What mode do you ride in and why?

pmcdonald

Well-Known Member
On my 70nm Syncdrive Sport equipped Giant commuter I keep it in Sport, the second highest mode providing 250x support (out of a possible 350x). That gets me to work fresh without totally coasting along.

My 85nn EP8 equipped Merida emtb offers eco, trail and boost. I sit in Trail most of the time as outings are more exercise focused. Trail is a good, reactive intelligent mode. Gets me up anything while still getting the heart rate elevated and minimising wheel spin.
 

newts

Member
Region
USA
Riding in Turbo only (as convenient as it might be) is bad for the mid-drive motor e-bike because it makes the chain stretched soon, and the drive-train worn out prematurely. For any e-bike, riding at maximum assistance requires the battery to be recharged often. It means a big number of recharge cycles that would end up in premature battery degradation. Meaning, a new battery is to be bought in a few years, and it means high cost and issues with availability.

As the Specialized e-bikes I ride allow tuning both of the Assistance (the Boost Factor) and the Maximum Motor Power for each of the ECO, SPORT, and TURBO presets, I carefully setup these parameters before any long ride. I reserve 100% Turbo of my full power Vado for steep mountain climbs, and use it only in emergency otherwise. (It is not much fun when you feel the e-bike is actually "riding you") :D

You are right, I did wear out the chain and 11t sprocket on my Vado the first year. That is why I ditched the chain and went with a belt and IGH. So far so good. The battery should last a reasonable amount. I bought the bike to use it, otherwise why bother with an e bike? I do use 40-80 charging on it and generally use about 20-30% a day. In theory I should get thousands of cycles and many years of use. (40-80 means don't let it get below 40 and stop charging at 80 some technical info here: https://batteryuniversity.com/article/bu-808-how-to-prolong-lithium-based-batteries)

If anyone is interested I jotted down some of my thoughts comparing the Vado 4 to a Gazelle C380+ http://volcano.newts.org/2022/07/18/specialized-vado-4-vs-gazelle-ultimate-380/
 

retiredNH

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
So, it's going to hurt my ebike if I ever ride the steep 9 mile long grade again? I was mostly in Turbo and either first or second gears. The road roughly gains 2200 feet in elevation in that nine miles. It is a power sucking road.
2200 feet in 9 miles? That's a gentle upslope where I live. :) OTOH, if it's steady, with no chance to rest for even a few seconds, I understand...
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
It is easy to ride in the maximum assistance mode if one only sets off for relatively short rides. Any long-distance rider has to conserve the battery charge, and plan the battery usage. There are two examples of long rides with totally different assistance plans:

1661892849302.png

125 km, 1543 m elevation gain (77 mi, 5,062 ft) mountain ride. 100% Turbo uphill, no assistance downhill. Average assistance of 49%. 981 Wh of batteries used.

1661893107235.png

168 km, 588 m elevation gain (104 mi, 1,930 ft) flatland ride. Low assistance of 40% had to be consistently used on my full power Vado to make the trip. 1060 Wh used from both batteries.
 

Nomad

Well-Known Member
It is easy to ride in the maximum assistance mode if one only sets off for relatively short rides. Any long-distance rider has to conserve the battery charge, and plan the battery usage. There are two examples of long rides with totally different assistance plans:

View attachment 133770
125 km, 1543 m elevation gain (77 mi, 5,062 ft) mountain ride. 100% Turbo uphill, no assistance downhill. Average assistance of 49%. 981 Wh of batteries used.

View attachment 133771
168 km, 588 m elevation gain (104 mi, 1,930 ft) flatland ride. Low assistance of 40% had to be consistently used on my full power Vado to make the trip. 1060 Wh used from both batteries.
 

Nomad

Well-Known Member
The batteries keep getting bigger so it getting less of a factor especial for a fit rider by the way can someone get me one of Giants 800wh here to the US??
 

SRoberti

New Member
Region
USA
I just got my first ebike (a Trek Alant+7s stagger), and I am still figuring out the ideal power level. I find I am most comfortable and can still actually "ride" my bike when I ride at the lowest power level and gearing combination that allows me to keep a cadence of around 80 rpm (unless I hit a steep hill). This way, I get a decent workout while feeling like I am riding on flat ground with a little breeze behind my back. I usually toggle between eco, tour and no assist modes and maintain 16 - 20 mph, depending on road/path conditions. Of course I have to periodically go into Sport or Turbo mode for hills (or just to see what it is like riding 28+ mph on flat ground). But I am largely happy with 18-20 mph while riding for fun or commuting. I'm still not sure about what kind of range I will get riding this way. The bike's computer has me at 48 to 60 miles on flat ground, but I haven't put that to the test yet. I usually recharge when the indicator states I am down to 40%.
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
Turbo is only for when you really need it for a burst. I have four levels and standby, 0. Ridding with it floored can cause overheating and stress bearings, clutches and the rest of the drivetrain. You wouldn't floor a car and leave it floored. I mostly like 2. And can up cadence and spin easy.
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
The batteries keep getting bigger so it getting less of a factor especial for a fit rider by the way can someone get me one of Giants 800wh here to the US??
For a full power e-bike, the 800 Wh is still not enough if you go for a really long ride unless you are really fit. My extremely fit brother could make 100 miles on a single 625 Wh battery upwind but he rode his Giant e-bike at the minimum assistance level. It took him over 10 hours of pedalling.
 

