Storm Fat Bike vs Prodaco Tech Rebel XS Fat Bike

biknut

Active Member
...................................Storm........................................................Prodaco

Price..........................$1.299..........................................................$3,995
Sale Price..................$499..$599..$649........................................$2,998.94
Weight W/Battery.....58.5 lbs........................................................68 lbs
Top Speed..................20 mph........................................................20 mph
Motor.........................8Fun 36V 350w...........................................SRAM eMatic 36V 250w
Battery.......................36v 8.8 Ah...................................................36v 10 Ah
Seat Post....................Alloy.............................................................Alloy
Grips..........................Locking.........................................................Locking
Brakes........................Mechanical Disk...........................................Hydraulic Disk
Handle Bar.................31.8mm........................................................31.8mm
Headset.....................Sealed Bearing..............................................Sealed Bearing
Crankset....................3 piece Alloy..................................................3 Piece Alloy
Bottom Bracket.........Sealed Bearing...............................................Sealed Bearing
Gears.........................Single Speed...................................................Single Speed
Tires..........................26 x 4.8...........................................................26 x 4
Charge Time..............1 1/2 hours.....................................................4.25 Hours
Range........................30-50 miles.....................................................20-30 miles
Sondors claims range of 20-25 miles

http://www.bikecraze.com/mobile/Product.aspx?id=40833
 

Ann M.

Well-Known Member
It's pretty obvious why Prodaco will soon be going extinct. Bye Bye.
Hey @biknut, you overpriced the Rebel by $1000 dollars and with its Sram 2 speed automatic motor & hydraulic disc brakes, this bike is in a whole different category from the Sonders bike. Take a look instead at the ProdecoTech Storm which is outfitted with disc brakes btw. and 36V Lithium battery.
 

EULITTLB

Active Member
SONDORS CLAIMS A RANGE OF 50 MILES!!!! STICK TO WHAT IS STATED AND CLAIMED.

Nobody knows if the Sondors ebike (there only being one in existence) meets US Safety and quality standards, whether it or the battery are certified for use in the USA, what the performance is or will be, what the quality of the bike will be like, who to approach in the instance of product failure or maintenance, or for reasons of liability where to go to address anything to. Ultimately whether anything but a cheap shell of a bike which does not perform as stated and is a pig to ride (subject to sales tax) will be delivered some time before the end of December 2015. For those who do not accept that despatching 7500+ bikes (if it ever happens) to a global market will not entail the most significant logistical and support issues for a Company with a network, never mind a single bloke, are deluded.

Philip, a sincere bit of advice from me to you.

You have alleged that I am a paid scumbag troll, you have queried whether they gave me a free Prodaco (sp) for my actions, Agency 2.0 have knowingly verified lies that I am paid by a major US ebike manufacturer to damage the Sondors campaign

Therefore I would advise you are very very careful from now on because you are likely to have legal action taken against you for spreading lies and to damage the reputation of Prodeco, a Company with which I have no association or affiliation whatsoever.

Take my advice or ignore it, your choice.
 

biknut

Active Member
Hey @biknut, you overpriced the Rebel by $1000 dollars and with its Sram 2 speed automatic motor & hydraulic disc brakes, this bike is in a whole different category from the Sonders bike. Take a look instead at the ProdecoTech Storm which is outfitted with disc brakes btw. and 36V Lithium battery.

This price I quoted is listed on the website I linked Ann baby. If you buy it from them that's what you're going to pay. And I got more bad news for you, and prodaco. At 20 mph you don't need anything other than mechanical disks, and with only 250w you're going to need a 2 speed motor just to come close to keeping up.

On top of all that, if that's not enough for you, a 2 speed motor is a reliability nightmare.
 

biknut

Active Member
SONDORS CLAIMS A RANGE OF 50 MILES!!!! STICK TO WHAT IS STATED AND CLAIMED.

.

Read the link. Both bikes estimate 30 mile range. Both are probably exaggerating, one a little more than the other. Storm Sondors is the more honest of the two. On video for all to see, he claimed his bike will go 20 to 25 miles on a charge with light pedaling. You've lost this fight badly EULITTLB because you tried to bring a knife to a gun fight. Just a big mouth isn't enough.
 

George S.

Well-Known Member
If you think the Sondoze will be the last China import, or the last guy to try to avoid US laws with a drop ship, you are probably mistaken. You have to compare China import bikes that are leaked into the US. Sondoze has led the way in this category, but we'll see how it works out. He can import a million bikes and be the King of Ebikes, for all I care. But he's not doing what Prodeco has done. Sondo seems to hate American jobs. Nothing to assemble here. No warranty service here. No customer service. I guess you get the number of the factory in China. "For English, press #23".

Sondo is not exactly a blue collar guy, right? He lives in Malibu?

