Add-E 250W Kit Review

Add E 250w Electric Bike Kit Review
Add E 250w Kit Installed
Add E 250w Kit Removable Bottle Battery 22 Volt 6 Amp
Add E 250w Kit Gearless Motor Unit
Add E 250w Kit Clean Handle Bars
Add E 250w Kit Belt Drive Compatible
Add E 250w Kit Kickstand Mount
Add E 250w Kit Grip Tape Friction Surface
Add E 250w Kit Side View
Add E 250w Kit Top Down View
Add E 250w Kit Width View
Add E 250w Kit Retail Box
Add E 250w Kit Unboxing
Add E 250w Electric Bike Kit Review
Add E 250w Kit Installed
Add E 250w Kit Removable Bottle Battery 22 Volt 6 Amp
Add E 250w Kit Gearless Motor Unit
Add E 250w Kit Clean Handle Bars
Add E 250w Kit Belt Drive Compatible
Add E 250w Kit Kickstand Mount
Add E 250w Kit Grip Tape Friction Surface
Add E 250w Kit Side View
Add E 250w Kit Top Down View
Add E 250w Kit Width View
Add E 250w Kit Retail Box
Add E 250w Kit Unboxing

Summary

  • Exceedingly compact, light weight and easy to remove (for temporary unpowered use) though it does produce more noise than most of the ebike kits I've tested
  • The bottle style battery pack is beautiful, the cap twists to add power at 50 watt increments up to 250 making it legal internationally, limited top speed of 15.5 mph
  • Lots of optional accessories including a twist or trigger throttle, the included five magnet pedelec disc isn't super responsive but works well and qualifies as Class 1
  • Compatible with a wide range of bicycle types but may require extra work to install (completely removing the bottom bracket), solid six month battery warranty

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Video Review

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Introduction

Make:

Add-E

Model:

250W

Price:

$1,012

Suggested Use:

Neighborhood, Urban

Electric Bike Class:

Pedal Assist (Class 1), Throttle on Demand (Class 2)
Learn more about Ebike classes

Warranty:

6 Month Battery, 2 Year Mechanical Parts

Availability:

United States, Worldwide

Model Year:

20152016

Bicycle Details

Battery Weight:

2.5 lbs (1.13 kg)

Motor Weight:

1.9 lbs (0.86 kg)

Geometry Measurements:

Motor Dimensions: 80 mm x 70 mm x 70 mm

Accessories:

EasyDo Bottle Cage for Battery, Additional Charger $80, Additional Battery $296, Universal Bottle Cage Mount $23, Crank Puller Tool $23, Brompton Specific Mounting Kit $182

Other:

Compact 2 Amp Charger, Removable Battery Pack

Electronic Details

Motor Type:

Mid-Mounted Gearless Motor
Learn more about Ebike motors

Motor Nominal Output:

250 watts

Battery Voltage:

22.2 volts

Battery Amp Hours:

6 ah

Battery Watt Hours:

133.2 wh

Charge Time:

2 hours

Estimated Min Range:

8 miles (13 km)

Estimated Max Range:

16 miles (26 km)

Drive Mode:

Cadence Sensing Pedal Assist, Twist Throttle, Trigger Throttle (5 Magnet Pedelec Disc)

Top Speed:

15.5 mph (25 kph)

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Written Review

The Add-E 250W is a perfect electric bike kit for someone like me because it’s light weight, minimal and supports more active ride styles. It’s also probably the only choice for a lot of people who live in Europe due to legal restrictions of 25 kilometers per hour (15.5 mph) and power rating of 250 watts or less. Top speed is definitely one of my complaints compared to other kits available in the US that can reach 20 or even 28 miles per hour but this is still a satisfying kit. It’s noisier than a lot of other ebikes because the motor in’t contained within a hub and is spinning at a relatively higher RPM. You’ll notice the high pitched electronic whir in the video review above. Still, it’s something I got used to with a bit of time and the other elements of the design (namely size) make it very stealthy, nearly hidden on the frame! Weighing in at ~5.5 lbs including the motor, battery and mounting hardware this kit is light… and it’s mostly removable. The battery bottle can be taken off (and replaced with a real water bottle if you’d like) and the motor slides forward and off with a quick bolt adjustment (using a hex wrench). All of the weight that is present is kept very low and centered on the frame for improved balance and if you plan on riding further and have space for a second battery bottle on the downtube (assuming you used the seat tube for the first one) that will cost you ~$300 extra. Batteries get a basic six month warranty but all hardware gets two years which is awesome!

To me the Add-E makes a lot of sense when used on city style bikes, and maybe road bikes as well, but it’s not idea for full suspension setups because it may not reach the rear wheel at all times. A hardtail trail bike could be a good fit but might produce even more noise due to the knobs and require more frequent adjustment as the tread wears down over time. I love that it’s a seemingly affordable kit but want to point out that you get ~30% of the battery I would consider “average” in the US and may experience much shorter rides as a result (especially if you opt for the twist or trigger throttles). If you do get a throttle, you’ll be transitioning the bike from Class 1 to Class 2 and it may not be allowed at all in some countries. Add-E makes a 600 watt kit that I’m excited to check out and it’s not that much more expensive. I think my favorite part about the way it’s designed is that the motor friction surface does not come into contact with the tire when coasting (if installed correctly). It just hangs out sort of bouncing up and down as you traverse cracks, curbs and other obstacles and this means coasting is not impacted. It’s a super-efficient design, it’s beautiful but it’s also a bit loud and the 250 watt version especially may be underpowered and limited on range for some riders.