HappyGrandpa

Member
Region
United Kingdom
As I understand it, if you have bike with a mid drive motor then it is important to keep up a cadence of 70 and above. What you definitely should not do is ride turbo in your highest for too long. This will burn out the motor, push excess strain on the chain and wear out the smallest sprocket. The latest Specialized Vado bikes have colour indicator on the display to help you maintain the most efficient cadence. Spinning the pedals also helps keep one’s knees in good shape
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
This will burn out the motor
Very few e-bikes can report the motor and battery temperature to the rider (Specialized e-bikes can). Ride in Turbo for 30 minutes on a warm day, and the motor temperature will reach 60 C. Ride more, and hope the thermal protection would kick in.
 

Nomad

Well-Known Member
For a full power e-bike, the 800 Wh is still not enough if you go for a really long ride unless you are really fit. My extremely fit brother could make 100 miles on a single 625 Wh battery upwind but he rode his Giant e-bike at the minimum assistance level. It took him over 10 hours of pedalling.
didn't say you could but there headed in that direction and I was seriously about 800wh they couldn't ship it from overseas
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
didn't say you could but there headed in that direction and I was seriously about 800wh they could ship it from overseas
If someone can fetch a 1200 Wh battery for a full power e-bike then I am all in! (Only worrying about the weight!)

Currently, my Vado batteries (as much as degraded they are) provide at least 1600 Wh of energy, and all my Vado SL ones are 800 Wh (that's 1600 Wh translated to a full power e-bike). A Double Metric Century is in my reach! :)
 

dodgeman

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Macomb, Illinois
I’ve learned to just ride slower at the lower assist levels. For example I took a longer ride for me, 32 miles with 1300 feet of elevation gain and a 12 mph headwind on the way out. I also screwed up and the battery was not fully charged, I was around 85%. I rode most the way out on eco and on tour on the way back. As a result my average moving speed was slow at 12.7 mph, I’m usually 1.5 to 2 mph faster than that. I’m probably spend the majority of my riding in tour mode.
 

PedalUma

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Petaluma, CA
80.5K is good for 97% of my rides. I can do everything I need daily with in 15 minute radius. Who really wants to spend longer than a feature film on a bike saddle? That is very rare. At a certain point each additional moment in the saddle is less fun than the one before. That is at about two hours. I would rather bring the lightest, smallest battery that I need for most of my rides. Than to lug massive capacity 100% of the time, that will only be used 3% of the time. I prefer a universal battery holder and connector so that I can use the battery that is most fitting for that ride. I usually take it easy unless I want to smoke two Vados in the afternoon, it makes me feel alright.
 

fooferdoggie

Well-Known Member
I ride as fast as I have energy in the lowest assist level I can. its the only way to get my heart rate up. did this today passing the throttle guy kept it in tour. P used the Allan 8 faster average then I ever have then fat tires really resist speed.
IMG_0623.jpg
 

Catalyzt

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
I have so little power (250 watts, 40nm w/ 418 Wh battery), and so few levels of assist (3), that the choices are pretty clear for the two types of riding that I do, and I use all three levels for both types of riding.

For general fitness rides when I'm not training aggressively, I'm shifting levels constantly, but I use "HIGH" for anything but gentle hills, "NORM" for gentle hills, and a combination of "ECO" and "NORM" for rolling terrain. For flat segments, I shut off assist completely.

For distance rides, which are up to 35 miles so far (and longer this fall, I hope) the only difference is that I use "NORM" for short, steep hills whenever I can, and for longer steep hills, I'll hang on to "NORM" for longer before shifting to "HIGH." I don't worry too much about "ECO" vs. "OFF" because it has less impact on range, but on gentle terrain, I probably hang on to "OFF" for longer before shifting to "ECO" for this kind of riding.

Given how little power my motor has, I don't worry about wear and tear on the chain, and so far, this hasn't been an issue. Believe it or not, I've only ridden about 1,000 miles in about a year (I have health issues, and the hills here are steep) and both the Park tool and my LBS tell me my chain is doing fine.

@Stefan Mikes -- The battery wear issue is one that I've considered. Just in round numbers, let's say that when I can stay mostly in "NORM," I'm going to get about 42 miles of range, and when I use "HIGH" more, I'll only get about 35 miles of range, so it's clear that I'm shortening the total lifespan of my battery at least 15% faster when I'm riding with more assist. (In fact, the numbers are more like 45 and 37, I'm just making the math easier!)

However, I think the real number is higher, maybe more like 20%, though it's only a guess. Sustained periods of high assist just intuitively to stress the battery so much more based on how quickly the battery bars get used up.

For my most brutal ascents, I'm in HIGH and granny gear for most of the time-- but I still will knock it down to "NORM" or even "ECO" every time the grade gets a little flatter, even if it's only for 25 to 50 feet, just to decrease stress on the battery (mostly) and the motor (somewhat.) I also stop frequently-- like, at least six times when I'm climbing Brand Park Motorway (3.7 miles, 1,850 feet of vertical, 9% average grade w/ 29% max grade) to reduce stress, and avoid degrading the lifespan of the battery, the motor, and the human.

I don't know if that makes any sense, but whoa... my OCD is really kicking today, huh?
 

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
Stefan's Specialized batteries need more tender loving care.
How do you know as none of your e-bikes is Specialized?

Catalyzt: I meant graduał reduction in the battery capacity that occurs during many recharge cycles.