Haibike XDURO RX 29" Review

Haibike Xduro Rx 29 Electric Bike Review 1
Haibike Xduro Rx 29
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 350w Bosch Center Drive
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 400w Pack
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 Cockpit Display
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 10 Cassette
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 Hydraulic Disc
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 Removable Lithium Battery
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 Rockshox Fork
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 Electric Bike Review 1
Haibike Xduro Rx 29
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 350w Bosch Center Drive
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 400w Pack
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 Cockpit Display
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 10 Cassette
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 Hydraulic Disc
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 Removable Lithium Battery
Haibike Xduro Rx 29 Rockshox Fork

Summary

  • Capable and sturdy eMountain bike with great frame balance, motor and battery (mounted low and center)
  • Available in four frame sizes for good fit, large 29" wheels provide improved traction, momentum and angle of attack
  • No bottle cage braze ons, motor design is less stealth than a geared hub and produces more noise

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Video Review

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Introduction

Make:

Haibike

Model:

Xduro RX 29"

Price:

$4,000

Body Position:

Forward

Suggested Use:

Urban, Trail, Mountain

Electric Bike Class:

Pedal Assist (Class 1)
Learn more about Ebike classes

Warranty:

5 Year Frame, 2 Year Motor and Battery

Availability:

United States, Europe

Model Year:

2014

Bicycle Details

Total Weight:

45 lbs (20.41 kg)

Battery Weight:

5.5 lbs (2.49 kg)

Motor Weight:

8.8 lbs (3.99 kg)

Frame Material:

Aluminum 6061, Hydroformed Tubes, Gravity Casting Interface

Frame Sizes:

15.74 in (39.97 cm)17.71 in (44.98 cm)19.68 in (49.98 cm)21.65 in (54.99 cm)

Frame Types:

Mid-Step

Frame Colors:

Grey with Black and Neon Green Accents, Grey with White and Neon Blue Accents

Frame Fork Details:

Rock Shox Recon Silver Air, PopLoc, Air Suspension with Damping, 100 mm Travel, 15 mm Thru Axle

Frame Rear Details:

142/12 mm OLN (Over Lock Nuts)

Gearing Details:

10 Speed 1×10 SRAM PG 1030, 11-36T

Shifter Details:

Shimano Deore, SL-M 610, Rapidfire on Right Bar

Cranks:

Xduro Aluminum

Pedals:

XLC MTB Platform

Headset:

FSA No. 57, Semi-Integrated, Tapered

Stem:

Xduro Aluminum, A-Head

Handlebar:

Xduro Lowriser Aluminum

Brake Details:

Tektro Gemini, Hydraulic Disc, 180 mm Rotors, Reach Adjust on Levers

Grips:

XLC Sport with Locking Rings

Saddle:

Xduro Light MTB

Seat Post:

Xduro Aluminum

Rims:

DT Swiss 466d Disc, Double Wall

Spokes:

DT Swiss Industry 2.0 mm

Tire Brand:

Schwalbe Racing Ralph Evolution, 29" x 2.25"

Wheel Sizes:

29 in (73.66cm)

Tire Details:

Foldable

Electronic Details

Motor Brand:

Bosch Gen 2 with Shift Detection

Motor Type:

Mid-Mounted Geared Motor
Learn more about Ebike motors

Motor Nominal Output:

350 watts

Motor Peak Output:

550 watts

Motor Torque:

60 Newton meters

Battery Brand:

Samsung

Battery Voltage:

36 volts

Battery Amp Hours:

11 ah

Battery Watt Hours:

396 wh

Battery Chemistry:

Lithium-ion

Charge Time:

3.5 hours

Estimated Min Range:

35 miles (56 km)

Estimated Max Range:

65 miles (105 km)

Display Type:

Bosch Intuvia, Removable Backlit Grayscale LCD

Readouts:

Speed, 4 Assist Levels, Battery Voltage, Odometer, Estimated Range, Clock, Max Speed, Average Speed, Trip Time

Display Accessories:

Independent Button Pad with Tactile Button Feedback

Drive Mode:

Advanced Pedal Assist (Combined Torque, Cadence and Speed Measured 1,000 Times Per Second), (Eco 50%, Tour 120%, Sport 190%, Turbo 275%)

Top Speed:

20 mph (32 kph)

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Written Review

I’m a fan of the Bosch centerdrive system given how responsive it is for mountain bike applications. It starts and stops almost immediately (as shown in the video review). The Gen2 design brings increased power at 350 watts for improved starting and climbing which is perfect for this 29er hardtail from Haibike. This is one of my favorite ebikes in their lineup because it’s the most affordable but still awesome looking with higher end components (including 180mm hydraulic disc brakes, RockShox Recon Air with 100mm of travel and 15mm thru-axle). The entire bike weighs just 45 pounds but is still rugged and truly trail ready. With four frame sizes (and two colors) to choose from you can match the bike to your body and enjoy riding as you would with a traditional mountain bike.

