Haibike SDURO AllMtn 6.0 Review

Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Electric Bike Review
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 250 Watt Mid Drive Yamaha 80 Nm
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Yamaha Battery Pack 500 Watt Hours
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Removable Lcd Display Handle Bar
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Schwalbe Nobby Nic 27 5
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Shimano Deore Xt Shadow Plus 10
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Rockshox Yari Air Rear Suspension
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Magura Mt5 Hydraulic Disc Brakes
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Two Cog Chainring
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Electric Bike Review
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 250 Watt Mid Drive Yamaha 80 Nm
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Yamaha Battery Pack 500 Watt Hours
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Removable Lcd Display Handle Bar
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Schwalbe Nobby Nic 27 5
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Shimano Deore Xt Shadow Plus 10
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Rockshox Yari Air Rear Suspension
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Magura Mt5 Hydraulic Disc Brakes
Haibike Sduro Allmtn 6 0 Two Cog Chainring

Summary

  • A trail worthy, full suspension electric mountain bike with stiff lightweight frame construction, optimized suspension and a tightly integrated mid-drive motor from Yamaha
  • Upgraded 500 watt hour battery pack delivers 60+ miles on medium assist, powerful hydraulic disc brakes with 203/180 mm rotors and four piston calipers are easy to use and very smooth
  • Simple remote button pad makes interacting with the control comfortable and intuitive, removable backlit display, integrated micro-usb port, internally routed cables, remote seat post dropper
  • The charger is large and heavy, I'm not a huge fan of the way it connects given the proximity to crank arms and locking feature (which could tip the bike or get bent easier), more limited RPM range on the motor

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Video Review

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Introduction

Make:

Haibike

Model:

SDURO AllMtn 6.0

Price:

$4,599

Body Position:

Forward

Suggested Use:

Trail, Mountain

Electric Bike Class:

Pedal Assist (Class 1)
Learn more about Ebike classes

Warranty:

2 Year Motor and Battery, 5 Year Frame

Availability:

United States, Europe

Model Year:

2017

Bicycle Details

Total Weight:

52 lbs (23.58 kg)

Battery Weight:

6.7 lbs (3.03 kg)

Motor Weight:

7.6 lbs (3.44 kg)

Frame Material:

Hydroformed Aluminum Alloy 6061

Frame Sizes:

15.75 in (40 cm)17.32 in (43.99 cm)18.9 in (48 cm)20.47 in (51.99 cm)

Geometry Measurements:

32" Standover Height

Frame Types:

High-Step

Frame Colors:

Anthracite with Yellow Accents

Frame Fork Details:

RockShox Yari Air Suspension with Motion Control Damper, Rebound Adjust, Compression and 150 mm Travel, Boost 110 / 15 mm Thru Axle with Quick Release

Frame Rear Details:

RockShox Monarch RT DebonAir Shock with Compression and Rebound Clicker, Boost 148 / 12 mm Thru Axle with Quick Release

Gearing Details:

20 Speed 2x10 Shimano Deore XT Shadow Plus with One Way Clutch, 11-36T

Shifter Details:

Shimano Deore DYNASYS Triggers on Left and Right

Cranks:

175 mm FSA Cranks, FSA X-10 Chainring, 32/44T

Pedals:

XLC Freeride, Plastic Platform with Alloy Pins

Headset:

FSA No. 57, A-Head, Semi-Integrated, Tapered

Stem:

Xduro Aluminium, A-Head, 12° Angle, 70 mm Length, Three 10 mm Stackers

Handlebar:

SDURO Lowriser Aluminum, 740 mm Length

Brake Details:

Magura MT5 Hydraulic Disc with 203 mm Rotor in Front and 180 mm Rotor in Back, Magura MT-5 Levers with Adjustable Reach, Quad Piston Calipers

Grips:

XLC Ergo Sport Body Optimized, Rubber, Lock On

Saddle:

Selle Royal Sirio

Seat Post:

XLC Pro, 150 mm Remote Drop, Aluminum Alloy

Seat Post Length:

300 mm

Seat Post Diameter:

31.6 mm

Rims:

Alexrims, Alloy-Double Wall, MD40, 32 Hole, Non-Taped

Spokes:

Stainless Steel 14G, Black

Tire Brand:

Schwalbe Nobby Nic, 27.5" x 3"

Wheel Sizes:

27.5 in (69.85cm)

Tire Details:

Foldable, EVO, Tubeless Easy, Snakeskin Puncture Protection, Trail Star 3, 15-35 PSI

Tube Details:

Presta, Non Tubeless Valves

Accessories:

Neoprene Slap Guard

Other:

Locking Removable Battery Pack, 2.2 lb 4 Amp Charger, Quick Release Wheels and Seat Tube, Cable Inlets, Replaceable Plastic Skid Plate, Gravity Casting Motor Mount Interface with CNC Milled Connection and Bearing Seat Points, Zero Cadence Assist

Electronic Details

Motor Brand:

Yamaha

Motor Type:

Mid-Mounted Geared Motor
Learn more about Ebike motors

Motor Nominal Output:

250 watts

Motor Peak Output:

500 watts

Motor Torque:

80 Newton meters

Battery Brand:

Samsung

Battery Voltage:

36 volts

Battery Amp Hours:

13.6 ah

Battery Watt Hours:

489.6 wh

Battery Chemistry:

Lithium-ion

Charge Time:

4.5 hours

Estimated Min Range:

60 miles (97 km)

Estimated Max Range:

120 miles (193 km)

Display Type:

Yamaha, Removable, Backlit LCD Console

Readouts:

Trip Distance, Total Distance, Current Time, Trip Time, Maximum Speed, Average Speed, Current Speed, Charge Level (10 Bars), Range, Cadence, Assist Level (Off, Eco+, Eco, Std, High)

Display Accessories:

Independent Button Pad with 5 Volt Micro USB Port

Drive Mode:

Advanced Pedal Assist (Wheel Speed, Pedal Torque, Pedal Cadence, Eco+: 50%, Eco: 100%, Std: 180%, High: 280%)

Top Speed:

20 mph (32 kph)

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Written Review

The SDURO AllMtn 6.0 is a near top of the line model from Haibike running a Yamaha mid-drive motor and upgraded 500 watt hour battery pack… That’s a 25% capacity increase from some of the lower-end models and prior year equipment. What I usually notice first about Haibikes is their beautiful purpose-built frames with angular tubing. The rear swing arm consists of four bars, orienting travel vertically and interfering less with braking action. You get light weight air suspension from RockShox, front and rear, with a Diamond Light Coating (DLC) meant to optimize slide and reduce stiction on the fork. Both wheels are connected with thru-axles for strength and stiffness and the hubs are slightly wider, featuring Boost Technology. This is one of many new e-mountain bikes with plus sized tires… 27.5″ x 3″ and that’s designed to improve traction given the heavier build of the bike at ~52 lbs and efficiency of electric assist helping to overcome drag. Schwalbe Nobby Nic tires come tubeless ready but apparently the rim has to be taped and a new stem added to actually run this way. I worked with a friend, Marc Johnson, of ReCycles in Irvine California for this review. He owns this model personally and was able to dig into some of the details with me on camera. I love how integrated the motor and battery are, without being built into the frame. This allows for quicker removal and less expensive replacement while also making them forward compatible from the smaller pack size. You don’t get the large open triangle that some other models from Specialized and Bulls are offering but the price tag here is lower. With four frame sizes to choose from, a wide dealer network worldwide and a control system that is easy to use and fairly advanced (integrated Micro USB port, soothing backlight, removable screen) I’m a fan. The only consideration is a slower cadence operation compared with Bosch. It’s great for ascending and offers plenty of torque. You can set multiple cogs up front (this has a 20 speed drivetrain) and I like how compact and protected it all is with a replaceable plastic shield at the bottom bracket… Just note that it doesn’t have a shift detection controller so you’ll want to change gears thoughtfully to reduce stress on the chain, scraping on the rear cogs and bending on the derailleurs.

Driving the bike is a 250 watt nominally rated, 500 watt peak, 80 Newton meter motor from Yamaha. It’s one of the quieter mid-drive systems I’ve tried and it’s certainly powerful. Using a range of sensors including rear wheel speed, pedal cadence and pedal torque, it responds naturally. Yamaha advertises a “zero cadence” feature meant to excite mountain bikers and it certainly starts fast… but to me it’s on par with Bosch. The material advantage to me is a near $1,000 price difference between most competing models. Marc argued with me on this point defending zero cadence and I welcome you to chime in if you’ve tested both. It certainly works well and is one of the leading systems on the market today.

Powering the motor and display system is a Lithium-ion battery pack that connects mid-frame on top of the downtube. Unlike Bosch and most others, it slides in from the side allowing for a more sloped top-tube and lower stand-over height. I like this design and appreciate the plastic loop at the top for carrying. You can charge the pack on or off the frame and removing it shaves 6.7 lbs making the bike easier to lift, service and transport. Both wheels also offer quick release and the display panel is removable. I love that… So the battery looks exactly like the smaller 400 watt hour pack from years past and charges relatively fast with the included 4 Amp charger. I do feel that this charger is larger and heavier than necessary, at least compared to other chargers on the market today. You get plenty of range with the 500 watt hour battery pack (between 60 and 120 miles depending on assist level, terrain, rider weight etc.) so hopefully you don’t have to carry the charger with you in a backpack… and you probably will need a backpack given the lack of bottle cage bosses on the bike. This is a fairly common occurance with ebikes and you could add a saddle rail adapter to solve it. Note the quality saddle and decent seat post dropper that come stock. Even the pedals are decent considering many high-end bicycles forego them altogether. My final gripe with the battery and charger has to do with how they connect. The charging port is a little circle and the charging cord ends with a circular male plug that inserts into place. Sure, you want a secure connection for charging but what if you trip over the cable or the bike tips or the pedals get bumped and spin into the plug?! Bad news hombre. Some other systems use the magnetic EnergyBus standard that just pops out, possibly not even tipping your bike. I wish Yamaha would adopt a solution like this.

Operating this electric bike is fairly simple. Once the battery is charged and clicked onto the frame (I believe you have to physically turn the key to lock it on vs. an automatic click) the display can be powered on with a press on at the remote button pad. I love how easy this pad is to reach, how it only has four buttons on top and that it appears to be well sealed against water and mud. Marc echoed this sentiment stating that he’d learned how to use it without looking in just a few short rides. It’s nice to have controls within reach that aren’t confusing when you’re riding in off-road conditions. Between the locking grips, the two-finger hydraulic disc brakes and the large LCD display panel… it’s very usable. And that display panel is well laid out. I like that it offers a 10-bar battery infographic and battery percentage readout! You also get a range estimator that changes dynamically as you arrow up or down between the four assist levels. These are features that only the high-end ebikes offer today. The other readouts on the display have to do with trip stats and can be cycled through using the S button below the power button. Note how the handle bar rises up and the stem is negative angle so you end up with a simulated flat bar but get the protection of the grips and metal tubing in the event of a bail. This was designed to protect the nice large display.

My understanding is that an All Mountain bike should be capable of downhill riding but still function on rolling hills and climbing. You get plenty of suspension adjustability here and a geometry that isn’t set too far back. The bike handles well and feels nice over the bumps but isn’t so specialized that you couldn’t tool around town with it. I’m a huge fan of full suspension given the distance and speed that ebikes empower their riders with and usually that comes with a much higher price tag. While the SDURO line can still be expensive and the 6.0 is higher in the range, you get a lot of premium hardware for under $5k. The warranty is 2 year comprehensive with 5 on the frame and even non-electric bike shops should be comfortable servicing it. Just remember to shift consciously at first and you’ll get the hang of the motor. Be careful with the battery pack and larger display and bring your CamelBak or other accessory bag. Big thanks to Marc and Haibike for partnering with me on this review, it’s always great to have an expert on-hand and his drone footage was a neat addition to the video towards the end :)

Pros:

  • Plus sized tires (those over 2.8″ wide) have caught on with electric mountain bikes because they can run at lower PSI, provide better traction and cushion and reduce deflection and slipping on rocky surfaces, the SDURO ALLMTN 6.0 uses higher quality Schwalbe tires that are 3″ wide
  • Available in four frame sizes, this electric bike offers higher performance and fit, I love how the top tube is angled down for lower stand over height (the battery slides out sideways to help achieve this
  • Excellent weight distribution with both the motor and battery mounted towards the center of the frame and kept low
  • The motor is powerful and responsive offering smooth starts and stops (measuring pedal cadence and torque to activate as well as rear wheel speed), you get up to 80 Nm of torque which makes it an excellent climber if you shift gears appropriately
  • Beautiful paint and graphics… Haibike has long been a favorite of mine because they just look cool and professional, notice the fork and saddle are tied in, non-ebikers seem more interested because it looks legit
  • Higher-end lightweight air suspension front and rear offers a ton of travel so you can handle a bit of downhill and use it as a true all mountain electric bike, the four-bar suspension uses 15 mm axles for strength and stiffness and the tubing is boxed and extra stiff without adding much weight
  • The battery can be charged on or off the bike frame and is easy to remove (though it does not rattle or feel loose when mounted to the frame), it weighs about 6.7 lbs so taking it off could make mounting the bike to car racks safer and easier (more space in the triangle), it offers excellent range now upgraded to ~500 watt hours vs. the older 400 wh (which are still compatible with the interface so you could use them if you already own a Haibike)
  • The Yamaha display system is a real standout to me, this is their upgraded model with a larger LCD which is removable and you also get a remote button pad which is easy to reach while riding and it has a Micro USB port built in
  • I’m a big fan of dropper seat posts and love that the ALLMTN Plus comes with one that is preinstalled which Marc was a fan of… he’s more of a mountain biker than me and approved of the component chosen
  • Powerful hydraulic disc brakes from Magura offer the precise, smooth stopping power required for true off-road riding, note the four piston calipers and adjustable reach two-finger levers
  • Sturdy thru-axles with wider hubs using Boost Technology and quick release for easy trail maintenance and quick compact transportability, one big advantage of a mid-drive is that the drivetrain itself is more traditional and easy to work with for regular bike shops
  • The Yamaha motor produces less noise than Bosch and Impulse 3.0 in my opinion, it’s a bit less noticeable (especially when riding on a dirt trail where the tires are already making noise just from rolling)
  • The pedals you get with this Haibike aren’t half bad… I prefer the wide platform with metal pins to smaller cages which seem to get bent, the included pedals work great for test rides
  • The cockpit is well thought out, notice the negative angle stem and low-rise bars meant to approximate a flat bar while protecting the display panel in the event of a crash
  • Rather than showing your battery percentage by default, the Yamaha display uses little bars on an info-graphic but I love that they have 10 bars (for 10% steps) vs. many other bikes that show just 5 or 6, if you flip through the readouts you can also get percentage which is fantastic but that same display area can be used for odometer, trip distance etc. so I love that you have a choice
  • You can run 29ers on this ebike if you want, the standard plus sized tire in 27.5 endes up being a similar diameter but wider than some might prefer… so you can swap them out and they should fit the frame
  • Despite having a 25% larger battery capacity, the overall weight of the bike hasn’t gone up much, the battery only increased by 0.2 lbs based on my own measurements
  • The fork comes with air tokens that allow you to reduce bottoming out without raising the air pressure beyond a desired performance level, the stanchions also have a hardened DLC (diamond light coating) for smooth slick performance, it reduces stiction
  • Shadow Plus upgrade on the rear Shimano Deore XT derailleur is a one way clutch lever (that you physically click back or forward) that tightens the spring to reduce chain bounce and slap, it changes how shifting feels so it’s neat that you get the option to click it on or leave the chain looser for easier shifting

Cons:

  • I like to complain about the more limited RPM output of Yamaha’s mid-drive motor but it works very well for climbing on mountain terrain, I was able to pedal slower while maintaining balance and get a lot of torque support
  • Unlike the Bosch and Impulse drive systems, the Yamaha mid-drive doesn’t offer shift sensing which could lead to chain and sprocket mashing (especially with two derailleurs here), learn to shift as the motor cuts out… when you stop pedaling momentarily
  • The battery charger seems unnecessarily large and bulky compared with some of the other options out there, I wish Yamaha would consider the magnetic EnergyBus port vs. their plug, which pushes in, in and could get bent or knock the bike over if tripped on, the left crank arm passes it closely which makes it vulnerable
  • Haibikes tend to be more expensive and are frequently out of stock in popular sizes, we were looking at the 6.0 here even though Marc wanted to buy the 6.5 originally… it was out of stock, I feel like they spread the line thin with so many options which can be disappointing if you visit a dealer and fall in love with a specific model or feature set
  • While it’s neat to have 20 gear combinations, I don’t change the front very often and have become a fan of the lighter, less complex 1×11 setups… especially given the non shift sensing mid-drive motor systems
  • I like how smooth the motor winds down as you stop pedaling but it isn’t as instantaneous as some other systems, notice how it continues rotating a bit during the ride test in the video review above
  • Despite being a more athletic-oriented sporty electric bike, there are no bosses for adding a water bottle, you’ll probably need a hip pack or hydration backpack. Marc teased me that this can protect your back if you fall off the bike… but he didn’t realize that I never fall :P
  • Even though the tires are tubeless ready, they don’t have liners or stems that will work for this, consider having your shop tape the rims and help get them tubeless for lower PSI and lower weight performance like Marc did for his bike in this review
  • I couldn’t figure out how to turn off backlighting on the display panel, I think it’s an always-on design which could be a little distracting at night if you prefer all-dark and stealth riding
  • It seems like walk mode is disabled on the Yamaha system still, at least for the USA, perhaps someone can chime in and correct me if not? I’ve seen other brands like Bosch enable it starting in 2017

Resources:

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Alex Aharonov
10 months ago

Love the drone footage. what Drone did you use?