Pros:

  • The bottle style battery is extremely convincing and I love the way it operates (twist the cap to the right for 50 volt increments of additional power from 0 to 50 to 100 up to 250 total)
  • It’s great that this kit can work as pedal assist only or you can opt for twist and trigger throttle options, basically going from Class 1 to Class 2 depending on your needs (throttle mode will likely drain the battery faster if you choose not to pedal as actively)
  • The kit is extremely light weight (~5.5 lbs for all pieces combined) and minimal in appearance, the basic pedal-assist only setup has only one wire and keeps the handlebar area of your bike clean, if you add a throttle you’ll have one wire going from the battery area to your bars
  • Once the mounting plate has been installed, it’s pretty easy to remove the Add-E motor by loosening one bolt and unplugging the power… then simply take the bottle battery off and you’re back to a normal bike
  • The bottle cage battery adapter can be used with traditional water bottles (if you take the battery and Add-E off) but it doesn’t sit perfectly flat at the bottom due to the plug interface
  • You can get additional batteries for ~$300 to increase range and since they fit into normal bottle cages you could potentially have two mounted to the bike if you have bosses on the downtube and seat tube, each pack only weighs ~2.5 pounds which is nice
  • Because the motor and battery are mounted at the middle of the frame you get excellent balance and reduce unsprung weight compared with a hub motor… that said, I don’t think it would work well with a full suspension bike due to wheel movement and limited travel of the Add-E

Cons:

  • There are no display readouts so you can’t tell how full the battery pack is, how fast you’re going, how far you’ve traveled or anything else… you have to estimate or get a separate cycle computer but that still won’t display your battery
  • The battery capacity offered by this kit is extremely small compared to most kits and bikes I review (about 30% of average) so the range is lower, but it’s also much lighter than traditional offerings
  • You absolutely need space to mount the bottle cage but Add-E does sell an adapter kit for those without threaded bosses on their seat tube or downtube
  • Limited power and top speed on the 250 watt kit, it’s setup for European standards so you get ~15.5 mph top speed vs. 20 mph which is more common in the US, their 600 watt kit can top 20 mph and doesn’t cost much more
  • Depending on the frame design of your bicycle this kit may be easy to install (using a kickstand plate just behind the bottom bracket) or difficult (mounting Carbon fiber plates directly to the bottom bracket)
  • The five magnet pedelec disc isn’t as responsive as a 12 magnet disc and you don’t get brake levers with integrated motor inhibitors so there are moments where you may be braking against the motor
  • If you mount this kit using the kickstand plate you may no longer be able to use the actual kickstand and your bike may tip… consider an aftermarket chain-stay mounting kickstand
  • This kit is actually kind of expensive in my opinion given the very small capacity of the battery pack (about 30% as large as a “normal” sized battery of ~350 watt hours) if you bought two additional batteries you’d be priced at kits with 350+ watts of power vs. 250 but still much lighter weight

Resources:

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More Add-E Reviews

Add-E 600W Kit Review

  • MSRP: $1,251
  • MODEL YEAR: 2015, 2016

Exceedingly compact, light weight and easy to remove (for temporary unpowered use) though it does produce more noise than most of the ebike kits I've tested. The bottle style battery pack is beautiful, the cap twists to add power at 50…...

Nirmala
1 year ago

I’m curious about the surface material of the friction drive. Is it replaceable? Do you think it might cause a lot of extra tire wear?

Court Rye
1 year ago

I’m wondering the same things Nirmala… but even without the grippy surface metal on rubber would still work alright (maybe unless it’s wet out?) difficult to say on the tire wear… I’d imagine that YES it would wear your tread down more quickly than a hub motor. It might depend on your tread pattern like knobby off-road vs. slick or hybrid tires. The system might also become louder on a knobby tire vs. the smoother ones used in this review :/

NerdBrick
9 months ago

I was one of the original funders of the Add-e campaign, and I have over 600 miles with my commuting on partial paved road and some hard packed gravel. It hasn’t really worn my tire any faster, but I should point out that I’m running a tire that is labeled “E-Bike” it has has a tread that good for my ridding conditions. The friction material on the motor is still holding up. I was worried it would be rubbed off sooner than the tire would wear. So far so good with both.

Greg Ritter
1 year ago

Thanks for the well done review. Was waiting for this review as I’ve been watching the news of the bike motor since its launch and like the look and idea behind the motor. But with what I’ve been learning about e bikes from reviews and info from this site, maybe this isn’t the way to go for an affordable, almost hidden ebike kit. I was looking for something with a little more power and some controls to adjust speed and keep track of battery life and distance. Plus the price is higher than I was thinking for what you get. Will continue to watch this site for further reviews, perhaps the go-e bike kit, with 800 W capacity and lower price point will have more success and be more of what I’m looking for. Will patiently stay tuned to electric bike review to keep informed.

Court Rye
1 year ago

Hi Greg! Yeah, I love the direction that the Add-E is exploring but it has limits with this iteration. I’ve been in touch with Go-E and hope to review their product at some point soon so keep an eye out and I’ll continue charging forward :D

Nirmala
1 year ago

A lot of the concerns raised in the review seem to be better addressed by the ShareRoller, another add-on friction drive. It is not as stealth as the Go-E, but it does have much more sophistication and features, and also three sizes of battery to accommodate different needs. You can learn more here: http://igg.me/at/shareroller/x/12713097

Court also did a review of an earlier version here: https://electricbikereview.com/shareroller/version-1/ (Note that the latest version includes a lot of improvements.)

David Barroso
1 year ago

I have the 600W (sport) version and it is great to take me to work and back. I do 15km (9.3mi) every day with some climbing (200m accumulated climb) with the power output set to maximum. The add-e takes me up to around 40km/h (24.8mph) with little effort. I do the same time by car, some times more, depending on traffic. I have a hardtail scott aspect with schwalbe big ben tyres.