This bike can easily reach 20 miles per hour and freewheels efficiently beyond when dropping hills. The 350 watt motor sits at the intersection of the downtube and seat tube doubling as the bottom bracket. It’s got a protective plastic cover along its base (to defer damage from any rocks or stumps you might encounter). It keeps motor weight low and center on the bike frame (right where you want it for balance) and leverages the 10 speed SRAM cassette in the rear. One of the neat things about this and other mid-drive ebikes is that maintenance and service on the wheels is handle just like a regular bike. While it’s true that more force is put onto the chain and cassette with mid-drive, this motor is smart enough to sense when you’re switching gears and will automatically cut out to avoid mashing. The motor is a bit louder than some gearless hub designs (producing a soft high pitched whine shown in the video review) but it’s not as loud as some and when you’re on a dirt path the sound of your tread will pretty much cover it up.

The battery pack used with this system is a 36 volt 11 amp hour Lithium-ion configuration that’s light weight and long lasting. It’s removable for easy charging or multi-pack use on those long distance rides. Even though the official specs say 25 to 35 miles my experience is that it can go much further (depending on the terrain and level of assist). By leveraging the gears on this bike and always using pedal assist (there’s no throttle mode) you get excellent range. The battery has a nice LED indicator on the side that displays its charge even without turning the bike on (or even having it on the bike) which is nice. The pack mounts low and center, just like the motor, but does take up the space where a bottle cage might have otherwise mounted. I feel like they could have added bosses to the seat tube for a cage mount but it’s not the end of the world. You can always get CamelBak…

The display unit on the XDURO RX 29er is large and easy to use. The screen is backlit and shows speed, distance and assist and you can interact with it using a break-out console. This means you can keep your hands on the grips at all times (critical for trail riding on bumpy, dangerous terrain). While some electric mountain bikes rely on throttle only operation if I had to choose one I’d go with pedal assist. There’s no chance of accidental acceleration based on squeezing the grips harder for stability and the centerdrive is so responsive (using torque, cadence and wheel speed) that it cuts out as soon as you stop pedaling. One of the neat things about the Bosch display is that you can either lock it to the mount with a set screw or remove the screw and take the panel with you (to prevent tampering and vandalism). It’s nice that they give you the choice here though I’ve heard that removing screens too often can allow the contacts to get dirty and weaken if not cleaned.

The Haibike XDURO RX 29″ is my favorite in large part because I can actually afford it. Sure, $4K isn’t cheap but this is top of the line stuff and I prefer the soft feel of off-road tires and air suspension to commuter style bikes. This thing works great on roads, trails or true mountain settings and gets excellent range thanks to the mid-drive which leverages the 10 gears in the rear. It’s easy to maintain, has a solid warranty and just looks cool. Haibike was one of the first brands to produce a true eMountain bike in Europe and now it’s finally coming to the US with Currie (Makers of IZIP and eFlow) providing distribution and support. I’ve only had limited time riding this bike but had the chance to jump it, do stoppies (thanks to the hydraulic disc brakes) and power up large hills. This thing actually feels like a bike but took the edge off for my knees and weekend warrior lungs.

Pros:

  • Super light weight frame and components (at just 45lbs), well balanced drive system with motor and battery low and center
  • Unique rear portion of frame brings seat stays and chain stays closer together for improved ride quality and flex
  • Bosch drive system is efficient, smooth and powerful with removable battery for convenient charging
  • Stiff cranks, decent pedals, rigid frame for good power transfer when riding
  • Solid 10 speed cassette for climbing and bombing applications, good pedaling range
  • Great customer support and warranty from Currie Technologies in the US (part of Accell Group which owns Haibike)
  • Four frame sizes so the bike will fit and feel great over long distances (40cm, 45cm, 50cm, 55cm), two color options is kind of nice
  • Centerdrive design makes wheel repairs on the trail much easier than hub motors which have extra cables and add weight to the wheel
  • By placing the motor on the frame unsprung weight is reduced and frame geometry can focus on ride quality vs. strength

Cons:

  • The battery pack takes up the space where a water bottle cage might otherwise mount
  • Externalized battery and larger bottom bracket make it obvious that this is an electric bike “less stealth”
  • No throttle mode, this bike only uses pedal assist (like all Bosch powered systems)
  • Only available in a high-step configuration but the top tube does curve down a bit for easier standing or bails (avoid racking yourself)

Resources:

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Rob Earp
3 years ago

This is a terrific bike because everything it does, it does exceptionally well. In my opinion, it is worth the extra money. I had an E3 Dash and after experiencing a number of problems, I “traded up” to the Haibike. I’m very happy I did. This bike is rock-solid, from the ride, to the shifting, to the big range/long battery life. This is not the most ambitious bike in terms of features. (It does not have a throttle or Cruise Control, for example.) The sophistication of the Bosch system seems to be aimed at providing the basics of pedal assist, torque, and range exceptionally well, and better than anyone else. And man does it succeed. I’m loving this bike and I’m grateful to Currie for their commitment on customer satisfaction. I may be a Haibike rider for life!

