The Green Room

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
Climate is what the experts expect. Weather is what people get. And this weather sucks.

"No one could have predicted this, Its all a hoax that will never happen, OK so It's changing, but it won't be that bad" are all Bull AFAIK . A hot topic, indeed, even for EBR off topic. You are a smart group, but please be polite.
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
Link to fire season thread
IMG_1211.jpg
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
I am not naive enough to believe that a thin venneir of green tech is going to be able to save the cities or the 'suburbs for that matter.

But two Ebikes and six solar panels on every third roof might just save you or me
.
 

Sierratim

Well-Known Member
All new homes in California are now required to have solar power. Good for the overstressed grid out here, but many aren't happy with the impact on home affordability with homes already out of reach of many. Always a two-edged sword...

Our business runs on solar. We installed it because it made economic sense but then California does have the highest electric rates in the country. Darn that two-edged sword!
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
My household solar electric made economic sense, but only because of a tax break for electric and because a basic hot water only system became lots more expensive than it had been.
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
20200821_125858.jpg

My inverters. Each one is connected to 12 panels with a maximum combined power of 7000 watts. Maybe in Colorado, you could get that, but in cloudy Pennsylvania, 4000 to 5000 is as much as we get, and under 2000 watts total is common.

The solar was the last step, after insulation, siding, air sealing, new heat pumps for water heater and room heating, and behavioral changes that cut our use by about a third.

The solar panels take two thirds of my roof, and provide about one third of our electricity. My rusty math indicates a problem with getting to net 0 without a really big roof. 🤔
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
We also keep some food ahead, and we have well water, but none of that helps if we had to evacuate. If the road isn't blocked we can live a week or so in the campervan , And the bikes can get through almost anything.
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
Still fire season in Ca.
And on the other side of the Pacific typhon season starts
Not looking real great over the Atlantic
 
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john peck

Well-Known Member
I am not naive enough to believe that a thin venneir of green tech is going to be able to save the cities or the 'suburbs for that matter.

But two Ebikes and six solar panels on every third roof might just save you or me
.
It just might do that; I´d like to think so, but ,at this point, I fear the best we can do is adapt.
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
We will certainly adapt. As a species, we are very good at adapting, but the costs of adapting can just be really expensive or much much worse. We probably can even thrive in a climate challenged world, if we really want to.
But not by depending on BAU...BusinessAsUsual.
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
Still fire season in Ca.
And on the other side of the Pacific typhon season starts
World Weather link
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
Still fire season in Ca.
And on the other side of the Pacific typhon season starts
Not looking real great over the Atlantic
And on top of the world literaly
 

john peck

Well-Known Member
We will certainly adapt. As a species, we are very good at adapting, but the costs of adapting can just be really expensive or much much worse. We probably can even thrive in a climate challenged world, if we really want to.
But not by depending on BAU...BusinessAsUsual.
¨When that last fish is caught, the last river poison, the last tree dead, will we realize we can´t eat money?¨
 

Art Deco

Well-Known Member
¨When that last fish is caught, the last river poison, the last tree dead, will we realize we can´t eat money?¨
Long before that we may find that we can't even trade some money for some thing to eat. Supply chains get long and fragile, local stores go out of business, and inflation is the only thing I know of that eats money ...
 

john peck

Well-Known Member
We currently face the same issues we had in the 60s,70s, & 80s. Very little has changed for the better, nor will it if we wait
for government to do anything. As individuals we must do it ourselves & change. Class conflict is obsolete. We must adopt
a tribal attitude & take care of one another, & address issues directly without wasteful debate. There are viable solutions,
but only if all segments of society join to solve them without ulterior design.
 

6zfshdb

Well-Known Member
View attachment 63097

My inverters. Each one is connected to 12 panels with a maximum combined power of 7000 watts. Maybe in Colorado, you could get that, but in cloudy Pennsylvania, 4000 to 5000 is as much as we get, and under 2000 watts total is common.

The solar was the last step, after insulation, siding, air sealing, new heat pumps for water heater and room heating, and behavioral changes that cut our use by about a third.

The solar panels take two thirds of my roof, and provide about one third of our electricity. My rusty math indicates a problem with getting to net 0 without a really big roof. 🤔

My neighbor and I looked at installing 7 KW solar systems 10 years ago. He did but I didn't. The main reason was the roof installed panels would have voided the 40 year warranty on the expensive shingles I have.

My neighbor used a ground mount array but lost a bit of his yard in the process. After 10 years, he estimates the system won't quite pay for itself with it's 20 year life expectancy. Another issue was, a panel failed in the center of his array and the company who made it went out of business. He couldn't find a replacement panel with the same dimensions so a patch job had to be done which looks rather ugly.

Still, solar is the "green" way to go and I'm always on the lookout for newer systems.
 

Browneye

Well-Known Member
Solar is a good option for residential needs. Battery or grid, close or far.
I studied it extensively, read a few books, and talked to a dozen 'pros' in the biz. After many months I came to the conclusion that was an expensive option upfront, but you get the most ROI if you own them. Buying power off your own grid at a corporate fixed rate is NOT the best option, but surely many will still opt for that.

The parts for a solar arrays come from Asia - just like our bikes. Some of it is great, some not so much. The panels themselves are solid technology with good warranties, plenty of big-names in that business. Controlers and hook-up has solid technology, and works very well. I was able to target cost per watt of output at about a dollar a watt, DIY. The installers were selling them at $5 per watt. There's a LOT of money being made in the solar business.

Since I planned to sell my home and move within a few years I opted out. The old central air quit, so we replaced it with mini-splits, and did more insulation and weather proofing. We stay in the cheaper tier of power, but get really close sometimes. I took my marine reef tank down - it was a power hog with pumps, heaters and chillers and lights. Still run a pool pump a few hours a day, and the old aqarium pump runs the pond. We run a lot of lights in the winter time, but everything is led or low-wattage.

The moral of the story is that my craft beer spending is roughly twice what my power bill is, so I can't really complain. LOL

While learning about solar systems I put my own unit together for our RV. It does a remarkable job at supplying what power we need off the grid. Its kind of fun to sit out in the boonies and want for nothing.

This is a 160w folding panel with a cheap controller for 12V - charges two golfcart batteries, there's an inverter for the big-screen led TV, and all lighting has been converted to led. The power hogs are now the fridge board, and the furnace. It stores in the basement so it's out of the way of damage on the road, and you can move it to front or back to get the best solar angle. If I spent a lot of time in the cold I would probably install a gas-fired heater.

From Zion Park area in Utah, The Zion Ponderosa. Definitely worth a drive up there, the countryside is gorgeous.