Court Rye
1 year ago

Wow, that sounds awesome David! Pretty stellar performance for such a small battery pack. I’m assuming you use pedal assist only vs. throttle? Any other tips about getting the most out of the Add-E, noticed you’re using smooth tires vs. knobby.

David Barroso
1 year ago

Only pedal assist. I have another set of wheels with schwalbe thunder burt (knobby tyres) for off-road use. Tyres with smooth surface work better with the add-e. They have a bigger and better surface and therefore better grip between the metal surface of the motor and the tyre. And also less noise. The add-e when working sounds like an RC toy car :)

Court Rye
1 year ago

Cool, thanks David… I reached out to the company and was told that these Schwalbe Hurricane tires work well for off-road because the center is smooth but they are still wider and have some knobs on the edges for traction.

Michael Craigie
11 months ago

David, I installed the 600w set on my bike yesterday and went for a 15km ride on Map 1. Fairly flat ride with only one 2 short but steep hills. In the course of the ride it wore my brand new Continental Gatorskin tyre right down till the threads are exposed at one point. Do you have any tyre wear issues? Have I perhaps installed it incorrectly do you think?

Court Rye
11 months ago

Wow! That’s intense Michael… I didn’t ride very far during my demos for this review + video but the tires held up alright and they were just basic. Continental makes good stuff so I’m really surprised you’ve had such deep wear. I want to provide some sort of feedback like maybe the motor is too close to the tire but honestly, the design is built to “dig in” to get traction so even if it’s further vs. close you should still have similar force going from the motor to the tire… I really don’t know but am hoping David can chime in and help.

Geir
1 year ago

Love your reviews Court. I have the 600W one too, but its way to noisy so im not going to use it. If you drop your address I’ll be happy to donate it to you so you can do a review (I guess you already have a battery and the stand installed?)

Court Rye
1 year ago

That’s an awesome offer Geir! I’ll reach out :D

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Douglas Ruby
4 hours ago

Part of the speed potential of the Vado 5.0 vs. 3.0 is based on the power of the motor (350W vs. 250W), part is the electronic governing speed sensor attached to the rear disc rotor (see the manual), and part is based on gearing (48T vs. 40T chainring). Note that the Vado 4.0 (same brakes/mech/features as 5.0), but 250W motor and 40T chainring, has the same 20 mph speed as the 3.0.

Having said all of this, if you don't particularly want a 28 mph assist speed, but want more power and range, then you can always purchase the Vado 5.0 and then swap front chain rings to a smaller size. With the 48x11 top gear, you get about 33 mph at a cadence of 90 rpm. You can cruise at 28mph in the 48x13 next to top gear at the same cadence. With a 40T chainring and 40x11 top gear, you can still get to 28 mph, but have to hit a cadence of 95 rpm in the top gear. OTOH, a nice 80 rpm cadence in the 40x13 next to top gear (9 or 10 depending on mech) would be 20.5 mph.

So my recommendation would be Vado 5.0 for its battery and power (for climbing), then potentially swap front chain ring to lower cruise speed (improving range), give you more gear options, and better climbing ratios. Also, running at the 50% assist with the stock 600Wh battery at around 20 mph should give you lots of range. You can always go to 100% when attacking hills.

Doug

(P.S. The Vado 3.0 is speed limited not only by power and gearing, but the speed sensor on the back wheel will cut motor power at 20 mph instead of the 5.0's 28 mph).

Larry Ganz
15 hours ago

I would expect that for a fairly heavy person that a more powerful motor with a lot of torque is more important than it's speed rating.

For example, if you were considering something from Trek (which I researched a lot before buying), I would have recommended the 20mph 75NM Powerfly over the 28mph 63NM XM700+ speed pedelec, because the slower bike has more torque to get a heavier person moving, especially on hills. At 215 lbs I didn't have any trouble climbing with a 50NM Dual Sport+ at 200%, but the 75NM Powerfly makes steep hills almost effortless at 300% assist.

The Vado 5.0 seems to give you both high speed and 90NM torque, with a larger battery to support the extra power you might draw (350W vs 250W of the 3.0). Regardless, with the mid-drive taking advantage of the gearing I'd expect most of these bikes with over 50NM to work up to 250lbs (max rating for Trek), depending on the number of hills you have to pull.

With both offering 90NM torque, maybe your choice could be based on (1) big price difference and (2) whether you will be riding in places that only allow a class 1 eBike (eliminating the 5.0).

However, Court has the Vado 3.0 and 5.0 both listed as providing lower % levels of assist than Trek, at 20% ECO, 50% Sport, and 100% Turbo. I don't know if that is a typo, but I fear that you'd have to own extremely powerful legs to get the full 90NM out of the motor at only 100% assist. I've run into some hills that have required the 200% support level that the Trek eBikes offer, and some where I was stuck at 5-7 mph uphill if I chose to stick with only 100% support, but I am disabled with only one working lung and fibromyalgia.

I've tried the same steep hill with a 50NM Dual Sport+ and 75NM Powefly 7, and 100% was almost not enough in some parts of my climb, although it was doable at slower speeds. But the 120% assist of the Powerfly in Tour mode was a noticeable bump over the 100% of the Dual Sport+ in NORM mode - and that same hill with 200% pedal assist doesn't make me stop to rest and sees 10+ mph speeds (while my 300% feels like cheating).

I'll have to go watch Court's video reviews now.