Reply
Court Rye
3 years ago

Awesome testimonial Rob! Thanks for sharing your experience with the Haibike XDURO RX. They actually just won the Interbike E-Bike of the Year Award for 2014 and I think they definitely deserve the positive recognition. Here’s a video I shot of the award ceremony.

Reply
Randy van Vliet
3 years ago

If they ever make a FS 29’er with 120mm front and rear, that will help get 225#’s up steep fire roads here So Cal, I may have to let go of my Niner Jet 9 frame for this.

Reply
Vince
3 years ago

I took a loaner bike from El Camino Bike in Encinitas Ca. out for a 13 mile trail ride and decided they should change the name from Haibike to Wowbike, because WOW is the only way to explain it. I could not trail ride hear in southern California for more than 2-3 miles because of the very steep and rock trails and now I am looking forward to trying many of the fantastic trails we have.

Reply
Court Rye
3 years ago

Awesome! I feel the same way, the Bosch drive system is amazing and when paired with a purpose-built mountain frame like the XDURO 29″ or one of their other setups… it’s just amazing. Way easier on my knees and makes it possible to reach greater distances. Have fun out there and thanks for sharing your take on this bike!

Reply
Vince
3 years ago

Thanks. In your experience do people switch out the seat? It seems hard, feels like a butt buster,

Reply
Court Rye
3 years ago

Hi Vince! Yeah, I hear about people switching the saddles all the time. I think they put on a very active, firm saddle that would appeal to hard-core riders but if you’re using this around town or just aren’t as interested in stiffness and power output (and weight savings) then this would be a good part to swap out. I got the FSRX 27.5 and kept the saddle (and it is firm) but the full suspension helped to reduce the discomfort :)

Reply
Vince
3 years ago

Also I want you to know that the video test ride does this bike no justice. A golf course is nothing compared to what this bike is capable of. You should let me make you a video of this bike on a real trail.

Reply
Court Rye
3 years ago

Please do! I was at an industry event where they were unveiling the bike for the first time and I was doing my best to find dynamic terrain for testing. Feel free to leave a video response on YouTube from my original review here.

Reply
Tom
2 years ago

The awesome folks at Fly Rides in La Jolla (CA) allowed me to take out an RX 29 overnight (at a reasonable price) so I could test on my intended commute route, involving about 4.5 miles of trail including sand, gravel, stream beds, single-track, steep, gullied sections, etc. It’s amazing. Had to buy one. It has no problem getting the job done, and is plenty comfortable on the streets as well. The long climb at the end before arriving at work is accomplished without breaking a sweat or breathing hard, while maintaining 19 mph (assist tapers off above this). I’m back to bike commuting after a 12 year suspension due to route/sweat worries. This bike solves both problems, and I’m loving it!

Reply
Court Rye
2 years ago

Tom! Thanks for the great feedback… It’s awesome that you’re back on a bike regularly for commuting purposes, sounds like the Haibike really met your needs. My experience with the brand (and the Bosch drive system) has been similar, it’s a really capable product :D

Reply

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Johnny
3 days ago

Awesome - thanks for the incredible write up. You've convinced me to steer clear of the yamaha drives for the time being. Which of course means that I would need to step up to a Xduro treekking for significant more money.

Local dealer just called and offered a 2017 Haibiki Xduro Trekking S (bosch speed powered) for $3200. Hmm ... I think I might be able to do a tad better if I wait a bit longer ..

Still very much worried about buying the IZIP via remote dealer, having an issue and then being stranded without local dealer support. Even though the price is very attractive. It seems like even if I don't buy the IZIP from the local dealer, they may still be able to / obligated to help with IZIP warranty work? The Xduro 5.0 sure is tempting, but it a bit overkill for my current needs.

Anybody knows where the op got this deal ? I think $3200 is a good deal for 2017 Xduro Trekking S (especially if it is otd).

I am leaning towards 2017 Xduro fullseven though and if there is a similar offer I really would love to get one(I actually would get trekking S if it is possible to take it to the trails too).

Mark Peralta
4 days ago

I used the Nuvinci + Bosch Performance combo for a month (replacement bike) and have also used the Bosch Performance drive with a cassette when I swapped e-bikes for a weekend with a colleague. Both e-bikes were 28mph iterations. The N380 bike was a Swiss made Flyer, whereas the 'cassette bike' was a Haibike Trekking Xduro S 5.0.

To answer your question, the cassette has a wider range of gears. I'll spare you the ratio math and simply narrate my experience. With the Nuvinci N380 I had trouble climbing hills above 12% grade and I even managed to stall a couple of times around 15% grade. With the cassette driven Haibike, I climbed an average 18% grade hill containing a short but steeper 22% grade section. It was tough but still doable. I weigh 220 pounds and am moderately fit.

I could not tell you exactly at what percentage grade you will start having trouble with the N380 because that depends on your fitness level and weight. But if you frequently need to climb hills above 12%, I would recommend staying with the cassette. Otherwise the N380 iteration will be more a lot more fun to ride.

