year, but toward the end of the thread there are people who have the new E6100 models. There is some discussion there about unassisted pedaling, so someone might have some experience.

I am awaiting delivery of the BMC Alpenchallenge AMP Cross LTD (flat bar), which will be my first e-bike. I am hoping to make use mainly in low assist levels and unassisted.

The Basso Volta looks incredible!
 

FlatSix911

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Silicon Valley
Greetings from Italy.
I am new and in the process of purchasing an eRoad. I found it very interesting to read the posts of this forum because I clarified my ideas and found some excellent observations.
The purchase I have to make concerns a BMC AMP Sport Three 2021 with Shimano Steps E6100 engine or a Polini EP3 motorized Basso Volta. I've never tried the Shimano Steps E6100 motor.
From what I have read and from what I have documented the BMC has an excellent weight / power ratio. You can use it even without assistance safely. It is light enough to be a mid-engined eRoad. It can be assumed that in exits of 100 120 km you can also do 50 60 km without assistance and if the slopes are not so important as to require the use of the engine. But as already written the battery life is linked to many factors that it is not possible to establish a rule for all situations. The BMC is of excellent quality and finish. The components are dignified without looking for the top of the range version.
The question I ask is whether according to those who own this model of BMC it is possible to make a "fairly extreme" use for asphalted mountain roads.
For example, is it conceivable to do laps of 140 150 km with an elevation gain of 2500m +?

I apologize if I have written a lot and I apologize for my translated English. Thanks to all for those who read me and answer me. Franco
Welcome to EBR. ;)
I have 2 Ebikes with the Shimano Steps E6000 system... the new E6100 is now 20% more efficient than the E6000.
Since you are an experienced rider, you should be able to cover over 150km in eco mode... I have found the Shimano system to be very efficient.

1605729319903.png

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Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
Franco,

Although the BMC e-bike you are interested in has excellent specifications and the E6100 motor is highly respected, I think you could make the 140-150 km with as much as 2500 metres of elevation gain only in case the most of input would be your own. Meaning, using the assistance for climbs only, and only in Eco mode. Don't be deluded about the promised range unless you have tried it yourself.
 
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FrancoPoz

Member
Hi Stefano.

Yes, that's how I'm going to do it.

In my only significant experience with an eRoad and precisely a Pinarello Nitro with an engine on the Fazua bottom bracket I did 170 km and 1800m elevation gain. I used the assistance only on a fairly long climb of about 10 km with an average gradient of 9% and peaks of 12%. I have always used the ECO mode with a variable pedaling regime between 65rpm and 75rpm. No off-seat because I sensed that these motors, unlike the X35 Motion, alter their assistance and must be used with a constant and continuous pedaling without having frequency variations. With this use I believe I can do the Gavia pass and the Mortirolo pass together as a mountain stage of the Giro
 

FrancoPoz

Member
Hello FlatSix911.

I asked these trivial questions for the simple fact that BMC equips commuter bikes with the E6100 engine and previously equipped the sport and cross versions with the E8000 engine. I was expecting the 2021 version to be equipped with the new EP8 instead they opted for the E6100. I read a post on this NG in which this choice seems to be dictated by the fact that the E6100 engine provides more than enough power in relation to the overall weight of the bike and that a lower power allows for greater autonomy with the same battery compared to the E8000 . I believe that for EP8 instead there are supply problems and Shimano delivery times. but I am convinced that in the future BMC will propose the version with EP8 in its catalog.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Brwinów (PL)
Hi Stefano.

Yes, that's how I'm going to do it.

In my only significant experience with an eRoad and precisely a Pinarello Nitro with an engine on the Fazua bottom bracket I did 170 km and 1800m elevation gain. I used the assistance only on a fairly long climb of about 10 km with an average gradient of 9% and peaks of 12%. I have always used the ECO mode with a variable pedaling regime between 65rpm and 75rpm. No off-seat because I sensed that these motors, unlike the X35 Motion, alter their assistance and must be used with a constant and continuous pedaling without having frequency variations. With this use I believe I can do the Gavia pass and the Mortirolo pass together as a mountain stage of the Giro
You should be happy with the BMC then. What is good is BMC use a mid-drive motor unlike hub-drive motors found in so many other road e-bikes!
 