EDIT - I mention the hills, even though your ride is flat, because hills make the bike perform as if I'm heavier than I am, which could replicate your experience with an extra 30 lbs to push.

ronin2000
2 days ago

Today I followed up my phone conversation with a formal email to the Turbo Product Manager. Key things I asked for were 5 year availability for out-of-warranty spares through the dealers and/or accessory catalog for:

Battery - At least the option to purchase a 691 Wh battery which can be used to replace any earlier Turbo battery. Or an approved battery refurb program where one gets a new battery and returns a core.
Handlebar Controllers - Spares availability for both the Shimano brake version (new Turbo X/S) and the older Formula Version (base Turbo, older Turbo X, Turbo S). Due to frequency of backlight failures and joystick failures.
Motors - At least the 250W motor for all base Turbo and older Turbo S/X. 500W version for new Turbo S. They can end-of-life the 200W, since the 250W could be a direct replacement.

I also suggested very strongly that Specialized read through this entire thread. I doubt they have ever end-of-life'd a bike before that has this much proprietary content and high average sales price. The issue is not just warranty support, but customer loyalty as they transition to the new model.

Doug

P.S. Go on line and read the Vado user manual. The feature set is really pretty good.

I read the Specs on the VADO, they seem quite nice and at a lower entry price to boot. Id just be less inclined to buy one if Specialized doesn’t support previous Turbo purchases and snubbed the current 1st get buyers. The specs seem more than adequate, however I’m still not sold on the aesthetics of the bike itself, perhaps seeing it in person would change my opinion.

Douglas Ruby
2 days ago

Today I followed up my phone conversation with a formal email to the Turbo Product Manager. Key things I asked for were 5 year availability for out-of-warranty spares through the dealers and/or accessory catalog for:

Battery - At least the option to purchase a 691 Wh battery which can be used to replace any earlier Turbo battery. Or an approved battery refurb program where one gets a new battery and returns a core.
Handlebar Controllers - Spares availability for both the Shimano brake version (new Turbo X/S) and the older Formula Version (base Turbo, older Turbo X, Turbo S). Due to frequency of backlight failures and joystick failures.
Motors - At least the 250W motor for all base Turbo and older Turbo S/X. 500W version for new Turbo S. They can end-of-life the 200W, since the 250W could be a direct replacement.

I also suggested very strongly that Specialized read through this entire thread. I doubt they have ever end-of-life'd a bike before that has this much proprietary content and high average sales price. The issue is not just warranty support, but customer loyalty as they transition to the new model.

Doug

P.S. Go on line and read the Vado user manual. The feature set is really pretty good.

harryS
4 days ago

Luigi, it's the motor controller that you have to worry about. If it can handle 48V, then a battery swap is possible. Contact Voltbike and ask them if the controller is compatible.

As for reliability, people kill bikes like yours w/o any changes because they beat them on hills. If you do the same, you will kill it on 48V too, but if you treat it nice, it could hold up. It it gets very hot, you're killing it.

For that bike, it would cost you around $250-300 for a 350W geared front hub motor plus a 26" wheel shipped from China. There's no guarantee, but every motor I've seen that uses that quick disconnect connector has the same pin-out, making it plug compatible. Again, ask Voltbike tech support. Bigger motor, and you get a little more acceleration and torque, but speed will be about the same.

For more speed, you also need the 48V battery.

A couple of my bikes have little 250W motors, but they have wide range controllers, I've run 52 volts into them. I like it. We'll see if they get hot. Riding season here hasn't really started, so my rides have been short,

Thomas Jaszewski
4 days ago

I'm finding the 250w power of my Voltbike Elegant motor not enough power for my commuting. I'm exploring ways I can power up the motor without much service. I thought maybe I could replace the 36volt battery with a 48volt battery. Is that compatible with the 250w motor and will it result in any significant power increase? Thank you, I appreciate any thoughts you all may have
Maybe but you'd probably need a new controller. Best to ask the maker. Some controller used can run multiple voltages and that Bafang motor MAY take the additional power. Cal the maker and google around o see if anyone else has.

Luigi
4 days ago

I'm finding the 250w power of my Voltbike Elegant motor not enough power for my commuting. I'm exploring ways I can power up the motor without much service. I thought maybe I could replace the 36volt battery with a 48volt battery. Is that compatible with the 250w motor and will it result in any significant power increase? Thank you, I appreciate any thoughts you all may have

Luigi
5 days ago

I'm finding the 250w power of my Voltbike Elegant motor not enough power for my commuting. I'm exploring ways I can power up the motor without much service. I thought maybe I could replace the 36volt battery with a 48volt battery. Is that compatible with the 250w motor and will it result in any significant power increase? Thank you, I appreciate any thoughts you all may have

Douglas Ruby
5 days ago

Vado 3.0 = 250W motor, 460 Wh battery, $3,000, 40T chain ring, 11-40T 10-sp cassette, suspension fork
Vado 5.0 = 350W Motor, 604 Wh battery, $5,000, 48T chain ring, 11-42T 11-sp cassette, solid fork
Turbo S = 500W Motor, 691 Wh battery, $7,000, 48T chain ring, 11-42T 11-sp cassette, solid fork

Notice the difference in gearing. Based on this, I would guess that the Vado 3.0 is realistically a 20 mph e-bike while the Vado 5.0 is definitely a speed pedelec. The gearing on the Vado 5.0 is the same as the Turbo S. Tires are 700x47 on the 3.0 and 700x51 on the 5.0 which enhances the gearing difference. Both come with fenders and Racktime rack with embedded taillight. The headlight is 300 lumens on the Vado 3.0 and 600 lumens on the Vado 5.0.

