These Kits are Rather Remarkable

George S.

Well-Known Member
I got my MAC front hub motor (350w) from EM3ev. So far, very glad I went down this road. The goods were all packed in heavy shrink, inside the wheel. Bottom of box was just torn and open, but nothing fell out. Everything could have fallen out, I guess. That would have been disappointing.

The wiring is rather amazing. It's looks impossible, but actually is almost idiot proof. So far I like the front motor because 1) it is soooo easy to get the wheel on. My experience with rear hubs was dismal 2) all the wiring runs will be short, mostly up the fork, back a bit to the battery 3) I like the looks - minimalist.

I got a schematic of the wheel off the website, but my tolerance between the caliper and hub motor is just about nothing. So I need to get the spacer. The screws holding the rotor on the old wheel were blue Loc-tited, and would barely budge. Threee required a hammer and chisel.

I don't consider the Elite Adventure (stupid name) a performance bike, so I'd be happy at 20 mph. See what it does in a few days. I figure after doing this kit, I will be the repairman for most stuff. Nothing like a ton of hands on. The Marathon Plus tires went on with no gloves or tools. My kind of tire. Looking forward to that first flat out on the road. :D Elite for EBR.jpg MAC for EBR.jpg
 

J.R.

Well-Known Member
Looks great George! I'd like to do something simple like that on a Raleigh Route I have, for friends to ride... Let me know how you like the handling with the front hub.
 

flymeaway

Well-Known Member
I got my MAC front hub motor (350w) from EM3ev. So far, very glad I went down this road.

Congratulations George! I have extra spacers from my purchase if you need any. Also, does the caliper clear the hub motor? If not you can buy a caliper that is narrower and it works, I had to do that with my rear hub installation. The wiring is pretty straight forward and if you bought an Infineon the hall sensor wires out of the motor will probably coincide with the colors coming out motor and the power leads will too. The white wire is the thermal sensor output.

Which winding did you buy....xT...4T, 6T????? I think the Elite is a solid performer, but not a performance bike. I ride it pretty regularly at about 23 mph.

Have fun....! keep us informaed on your progress.

Court J.
 

Jesse

New Member
I got my MAC front hub motor (350w) from EM3ev. So far, very glad I went down this road. The goods were all packed in heavy shrink, inside the wheel. Bottom of box was just torn and open, but nothing fell out. Everything could have fallen out, I guess. That would have been disappointing.

The wiring is rather amazing. It's looks impossible, but actually is almost idiot proof. So far I like the front motor because 1) it is soooo easy to get the wheel on. My experience with rear hubs was dismal 2) all the wiring runs will be short, mostly up the fork, back a bit to the battery 3) I like the looks - minimalist.

I got a schematic of the wheel off the website, but my tolerance between the caliper and hub motor is just about nothing. So I need to get the spacer. The screws holding the rotor on the old wheel were blue Loc-tited, and would barely budge. Threee required a hammer and chisel.

I don't consider the Elite Adventure (stupid name) a performance bike, so I'd be happy at 20 mph. See what it does in a few days. I figure after doing this kit, I will be the repairman for most stuff. Nothing like a ton of hands on. The Marathon Plus tires went on with no gloves or tools. My kind of tire. Looking forward to that first flat out on the road. :DView attachment 2789 View attachment 2790
Hi George,
I'm glad I got to read your post regarding a front wheel drive hub. I'm in the planning stages of adapting electric assist to my Surly Ogre, 29er frame. I'm a clydesdale in size, over 6 feet and about 230 odd pounds so I was looking into a 500 watt front hub. I've read different stuff regarding this and that and how this is better than that and so on. Now I'm even more confused so I'm going to a store to test ride some electric bikes and go from there.
 

George S.

Well-Known Member
Hi George,
I'm glad I got to read your post regarding a front wheel drive hub. I'm in the planning stages of adapting electric assist to my Surly Ogre, 29er frame. I'm a clydesdale in size, over 6 feet and about 230 odd pounds so I was looking into a 500 watt front hub. I've read different stuff regarding this and that and how this is better than that and so on. Now I'm even more confused so I'm going to a store to test ride some electric bikes and go from there.

There are some issues with torque, loads on the fork. I've got a set of torque arms. I think the Ogre has disk brakes which generally means they plan for torque loads, but I'm not sure how the engineering works. I've mostly seen front hubs up to 350w. I checked and I think you have a steel fork. Can't do better than that. That would be a really nice bike to convert. Seriously. I want the BB7's.:rolleyes:

The weight is mostly a slope thing, climbing. In other words, you won't accelerate as fast (on the flat), but once you are moving, the weight doesn't matter so much. But you might want the gearing of a mid-drive with serious hills, or the 500 watts, and there are different windings.
 

George S.

Well-Known Member
Congratulations George! I have extra spacers from my purchase if you need any. Also, does the caliper clear the hub motor? If not you can buy a caliper that is narrower and it works, I had to do that with my rear hub installation. The wiring is pretty straight forward and if you bought an Infineon the hall sensor wires out of the motor will probably coincide with the colors coming out motor and the power leads will too. The white wire is the thermal sensor output.

Which winding did you buy....xT...4T, 6T????? I think the Elite is a solid performer, but not a performance bike. I ride it pretty regularly at about 23 mph.

Have fun....! keep us informaed on your progress.

Court J.

Hi Court,

Thanks for posting what you have. You made the MAC sound very good, and it wasn't that much more than basic front hubs. I went with the default, which is the 14T winding. Paul lists the 14T as 2 mph faster. I mostly fight wind, not hills.