Reply
Joe
10 months ago

I’m curious what you mean by “twisting to connect charger” ? I have a 2016 Sduro Trekking and the plug goes straight in with arrows aligned. I think twisting would damage it.

Reply
Court Rye
10 months ago

I may be mistaken Joe, we didn’t have the charger with us and it’s possible I was confusing the push-in connector from Easy Motion which has the twist wings on it to the one for Yamaha. Thanks for chiming in, I will edit my feedback here :)

Reply
Shaggy
9 months ago

Never thought to ask before, but can this Yamaha (and bosch) be ridden as e-bikes without their displays attached? I am thinking of the night-time riding lit display situation. (Thank you for your reporting about rpm-range–I expect it may be hard for a new buyer to evaluate what’s better for them when the experience is all new and unfamiliar).

Scott
7 months ago

Shaggy, these bikes cannot be ridden electronically without the display. Anything happens to it, it can always be replaced, but it’s generally a good idea to take it with you if you lock the bike up and to take it off the bike when transporting (actually both companies recommend removing for transport).

I’ve loved this bike every time I’ve ridden it. Perfect for trail riding and more serious downhill rides. We’ve partnered with Haibike for a number of years now, and this is truly one of my favorite Sduro AllMtns yet. Check it out at San Diego Fly Rides if you’re interested!

Reply
Court Rye
7 months ago

Thanks for the clarification about the display Scott! You can reply directly to users and it will message them. It appears this comment was made in the general “reply all” field. Feel free to copy/paste and I’ll delete this older comment if you’d like :)

Reply

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LimboJim
2 weeks ago

Anyone using the
KMC X10e Sport Bicycle Chain?

Yes, for about 250 hard trail miles so far on my Sduro AllMtn+ with no problems! I bought several at an EU site that sells a lot of ebike-specific parts for far less than anyone I've found in the US - $25-30 shipping but I save more than that with each $100 I spend there: https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/kmc-x10e-e-bike-chain-10-speed-32293

Marc Webster
4 weeks ago

I haven't experienced the latest eMTB-specific Bosch CX, Yamaha PW-X or Brose-S motors, so I can't compare them to the E8000. I do own three Haibikes (2014 Xduro FS RX, 2015 Xduro rx29 & 2016 Sduro AllMtn+) however, and will say that the overall build quality and finish on all three are noticeably superior to my 2018 Motobecane eBoost Pro (pivots, motor bash guards, PAINT etc.). So I'd jump on that deal for the "lower-specced" Haibike AllMtn 7.0; I think you might be happier in the long run (you can always upgrade componentry later).

I have ridden a BBS02-fitted Biktrix offroad extensively, as well, and the low overhang sent me flying off the bike when I tried to clear a 4-5" log that every other MTB or eMTB I've ever ridden cleared with ease. Also, IMO, Bafang's power is far too binary, and it's way to torquey at its lowest assist level for traversing technical singletrack. The lag time after pedal disengagement is also a liability on tight turns etc.
Thanks Limbojim,

I have ridden a BBS02 converted bike and while it did have a ton of speed and power it was not refined and easily controllable in singletrack as you mentioned. That is why when I converted my commuter I chose a small Q128 hubmotor from BMS. I wanted a bike under 40lbs that still felt like a bike. Also on the off chance I lose power I wanted it to not have too much drag and the geared hubmotos hardly have any. I pedaled my dads BBS02 bike and it was abysmal to pedal with all the drag. I did pedal the All Mountain 7 with the motor off and it was even worse than the BBS02. I had read the shimano system pedals a bit better and the Brose system completely decouples. Some of the points newfydog mentions sound good and also seems the shimano bikes batteries are a bit less then the Bosch. I do like that you have experience on both so that puts the All mountain 7 more on top for me and if needed I can take the money I save on the used All Mountain 7 to buy an extra battery one day.

I will think this all over and do more research over the holiday.

LimboJim
4 weeks ago

Hello All,

First post here.

I am currently commuting on an electric bike that I made by adding low power hubmotor (Q128 from BMS) and it works so well I now want to replace my 2008 Specialized FSR 29er with an electric bike. I test rode the Haibike all mountain 6.5 and 7, Specaialized Revo and the Giant. I was considering converting my FSR that I own with a BBSHD and using my commuter battery but don't want the liability of a motor hanging below. Now I see Motobecane has made what looks to be a really nice bike. I have no familiarity with the Shimano E drives but did find I liked the Bosch over the Yamaha. Before finding the Motobecane I was pretty much settled on the 2017 All mountain 7 and my LBS has it for roughly 3800 out the door so its very similar in price to the Motobecane. Yet the motobecane is better specked and unsure if i want ot take the chance site unseen and no demo ride when I know I like the All mountain 7.

If anyone on here has experience with the bike vs Haibike I would love to hear it. Also a Bosch CX vs Shimano comparison. Limbojim would love more info...

Also I want a PAS type bike over the high powered Luna bikes as I want to keep the bie fele over more the motorcycle feel. Not ot put down what they are doing s I think its amazing but for my Mtn biking tastes I only want some help in climbing mostly...

Thanks,

Marc
I haven't experienced the latest eMTB-specific Bosch CX, Yamaha PW-X or Brose-S motors, so I can't compare them to the E8000. I do own three Haibikes (2014 Xduro FS RX, 2015 Xduro rx29 & 2016 Sduro AllMtn+) however, and will say that the overall build quality and finish on all three are noticeably superior to my 2018 Motobecane eBoost Pro (pivots, motor bash guards, PAINT etc.). So I'd jump on that deal for the "lower-specced" Haibike AllMtn 7.0; I think you might be happier in the long run (you can always upgrade componentry later).

I have ridden a BBS02-fitted Biktrix offroad extensively, as well, and the low overhang sent me flying off the bike when I tried to clear a 4-5" log that every other MTB or eMTB I've ever ridden cleared with ease. Also, IMO, Bafang's power is far too binary, and it's way to torquey at its lowest assist level for traversing technical singletrack. The lag time after pedal disengagement is also a liability on tight turns etc.

bob armani
2 months ago

Hi,
I am a German guy currently visiting the Bay Area for a while.
Riding Haibike eMTBs since 2012, got divorced after I bought my 8th Haibike o_O. I've got lots of experience with the Bosch motors, riding them a lot and even repair the motors if necessary.

