Toyota CEO brings up excellent observation about Tesla

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smorgasbord

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
The distinction you made is relatively without merit. Government has tilted the playing field by rewarding and punishing.
As it does with almost everything from refrigerators to logging to baby pajamas to oil drilling rights to house paint, etc.
 

Handlebars

Well-Known Member
Region
Canada
As it does with almost everything from refrigerators to logging to baby pajamas to oil drilling rights to house paint, etc.
And so? Tesla got credits and others had to pay Tesla to get some credits. Even for a kind of fake battery swap demo, they got credits.
 

Timpo

Well-Known Member
Toyota is just like the others. They are missing the EV boat. Tesla has shown that EV is for real and not something for the drawing board.
Tesla has changed the game!
Tesla did truly change the game.

Before Tesla came in the industry, full EV cars with autopilot seemed like distant future fantasy.
In addition, Tesla completely changed the notion of "slow" EV cars.

The Tesla Roadster does 0-60mph in 1.9 seconds. (The upcoming new one will be 0-60mph in 1.1 seconds)

Jay Leno said how Tesla is in completely different league in terms of acceleration.
He even mentioned how he gets to drive Dodge Demon, Bugatti Chiron, Koenigsegg and all the other extremely fast cars, but Tesla is in completely different league.
 

smorgasbord

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
And so? Tesla got credits and others had to pay Tesla to get some credits. Even for a kind of fake battery swap demo, they got credits.
If your beef is with the government, then vote them out, contribute to a PAC, start a PAC, or run for office yourself.

If your beef is with Tesla, then explain why a business shouldn't take advantage of a law as written.

AND note the following:
• The law was changed and Tesla no longer receives credits for battery swapping capability.
• Credits are not cash. The government does not give money to Tesla.
• Other OEMS, like Fiat-Chrysler, give money to Tesla because by law they need those credits since by law they have to produce a certain percentage of vehicles that pollute less or not at all. If FCA, GM, Ford, BMW, etc. had started producing hybrids and battery-electric vehicles back in 2012, like Tesla did, they wouldn't need to buy credits from another company and Tesla's credits would be worthless.

Instead, the automotive OEMs decided it would be cheaper and better for them to continue to make polluting vehicles and buy the necessary credits (both the US and EU have such systems) from other companies rather than spend the time and money to design and build BEVs or other vehicles that polluted less.

Matter of fact, some OEMs decided to cheat the make vehicles that behaved differently during emissions tests than they did in the real world. These OEMs, like VW, Audi, Mercedes, Chrysler and others, literally decided to pollute the air you and I and our children breathe, and then to lie about it, rather than make better vehicles that didn't harm our environment as much.

You're picking on the wrong boogeyman. Tesla's not the problem here. Go ask GM why they stopped making the EV1 just after they got the automotive pollution laws in California changed, and then destroyed just about every EV1 they had produced. Go ask Ford why it's taken until the third decade of the 21st century to make an EV that people would actually want to buy. Go ask VW why they intentionally made vehicles that polluted less when being tested than when being driven, and why they intentionally illegally turn off pollution controls at certain times while driving (Germany just ruled on this one, btw).

And again, if you want to change the laws so vehicles can legally pollute more or have no monetary requirement to make vehicles that pollute less, do something about those laws, but frankly it's misguided to rail against companies like Tesla that are both following the law and producing vehicles that harm our environment less.
 

FlatSix911

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Silicon Valley
Tesla did truly change the game.

Before Tesla came in the industry, full EV cars with autopilot seemed like distant future fantasy.
In addition, Tesla completely changed the notion of "slow" EV cars.

The Tesla Roadster does 0-60mph in 1.9 seconds. (The upcoming new one will be 0-60mph in 1.1 seconds)

Jay Leno said how Tesla is in completely different league in terms of acceleration.
He even mentioned how he gets to drive Dodge Demon, Bugatti Chiron, Koenigsegg and all the other extremely fast cars, but Tesla is in completely different league.
A quick correction on the Roadster stats... ;)

The original first-gen does 0-60 in 3.7 seconds
The new second-gen does 0-60 in 1.9 seconds and with SpaceX package (which includes rocket thrusters) in 1.1 seconds

Full disclosure, I'm long-term bullish on Tesla and own their stock and a few their of cars.

1609007036584.png
 

Timpo

Well-Known Member
A quick correction on the Roadster stats... ;)

The original first-gen does 0-60 in 3.7 seconds
The new second-gen does 0-60 in 1.9 seconds and with SpaceX package (which includes rocket thrusters) in 1.1 seconds

Full disclosure, I'm long-term bullish on Tesla and own their stock and a few their of cars.

View attachment 75186

Sorry I don't understand.. your correction and my numbers are exactly the same. :oops: ???

If, what you meant by the correction was that I didn't specify that first gen 2008 Roadster was slower at 3.7 seconds?
That original 2008 Roadster based on Lotus Elise?

Tesla vs. Lotus: Electric Boogaloo
 

Handlebars

Well-Known Member
Region
Canada
If your beef is with the government, then vote them out, contribute to a PAC, start a PAC, or run for office yourself.

If your beef is with Tesla, then explain why a business shouldn't take advantage of a law as written.
False dichotomy, thanks.
 

Handlebars

Well-Known Member
Region
Canada
Perhaps you do not understand what a false dichotomy is.
"false dichotomy (plural false dichotomies) A situation in which two alternative points of view are presented as the only options, when others are available."
You offered two avenues that you presumably thought I was on one of, but I was on neither of them.