Bicyclista
1 week ago

I use a Burley Travoy trailer with my Haibike full-suspension mountain bike. I had to improvise an extension for the trailer hitch to clear my big wheels (27.5-inch wheels with 3-inch tires). I use it to carry my photography gear, which is only 11 lbs. My Haibike's Yamaha motor is rated at 250W, so it's small compared to motors on Juiced bikes, but it puts out 80 Newton-meters of torque, which is more than most bikes. Nevertheless, it doesn't feel like I'm pulling anything, there is no drag. Nor does it seem to have decreased my range. The only issue is that my bike did not come with a kickstand. I am waiting for Amazon to deliver the one I bought. I hope it fits, it works, and that I won't have to find a post or a tree to lean my bike against when I'm using the Travoy trailer.

Tora Harris
1 week ago

Not a great deal if the charger has a problem. ALWAYS look at warrantees. I have two $80 chargers that died a month out of their 90 day warranties, now what? Start by doing he numbers. Someone in this thread also mentioned the Satiator. A charger with a very good warrantee and one that can grow with your hobby. Peer reviewed research has sown that charging to 80% can more than double the battery life. So it I take my $500 battery and double the life, essentially I have $1000 in value. That $300 charger has me ahead on one battery by $200. 200 in my pocket. Next battery or backup battery or different voltage battery and I can use the same charger. I just saved myself another $50 to $100 bucks. Maybe it's the mindset that everything should be low end and value priced to be worth buying, frankly that confuses me. Batteries are the most expensive drain on the eBikers wallet. Anything I can find to extend life leaves dollars in my pocket. No brainer for me. It IS hard to swallow. I mean on face $300 is steep. But being able to charge ALL my batteries from 12-60V. Change at a full range of rates, fast if a need hit, slow for best pack health. Charge at user determined percentage. 50% for storage 80% for longevity. 100% for a longer ride. A history of the battery charge cycles, and more. I used o have 4 chargers. Even if they were ;ow end I'd still have near $175 in and no warranty over a couple of months. I sold them and the same guys selling the $80 chargers sold hundreds of Satiators. But the margin on Satiators is nowhere near that of the China chargers and the warrantees, are, well, abysmal.

OK off the soapbox. Can someone show me the data proving that a torque sensor saves on battery power? I do get the difference, and it is nice for the bicycle purist, but does the torque sensor have a payback as short and obvious as a programable charger? Please educate me. As I understand the physics, the power has to come from somewhere. If you increase range with the TS, it's because you provided additional power. Important for a EU 250W limit with no throttle, but you'll save more with a $300 charger than a $200-$300 torque sensor. Promise.

The Cycle Satiator is the best charger for e-bikes period. It basically does everything and built to be nearly indestructible. It can charge very fast, very slow, any battery and charge to any charge level. If you can afford it, just get it. It's worth it.

Torque Sensor can save battery energy if set up correctly.
It is easy to understand why by thinking about it like this: A car's gas pedal is not a on/off switch. It has many levels of actuation so you can modulate your power in the starts and coasting etc.

The cadence sensor-only type bikes are like on/off switches. It flicks the motor on when you start pedaling and turns it off when you stop pedaling. If you ever use them you will realize that it very often turns the motor on at times when you don't really want or need the boost. That is what is wasting energy. If the boost is set too low and you pedal harder to accelerate, it will feel like the motor is inhibiting you. In those moments you are wasting energy. Those little inefficient moments add up and overall you can have less range.

The torque sensor measures the pressure you put on the pedals and also can measure how fast you are turning the pedals. With those 2 bits of information it can work out your intensions quite precisely (if programmed right). The controller can apply power to the motor to exactly match those intentions. So when you want to speed up, pedal harder and the bikes speeds up. If you want to go slower, pedal softer and the bike will slow down. Your intensions and the motor's power are in harmony. This is more efficient.

On less powerful bikes with around 250W, you may not feel the difference as the motor just does not have the power or torque to really accelerate forward when you push down harder.

On the HyperFat which can peak at 1,500 Watts, the feeling is very impressive. The bike can react to your every move and amplifies your effort by around 5x. The bike feels totally weightless. However, even in the highest boost setting, you can ride the bike very slowly, controlling the bike's speed with just the pressure you put on the pedals.

Thomas Jaszewski
1 week ago

is that $99 a good deal? I don't know pricing ranges here.

and darn it you still got me thinking about that torque sensor. I was convinced I really didn't need it but I've never ridden a bike with one and after a few reviews...im not sure.
Not a great deal if the charger has a problem. ALWAYS look at warrantees. I have two $80 chargers that died a month out of their 90 day warranties, now what? Start by doing he numbers. Someone in this thread also mentioned the Satiator. A charger with a very good warrantee and one that can grow with your hobby. Peer reviewed research has sown that charging to 80% can more than double the battery life. So it I take my $500 battery and double the life, essentially I have $1000 in value. That $300 charger has me ahead on one battery by $200. 200 in my pocket. Next battery or backup battery or different voltage battery and I can use the same charger. I just saved myself another $50 to $100 bucks. Maybe it's the mindset that everything should be low end and value priced to be worth buying, frankly that confuses me. Batteries are the most expensive drain on the eBikers wallet. Anything I can find to extend life leaves dollars in my pocket. No brainer for me. It IS hard to swallow. I mean on face $300 is steep. But being able to charge ALL my batteries from 12-60V. Change at a full range of rates, fast if a need hit, slow for best pack health. Charge at user determined percentage. 50% for storage 80% for longevity. 100% for a longer ride. A history of the battery charge cycles, and more. I used o have 4 chargers. Even if they were ;ow end I'd still have near $175 in and no warranty over a couple of months. I sold them and the same guys selling the $80 chargers sold hundreds of Satiators. But the margin on Satiators is nowhere near that of the China chargers and the warrantees, are, well, abysmal.