These are my bikes here in the US:
My German 2015 Haibike FatSix

My US version 2017 Haibike Cross 4.0

My German 2015 Haibike Sduro AllMtn Pro

And if I don't know what to do, I just cruise around with another 2017 FatSix which is so much fun using the eMTB mode :D

Here are some of my threads in the German Pedelec forum:
Repair broken Bosch motor
https://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/performance-motor-innenleben-so-sollte-es-eigentlich-nicht-aussehen-o.40234/

My current activities
https://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/the-orange-thing-geht-auf-reisen.47919/page-9

My 2015 trip across Eastern Europe
http://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/radreise-nach-osteuropa-mit-dem-haibike-fatsix-vorbereitung-tourbilder-etc.34651/

You go German guy! You are an inspiration to all of us ebikers here in the US. Those are some nice ebikes you own. When it will cost you a divorce, you know where your passion is. Just like owning too many rebuilt muscle cars her in the US which may make the wifey a little pissed off...LOL
It seems like most of all the best engineered bikes come out of Germany IMHO. Love the designs and the styling of most of the brands. Bulls, Focus, KTM, Haibike etc. Enjoy and ride safe!!:cool:

E-Wheels
2 months ago

Hi,
I am a German guy currently visiting the Bay Area for a while.
Riding Haibike eMTBs since 2012, got divorced after I bought my 8th Haibike o_O. I've got lots of experience with the Bosch motors, riding them a lot and even repair the motors if necessary.

These are my bikes here in the US:
My German 2015 Haibike FatSix

My US version 2017 Haibike Cross 4.0

My German 2015 Haibike Sduro AllMtn Pro

And if I don't know what to do, I just cruise around with another 2017 FatSix which is so much fun using the eMTB mode :D

Here are some of my threads in the German Pedelec forum:
Repair broken Bosch motor
https://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/performance-motor-innenleben-so-sollte-es-eigentlich-nicht-aussehen-o.40234/

My current activities
https://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/the-orange-thing-geht-auf-reisen.47919/page-9

My 2015 trip across Eastern Europe
http://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/radreise-nach-osteuropa-mit-dem-haibike-fatsix-vorbereitung-tourbilder-etc.34651/
@wildtrak Welcome to the forum
Your post reminds me of the formula N+1 which is used in calculating the ideal number of bikes one should own in a lifetime
N being the number of bikes you currently own

wildtrak
2 months ago

Hi,
I am a German guy currently visiting the Bay Area for a while.
Riding Haibike eMTBs since 2012, got divorced after I bought my 8th Haibike o_O. I've got lots of experience with the Bosch motors, riding them a lot and even repair the motors if necessary.

These are my bikes here in the US:
My German 2015 Haibike FatSix

My US version 2017 Haibike Cross 4.0

My German 2015 Haibike Sduro AllMtn Pro

And if I don't know what to do, I just cruise around with another 2017 FatSix which is so much fun using the eMTB mode :D

Here are some of my threads in the German Pedelec forum:
Repair broken Bosch motor
https://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/performance-motor-innenleben-so-sollte-es-eigentlich-nicht-aussehen-o.40234/

My current activities
https://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/the-orange-thing-geht-auf-reisen.47919/page-9

My 2015 trip across Eastern Europe
http://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/radreise-nach-osteuropa-mit-dem-haibike-fatsix-vorbereitung-tourbilder-etc.34651/

1/3
Robert Stevens
5 months ago

I've had the same problem with my Haibike sduro Yamaha. The lock latching is not holding the battery tight to the lock as it should. Three friends have the same bike without this issue. The problem can be solved as described in this thread but I wonder if there is a way of adjusting the lock mechanism so that the battery is held tight to the lock? I've previously used foam to force the battery upward towards the lock. I thought a more elegant solution would be a product called Sugru. This is a mouldable silicone rubber-like material. I formed two discs (pads) of Sugru and stuck them to the underside of the battery close to the position of the lock. Unforunately, Sugru cures too hard and therefore has very little flexibility -- unlike true silicone rubber. So while you can reduce the rattle, it is still present. A solution may be to glue a thin pad of foam to the pads that you form from the Sugru. None of this should be necessary on a quality bike. I will next attempt to open up the lock or replace it with another mechanism. I've had quite a few issues, both electronic and mechanical, with Haibike (which I love regardless). So I can't say I find the bike reliable. I'll post problems and solutions in other threads.
I have a Haibike AllMtn 6.0, and love it. My battery latch is working properly, although as a reminder, when transporting your bike, make sure the battery is fully seated in the latch. I thought mine was, but I lost it in transit to my favorite bing venue. A new 500 Wh battery cost around $900...............needless to say, a major bummer!

Bicyclista
5 months ago

I second what Chris Nolte said, although some of it requires translation if you're a newbie. "Plus size bikes" are not oversized bikes! Rather, they are bikes whose frames allow using (around) 3-inch-wide tires, i.e. wider than most mountain bikes (around 2.25 inches) and thinner than fat bikes (4 inches wide or more). For me, plus-size tires are the sweet all-terrain tires, allowing you to ride anything from pavement to gravel to sand.

You should ALWAYS get a frame that is the right size for you.

As the owner of a full-suspension Haibike Sduro AllMtn Plus, which uses a mid-drive Yamaha motor, I can tell you that Bosch is not the only good motor around. My bike can climb hills really well, and it matches my 60-90 rpm cadence. If, however, you're a high cadence rider you would probably be better served by Bosch. Court Rye, the owner of this site, has noted in his reviews that Yamaha motors' power output goes down at high cadence whereas Bosch motors' power band continues on. However, bikes with Yamaha motors are substantially less expensive than those with Bosch motors, at least in the Haibike line.