Sondoze has the huge tires. I mean huge. You might as well call them RangeKillaz. A lot of those people at the Demo really need a lighter bike with a step through. But I'm starting a towing service in LA to retrieve Fat Bikes that wander onto the beach, dig in, and have to be dragged to civilization.
 

biknut

Active Member
If you think the Sondoze will be the last China import, or the last guy to try to avoid US laws with a drop ship, you are probably mistaken. You have to compare China import bikes that are leaked into the US. Sondoze has led the way in this category, but we'll see how it works out. He can import a million bikes and be the King of Ebikes, for all I care. But he's not doing what Prodeco has done. Sondo seems to hate American jobs. Nothing to assemble here. No warranty service here. No customer service. I guess you get the number of the factory in China. "For English, press #23".

Sondo is not exactly a blue collar guy, right? He lives in Malibu?

Sondoze has the huge tires. I mean huge. You might as well call them RangeKillaz. A lot of those people at the Demo really need a lighter bike with a step through. But I'm starting a towing service in LA to retrieve Fat Bikes that wander onto the beach, dig in, and have to be dragged to civilization.

I can sympathize about the jobs, but that's not Storm's fault. You can't blame the guy for looking at the current business climate and trying to take advantage of it. You can blame the bought and paid for government for that. All he's doing is using the current business climate to his full advantage. Manufacturing is dead in this country. Service jobs are what we have now. A successful Storm will actually be good in that respect, because with more eBikes on the road, they'll be more demand for repairs and service. We are the customer service. That's were the money has been in bicycles shops for a long time now anyway. Accessory's, and service, not whole bicycle sales. Shops should be thankful Storm doesn't have customer service, but actually at this time we don't really know what he'll have. He did say long term, that there could be dealers in the picture.

And you could be right about big tires being a range killer, but lets face reality, it's about the look. SUVs aren't exactly economical either, but that doesn't stop people from buying them.

I did a poll on the fb page asking what type of riding people would be doing with their Storm, street, or off road. It's 6 to 1 street. That's an even higher percentage than motorcycles in general.

As for Sondors not being a blue color guy? What kind of snobby comment is that?
 

George S.

Well-Known Member
The government doesn't work? Yeah, no kidding.

There's too much regulation? Yeah, no kidding.

You don't want any manufacturing jobs in this country? That's nuts.

The money you send to China for ebikes is coming back here. Alibaba wants to own Cloud Computing.

The next presidential election will have to be about the economy. We need jobs and a middle class.

The Middle Class generally does not:
1) live in Malibu
2) have girlfriends and surf when they want
3) have a therapist who helps them because being in traffic stresses them out

Storm is a rich guy who has decided to distribute Happy Meals to the masses. In Storm's world, people don't have many rights. He gives people what he wants. Storm is like the King. Storm is the law, and his Storm Troopers love him.

What people need is a middle class economy.

That means trying to create as much of an ebike industry in this country as possible. You've thrown in the towel, given up on America, and the American worker.

Color me blue.
 

biknut

Active Member
The government doesn't work? Yeah, no kidding.

There's too much regulation? Yeah, no kidding.

You don't want any manufacturing jobs in this country? That's nuts.

The money you send to China for ebikes is coming back here. Alibaba wants to own Cloud Computing.

The next presidential election will have to be about the economy. We need jobs and a middle class.

The Middle Class generally does not:
1) live in Malibu
2) have girlfriends and surf when they want
3) have a therapist who helps them because being in traffic stresses them out

Storm is a rich guy who has decided to distribute Happy Meals to the masses. In Storm's world, people don't have many rights. He gives people what he wants. Storm is like the King. Storm is the law, and his Storm Troopers love him.

What people need is a middle class economy.

That means trying to create as much of an ebike industry in this country as possible. You've thrown in the towel, given up on America, and the American worker.

Color me blue.

Not exactly true George. I agree with a lot of what you're saying. I haven't given up on America either, but I have given up on our current government. It's bought and paid for by big business. Big business includes the msm, that lies for constantly big business. It's just a fact that big business wanted to move all the manufacturing out of the country.

I don't elevate Storm as high as you is all. We don't really know that much about him. If he was so rich he wouldn't have needed indiegogo to launch a business. Are you saying all successful people are bad? He may not like what happened to America any more than we do, buy I don't fault him for surveying the present business terrain and making the best of it. If he succeeds common men will be a little better off than we are now.
 

Ann M.

Well-Known Member
This price I quoted is listed on the website I linked Ann baby. If you buy it from them that's what you're going to pay. And I got more bad news for you, and prodaco. At 20 mph you don't need anything other than mechanical disks, and with only 250w you're going to need a 2 speed motor just to come close to keeping up.