OK off the soapbox. Can someone show me the data proving that a torque sensor saves on battery power? I do get the difference, and it is nice for the bicycle purist, but does the torque sensor have a payback as short and obvious as a programable charger? Please educate me. As I understand the physics, the power has to come from somewhere. If you increase range with the TS, it's because you provided additional power. Important for a EU 250W limit with no throttle, but you'll save more with a $300 charger than a $200-$300 torque sensor. Promise.

bob armani
2 weeks ago

I saw the Interbike coverage and I think the Raleigh Redux IE is the bike for me. I have done some research on the Brose motor and I love the torque and the range. 35 - 80 miles on a 250w motor is amazing. I just wish it had front suspension. I was interested in the IZip Protour but the motor and range are not as impressive and the Redux IE.

Wow this is a very cool looking bike, with a Brose' motor, how could you not love this bike! Raleigh has finally hit it with a more stealthy looking bike. I wish some of the other mfgs would get on board with this look in an ebike like Haibike and Izip etc. Looks like this is going to hit some home runs at this price point.:p

Dual Rider
2 weeks ago

Thank you both for your time and comments; I really appreciate it! To answer some of pxpaulx's questions: As silly as it may sound given both bikes are fully suspended mountain bikes, I will probably use the bike to commute to work and ride on bike paths (some paved and some gravel or hard pack) more than anything else, which is why I liked the idea of the faster one. If I was going to primarily use it for real mountain bike terrain on actual mountain bike trails, the slower one would be fine. With that said, I do like the idea of having the ability to take it off road as well and perhaps even taking it bikepacking. I currently ride a dual sport and adventure motorcycle as well that I love to take off road as much as possible trying to minimize any pavement or "slab" time. I love camping off of it in the middle of nowhere, so the idea of combining some of that with the bike has a certain appeal to me. I hadn't considered not being able to fit the tires in bike racks, so thank you for that thought. The bike rack at my office wouldn't be a problem though as it has very large spaces, plus no one else seems to ride... Do I truly need 28mph? Of course I don't "need" it, but 20 seems just a bit too slow on the road... I actually wish I could just compromise and have a class 1 that cut off at 25mph as that seems about right, but no such luck unless I mess with the engine or the sensors, etc., which I'm not sure I want to do due to potential warranty and legal issues... I like the idea of the bigger tires for both traction and ride, but again, I don't "need" them...

With respect to some of heliswiss's comments. I will admit that the primary thing keeping me from pulling the trigger on the 45 is the fear of dropping this much money on something that could in the future (i.e. writing on the wall...) be determined not to be a bicycle in the state of Oregon. It's actually already fuzzy here as all of the information from official sources seems to indicate that anything over 20mph is not a bicycle... When I talk to dealers, however, they keep telling me that as long as there is no throttle pushing you over 20mph you are OK with a 28 mph or class 3 bike here. Multiple dealers are selling these types of bikes in Portland, and the chances of anyone ever stopping me on the 45 are probably pretty darn slim, but these things still don't mean it is technically legal, which really bugs me as I just don't want any hassles with the police or legal system in any way... With respect to the German Bulls website saying the Evo 45 is a 250W motor, I saw that too, but my guess was that was because all bikes are limited to 250W or less in Europe...???

Just to muddy the waters a bit, I literally just got off the phone with a dealer in my area that said they can still get the 2016 non plus version of the FS3 and it is $600 less than the plus and $600 - $1,000 less than the 45 depending on which dealer I buy from... I'm guessing this is probably the bike pxpaulx has and from what I can tell, I don't think there were any updates or differences between 2016 and 2017 other than the tire size and colors...??? Is this correct? I'm not sure bigger tires are worth $600... It may be worth more to me to go faster though, but not sure it is $1,000 worth it! I don't think I've ever had a harder time making my mind up and making a decision on something ever in my life! I've bought trucks, motorcycles, and even houses quicker than this with less research time! The money conscious side of me says, this is a gift and it is the answer, buy the cheaper version and be happy! Unfortunately, the other side of me says if I'm spending this much money to begin with, get whichever one I want the most and don't compromise, which again brings me back to the 45, I think, but with some reservations still...

Again thank you both for your comments and I welcome any additional thoughts or comments from you or others!!!

heliswiss
2 weeks ago

I just went through the same dilemma, myself.

I opted for the FS3 Plus which should arrive this week. Already owning a Stromer ST2 and being very happy with it I felt like I didn't want to miss the speed. But ultimately it came down to wanting a mountain-bike first and foremost. Chances of bombing around the woods with motor assist at 28Mph are slim to none, where I ride. Also, it is a Class 1 Pedelec, which legally should give more trail-access than a Class 3 Speed Pedelec. May not be a huge issue where I live now, but I can see the writing on the wall.

So I guess you need to ask yourself what the primary purpose of the bike will be. If it is a bike mainly t be used on the road, gravel or whatever surface the Eve 45 may be the ticket. If you are looking for an MTB to access the off the beaten path stuff, then the FS3 may be a better choice. Motor-wise I am not so sure how the 350W vs 250W rating is established and if it translates into a real-world difference for instance while climbing, other than obviously the higher speed. Also, I am not sure where the discrepancy lies, but on the German Bulls website the Evo 45 is also listed with a 250W motor...

harryS
2 weeks ago

I wouldn't count on an ebike purchased today being very desireable in year 2020. Technology will change. I'm 67, retired with several hub motor equipped bikes with 250-500W motors, 36-48V batteries, and a mid drive conversion. No hills where I live.