If you need to have a rack to take things with you, a hard tail with front suspension might be better. I have yet to find a good rack for my full-suspension, plus-size tire bike, i.e. a rack that attaches to the moving seat stays AND is wide enough to clear the plus-sized tires. (I don't like cantilever racks that attach only to the seat post; they are inherently weak.) But I would definitively recommend a suspension seat post if you get a hardtail.

Bicyclista
5 months ago

This is a small issue, but it could lead to an accident if a cable gets tangled with your wheel. I have a Haibike Sduro AllMtn Plus. I've ridden it about a year and 1600 miles, mostly pavement, some dirt, nothing extreme. Overall a great bike!

This is the first issue I've had so far: the small, black plastic clip that holds the speed sensor cable secured to the frame fell off during a ride a couple of days ago. Haibike uses the same kind of clip or clamp to secure other cables as well, such as disc brake cables. (I was going to attach photos but I see that pictures have to be hosted by an external server, and I've cancelled all my accounts in photo-hosting sites.) The clips appear to be specific to Haibike. They attach to tiny cradles or bosses in the frame. A neat solution, as long as they don't fall off!

I emailed my dealer, @San Diego Fly Rides, asking whether the clip was readily available and whether its replacement would be covered under warranty. This is their reply:

"Hi... its not covered under warranty as its lost but we'll see if we have one around here otherwise we'd have to order some - will keep you posted, thnx"

I do not follow their reasoning, that because it's "lost" it is no covered under warranty. It fell off during a normal ride, and perhaps it fell off because it was loose or because the design is faulty.

In the meantime I wrapped the cable to the frame with black tape and I am waiting to hear back from @San Diego Fly Rides.

Ariche
5 months ago

I just got my new bike yesterday, my first ebike.

What a blast. I haven't been for any major rides yet, just about town, which has a few hills.

I am recovering from a medial ligament knee injury and justified the expense on that basis. But I was hoping it was going to be a hoot and it sure is.

The bike quality is excellent. The Yamaha PW system has such smooth delivery. Town traffic is speed limited to 30kph an I now have no qualms about pulling into traffic and taking a genuine slot in the traffic. It's much easier to get up to speed and not feel "in the way".

For an entry level full suspension bike it's very functional.

I will report back in a week or two with an update. I'm very glad I went for a Haibike.

PS. Thanks for all the bike reviews. They really helped choosing this bike.

Trampus
5 months ago

My first post, EBR has been a great resource, thanks.

I just got my 2016 SDURO ALLMTN and having a lot of fun. Question, anyone have a fix for the battery rattle? I knew it was coming this way because Court mentioned it, I think on a 29" he tested, and I read it somewhere else. I believe the Bosch has a pad between frame and battery, so I was thinking of making a Neoprene one, or just wrapping a velcro strap around it.

I've had the same problem with my Haibike sduro Yamaha. The lock latching is not holding the battery tight to the lock as it should. Three friends have the same bike without this issue. The problem can be solved as described in this thread but I wonder if there is a way of adjusting the lock mechanism so that the battery is held tight to the lock? I've previously used foam to force the battery upward towards the lock. I thought a more elegant solution would be a product called Sugru. This is a mouldable silicone rubber-like material. I formed two discs (pads) of Sugru and stuck them to the underside of the battery close to the position of the lock. Unforunately, Sugru cures too hard and therefore has very little flexibility -- unlike true silicone rubber. So while you can reduce the rattle, it is still present. A solution may be to glue a thin pad of foam to the pads that you form from the Sugru. None of this should be necessary on a quality bike. I will next attempt to open up the lock or replace it with another mechanism. I've had quite a few issues, both electronic and mechanical, with Haibike (which I love regardless). So I can't say I find the bike reliable. I'll post problems and solutions in other threads.

Mark K
7 months ago

I was gonna say, @Mark K, that the quality of your photography is high! As a fellow professional photographer, I wish I had traded a film for my Haibike Sduro FullSeven AllMtn Plus, the way your girlfriend did for her Trekking. I love my bike, although I finally decided to add Mr. Tuffy liners to my tires. On all other fronts, electrically and mechanically, my bike has performed perfectly. I upgraded the pedals, the grips, and the saddle. I cut the handlebars two inches from each side as they were too wide for me. I raised the stem. I added lights and a mirror. I wish I had a kickstand. What kickstand are you using?

I use this kickstand.

Bicyclista
7 months ago

I was gonna say, @Mark K, that the quality of your photography is high! As a fellow professional photographer, I wish I had traded a film for my Haibike Sduro FullSeven AllMtn Plus, the way your girlfriend did for her Trekking. I love my bike, although I finally decided to add Mr. Tuffy liners to my tires. On all other fronts, electrically and mechanically, my bike has performed perfectly. I upgraded the pedals, the grips, and the saddle. I cut the handlebars two inches from each side as they were too wide for me. I raised the stem. I added lights and a mirror. I wish I had a kickstand. What kickstand are you using?

LimboJim
7 months ago

Bob, its "under power and slow," = lack of power with any grade over 10%, we spent most of our time riding in mountain in So Cal. The Brose below 10% rides like all of them, but anything over 10%, the Brose is a dog, anything over 15% be prepare for a workout, over 20%, you better be running a 36t in the rear. In the mountains, we rarely go past 12-15 mph on single track riding, but in certain areas it requires torque to get you out, there were it lacks the power.

Brose stealthy look is my favorite, out of the Big 3, but torque power is my least fav....
My Bulls...FS3 Plus, rated at 90Nm, has at least as much torque as my 80Nm Yamaha-powered SDURO AllMtn Plus, and both eMTBs climb 20% grade hills with relative ease. The Brose motor's definitely more subtle, with its peak power coming at lower cadence than my Bosch, but I've yet to experience a CX. The Yamaha also seems to peak at a lower cadence than Bosch.

FWIW, I posted about a broken chain experience I recently had with my Bulls in its first 120 miles or so, which I believe was caused by large chainring to large sprocket cross-chaining. My concern is that, when the chain broke, the Brose motor spun furiously fast, making a horrible, very high-pitched whining sound for several seconds. I've broken a hi-torque ebike chain before (on my 2015 iZiP Sumo), and its much lower-tech TranzX motor shut right off.

