Should I change my 10 speed cassette to 8 speed with BBS02?

Xyeet

Member
My bike is going to have BBS02 750W middrive and I was wondering should I change my 10-speed cassette to 8 speed one? And is it even possible? I was thinking about getting something like this Steel sunrace one: https://www.bike24.com/p2214055.html
 
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Mike_V

Active Member
See how many of the 10 you can use, which will depend upon the chainline:
BB dimension, offset of the CR, chainstay length,flexibility of the chain and it's max angle to stay engaged on a sprocket
 

Tom@WashDC

Active Member
Region
USA
City
Loudoun County, VA
The Biktrix Juggernaut Ultra FS, uses an 11 Speed Cassette, 11-42T. So yes you would probably be happy with 10 Speed cassette. Really depends on your chain line, size of your chainring, and the type of riding you want to do.

I have a Mongoose Dolomite Fat Bike with a BBSHD. I currently have a Luna 42T Chainring and a 14-28 rear cassette. I'm moving to a 9 or 10 speed SRAM Cassette to get the range I want.
 

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AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
I think a lot of this is going to be about how the bike is ridden. The Ultra is similar to the BBS02 and it's a complete torque monster. It just doesn't need all those gears to stay in it's useful power band for my purposes. For instance, mine is kind of a hybrid with about 60% pavement and 40% everything else, and 90% or more of my riding is done in just 4 gears.... and then, this is a pretty hilly area!

My point is, with the right chain ring and cassette gears, I think even a 7 speed would work fine. These guys are selling rigs with all these gears for use with an electric motor are missing the mark big time. More gears are NOT always better! Think marketing hype here. You are no longer pedaling this bike! You have a motor with a really wide power band between your feet now.....
 

reed scott

Well-Known Member
I think a lot of this is going to be about how the bike is ridden. The Ultra is similar to the BBS02 and it's a complete torque monster. It just doesn't need all those gears to stay in it's useful power band for my purposes. For instance, mine is kind of a hybrid with about 60% pavement and 40% everything else, and 90% or more of my riding is done in just 4 gears.... and then, this is a pretty hilly area!

My point is, with the right chain ring and cassette gears, I think even a 7 speed would work fine. These guys selling rigs with all these gears for use with an electric motor are missing the mark big time. More gears are NOT always better! Think marketing hype here. You are no longer pedaling this bike! You have a motor with a really wide power band between your feet now.....
Yeah, I brought this up when I joined here when only reading about electric bikes and now I have one I know what you say is perfectly true. 👍
 

Mike TowpathTraveler

Well-Known Member
Well, let me be Mr Contrarian. :rolleyes: High watt motors mask alot of poor riding habits. The most efficient riding of a bicycle remains spinning the pedals at a relatively high rpm (think 70 to 100 rpm). This in turn, creates the least amount of stress on our knees. The added benefit of this spinning is it gives the best mileage potential from a fully charged battery; with another benefit of giving your chain, front chain ring gear teeth, rear sprocket teeth, the longest possible life.

I think that more and more, with the introduction of these high newton-meter rated motors, the ebike becomes less a bicycle and more that of a moped or motorcycle.

Anybody just using 4 gears or so, even in hilly territory, is really stressing the heck out of that drivetrain (which was always designed for an analog bicycle in mind.....not a high torque ebike).

YMMV
 

Tom@WashDC

Active Member
Region
USA
City
Loudoun County, VA
Well, let me be Mr Contrarian. :rolleyes: High watt motors mask alot of poor riding habits. The most efficient riding of a bicycle remains spinning the pedals at a relatively high rpm (think 70 to 100 rpm). This in turn, creates the least amount of stress on our knees. The added benefit of this spinning is it gives the best mileage potential from a fully charged battery; with another benefit of giving your chain, front chain ring gear teeth, rear sprocket teeth, the longest possible life.

I think that more and more, with the introduction of these high newton-meter rated motors, the ebike becomes less a bicycle and more that of a moped or motorcycle.

Anybody just using 4 gears or so, even in hilly territory, is really stressing the heck out of that drivetrain (which was always designed for an analog bicycle in mind.....not a high torque ebike).

YMMV
I agree Mike. I was originally going to go with a reworked cassette, and reduce the number of gears used to about four or five. On my Luna BBSHD I've experimented with a 46T Chainring, 42T Chainring, 40T Chainring, and 30T Chainring, interchanging all of those on two, 7 speed rear cassettes (11-34, and 14-28). I've concluded that my riding should rely less on the brute power of the motor, and more on the efficiency of my gear choices and pedaling. My riding consists of 40% flat paved bike trails, 60% off-road with occasional 100ft-200ft hill climbs as steep as 45 degrees. I've decided that a 10/11 speed cassette (11-46) with a 42T Chainring will give me the most efficient use of my knees and motor, and put less stress on my cassette over the long haul. Is it too many gears, maybe for 80% of my riding, but in the long run I will get a better overall experience with less wear and tear on my motor, drivetrain, and me.
 

reed scott

Well-Known Member
Well, let me be Mr Contrarian. :rolleyes: High watt motors mask alot of poor riding habits. The most efficient riding of a bicycle remains spinning the pedals at a relatively high rpm (think 70 to 100 rpm). This in turn, creates the least amount of stress on our knees. The added benefit of this spinning is it gives the best mileage potential from a fully charged battery; with another benefit of giving your chain, front chain ring gear teeth, rear sprocket teeth, the longest possible life.