A 250W hub motor with 36V battery is not good for big hills. It's good for pedal assisted 14-16 mph on flat land. A 500W geared hub motor with 48V plus gearing down with a good dose of sweat should climb your hill. Well, both would work, if you work hard.

Change to a mid drive motor, which powers thru the derailleur, and a 250W motor on 36V still needs you to gear down and add your 80-100 watts of leg power. If you can barely make it up the road where you live now, I think you could do it. However, you don't get mid drives in your budget range.

If you have some mechanical ability and own a bike that fits, have you considered a mid drive conversion kit. About $1000 for my 750W Bafang BBS02 with battery/charger. Ride it in pedal assist and under 16 mph. Motor and battery will add 14-16 pounds to your bike.

Tradeoff is while it's lower cost, it's only as good as your current bike's brakes, shifters, and gears. If they suck, so will the conversion. A commercial mid drive will give you more features like torque sensor, thermal overload protection in motor, and less unknowns as far as battery reliability.

bazzapage
3 weeks ago

Newbie here ... Great thread. I joined the world of electric bikes with a closeout 2015 Turbo X. I have commuted to work a few times already and fixed some minor issues myself such as a squeaky rear brake. I had a quick question for anyone with this same bike. On open paths, I can reach 20-22 mph with relative ease but it seems to be a struggle to reach and maintain speeds closer to 26 mph. i'm about 5'8" and 175lbs. Do I need to get this checked out or does this seem about normal?
Assuming yours is the 200W version (SBC-M02) it cuts out at 26. With the slightly nobblier tyres on the X and higher front-end you can expect to be a bit slower than the base Turbo. I imagine that is why the 2016 version went with the 250W motor which is about 20% more powerful in reality. (sounds obvious given their ratings but often you can't trust motor power ratings).

Bill R
3 weeks ago

I saw the Interbike coverage and I think the Raleigh Redux IE is the bike for me. I have done some research on the Brose motor and I love the torque and the range. 35 - 80 miles on a 250w motor is amazing. I just wish it had front suspension. I was interested in the IZip Protour but the motor and range are not as impressive and the Redux IE.

Yes, Raleigh Redux IE looks very interesting can't wait to see a review

Ebike Crazy
3 weeks ago

@Ann M. would like to hear about Raleigh 2017 Redux IE, I think it may have a Brose motor also like to hear about IZIP 2017 Protour with COBI built in
I saw the Interbike coverage and I think the Raleigh Redux IE is the bike for me. I have done some research on the Brose motor and I love the torque and the range. 35 - 80 miles on a 250w motor is amazing. I just wish it had front suspension. I was interested in the IZip Protour but the motor and range are not as impressive and the Redux IE.

hemant
3 weeks ago

Thank you all for reply
Sure this community is awesome.:):)
@Joll thanks for the link it's an awesome site, will contact him soon.
@Harry thanks for the reply I would most probably go for mid drive and will check on Aliexpress too.
@harryS it's the Binox 250w model that is available in India.
@Ann M. I will sure make sure to use that torque arms when I do rear hub Installation.

Can I use a gear sensor with Bafang mid drive bbs02?
I will contact the local vendors about these kits and will update you all soon.
Thanks

SuperGoop
4 weeks ago

Thanks @Rakxe I just re-read my post and my last sentence should read "I hope it is NOT a rear-rack battery". Sorry about that.

So, are you saying that the battery is hidden inside the tube? That would be great!

Here is a picture of your ebike with a 250W motor. Where is the battery?

cdp
1 week ago

my bike is a little too large for me and i want to sell to buy a different bike. Used 5 times ( maybe 5 miles). Kept indoors and fully charged .

https://post.craigslist.org/manage/6084078213/t26z9

The Electrified S aims to look just like a bike - not a bike with electric drive added as an afterthought, or as an external component - and has its battery, electronics, display, and LED lights built right into the frame, along with a keyless lock, giving the bike a very simple outward appearance which belies the technology built into it.

The bike's electric assist is delivered by a 250W (350W peak) front wheel hub motor, which is powered by an LG lithium-ion battery (418Wh 36V 11,6A) integrated into the bike's down tube.

Along with its normal cycling functions, including electric pedal assist and 'power boost', the Electrified S also features a touchpad display built into the top tube, which shows the speed, , power level, and battery life. Front and rear LED lighting offer visibility while on the road, and the bikes come with steel fenders, with all other major parts secured with anti-theft hardware. The bike's manual drivetrain is through the rear SRAM two-speed internal gear hub.

The bike comes with an app which allows riders to use the Bluetooth connection to remotely unlock or lock the bike, to track it via a worldwide GSM system if it ever gets stolen, or to change the bike's power settings.

Also included are the waitress set front basket and the upgraded chain.-

replacement value $3,000 ( but white is no longer offered)

I have ridden it 5 times, and have kept it indoors and charged
I am using a stock photo- but is as pictured.

Devon
4 weeks ago

I also really like the quick adjust on the seat height on the Levo, but that alone isn't enough to make me buy it.

Levo
Pros

Sold locally (shop on the trail)
Nice mobile app with GPS, stats, and configurable presets
Bottle cage
About $600 cheaper

Cons

20mph top speed
Smaller battery/range
250w motor (may improve batt range)
Fat tires (not bad but not preferred)

Evo
Pros

Larger battery
350w motor (may use battery faster)
28mph top speed
Mounted controller/display
Built in headlight/taillight

Cons

About $600 more
Not available locally (1hr away)
No mobile app
No quick adjust on the seat
No stock bottle cage

Am I missing anything?