A tip if you get the N380: you can easily shift to a lower gear ratio under load going uphill. But it's sometimes more difficult to twist 'to a higher gear' when gaining speed. The trick is to back off pedalling for a second whilst you shift. It makes the experience a lot easier on the hands if you tend to get blisters. This was the main issue I encountered.
If the chain ring is 3 speed just like what Yamaha uses on their ebikes, then using a nuvinci would be adequate even on steeper hills. Unfortunately, Bosch only uses single chain ring and the trend for nuvinci is to use belt drive, eliminating the feasibility of multiple speed chain ring.

JayVee
4 days ago

All other things being equal, which would be the better hill climber and to what degree is the difference? I'm referring to the Super Commuter 8 which has a rear cassette assembly, vs the Super Commuter 9 which has the Nuvinci internal gears. I guess I'm asking which has the lowest gear, or are they equal?
Thanks,
Rich

I used the Nuvinci + Bosch Performance combo for a month (replacement bike) and have also used the Bosch Performance drive with a cassette when I swapped e-bikes for a weekend with a colleague. Both e-bikes were 28mph iterations. The N380 bike was a Swiss made Flyer, whereas the 'cassette bike' was a Haibike Trekking Xduro S 5.0.

To answer your question, the cassette has a wider range of gears. I'll spare you the ratio math and simply narrate my experience. With the Nuvinci N380 I had trouble climbing hills above 12% grade and I even managed to stall a couple of times around 15% grade. With the cassette driven Haibike, I climbed an average 18% grade hill containing a short but steeper 22% grade section. It was tough but still doable. I weigh 220 pounds and am moderately fit.

I could not tell you exactly at what percentage grade you will start having trouble with the N380 because that depends on your fitness level and weight. But if you frequently need to climb hills above 12%, I would recommend staying with the cassette. Otherwise the N380 iteration will be more a lot more fun to ride.

A tip if you get the N380: you can easily shift to a lower gear ratio under load going uphill. But it's sometimes more difficult to twist 'to a higher gear' when gaining speed. The trick is to back off pedalling for a second whilst you shift. It makes the experience a lot easier on the hands if you tend to get blisters. This was the main issue I encountered.

JayVee
4 days ago

Just a comment for those looking to understand Haibike Trekking frame sizes. I have the Trekking Sduro S 6.0 which has the same frame as the Bosch powered Trekking Xduro 5.0 from what I can see. It is however different to the 4.0 as explained by Ravi above.

An addition to what I said earlier in this thread. I have size S (52) but there are 2 additional spacers above the stem. I'm pretty sure that they were added by the shop where I bought the bike. This raises the handlebar height by about 3 cms. I measure 1m82-83.

tallpaul
4 days ago

Appreciate the FS as our streets can be as harsh as the trails!
With Haibikes it used to be XDuro meant Bosch and Sduro meant Yamaha, but this year that is not the case. Not sure how bikes are fitted with levels of components, you gotta do your homework with research and test drives.

Johnny
4 days ago

The Bosch Performance Line models will give max speed of 28mph assist, the CX models are limited to 20mph.
Haibikes choice of names and model numbers for their bikes is confusing, and seems to have changed this year to add to the confusion.
But that are beautifully made machines. The welds, fittings, and overall design are top notch.
And I have to agree with you about the cost of the batteries! but then again I don't know what goes into the making of the batteries, but still, almost $1000 for a 500w is a lot of $$$$.

Is there a difference other than Bosch motor instead of Yamaha between Xduro and Sduro lines(like better frame , components etc?).

Should I go for hard tail or Full suspension ? I am also thinking of riding the bike on trails but then how will the commute be with FS ?

bob armani
4 days ago

......last years models....

I'm with Rich c above, Haibikes are very well sorted out. I have the Bosch but I think the Yamaha is pretty similar, maybe a bit more punch but not as smooth response.... again, I have the Bosch and only know about the Yamaha from what I have read.
The "symbiotic" relationship you develop between the motor and its sensors (torque, speed and cadence read about 1000 times a second, and your selection of gears, and your pedal power, make for a truly well balanced experience.You get as much exercise as you want plus help up those long hills. 30 mile commutes are well within the range of the Bosch with the 500 watt battery. I have the 400 watt battery and can easily do 30 miles on it, including some good sized hills, and usually headwinds.
Depending on what shape you are in you will more then likely find that turning the motor off will take a lot of pedal power seeing as the bikes usually weigh in at around 50+ lbs. I usually keep it in ECO mode for flat and mild terrain. In ECO I could probably get 75 miles if there was no wind and little if no hills!
Haibike mtb's are fine for the street. I have the Full Seven with the 28 mph Bosch. It eats up the bumps, which I appreciate as I am an older guy and don't care for jarring rides.
Suggest you find a dealer and take a few out for a test ride.

Hey Tallpaul- Just curious, if you were referring to the '2018 Haibike XDURO XTREME 28MPH Full Seven S 9.0 Electric Bike eMTB Full Suspension Soft Tail' ? I would have liked to see a smaller more integrated motor on that model IMHO. I did not know Bosch made a 350 watt 28mph. Is that new for this year? Ride safe!