The fact that the Brose kept spinning makes me worry about the long-term - it rode fine after we fixed the chain but it was an AWFUL sound! Barney's put in a query with Bulls' Germany HQ because he's never heard of this happening.

bob armani
8 months ago

Hi.

After long deliberations, tons of on-line reviews I jumped into the pool and bought SDURO ALLMTN PLUS.
I was a bit worried about the negative tester's comments about Haibike upright geometry, it turned out to be a complete bull. The bike is absolutely fantastic. I climbed 3,000ft and blasted down on a steep and technical trail and the bike performed flawlessly. After completing 2.5hour ride my battery was at 50% and the only thing that went through my mind was, let's do it again :)

Anyone out there have the same bike?

Glad to see your excitement about your bike. I was considering the same model without the plus tires or the BULLS EVO FS3. I too am so excited about these bikes after long and thought out research reviews. How has your bike been performing? Does it meet your expectations in quality? Do you recommend this bike to others? Thanks a lot and always ride safe! :D

LimboJim
8 months ago

Wheel spokes: I have two 2015 XDURO Haibikes, an FS RX and an rx29. Both had spokes come loose in the first few trail rides; the FS RX's rear wheel wobbled noticeably during its third or fourth ride and I was lucky it could be trued! The first LBS I brought it to thought it was too far gone, but second opinions can be worth a few hundred bucks, minimum...

FWIW, my 2016 SDURO AllMtn Plus has had no such issues, but didn't come with DT Swiss wheels like my XDUROS did. After the above experience, however, I bought a tension meter and now check spoke tension on all my eMTBs regularly. It has proven its worth, as have the few minutes it takes to test the spokes.

Bicyclista
8 months ago

@ahkim, if you're 5'-6" you should probably ride a small frame size. I am 5'-6" and I ride a small Haibike Sduro AllMtn Plus (2016). Before buying you should test ride and you MUST get fitted for the proper size.

I would recommend the 3" tire. The fatter the better off-road capability. In 2016 there was a version of the Sduro that came with 3" tires, such as my bike. They may have changed that for 2017.

Regarding Bosch vs Yamaha, both are good. Read Court's reviews of the different Haibikes that use each motor. In general, if you are a high cadence cyclist, go with Bosch. If you are a low to medium cadence cyclist, go with Yamaha (Court points out that the Yamaha motor tends to cut out at high cadence). For me, the Yamaha motor fits my riding style.

ahkim
8 months ago

Hi Everyone

So I'm ready to pull the trigger on an ebike and I've narrowed it down to a few bikes.

Xduro FullSeven 7.0
Xduro AllMtn 7.0
Sduro All Mtn 6.5
Trek Powerfly FS 8

I'm trying to understand the differences between the bikes, here's what I know:

Xduro has Bosch vs Sduro has Yamaha motor
Xduro has 3" tire vs Sduro 2.8" tire
Obviously there are differences in the components
Xduro FullSeven has an extra cm of standover height over Sduro AllMtn

What I don’t get is the difference between the Xduro FullSeven and Xduro AllMtn. Seems like they are very similar, so why make them different lines?

Some general info:

I'll ride trails on the weekend and ride to work once a week. (14 miles to work)
I'm in Minnesota so we don't have crazy long and steep trails but we do have some good technical trail systems.
I'm 5'6"; shorter inseam so standover is going to be an issue. I'm thinking about a Medium.
I'm considering converting to Di2 XT.
There's a local bike shop that carries Haibike but I want to get some facts before I head in. I haven't tried the Haibike yet.
I've tried the Trek Powerfly and thought it was great but standover was not good.

Are there any other bikes that I should consider?

DanielGlacial
8 months ago

Thanks for answers, i know about e-connect ,and looks fine but i think if it get stolen it still wont be found or it will be broken. The other features i think my iphone will do, like map tracking.

I am 40 so comfort is nice, but still a hefty 1000 euro more then hardtail 7.0.

I wish i knew if the new yamaha engine pw-x is worth it, or if its something i wont notice.

My ride will be work commute 24 miles per day, so the 500 wh battery will be good.

It will also be used in free time for trails and hopefully some downhill tracks close by.

Seems 50/50 when you look youtube, but these are more advanced riders, alot seem to do fine with jumping with hardtail as well.

I wanted the 27.5 plus tires in sduro 7.0 allmtn but they didnt seem to have it home, and still 4300 euro, then this one is better on paper.

I hear about alot of service with read dampers, might be annoying, but what do i know. Its a huge investment, which mean i wont buy a car for a year to save the money used on bike. We have 1 car in family.

Duke em
8 months ago

So I had a 2016 All Mtn Sduro SC bike.
Sold that and just got the newer year version!

Have ridden on the trails twice so far.

I think these are similar spec sduro yamaha bikes (SC 2016 = 6.0 2017).
Both yamaha.

I love the 3" plus sized tires on the 2017! I'm not a skilled rider. Only started mtn bike riding 5 months ago. It sure helps with my poor line choices when on the technical trails!!

I love the improved range on the 2017 battery. I can use the highest assist mode more often and not worry about range as much.

Biggest reason I upgraded so quick was because i'm 5'10" tall with a 33" inseam. That puts me at in between the medium and large frame mtn bikes.

My 2016 was a sized large (48cm). Since I'm now loving more technical riding, I've learned that I'm suppose to go for a bike on the smaller side. So large was not good for technical riding for me.

My 2017 is now a size medium (44cm). It's perfect! It feels so much better when going on sketchy trails where I need to really be in flow to avoid a crash and burn.

That's all i have to report for now. the 2017 All-mtn sduro 6.0 is awesome!
I'm in San Diego. Whoever else has an e-mtn bike, let's ride!

Lenny
8 months ago

Hey guys,

I am about to pull the trigger on a Haibike Sduro AllMtn 6.0. My only concern now is choosing the right frame size. I am 6ft3 or 193 cm tall and my inside leg measurement is 34" or 85 cm. What frame size would you choose, the 19"/48 cm or the 21"/52 cm? The tyre size is 27.5".