Devon
4 weeks ago

I'm about 5'2" and 95lbs, skinny and in fair shape, but by no means am I athletic. Furthermore, I have about a 60 deg scoliosis in my lower back (hence the desire for a full suspension), a restricted airway that severely limits my breathing abilities, and live in a city with a lot of hills (reason for wanting an ebike).

That said, riding a normal bike around here is literally impossible as I'd be out of breath long before getting up a single hill - and without going into detail, just know that my breathing isn't something that will improve over time. So, given the option of a Specialized Turbo Levo FSR 6Fattie or BULLS E-STREAM EVO 45 FS, any suggestions as to which I should go with?

The Specialized bike has a nice mobile app and IS available locally from a bike shop, but is only 20mph top speed with a 250w custom motor.

Whereas the BULLS bike DOES NOT have a mobile app (has a small screen/controller) and IS NOT available locally (so servicing it would cost extra) but has a 350W Brose motor with 90Nm of torque and assists up to 28mph.

Which would you choose if in my position and why? Which would be better at climbing a hill (mainly concerned about paved roads, not planning to off-road)?

Peter Kenyon
3 months ago

Because it spins in contact with the tyre, how much wear is there on the tyre? I remember similar products twenty plus years ago and the rate it wore the tyre was incredible. Wasn't worth the expense.

Don
3 months ago

+Peter Kenyon . You are absolutely right. Regarding this particular product, our experience shows need of one road Tyre (Michelin 700x28) every 51 km, meaning 0.46 € per Km. If the motor follows... Because it is terribly fragile.

james hester
4 months ago

Anyone know of the most inexpensive solution for a e bike add on? Don't care about looks or weight just need power and range.

mike x
4 months ago

250volts may work well for 250w-500w motors so you could use 1amps continuous discharge current on low 2.5 or 5ah capacity battery packs which would keep discharge current on cells low

Rick Kern
5 months ago

This could be excellent as just booster power for getting up hills. Most people cruise just fine.

Don
3 months ago

+Rick Kern . Come on Rick, as an add-e's pawn, you perfectly know that it can't climb a hill. It heats up and gets damaged. It's even written in page 30 of it's manual § 8. So on the way up the hill one should stop and check the temperature of the motor by hand... Stop fooling people you guys, there is an end to every deception.

Eric Piepers
6 months ago

Your hand reminds me of Spiderman.., but nothing comes out of yours.. :-D

Jimmy Walker
6 months ago

What is it like on wet roads

Bharath Naik L
7 months ago

Hi, What is the speed that I get if I add 250w motor to my fat tyre cycle ? Which one is good for fatbike ? 250w or 500w or 1000w ?

subhash nayak
7 months ago

can i use it in my Hercules A500

SilverPower
7 months ago

trop de bruit

Adventures with Jerry
7 months ago

what about weather resistance. i live in Michigan we get lots of rain and snow how is this going to hold up to that.

cold productions
8 months ago

Can I use it on a beach cruiser ?

Rocky
9 months ago

+Pavle Pavlovic Well observed. I 100% agree with your coherent comment. It is true that this product is a real CRAP in every aspect. Considering changing the tier every 30-35 miles, and the battery (300 $) every 6 month and what you have to pay meanwhile to the vendor for repairing because it is a poor quality material and not secured, makes that buying a real and serious electric bike will certainly save you a lot in wallet, nerves and Asprin expenses.
PD: Probably Add-e will soon report your comment as spam, like other similar ones we don't see anymore. :-)

Don
10 months ago

Is there anyone who knows where to find an official technical specification sheet for this thing, like in every toy, drill, fan box or whatever electrical?
A copy of certification, registration (company and product), governmental security approval, declaration of conformity?
Because when I ask Add-e on their channels, they don't reply and delete my requests!
Thanks

Don
10 months ago

+ElectricBikeReview.com
Thank you very much, I'll indeed ask ELV Motors.
PS: It is uncomfortable not to find any trace of this product in European registration institutions, when they pretend it's made in Austria.

ElectricBikeReview.com
10 months ago

Hmm... I don't know? You could reach out to ELV Motors in Santa Clara California. They carry the Add-E and might be able to provide the details you're looking for :)

Marco Antonio
12 months ago

as I can get it in Chile????

Its All Too Beautiful
12 months ago

Cost?

20082002 00
12 months ago

What if you hit a shit with the wheel

Don
11 months ago

You hit it by buying one of those, anyway ....

Tails Furse
12 months ago

That sounds wicked loud. Does your microphone have a compressor on it that makes it sound louder?

Don
8 months ago

+AK Stills
AK - Yes this is correct. You can check the real sound here https://www.dropbox.com/s/kj2ioe8s5h50f7i/AddeNoise.mp3?dl=0
Tire waste is 30-35 miles = +/- 0.50 € per mile (for a tire costing15 €) This fact is also mentioned in other comments. + New discovery: This product is not waterproof.
Take your time and think it twice before investing your money in this product.

Ak Stills
8 months ago

Don - sounds like you've owned this? did you have this experience as mentioned above?

Tails Furse
11 months ago

35? I ride that in two days! Haha, jeez oh man!

Don
11 months ago

It really is loud. But that's not all, it also destroys the tyre very fast, in my case this was 35 miles per tyre.

Suden Gurung
1 year ago

hi .where didi u buy this add e kit. Does add e kit is in amazon.

Anthony Steele
1 year ago

im amazed this works

Rocky
10 months ago

You are 50% right: It works very little, like it's size.

Cutler Cycles
1 year ago

Cool review Court. Neat little thing

Rocky
10 months ago

but inefficient