Johnny
5 days ago

@Dewey: Again thanks for the info, I didn't know that Giant customized their motors. Again when I was looking into the specifications I did not see much information about the motor. It seems Explore uses a version that is speed limited to 20, yet I see 28 mph version of the same "sport " model.

I'm a huge Haibike fan, I own two 2016 bikes. A Full Seven XDURO S RX mtb, and a Trekking XDURO S RX. Both are speed versions, 28mph, both are Bosch. You get a little noise from the Bosch mid drive (as compared to the Brose for example), but it's so smooth in handling power and torque. Personally, I feel the Bosch is worth every penny. If you ride many hills, you'll appreciate the 28mph bikes. When riding a 20mph bike, you go over that coming down the grade. But when you get to that 20mph setting as you level out, you can feel it hunt between assist and no assist. With the 28mph, you just don't hit that annoyance. Right now is the perfect time to buy a Haibike. I bought one in November 2016 and the other in March 2017. Both highly discounted from MSRP.

Thanks for the response, so you advise going for a 2017 x duro instead of an sduro ? I realize that for some models they did not state the maxspeed but should I assume that it is 28mph if the system is 350w Bosch CX ?
I think at some place that Bosch system will not accept other battery packs (and I see that Bosch insanely overprices their packs ) is it still the case?

I should find a shop and test these models.

rich c
5 days ago

I'm a huge Haibike fan, I own two 2016 bikes. A Full Seven XDURO S RX mtb, and a Trekking XDURO S RX. Both are speed versions, 28mph, both are Bosch. You get a little noise from the Bosch mid drive (as compared to the Brose for example), but it's so smooth in handling power and torque. Personally, I feel the Bosch is worth every penny. If you ride many hills, you'll appreciate the 28mph bikes. When riding a 20mph bike, you go over that coming down the grade. But when you get to that 20mph setting as you level out, you can feel it hunt between assist and no assist. With the 28mph, you just don't hit that annoyance. Right now is the perfect time to buy a Haibike. I bought one in November 2016 and the other in March 2017. Both highly discounted from MSRP.

hurricane56
1 week ago

Awesome - thanks for the incredible write up. You've convinced me to steer clear of the yamaha drives for the time being. Which of course means that I would need to step up to a Xduro treekking for significant more money.

Local dealer just called and offered a 2017 Haibiki Xduro Trekking S (bosch speed powered) for $3200. Hmm ... I think I might be able to do a tad better if I wait a bit longer ..

Still very much worried about buying the IZIP via remote dealer, having an issue and then being stranded without local dealer support. Even though the price is very attractive. It seems like even if I don't buy the IZIP from the local dealer, they may still be able to / obligated to help with IZIP warranty work? The Xduro 5.0 sure is tempting, but it a bit overkill for my current needs.

The service portion is something you'll need to check with the iZip. Just as an example, my friend with a Bulls bike had to pay the LBS a diagnostic fee to initiate a warranty claim on his Bosch powerpack 400. He did not buy the bike at the LBS. This is the one grey zone with many ebike service experiences, it probably varies widely amongst manufacturer and LBS. Even my local dealer where I purchased the bike from has to charge for labor on a warranty parts replacement. The last time I had a repair done they were kind enough to waive the fee, but were upfront about disclosing that before work commenced. I'm guessing Haibike does not compensate the LBS for their time. If you do inquire with the iZip people, you'll also want to ask if the TransX takes software updates and if that would result in a dealer service fee as well.

Ravi Kempaiah
1 week ago

My bike is powered by Bosch Performance Line. Seems you all have gotten many more miles on your chain.
I didn't have any issues with the chain and derailleur but constant noise from the chain when pedaling. At first I would clean and lube the chain and it would quiet down but after maybe 50 miles or so it would be noisy again. Switched from dry lube to ChainL with the same results. And the last attempt or so to lube and quiet the chain was unsuccessful, still noisy after the lube.
While in the shop for the new chain the Sprocket Equalizing System (S.E.S) bearing was replaced as it exhibited some binding as it rotated. It was replaced with an upgraded ceramic bearing.
I would say my riding is not severe at all, mostly smooth paved bike paths and an occasional stretch of dirt path.
I do try to keep the bike and all its running gear clean and well lubed. I hope this eBike specific chain will outlast the original Shimano.

Have you cleaned the complete drive train?
Like the chaining, cassette, derailleur etc.

I am amazed that people get less than 1000 miles on their chain. I don't do off-road stuff but mostly on-road. Chicago winters are harsh and in the last 14 months, I put ~5000 miles on my Xduro Trekking Speed bike and had to replace the chain only around 4000 miles. Granted, I never the use Turbo, 99% Tour mode and I clean and lube the drive train every 250 miles.

Bryan995
1 week ago

1. The drive has a tendency to resist your efforts above a certain RPM level, and the cadence window in which it provides power is pretty limited. This is perceptible in Standard mode, and painfully perceptible in ECO and ECO+ modes.