FrancoPoz

Member
There is a substantial difference between the X35 type hub motors or the newer and more recent FSA than the bottom bracket motors. The motors in the hub have no torque sensors and supply the power according to the revolutions of the hub and more generally of the wheel. So if you do a climb with very hard double-digit gradients - and in my part there are a lot of climbs like that - you have no benefit. On the other hand, the eRoad with X35 is lighter and less altered in its general appearance. Scoot Willer Orbea are great examples. The motors in the bottom bracket are more specific and more purpose-oriented. They have higher powers generally on the 60Nm forward and can have battery of 500Kw and more. For my purpose and the fact that I have to keep my heart rate low this type of solution is the most suitable.
 

FlatSix911

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Silicon Valley
Hello FlatSix911.

I asked these trivial questions for the simple fact that BMC equips commuter bikes with the E6100 engine and previously equipped the sport and cross versions with the E8000 engine. I was expecting the 2021 version to be equipped with the new EP8 instead they opted for the E6100. I read a post on this NG in which this choice seems to be dictated by the fact that the E6100 engine provides more than enough power in relation to the overall weight of the bike and that a lower power allows for greater autonomy with the same battery compared to the E8000 . I believe that for EP8 instead there are supply problems and Shimano delivery times. but I am convinced that in the future BMC will propose the version with EP8 in its catalog.
Hi Franco,
Glad you asked about the E6100 compared with the Shimano mountain bike motors, E8000/E7000, and the new EP8.
They are designed for high power & torque and offer a reduced range as a result... the E6100 is the champ for max range.

Both of my road bikes are optimized for range with the E6000, while my mountain bikes are optimized for high torque. Hope this helps. ;)

1605732755031.png
 
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FrancoPoz

Member
Hi Franco,
Glad you asked about the E6100 compared with the Shimano mountain bike motors, E8000/E7000, and the new EP8.
They are designed for high power & torque and offer a reduced range as a result... the E6100 is the champ for max range.

Both of my road bikes are optimized for range with the E6000, while my mountain bikes are optimized for high torque. Hope this helps. ;)

View attachment 71757
This comparison table is beautiful. Can you explain to me what is the difference between Boost and High? ... and also between Trail and Normal? ... maybe because these types of engines - I mean E8000 E7000 - are for eMTB and not for eRoad?
 

Bufatutu

Member
Just got my first ebike, a mtn bike with Shimano 8000, which I mostly use on the road, paved and gravel, and exploring. I live in the heart of the mountains and I'm a several times a week non-e hill biker. Going up hills, long slopes and rarely steep slopes, even with zero offroading, eats the battery, regardless of the specific motor. Even in eco mode. Pedaling uphill in eco mode will very substantially decrease your range.

Here is the link for the Shimano Steps Service/Dealer Manual, which is filled with charts and graphs comparing the various modes and how they impact power levels, distances, etc as you change pedal pressure and cadence. It does this for each of the Steps motors. It also shows the various adjustments that can be made to each power mode with the e-Tube app. This manual is really quite amazing; it should be required to be given to every purchaser of a Steps motor powered bike. https://si.shimano.com/pdfs/sm/SM-SHIMANO_STEPS_US-000.pdf

I recently downloaded the e-Tubes app. I couldn't believe how simple it was to adjust each of the three power levels--eco down, Trail up, and Boost down. It made a fun machine into a custom-fitted delight that has quickly become an extension of my aging/faltering but still strong body.
 
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ephemere

Member
Region
USA
City
Bay Area, CA
Franco, check out pages 44-45 of the Service Manual. It explains how Shimano got the range numbers in the chart above. The E8000/E7000 test course has a hill and an extra stop-go, while the E6100 test course is flat. It's great that Shimano publishes the specific test conditions.
 