On top of all that, if that's not enough for you, a 2 speed motor is a reliability nightmare.
@biknut, here's a link from ProdecoTech's site with the price at $2999. http://www.prodecotech.com/electric-bikes/rebel-x-s/. Have to agree that its a lot for the Sram system, but I've not had the opportunity to test ride one and the bike is not available yet. It doesn't look like Court has done a review on the Rebel; however, he has talked about Sram's EMatic system on the Townie Go and the OHM XU 450 E2 if you want to analyze the system more. http://electricbikereview.com/electra/townie-go/
http://electricbikereview.com/ohm/xu450-e2/
What's unclear is why the insistence to compare the Rebel to the Storm bike--they're totally different products.
 

biknut

Active Member
@biknut, here's a link from ProdecoTech's site with the price at $2999. http://www.prodecotech.com/electric-bikes/rebel-x-s/. Have to agree that its a lot for the Sram system, but I've not had the opportunity to test ride one and the bike is not available yet. It doesn't look like Court has done a review on the Rebel; however, he has talked about Sram's EMatic system on the Townie Go and the OHM XU 450 E2 if you want to analyze the system more. http://electricbikereview.com/electra/townie-go/
http://electricbikereview.com/ohm/xu450-e2/
What's unclear is why the insistence to compare the Rebel to the Storm bike--they're totally different products.

Well they're both fat bikes so I wouldn't say they're totally different products. They seem to have a very similar appearance, and performance. Price wise they're totally different though. The site I linked says $4000 is the list, and $3000 is the sale price. You don't think they could be accused of a little false advertising do you? I was sort of getting the feeling only Strom ever did that.
 

EULITTLB

Active Member
The MSRP and the sale price are understandable and given terms in business.

If I contributed $500 at the early stages to a crowdfunding campaign on the basis I was effectively buying a $1300 bike, only to find that after the end of the campaign a second campaign had begun with the price at $649, and the bike was never going to retail at $1300 anyway, I would be a bit miffed.

Philip, sincere question - crowdfunding and perks etc aside, Sondors claims the bike will be sold at $1300 - but surely "selling" something in America has to be backed up by certification, support, liability insurance, to meet minimum safety and quality standards? Reflectors? Is a bell an essential like it is in the UK? Can this one man with Aspergers hit a global market with 7500 bikes without problems and carry this off without any crises at all?
 

Ann M.

Well-Known Member
Well they're both fat bikes so I wouldn't say they're totally different products. They seem to have a very similar appearance, and performance. Price wise they're totally different though. The site I linked says $4000 is the list, and $3000 is the sale price. You don't think they could be accused of a little false advertising do you? I was sort of getting the feeling only Strom ever did that.
Unfortunately, a lot of shops or websites do that fake MSRP price and then call it the real price 'sale.' According to information from the BBB if an item is always listed at the so-called sale price then it is not really a sale, its the regular price and would be misleading. Same as with Sonder's $1299. The review of the Sand Viper that Court did, really is more of a similar type comparison rather than the Rebel.
 

EULITTLB

Active Member
@Ann M. but doesn't it make you feel you have got a bargain when you see something listed at 50% off MSRP? Key is determining if it a 50% deduction off of the true value/worth of a product/service.

I do not believe the $499 Sondors ebike will ever sell for $1299, period. It will stall at $649 because once the 'unknown' factor is taken into account together with the $194 shipping cost - plus sales taxes etc - then it isn't an affordable ebike at all, forget commitment to making it affordable etc. Why buy a product without warranty and support when you can buy better elsewhere with (of course this assumes as I have stated all along that there are vast exaggerations and inconsistencies in the claimed performance and no, I don't believe Sondors has, or has the ability, to reinvent the wheel or transform current battery technology at 1/5th of the price....... and there are those that may agree with me elsewhere too!)

Ann, in the US (as in the UK) do bikes have to have reflectors, mudguards, bells to comply with minimum safety standards? I see some of these items are being offered as optional extras now on the Sondors page i.e. they won't be as standard. Does this sound right?
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
At this very moment in time the Sondors is still an ever evolving idea. The bike and list of parts for the Sondors at the start of this thread is just supposition. There is no bike, specification list or brand until there are bikes. The ProdecoTech Rebel is a real product, made with high quality brand name components, backed by a US manufacturer and 2 year warrantee. I'm interested in principles, not personalities. I'm not calling out anyone, I just wish there was honesty in all the posts here.
 

Gus

Active Member
@Ann M. in the US (as in the UK) do bikes have to have reflectors, mudguards, bells to comply with minimum safety standards? I see some of these items are being offered as optional extras now on the Sondors page i.e. they won't be as standard. Does this sound right?

Ahh EU, this is the United States of America. The land of the unsafe fatties. I believe the only thing that is required is reflectors. No bell. No fenders. The majority of bike riders here are weekend cyclists that play dress-up in lycra and try to be Lance for a few hours.

Insura-wha? Supporta-who? Its not required to sell anything.

Why buy the certified Angus burger when you can get a double-cheeseburger for $1 at McDonalds? Because cost is king and people will look past that $1 burger shortcomings if they think they are getting a deal.