This has several consequences:

- If you want to tour around in a hilly area, you need to be really fit with the Yamaha. I use ECO mode only when absolutely needed. The Bosch and Shimano ECO modes are infinitely easier on the knees.

- If you want to climb a hill, the lowest gears might not necessarily be the best gears. If you're spinning away in 1st gear you will quickly hit a cadence where power drops off. This means you'll need to shift up a gear or two to get power. But it also means that climbing will be more difficult on the knees (once again). I climb a 7% grade incline every day and the bike is in 8th or 9th gear (meaning, 2-3 gears away from 11 teeth). I hand't noticed this until someone remarked that I was climbing in a really high gear. Might explain why my knees ache sometimes...

- Because the cadence is limited, the bike requires an inordinate number of gear shifts in traffic. Think of a scenario where you have several consecutive red lights. After the first red light goes green, I need to shift up 6 times to reach cruising speed. But as soon as I reach cruising speed, I have to shift down several times as well. And start over at each red light. Other drives, like the Bosch or the Shimano have a more intelligent way of dealing with this. Start in 1st gear and shift into second or third gear, then increase the number of RPMs instead of shifting through all the gears. You'll get just as much power and won't constantly be changing gears.

2. The engineering on some of the parts isn't up to Yamaha standards.

- The remote is fastened by screws which “bite” into the plastic casing. The result is that it’s impossible to tighten them so that the remote doesn’t swivel around the handlebars. This means that it’s nearly impossible to walk the bike up a hill using RUN mode. Press on the RUN button and the remote simply swivels out of your hand.

-The bike’s remote is designed in such a manner that you have to take your right hand off the handlebars in order to switch to another level of assist. But the remote often slips away...

- The button to power on the bike is starting to fail. Sometimes it works, sometimes not.

- The diagnostic button on the battery sometimes doesn't work.

3. Although not directly Yamaha's fault, the lighting on many Trekking Sduros is not sufficient for riding in the countryside at night. I have a Trekking Sduro S 6.0 which has a 60 lux light. When riding in the forest at night I can't see the contours of the road ahead. This is because the projected beam is too narrow and the lights not powerful enough.

So, if I had to do it again, I wouldn't buy a Yamaha powered bike. This is particularly true of the older PW drive system, which still equips most SDUROs.

Awesome - thanks for the incredible write up. You've convinced me to steer clear of the yamaha drives for the time being. Which of course means that I would need to step up to a Xduro treekking for significant more money.

Local dealer just called and offered a 2017 Haibiki Xduro Trekking S (bosch speed powered) for $3200. Hmm ... I think I might be able to do a tad better if I wait a bit longer ..

Still very much worried about buying the IZIP via remote dealer, having an issue and then being stranded without local dealer support. Even though the price is very attractive. It seems like even if I don't buy the IZIP from the local dealer, they may still be able to / obligated to help with IZIP warranty work? The Xduro 5.0 sure is tempting, but it a bit overkill for my current needs.

hurricane56
1 week ago

I was seeing the Xduro prices yesterday of about $3500. Maybe they will come down more. But I like your thinking. If you're testing the waters and think you might upgrade in a few years - and particularly because your commute is shorter - then the IZIP sounds like a great way to go (although I don't have experience with IZIP). It would be nice if you could find a local dealer for that IZIP however. You'd definitely want to test it out.

It’s always a balancing act between waiting for more of a discount and having it now with your preferred frame size. last year the commuter oriented bikes were in stock well past the new year.

Over50
1 week ago

... Will have to call for pricing but I have a feeling the Xduro trekking may be closer to 3k?...
In that case is it worth the 2x price increase over the IZIP? If the haibike will hold its value more so than the IZIP then I have no issue paying a bit more now. But if in 4 years both are down to $500 resale then the IZIP seems like the way to go. Thanks for the help!

I was seeing the Xduro prices yesterday of about $3500. Maybe they will come down more. But I like your thinking. If you're testing the waters and think you might upgrade in a few years - and particularly because your commute is shorter - then the IZIP sounds like a great way to go (although I don't have experience with IZIP). It would be nice if you could find a local dealer for that IZIP however. You'd definitely want to test it out.

rich c
1 week ago

Does your Haibike have a Bosch or Yamaha? 1700 miles on my 2016 Haibike XDURO Full Seven S RX, no chain issues yet.

Bryan995
1 week ago

Just for reference my Trekking S Xduro was $2699 during last years clearance.

As for resale the Haibike might have an edge but seeing resale ads for ebikes here in the SF Bay Area, many bikes are posted for sale at 40-50% off the original sale price after less than a year. I’d recommend buying the bike that fits your needs now and not factor in resale.

Perfect - appreciate that data point. Best I can find for the Sduro trekking 4.0 is $1999, so $700 more for the Xduro seems reasonable. Still need to do a bit more searching around re. best pricing. I am down in SD.

hurricane56
1 week ago

Just for reference my Trekking S Xduro was $2699 during last years clearance.