FlatSix911

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Silicon Valley
Just got my first ebike, a mtn bike with Shimano 8000, which I mostly use on the road, paved and gravel, and exploring. I live in the heart of the mountains and I'm a several times a week non-e hill biker.
Going up hills, long slopes and rarely steep slopes, even with zero offroading, eats the battery, regardless of the specific motor. Even in eco mode. Pedaling uphill in eco mode will very substantially decrease your range.

Here is the link for the Shimano Steps Service/Dealer Manual, which is filled with charts and graphs comparing the various modes and how they impact power levels, distances, etc as you change pedal pressure and cadence. It does this for each of the Steps motors. It also shows the various adjustments that can be made to each power mode with the e-Tube app. This manual is really quite amazing; it should be required to be given to every purchaser of a Steps motor powered bike.
https://si.shimano.com/pdfs/sm/SM-SHIMANO_STEPS_US-000.pdf

I recently downloaded the e-Tubes app. I couldn't believe how simple it was to adjust each of the three power levels--eco down, Trail up, and Boost down.
It made a fun machine into a custom-fitted delight that has quickly become an extension of my aging/faltering but still strong body.
Great information... thanks for sharing. ;)
I have found these range estimates to be very close to reality when I am cycling on and off-road.

E8000 E7000 Range.JPG
E6100 E5000 Range.JPG
 

FlatSix911

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Silicon Valley
..........I thought I had finished my studies at my age ..... instead, even to have fun on the bike and sweat it out, I must first study the manuals ........ I will never make it ......
All part of the fun with owning an EBike... a bit of continuous learning! ;)
 

FrancoPoz

Member
... and it is my doubt that I have about the E6100 engine ... not about its efficiency and effectiveness but about its use ..... friends of EBR correct me if I'm wrong ..... E6100 is suitable for commuter bike and light trekking while the E8000 or E7000 engine is more suitable for sport ..... even the images in the beautiful manual testify to it .... having said that - and I apologize if I am redundant - it seems to me against the trend BMC to equip its AMPs in the different Cross Road Sport declinations with the E6100 engine ... but perhaps there is an explanation ... all the comments enhance the lightness of the chassis and the driveability of the vehicle even without assistance from the engine and then I think that the 60Nm of the E6100 engine is more than enough to do the 2700m of altitude difference of the Stelvio Pass
 

FlatSix911

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Silicon Valley
... and it is my doubt that I have about the E6100 engine ... not about its efficiency and effectiveness but about its use ..... friends of EBR correct me if I'm wrong ..... E6100 is suitable for commuter bike and light trekking while the E8000 or E7000 engine is more suitable for sport ..... even the images in the beautiful manual testify to it .... having said that - and I apologize if I am redundant - it seems to me against the trend BMC to equip its AMPs in the different Cross Road Sport declinations with the E6100 engine ... but perhaps there is an explanation ... all the comments enhance the lightness of the chassis and the driveability of the vehicle even without assistance from the engine and then I think that the 60Nm of the E6100 engine is more than enough to do the 2700m of altitude difference of the Stelvio Pass
I think you will find the E6100 motor is a perfect fit for the BMC Cross... it is really optimized for range and is also a capable climber when 60Nm of torque is needed.
That said, I would only recommend the E7000/E8000 motors for more extreme off-road mountain bike climbing torque when the range is a secondary consideration.
Hope this helps. 😉
 

FrancoPoz

Member
I think you will find the E6100 motor is a perfect fit for the BMC Cross... it is really optimized for range and is also a capable climber when 60Nm of torque is needed.
That said, I would only recommend the E7000/E8000 motors for more extreme off-road mountain bike climbing torque when the range is a secondary consideration.
Hope this helps. 😉
Yes, you have written my thoughts well ... maybe my post is trivial but some interesting information and manuals have been disclosed that can clarify doubts and provide specifics ... thanks to all .... here in Italy also wonderful days if in the morning it is a lot of humidity and there is a little fog but in the central hours of the day the sun rises and it is fantastic to ride in the hills ... a warm greeting to all ... as soon as I have the BMC AMP Sport I'll let you know my evidence PS the img attach it is my tour today
 

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