I don't know if you still have those stock Tektros. The hub sticks out to exactly where the inside (hub side) of the caliper housing sets. There's about 4mm of adjustment, toward and away from the motor, on the caliper mount. So I hope with a 2mm spacer I can adjust the caliper out that far. I got the spacer off Ebay and he said it would be here tomorrow. Looks like rain for the weekend.

I might have to go with the thin caliper. There was something called an Alhonga in a thread on Endless Sphere. It looks very thin. Brand is unknown to me.

ebk-dsc-6040.jpg


The Elite is an interesting bike. After 20 months, it seems like a solid frame. I think it is great value compared to the stuff you see around $700. I've ridden it at 25-30mph, down hills, and it's not as stable as my Prodeco X3. But I plan to do the wiring so I can break the Elite down and transport it without a rack.

Gotta say, you guys who are doing the kits and setting things up right seem to be having really good luck over the long haul, even with serious miles. I'm hoping I can fix anything on this bike, and Paul sells a lot of parts for the motor.

George

Edit: The wiring chart says the white wire is to enable regenerative braking. (? ignore)
 
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flymeaway

Well-Known Member
I might have to go with the thin caliper. There was something called an Alhonga in a thread on Endless Sphere. It looks very thin. Brand is unknown to me.

Edit: The wiring chart says the white wire is to enable regenerative braking. (? ignore)

Hi George...that is the correct caliper. I needed it to clear the rear hub and it works as good as the stock Tetro supplied. As far as the wiring, if your chart says it's to enable regenerative braking then your hub is wired differently then mine. Stick with the chart, and/or confirm the wire connections with Paul. I found him helpful and very responsive to all my questions.

If hills are of no concern, I'm pretty sure you'll be impressed with the motor. I opted for the Grin 3 position aux switch to control my motor and position #2 is set-up to output 350W which happens to be the setting I use the most. At 350W output the 500W rear hub runs comfortably on the flat with easy cadence (not to strenuous) 24+ MPH. At 500W I run about 26-27 mph which feels a tad uncomfortable on the cow paths they call state roads in New Hampshire.

Court J.

PS.....The one thing I noticed immediately is the fast acceleration. Considerably faster then my Neo Carbon, or the mid-drive Bafang on the Elite.
 

Jesse

New Member
There are some issues with torque, loads on the fork. I've got a set of torque arms. I think the Ogre has disk brakes which generally means they plan for torque loads, but I'm not sure how the engineering works. I've mostly seen front hubs up to 350w. I checked and I think you have a steel fork. Can't do better than that. That would be a really nice bike to convert. Seriously. I want the BB7's.:rolleyes:

The weight is mostly a slope thing, climbing. In other words, you won't accelerate as fast (on the flat), but once you are moving, the weight doesn't matter so much. But you might want the gearing of a mid-drive with serious hills, or the 500 watts, and there are different windings.
Yes, I'm using the Shimano IceTech hydraulic disc brakes system and even though the steel fork is rated for them, I would still want to add a set of torque arms for assurance. I thought about a mid-drive but since I'm planning to tour in the future, I don't want to run out of juice and be stuck with only one chain ring and a full load of gear plus the weight of the mid-drive system.

You mentioned "windings" for the front hub, what would you recommend for my intended application? Any recommendations for battery and controllers outputs that are reliable ?
 

tinasdude

Active Member
I thought the mid drives were more efficient so you would be less likely to run out of juice? Your climbing may be limited by that hub motor. It may not be able to handle a long climb. I drove myself crazy reading about e motors and what might be best. I settled on the BBSO2 mid drive eventually. But alas it wouldn't fit my 100mm BB fat bike. Conversions that would make it work are expensive. EM3ev sells complete BBSO2 kits. For the normal bike and keeping to the rules that will keep you a bicycle, I don't think it gets much better. Get a 11-32 freewheel for the rear, and if you have no juice it won't be that bad. Or keep the hub motor and find flat routes. You will have more torque with your hub though. Sorry, guess I am getting partial to mid drives. Handling characteristics are better as well. No matter. You e-biking!!
 

George S.

Well-Known Member
I climb a mile long 7% grade almost every day. The motor barely gets warm. It will climb 11-12% grades. That's all we have, around here. It is just an all around great motor. I use it with a Zippy LiPo pack, hobby batteries (RC). Since these cells will deliver huge amounts of current, it may help. I look down and see I am drawing 800 or 900 watts, climbing a steep grade, but the motor does not get hot. I don't know how the controller is set up, in terms of max watts. I try to use the wattmeter and keep things around 500 watts climbing hills, but the motor is just so willing to deliver power.

Something @flymeaway said in another post. The hubs can't really get going, especially with weight, on a hill. It's hard to say what grade it would be able to start on. It does OK on the 7%.
 
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flymeaway

Well-Known Member
Something @flymeaway said in another post. The hubs can't really get going, especially with weight, on a hill. It's hard to say what grade it would be able to start on. It does OK on the 7%.[/QUOTE]

Hi George,

It was a reply to someone who wanted to build a cargo bike ( I assumed a lot of weight). I agree that a single rider with a geared hub will do alright starting on a reasonable grade, but not a cargo bike. I think he said he was going to do start/stops in traffic on uphill grades, in this instance I do think the 750W 48V BBS02 would be a better choice.

Court J.

PS...just passed 450 uneventful miles on the MAC500 Cafe'....very nice conversion, I really like it a lot. I alternate daily commutes between the Bafang/MAC bikes, I don't use the Neo Carbon for commuting anymore.