As for resale the Haibike might have an edge but seeing resale ads for ebikes here in the SF Bay Area, many bikes are posted for sale at 40-50% off the original sale price after less than a year. I’d recommend buying the bike that fits your needs now and not factor in resale.

Bryan995
1 week ago

He asked for other suggestions. I really wouldn't get an Sduro. And I own one... :)

Hmm ... Sounds like the Yamaha Sduro is out then!? IZIP vs Xduro? :)

Bryan995
1 week ago

Actually the poster didn't specify Xduro or Sduro (unless I missed it) but I guess based on the price quoted it has to be Sduro. But both are discounted pretty heavily right now so Xduro would be a good suggestion. Perhaps the prices will come down even more as we get to year end. So the commute sounds very short but with a large hill. The Bosch CX will power up that hill and since the distance is short range will not be an issue.

Yes sorry all. I was refering to the Sduro Trekking 4.0 with Yamaha PW not the Bosch powered Xduro. Everything I read says to go Bosch and it seems like you all echo that :).

Will have to call for pricing but I have a feeling the Xduro trekking may be closer to 3k?

In that case is it worth the 2x price increase over the IZIP? If the haibike will hold its value more so than the IZIP then I have no issue paying a bit more now. But if in 4 years both are down to $500 resale then the IZIP seems like the way to go. Thanks for the help!

Over50
1 week ago

@Over50 owns a Trekking 4.0.

His experiences are described in the thread below:

https://electricbikereview.com/forum/threads/over-50s-2017-xduro-trekking-4-0-chronicles.13845/

Actually the poster didn't specify Xduro or Sduro (unless I missed it) but I guess based on the price quoted it has to be Sduro. But both are discounted pretty heavily right now so Xduro would be a good suggestion. Perhaps the prices will come down even more as we get to year end. So the commute sounds very short but with a large hill. The Bosch CX will power up that hill and since the distance is short range will not be an issue.

JayVee
1 week ago

Poster is asking about SDuro not XDuro .

He asked for other suggestions. I really wouldn't get an Sduro. And I own one... :)

e-boy
1 week ago

Poster is asking about SDuro not XDuro .

e-boy
1 week ago

Poster is asking about SDuro not XDuro .

JR
2 years ago

$4000 retail according the EBreview. I don't understand why people purchase these bikes. I'm running a 29er hardtail MB that retailed for 1.2 k new I purchased off craigslist for $600 + a bafang 1000w kit/ 50v 20 ah battery for +$1500 for a $2100 total cost bike which literally crushes this and all pre-fab electric bikes in every category. My bike weighs 47 lbs, top speed of about 35 mph and a range of 30 + miles cruising at 25mph without peddling. What I did took a few hours and is easily reproducible.

chicovonchico
2 years ago

i’ve  spent over 50 grand on bikes.Ridden them all hard.All brand new ,top shelf.

JR
2 years ago

Exactly, why speed 4k on this when you can spend much less for much more performance?Lets compare apples to apples, e-bikes to e-bikes.  I just don't get it. It's sort of like spending 50k on a Honda Accord when you could take that 50k and buy a used BMW.

chicovonchico
2 years ago

I don’t understand why people spend millions on homes,or all their money on drugs /booze,big trucks,cars ,clothing,Harley’s,boats etc,etc,,,but they do??Bosch Bikes are super fun ,smooth reliable,”pedal assist” incredible range with smart BM,you could buy a moped way more power and distance ,cheap as shit to ride.

chicovonchico
2 years ago

Have you ridden a Bosch drive?You haven’t..out of the first 100.000 units they had one returned.the batteries will last for up to 40,000kms.
My LBS wouldn’t touch a Bafang.And you’re right some people work and have money to spend.They make no sense to you ,to justify your Chinese Drive.I also ride  Kranked esuperdrive on a Santa Cruz Nomad carbon which kicks the living crap outta any Bafang,Look it up.Google Kranked esuperdrive,Some people have money,some don’t.

JR
2 years ago

+Speed Play I too prefer ISIS cranks to square cranks too but it is hardly something I would let swing my decision when looking at drive systems since the difference is negligible. Here is in a nutshell why I would never buy Bosch from electric bike blog's website. Proprietary, DIY unfriendly, under powered, over priced crap.

There are several serious problems I see with the Bosch system

1) You have to use their charger and it charges to 100%. The battery warranty is for 500 cycles / 2 years but if only charged to 80% (like with a cycle satiator) it would proably last twice that long. You can’t charge their system with another charger or you void the warranty.

2) The computer has it’s own battery that charges off the main battery. If that battery dies you have to replace the whole computer, which costs about $80. You would have to leave it unhooked for about 5 months for that to happen, although the battery may also just die from old age as well. My feeling is that ALL batteries should be replaceable.

3) The battery shuts down when it goes over 140 or under 32 degrees. The average temp in Ithaca NY is 40 degrees. That means for about 5 months out of the year you can’t leave the battery with the bike outside or you risk having it drop below 32 degrees. This means all cold weather commuters would be out of luck if they left their battery outside for long enough for it to drop below freezing.