I think that more and more, with the introduction of these high newton-meter rated motors, the ebike becomes less a bicycle and more that of a moped or motorcycle.

Anybody just using 4 gears or so, even in hilly territory, is really stressing the heck out of that drivetrain (which was always designed for an analog bicycle in mind.....not a high torque ebike).

YMMV
I agree with you but I also am convinced that any decent ebike needs no more than a 9 speed transmission. This would allow for the strongest chain and that has to be a good thing.
 

AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
Well, let me be Mr Contrarian. :rolleyes: High watt motors mask alot of poor riding habits. The most efficient riding of a bicycle remains spinning the pedals at a relatively high rpm (think 70 to 100 rpm). This in turn, creates the least amount of stress on our knees. The added benefit of this spinning is it gives the best mileage potential from a fully charged battery; with another benefit of giving your chain, front chain ring gear teeth, rear sprocket teeth, the longest possible life.

I think that more and more, with the introduction of these high newton-meter rated motors, the ebike becomes less a bicycle and more that of a moped or motorcycle.

Anybody just using 4 gears or so, even in hilly territory, is really stressing the heck out of that drivetrain (which was always designed for an analog bicycle in mind.....not a high torque ebike).

YMMV
First, I would just like to establish not all riders are capable of 70-100 rpm cadence levels, especially for any length of time. Let's be really clear about that. I think that ability is a terrible assumption regarding Joe and Jane average (senior) rider.....

Second, my watt meter, which I monitor constantly when I believe I might be pushing the motor's abilities, doesn't lie. It WILL tell me when that's the case, with a rather high degree of certainty - no guessing. If my motor is rated for 1600w, and I'm pulling less than 600w, how much "stress" would you say I'm putting on the motor, or the drive train in general?

Too, some of this is going to be about how fast we are going/what gear are we in? It's not hard to imagine the effect 1600w (or even 600w) may have on an 11 tooth gear for instance........

My comments were with speeds of 8-15mph in mind (when under power).

And I do get that there are folks who might be able to use all of anything they are given. If you'll refer back to my post, I think you'll find I said 90% of my riding is in just 4 gears, and that for MY purposes 7 speeds would be fine - with the right gear set.

Last, I see nothing wrong with being contrarian. I think comparing our ideas with one another is pretty awesome actually! -Al
 
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Art Deco

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Selinsgrove Pennsylvania
I think 7 to 9 speeds is about right also. A 3 speed isn't enough unless you have a very big motor for hills and ten speeds or more use thinner chains. A belt drive and IGH would change that, as well.
 

reed scott

Well-Known Member
I think a lot of this is going to be about how the bike is ridden. The Ultra is similar to the BBS02 and it's a complete torque monster. It just doesn't need all those gears to stay in it's useful power band for my purposes. For instance, mine is kind of a hybrid with about 60% pavement and 40% everything else, and 90% or more of my riding is done in just 4 gears.... and then, this is a pretty hilly area!

My point is, with the right chain ring and cassette gears, I think even a 7 speed would work fine. These guys are selling rigs with all these gears for use with an electric motor are missing the mark big time. More gears are NOT always better! Think marketing hype here. You are no longer pedaling this bike! You have a motor with a really wide power band between your feet now.....
When I first brought this up way back in my 'pre-noob' days ( I didn't even have an ebike yet ) Pushkar agreed with us but also said something to the effect that ebike makers and sellers had to bow to the market and the market is not well informed. Bigger better faster fancier is what people want and people generally think a 12 speed has to be better than a 10 speed and a ten speed surely is better than a 9 speed etc. Powerful ebike motors do not need 12 speed detailers but the reality on the ground is none of the manufacturers at this time make the best derailleurs in configurations designed for less cogs. I wish they did.
 

reed scott

Well-Known Member
I think 7 to 9 speeds is about right also. A 3 speed isn't enough unless you have a very big motor for hills and ten speeds or more use thinner chains. A belt drive and IGH would change that, as well.
I worry about the tension stress necessary for belt drives on the components of a bicycle. This is the only reason I am not getting my next bike with an IGH.
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Selinsgrove Pennsylvania
I stayed away from IGH b/c any bike shop can fix a deraillier issue... I hope ... and we intend to travel with the bikes.
Anyway to the OP I wouldn't change it out, just shift with care and don't stomp the pedals in high gears or such.
 

AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
Kinda why I'll never own a Ferrari. It's not that I think I can't drive it effectively, well enough to have fun anyway. But if it breaks.....

I'll let the IGH's mature a bit longer - to shake out what works, and what doesn't....
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Selinsgrove Pennsylvania
I'm pretty sure IGH and belt is the future of eBikes, but I'm not going to be an early adopter. Just like I resisted automatic transmission cars until the last few years when they became special order only items.
 

AHicks

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Snow Bird - Summer S.E. Michigan, Winter Gulf Coast North Central Fl.
I'm pretty sure IGH and belt is the future of eBikes, but I'm not going to be an early adopter. Just like I resisted automatic transmission cars until the last few years when they became special order only items.
Oh good lord. I made that transition when they started winning races with them.....