Picture is just for attention. :)/QUOTE]

You should definitely go with 52cm frame.

DonWerner
8 months ago

Hey guys,

I am about to pull the trigger on a Haibike Sduro AllMtn 6.0. My only concern now is choosing the right frame size. I am 6ft3 or 193 cm tall and my inside leg measurement is 34" or 85 cm. What frame size would you choose, the 19"/48 cm or the 21"/52 cm? The tyre size is 27.5".

Picture is just for attention. :)

Duke em
9 months ago

Hi Folks,

I've only had my bike for 5 months now. I do quite a bit of technical trail riding that involves jumps, bunny hops, manuals and wipeouts. Haven't had any serious crashes. More of me falling off the bike then the bike crashing thus far.

I've noticed for last number of rides, my display doesn't show my speed correctly. It will show zero at times when I'm actually coasting or sometimes when I'm pedaling as well. It kinda goes down to zero, then back to the speed bike is moving. Back and forth. Like there is a loose connection.

At the times when the display speed shows ZERO, and I'm actually pedaling and moving with momentum, the motor assist provides NO assist at these times when the display shows ZERO mph. Not good when I'm pedaling/climbing uphill, on a trail that goes a long way up. I get NO ASSIST! At these times when I'm pedaling up a climb and the speeds shows ZERO, the assist level digital icon for (econo / std / high) will be blinking. When the speed shows an actual number of my moving speed, the digital icon for the assist level will remain steadily ON (without blinking).

Anyone else have this problem? Or have ideas about how much of a problem this will be to fix?

Duke

Jonathan Brazeau
2 months ago

Gentleman, fun stuff, thanks for the in-depth review.... just went to try a demo e-bike similar to this at a local shop and I'm sold on the technology, best of all worlds.... I didn't bother asking the rep this question at the time but what is the warranty situation with these news bikes? Also, what is your unbiased opinion on Shimano steps vs. Yamaha motors..

MrHockaluger
2 months ago

Been watching this particular video a few times along with other of your Haibike reviews as I'm in the market for an ebike. Kept coming back to this one cause the other guy's riding style is similar to mine so I can relate to him liking this model. Found a nice deal at a somewhat local shop for around $3700 + tax. Really looking forward to riding it.

wordupmag
1 month ago

Wheelworld Culver City has it for 3700

Marc Diedrichs
4 months ago

Bought it new in Germany for 3400€. Amazing bike

Adam Heath
4 months ago

how and where can I get the tune for the removal of the speed limiter

WilliamPavonRSS
6 months ago

I have this amazing bike as well, I love it. The efficiency is infinitely better than my bbshd, not the same power or speed, but the range is quadruple.

Alexi Thunderbird
7 months ago

I'm a complete noob and was considering a dual sport motor bike. is this good for long distances? how about going up steep Hills? I noticed in another video I just watched the guy demonstrating had trouble getting up a hill.

Jeroen de Smit
7 months ago

Are you going to review the Haibike Sduro Hardseven 7.0 with the Yamaha PW-X motor anytime soon?
Next month I'm going to buy my Haibike but I can't choose between these bikes.

Jeroen de Smit
7 months ago

Can't stop watching this movie, awesome bike, awesome footage and all the information needed.

J P
8 months ago

Hi!

I got my sduro allmtn 6 today!

You always told, that the charger of the yamaha system is huge, but i don't know maybe yamaha reacted to this issue and mine is smaller and lighter than the bosch charger! :D

John Lambert
8 months ago

Great review as always Court! How would something like this compare to a Specialized Turbo Levo? I can only presume Specialized use higher quality components to justify the higher price but moreso how would the performance difference be?

babur.karaoglu
9 months ago

what about the haibike boss lady stepping down and quitting her baby...

Dave Berg
9 months ago

How tall is the dude riding the bike ? He is riding a L-size, which is good for people around what hight ?
Where I live it´s not easy to try out Haibikes so i would like to know what size to aim for.....

T Lust
9 months ago

I got my Haibike ♥️it!

Wayne Rhea
9 months ago

hey I was looking to get a bike for someone thing is they are about 250 pounds so I need a bike that can take hills and trails while still getting good range price isn't a problem unless it's over 5k any suggestions.

eBikeSupply
9 months ago

Hi Wayne, I would recommend the Easy Motion Atom Lynx 4.8 because of the highest motor torque available in the industry at 90nm. This will get you up ANY mountain bike trail & work excellent for a 250lb rider. http://www.emotionbikesusa.com/en/bicycles/ebikes/atom-lynx-4-8-27-5-pro-ur907-us.html

Gaj B
9 months ago

I hate Solar Panels, all they ever do is glare into my eyes while I'm walking up the fields with my Dog. I cannot even enjoy that any more because everyone has them on their houses.... either make them anti glare or get rid of them.

Nelson Mayingi
9 months ago

the battery is 500 W just like a Yukon or a radrover electric bike.What makes this go 60+ miles while the voltbike or radpower only goes up to 40 miles?Please,explain!

RainGhoulny
9 months ago

Fantastic video to enjoy, well done guys...

Ed Meyer
10 months ago

I have this bike. It rocks!
just installed the speed box 2 chip, its pushing a little over 30mph.

cresshead
10 months ago

Brilliant bike - great review and amazing drone footage which really does show off the elevation.

Tamas Varga
10 months ago

Great video I was waiting for more Yamaha reviews. I just don't get the 2x drivetrain I found it unnecessary just makes it more complicated for no valid reasons. Top speed is limited anyways (good luck pedaling faster when the assist cuts off) and with a 32/34T chainring you can climb walls especially in High mode. I just bought a Lapierre cross bike for my wife with Yamaha system and tested it yesterday on a 55km (40miles) loop with 620m (2000ft) elevation. 90% in Eco mode I tried Standard on couple of bigger climbs and once High but it's just too much for me. Arrived home with 38% battery left (400Wh) which is very decent range. Awesome system I just had to slow down my cadence it was the most efficient up to 70rpm - which will be perfect for my wife as she doesn't like to spin.