4) You can’t fix the unit yourself, or program the unit yourself, or pretty much do anything with the unit except send it back and get a new one. Fixing stuff is where bike shops make most of their money. Bosch is changing the environment from one where shops can fix things to an environment where they just ship them back to the factory repair center and get a new one programmed shipped back.

The lack of power and the inability to be mounted on existing fat-bike designs makes the Bosch a system that I would never buy, except maybe secondhand to take apart and try to bypass their programming. This system is designed for rich people who want a turnkey solution that every repair will be free (under warranty) or cost $1000 (roll a die). Think of it as the Mercedes Benz of the Electric-bike world. Next…

Jimbo Jones
2 years ago

Bloody fantastic bike mate!!! After watching your reviews I went to an electric bike shop here in Melbourne, Australia and test rode one. Well bloody hell mate I was impressed!!! I've ridden a lot of bikes before but riding the Haibike Hardseven, wow!!! The motor is so smooth and quiet and pushes you according to your pedal input strength. It's like there's no motor there!! I was so impressed, I bought it!!! Thank you so much for your fantastic reviews mate. You hit the nail on the head with these bikes. I guess you can't give negative feedback if the bike is simply awesome!!! You get what you pay for!!!

JR
1 year ago

+Keith Reeder No it's not. Any DIY BBSHD bike will crush this overpriced, underpowered, underwhelming bike. You don't know shit Keith.

Keith Reeder
1 year ago

Drivel, Johnny.

JR
2 years ago

+Jim Papanikolopoulos Build your own for half cost and crush every pre-fab e bike available.

E. Nieminen
3 years ago

The elctric motor should not be using the chain at all. I have tried one where there was this engine integrated in the back wheel, and it worked same way, but the rider is really only adding power to it and you wont feel the motor vibrating the pedals or anything. Its like completely different system the electric power and the traditional power.

Tawd
3 years ago

Maybe you can pass it along to the manufactures that this customer is not going to buy a bike for the very reason I do not know what the drawbacks are and I cannot figure out what they are from watching a video‼️👎

ElectricBikeReview.com
3 years ago

+Tawd I've got a list of "cons" back at the site in the full writeup. People can also leave comments and there's a link to the forum where more feedback is shared. Hope this helps: http://electricbikereview.com/haibike/xduro-fs-rx-27-5/

Taggerung
4 years ago

Just hope you stayed off the Fairways! :-)

ElectricBikeReview.com
4 years ago

+Taggerung No worries, happy to clarify ;)

Taggerung
4 years ago

+Electric Bike Review Alright, I understand now. I can be a bit slow on the uptake sometimes.

ElectricBikeReview.com
4 years ago

+Taggerung I have a couple of tools, one is a handheld cradle for getting ride shots. I just set it down next to the path and they picked it up (maybe they thought it was trash or were concerned about running it over or maybe they were angry at me and trying to steal it... not sure).

Taggerung
4 years ago

+Electric Bike Review How could they have picked up your camera mount? Is it not on your bike helmet? 

ElectricBikeReview.com
4 years ago

+Taggerung I got a couple looks from passing golfers... maybe they were thinking "target practics??" and one did pick up my camera mount when I set it down for a test ride but I stole it back later :)

Mathieu Bouvier
4 years ago

I think your reviews lack negativity, you do a great job covering the positive stuff but rarely talk about drawbacks/issues, my 2c

ElectricBikeReview.com
4 years ago

I appreciate the feedback and realize some of the video "reviews" are actually more like "overviews" I try to add more cons in the writeups but also have limited time with the bikes and want to maintain a constructive relationship with each manufacturer. It's a tricky balance but by showing the bike visually and riding I hope that people can also identify cons for themselves.

nature albums
4 years ago

I love your reviews keep them coming. This bike no way justifies that price tag ever..

ElectricBikeReview.com
4 years ago

+necip perver The centerdrive is one of the most efficient setups I've tried so the average sized battery performs quite well. Here's a post from someone who bought a Haibike talking about going 44 miles and only using half the battery pack: http://electricbikereview.com/community/threads/haibike-eq-xduro-cross.130/page-4#post-2319

nature albums
4 years ago

+Electric Bike Review  realistically I would expect a better battery not enough beef there for range. 

ElectricBikeReview.com
4 years ago

Ha! Yeah, this thing is $4K which isn't cheap but the components and drive system are higher quality. It's not that much more than some hardtail non-ebikes. The Santa Cruz Highball Alloy starts at $2K for example and is also a 29er (goes up depending on components)

markharrispt
4 years ago

One of the Best integrated designs thus far, using the Bosch motor within frame geometry. Purpose-built. Surprisingly noisy.

ElectricBikeReview.com
4 years ago

Depending on where the camera is positioned the noise is amplified (especially when I mount it to the frame) but in practice it's not so bad, mostly masked by the tread sound and any debris on the trail. Still, this is louder than a gearless design... the price you pay for more torque and less weight :)